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#1
Gibson Les Paul Vintage Mahogany
http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Gibson-Les-Paul-Vintage-Mahogany-Electric-Guitar?sku=517536

Schecter C-1 FR Hellraiser
http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Schecter-C1-Hellraiser-FR-Electric-Guitar?sku=518471

I like to play all styles of music, but my favorite bands include Metallica, Pantera, Smashing Pumpkins, Rage Against the Machine, Weezer, Led Zep, Black Sabbath, and some punk.

So as you can see, I would prefer to play all types of music, but I like to focus on metal/hard rock.

I currently have the Gibson LP Vintage Mahogany for the past 2 weeks, and I have almost no complaints about it. I'm used to the weight and the neck thickness because I'm stepping up from an Epiphone SG. I also have a Line 6 Spider Valve 212, and the LP is able to play a lot of stuff.

My only complaint is that I wish I had a whammy bar to play around with. But is maintaining a Floyd Rose annoying, as well as changing the strings?

Should I opt for the Hellraiser instead? It would run me about the same price because I would have to buy a hard case for the Hellraiser, which would run me about an extra $100 or so.

Also, what guitar would have a better resale value in the future?

Please give other suggestions if you want, but I am not going over $1000, and that includes the price when a case is included.

My only outlets to buy guitars are Guitar Center and Sam Ash, because for one, my parents won't let me buy online, and I would like to try out the guitar.
#2
The hellraiser is built for METAL. The Les Paul is a better all around guitar, and it will maintain resale value better.

Is the whammy bar really the only reason? Ask yourself if you REALLY need one, and if your desire for one makes selling the Les Paul worth it.

If you just want to fool around with a whammy bar, why not get a cheaper axe with a decent floyd?
#3
i dunno you might be better off with a new amp.
but out of the guitars i'd say go the LP. since floyds can be a pain in the arse, and the LP, would probably have a better re-sale value, and you all ready seem to really like it
#4
I guess a whammy bar is just something supplemental I don't need to worry about for now.

Did I make the right decision for the guitar? I'm pretty happy with everything, maybe except the color. Should I opt for a used Les Paul that will actually have a finish?
#5
Gibson - Better resale value in the Futre.
- Quality
- Better Tone
- No Whammy

Schecter- Cheaper wood used
- Cheaper pick ups
- Floating Tremolo


The Gibson is much better quality, getting a guitar with a good trem around 1000, you'll probably have to shoot for an Ibanez with an edge pro, or something with an original floyd rose.

Btw, the amp you have is horrible. Seriously you need to look into getting rid of it ASAP.

As for the floyd difficulty, at first it'll seem hard and long (no pun intended) but people show you how to set it correctly on youtube so it floats right. Once you lock it in right, it stays in tune longer than any other type of guitar (most people wouldn't think so) but you've seen someone like Joe Satriani play live, he beats it to death after multible songs and it stays in tune.
Last edited by nan0 at Jan 2, 2009,
#6
What's wrong with my amp? It's a 40 watt tube amp, and it's just the Spider III series that suck. This amp is a totally different story and can do it all.
#7
my bad, i misread it, thought it was a Spider III
i stand by my suggestion of of go with the LP
Last edited by telemetal at Jan 2, 2009,
#8
So let me get this straight, it's the Line 6 Spider IIIs that suck, right? I'm pretty happy with my Spider VALVE, co-produced by Bogner, but does anyone with more experience than me with this amp have any arguments?
#9
I guess your amp isn't that bad then, I misread it as well. Sorry about that.

Anyway, do what you fell/think is right. You should play them in person though. Personally I don't like the shecters neck shape or feel. The fret boards feel small to me as well.
#10
one of my friends has that exact LP. it's definitely not as good as a $2k+ "real" gibson. the neck feels real sticky, despite being unfinished, the fretwork was kinda sad, and it didn't really play that great overall. i would think the schecter's pickups are far more suited towards metal than the burstbuckers the LP has. go with the schecter.
#11
And schecter's necks aren't sticky? