#1
im not at all a big fan of rap/ hip hop at all, but the carrer field i want to go into may end up recording it if worse comes to worse so i wanted to explore how it is made a little bit. i was wandering how they get the tight, heavy, thuderous bass in their songs. is it an acutall bass guitar with some subs and crossovers or is it computer generated?

Im sorry in advance if this is not the right forum for this question
My rig:
Gibson faded V
Dean Razorback
Fender Showman Strat
Dean Dimebag Tribute ML
Custom guitar
Boss ME-50
Marshall AVT50H

92% of teenagers have moved to rap, put this in your sig if you're in the 8% that still listens to real music.
#2
using Dr Dre's The Chronic as a reference, I hear both bass guitars and funky moog basslines on there


though I don't think thats the type of bass you're referring to
Last edited by seljer at Jan 1, 2009,
#3
Most likely computer-generated, as its mostly low frequency, almost no treble. Listen to Bust a Move by Young MC, which is played on by Flea, and it sounds much different than average hip-hop bass.
#4
The bass you're hearing is created by a drum machine like the Roland TR-808, and they're often referred to as 808's. This is not created by any sort of guitar or bass.

However! You should also be aware that actual bass guitar is prevalent in hip-hop, whether in samples, or as part of the song. A lot of West Coast hip-hop, especially Snoop Dogg, has awesome, awesome bass playing.
#5
Quote by MustangMan311
The bass you're hearing is created by a drum machine like the Roland TR-808, and they're often referred to as 808's. This is not created by any sort of guitar or bass.

the term 808 is never associated with bass, only drums. Synths produce most of the bass sounds you hear in rap, but there are some great groups who use real bass guitar too.
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#6
Quote by MustangMan311
The bass you're hearing is created by a drum machine like the Roland TR-808, and they're often referred to as 808's. This is not created by any sort of guitar or bass.

However! You should also be aware that actual bass guitar is prevalent in hip-hop, whether in samples, or as part of the song. A lot of West Coast hip-hop, especially Snoop Dogg, has awesome, awesome bass playing.



i was always curious about that because i remember back when i liked rap, (before i picked up a guitar) DMX had a music video that showed him playing a fender P-bass but it was still really thumpy, but i never knew how to make a reall bass sound like that
My rig:
Gibson faded V
Dean Razorback
Fender Showman Strat
Dean Dimebag Tribute ML
Custom guitar
Boss ME-50
Marshall AVT50H

92% of teenagers have moved to rap, put this in your sig if you're in the 8% that still listens to real music.
#7
Quote by GibsonVdude
i was always curious about that because i remember back when i liked rap, (before i picked up a guitar) DMX had a music video that showed him playing a fender P-bass but it was still really thumpy, but i never knew how to make a reall bass sound like that


The low end stuff that shakes subwoofers will be digital. Lil Jon stuff uses this type of 20-35hz (Roughly) stuff.

Example 1

My PC speakers cant even pick that bass up lol

However, rap artists still use bass guitars. Eminem/NWA/Dre/Snoop usually have a bass guitar. Listen to Dr Dres 2001 album, loads of fretless bass parts.

Example 2

You can hear a "real" fretless doing that, then when the drum kicks in a lower digital bass follows it.

Then there are modern artists without any digital samples.

Example 3

Still getting a nice, deep low end tone with a bass guitar. Boost lows and low mids, neck pickup, maybe buy an octave pedal to get a nice subwoofer thump.

Example 4

Example 5

That style of bass tone COULD be done on a bass guitar in my opinion. I base my idea of "A rap bassline" off these songs. A deep, distorted thumping tone.

Hope I answered some questions.
#8
Quote by aetherspear
the term 808 is never associated with bass, only drums. Synths produce most of the bass sounds you hear in rap, but there are some great groups who use real bass guitar too.

But the bass that he's talking about is the kick drum, which is the 808.
#9
Quote by Micehorns
The low end stuff that shakes subwoofers will be digital. Lil Jon stuff uses this type of 20-35hz (Roughly) stuff.

Example 1

My PC speakers cant even pick that bass up lol

However, rap artists still use bass guitars. Eminem/NWA/Dre/Snoop usually have a bass guitar. Listen to Dr Dres 2001 album, loads of fretless bass parts.

Example 2

You can hear a "real" fretless doing that, then when the drum kicks in a lower digital bass follows it.

Then there are modern artists without any digital samples.

Example 3

Still getting a nice, deep low end tone with a bass guitar. Boost lows and low mids, neck pickup, maybe buy an octave pedal to get a nice subwoofer thump.

Example 4

Example 5

That style of bass tone COULD be done on a bass guitar in my opinion. I base my idea of "A rap bassline" off these songs. A deep, distorted thumping tone.

Hope I answered some questions.


thanks that opened my eyes actually. thats really low isnt it? i thought that 20 hz was roughly the very lowest a normal ear can hear? im not saying your wrong im just saying thats pretty damn low haha
My rig:
Gibson faded V
Dean Razorback
Fender Showman Strat
Dean Dimebag Tribute ML
Custom guitar
Boss ME-50
Marshall AVT50H

92% of teenagers have moved to rap, put this in your sig if you're in the 8% that still listens to real music.
#10
Quote by GibsonVdude
thanks that opened my eyes actually. thats really low isnt it? i thought that 20 hz was roughly the very lowest a normal ear can hear? im not saying your wrong im just saying thats pretty damn low haha

Yeah, that's why you end up feeling it more than hearing it, usually.
#11
Quote by MustangMan311
But the bass that he's talking about is the kick drum, which is the 808.


Nobody but you is talking about drums
#12
Quote by MustangMan311
Yeah, that's why you end up feeling it more than hearing it, usually.


good point haha
My rig:
Gibson faded V
Dean Razorback
Fender Showman Strat
Dean Dimebag Tribute ML
Custom guitar
Boss ME-50
Marshall AVT50H

92% of teenagers have moved to rap, put this in your sig if you're in the 8% that still listens to real music.
#13
Bass guitars serve a musical function. Rap/hip hop serves very little of a musical function if any at all; this translates into: an authentic bass guitar in rap/hip hop is very rare. Of course my personal opinion would be that using any kind of musical instrument in rap is blasphemous, but hey.


If you want to compose a rap song; that is after the laboriously demanding task of using a significantly limited vocabulary, using an exuberant amount of profanity to explain your own hormonal interpretation of the objectification of women and your justification of blissful ignorance, in the seemingly original lyrical content; musically imply perhaps a I V or I vi chord progression by a simplistic melody line ( using a limited number of notes so as to ensure your listeners do not die from an overload of bohemian concepts of music )that is essentially monophonic; perhaps with the occasional exception of a hooting tonic held at great lengths so as to give the illusion of vocal virtuosity. Of course beneath this all employ the services of a musician who is well qualified in the art of choosing a drum beat from an expensive drum machine you bought shortly after selling your soul to the philistine masses, so as to provide a steady deafening rhythm to hypnotize your young fans so as to brain wash them with the above mentioned lyrics and perhaps spend money on your merchandise to maintain his own version, of again, the above mentioned ideals exploited in your lyrical content and perhaps continue the art form you have thus far maintained with so much bestial passion and a morbid lack of intelligence.

I don't know about you; but I enjoyed that. Was feeling kinda low today...Oh well...


Good day all.
#14
Quote by MisquotedTeabag
Bass guitars serve a musical function. Rap/hip hop serves very little of a musical function if any at all; this translates into: an authentic bass guitar in rap/hip hop is very rare. Of course my personal opinion would be that using any kind of musical instrument in rap is blasphemous, but hey.


If you want to compose a rap song; that is after the laboriously demanding task of using a significantly limited vocabulary, using an exuberant amount of profanity to explain your own hormonal interpretation of the objectification of women and your justification of blissful ignorance, in the seemingly original lyrical content; musically imply perhaps a I V or I vi chord progression by a simplistic melody line ( using a limited number of notes so as to ensure your listeners do not die from an overload of bohemian concepts of music )that is essentially monophonic; perhaps with the occasional exception of a hooting tonic held at great lengths so as to give the illusion of vocal virtuosity. Of course beneath this all employ the services of a musician who is well qualified in the art of choosing a drum beat from an expensive drum machine you bought shortly after selling your soul to the philistine masses, so as to provide a steady deafening rhythm to hypnotize your young fans so as to brain wash them with the above mentioned lyrics and perhaps spend money on your merchandise to maintain his own version, of again, the above mentioned ideals exploited in your lyrical content and perhaps continue the art form you have thus far maintained with so much bestial passion and a morbid lack of intelligence.

I don't know about you; but I enjoyed that. Was feeling kinda low today...Oh well...


Good day all.


This was a pretty sensible discussion before you shitted it up. I mean, if you actually read the thread and checked out the YT links you would already know you were wrong. You would do well to abandon your prejudices and listen to some real hip hop. In the meantime, fuck off with this ridiculous sludgy prose, nobody enjoys reading that junk.
#15
^^ Witty response. I sense the same sort of irony most of your peers possess. I think it's called persistent reiteration of the same sickening point with absolutely no justification and more more bad naughty words. Tsk tsk...
#17
Quote by MisquotedTeabag
^^ Witty response. I sense the same sort of irony most of your peers possess. I think it's called persistent reiteration of the same sickening point with absolutely no justification and more more bad naughty words. Tsk tsk...

Man, you sure are a douche.
#18
Quote by MisquotedTeabag
Bass guitars serve a musical function. Rap/hip hop serves very little of a musical function if any at all; this translates into: an authentic bass guitar in rap/hip hop is very rare. Of course my personal opinion would be that using any kind of musical instrument in rap is blasphemous, but hey.


If you want to compose a rap song; that is after the laboriously demanding task of using a significantly limited vocabulary, using an exuberant amount of profanity to explain your own hormonal interpretation of the objectification of women and your justification of blissful ignorance, in the seemingly original lyrical content; musically imply perhaps a I V or I vi chord progression by a simplistic melody line ( using a limited number of notes so as to ensure your listeners do not die from an overload of bohemian concepts of music )that is essentially monophonic; perhaps with the occasional exception of a hooting tonic held at great lengths so as to give the illusion of vocal virtuosity. Of course beneath this all employ the services of a musician who is well qualified in the art of choosing a drum beat from an expensive drum machine you bought shortly after selling your soul to the philistine masses, so as to provide a steady deafening rhythm to hypnotize your young fans so as to brain wash them with the above mentioned lyrics and perhaps spend money on your merchandise to maintain his own version, of again, the above mentioned ideals exploited in your lyrical content and perhaps continue the art form you have thus far maintained with so much bestial passion and a morbid lack of intelligence.

I don't know about you; but I enjoyed that. Was feeling kinda low today...Oh well...


Good day all.


God, would you please just shut the fuck up. You don't even try to add to conversations. Just go away, please. While you shut your mouth, you should try listening to The Roots or Antedote to hear some quality jazz rap and actually learn something for once.
Quote by dudetheman
So what? I wasted like 5 minutes watching DaddyTwoFoot's avatar.


Metalheads are the worst thing that ever happened to metal.
#19
^^ I know I didn't add anything to the discussion. Nobody ever will. I mean we're discussing hip hop on a musicians forum. By that contradiction itself the rules of the universe say this post shouldn't even exist, yet alone discussed. But, I'll let you talented musicians back to your discussion of repeated 4/4 rhythms and mono-intervalic melody lines that scream artistic genius. =)
Good day.
#20
Quote by MisquotedTeabag
^^ I know I didn't add anything to the discussion. Nobody ever will. I mean we're discussing hip hop on a musicians forum. By that contradiction itself the rules of the universe say this post shouldn't even exist, yet alone discussed. But, I'll let you talented musicians back to your discussion of repeated 4/4 rhythms and mono-intervalic melody lines that scream artistic genius. =)
Good day.


You sure think that you're the ****.
#21
No, I think all of you are ****. It's a relative term. I know I'm only an average musician, but compared to anyone who believes and lives only within the musicality of hip hop, hell, I'm a friggin Mozart. =)

Seriously, stop chit chatting about what I said and start talking about your music....Or wait, perhaps you've run out of things to say that's musically relevant with regard to hip hop....Oh gee...
#22
You're the kind of **** who gave 08ers a bad rep for a whole year.
I don't give a damn about hip-hop but you're being so ignorent outside of the Pit that you deserved to be banned.
#23
Quote by MisquotedTeabag
No, I think all of you are ****


This is getting ridiculous

Quote by MisquotedTeabag
I know I'm only an average musician, but compared to anyone who believes and lives only within the musicality of hip hop


This is UG, I don't think anyone would 'live only within the musicality of hip hop'.

Quote by MisquotedTeabag
Seriously, stop chit chatting about what I said and start talking about your music....Or wait, perhaps you've run out of things to say that's musically relevant with regard to hip hop....Oh gee...


Quote by the rules
NO SPAM
- This means no meaningless posts, overdone threads or random gibberish. It is not ok to post in an obvious spam thread other than to report it.


*reported*
#24
Quote by MisquotedTeabag
^^ I know I didn't add anything to the discussion. Nobody ever will. I mean we're discussing hip hop on a musicians forum. By that contradiction itself the rules of the universe say this post shouldn't even exist, yet alone discussed. But, I'll let you talented musicians back to your discussion of repeated 4/4 rhythms and mono-intervalic melody lines that scream artistic genius. =)
Good day.


but i like 4/4 beats...

on topic: usually for the stuff i listen to, when they use an 808 to make the bass kick they will compress the waveform so they'll get that quick "thud" sound instead of a resonant booming sound.
Quote by Sicko 21X7
tremelo the brown note until she caves
#25
Yes, yes, I deserved to be banned! I agree! Such rhetoric! Such wit and understanding of music and culture! Yes, yes, I see the light. Hip hop is amazing!

Okay, now get off my back, go back to your lil' tea party about whether or not 50 cents will get past the 5 notes of the chromatic scale he's using his entire lifetime and I'll ban myself, atleast from this thread. Plus, I need to sleep, and perhaps listen to a drum machine and call it music. =)
#26
Man, I can totally picture you.
Sitting at home with a laptop, smoking a pipe and drinking wine and reading the Washington Post.
#28
O_o! okay someone majorly missed the point of the thread lol

Escentially there's not much in the sound, as far as I'm concerned, technique wise ya know. But as everyone has been saying its a mixture of bass with the lows emphasised with various filters, that super low synth business and the bass drum.

I know I'm rehashing but heres something... (perhaps hehe but not likely)
We can advise on this thumping bass sound, but what would be best for you I recon would be experiment.

I commend you for wanting to understand styles you don't necessarily enjoy listening, that shows a true balanced musician. Well done mate!
#29
I thought the way teabag did when I was 14 too.

But seriously... teabag.... If your point of reference for hip-hop is simply 50 Cent and stuff like that, then you're really missing out. (and that as a point of reference would probably mean you have a point about the inanity of it all....)

But that's like listening to only a couple of hugely successful commercial rock artists and judging all rock based on them. It's just way too narrow.

Rapping has a lot in common with blues guitar playing. It's about the feel, the phrasing and the tone - not the big words or the ability to shred. I challenge you to cover a Public Enemy tune and have it come across with a similar impact.

A lot of earlier rap, and the likes of which is still around today but is more underground revolves around social consciousness. Public Enemy and KRS-One are still bitingly critical and poignant as they were back in the day when they first started out.

Production in hip hop is huge. Regardless of the content, some of those producers out there are absolutely unbelievable. This is where a lot of the talent is in the hip hop industry also. People back in the day spent ages rifling through albums and knitting together their samples using turntables and such, finding the best beats, the best tones, etc. and recycling them into the something truly new and unique. Nowadays, though that is still not done to the levels they used to (for a variety of reasons), producers are spending ages finding the right tones and instrument samples to layer together to create the ultimate textures, the ultimate bass tones, and the ultimate sonic landscapes.

A lot of those bass tones are a combination of layering and manipulation of stuff that may or may not be originally organic in nature. Timbaland is a good example of this sort of behaviour with stellar results.

So, teabag... before you paint it all with the same indicting brush, broaden your horizons and your mind a bit. There is so much more out there than all the douche-bags out there spitting about how many times dey been capped, how big their python is, gang-bangin, drive-bys, bling bling, and how many shorties they tapped.

Dudes like Chuck D are actually *very* critical of the commercialized nature of hip hop today and how a lot of it only serves and is subservient to the old racist ideologies. He is one of the brilliant social minds of our times. Same with KRS-One. Start there, and begin to branch out.

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
#31
Listen to The Roots when they were with Hub Hubbard.
THATS real hip hop bass
#32
guys, guys, guys calm yourselfs! all i wanted to know is how they made their sound they way they do. and i am by no mean trying to make a rap, i despise rap but respect their efforts.

Quote by Of_Wolves
O_o! okay someone majorly missed the point of the thread lol

Escentially there's not much in the sound, as far as I'm concerned, technique wise ya know. But as everyone has been saying its a mixture of bass with the lows emphasised with various filters, that super low synth business and the bass drum.

I know I'm rehashing but heres something... (perhaps hehe but not likely)
We can advise on this thumping bass sound, but what would be best for you I recon would be experiment.

I commend you for wanting to understand styles you don't necessarily enjoy listening, that shows a true balanced musician. Well done mate!


thanks bro!
My rig:
Gibson faded V
Dean Razorback
Fender Showman Strat
Dean Dimebag Tribute ML
Custom guitar
Boss ME-50
Marshall AVT50H

92% of teenagers have moved to rap, put this in your sig if you're in the 8% that still listens to real music.
#33
Quote by axemanchris
People back in the day spent ages rifling through albums and knitting together their samples using turntables and such, finding the best beats, the best tones, etc. and recycling them into the something truly new and unique. Nowadays, though that is still not done to the levels they used to (for a variety of reasons), producers are spending ages finding the right tones and instrument samples to layer together to create the ultimate textures, the ultimate bass tones, and the ultimate sonic landscapes.

A lot of those bass tones are a combination of layering and manipulation of stuff that may or may not be originally organic in nature. Timbaland is a good example of this sort of behaviour with stellar results.

CT


Just in case you thought the question wasn't answered.

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
#34
hahaha you guys fell for that troll hardcore
Last edited by Tophue at Jan 3, 2009,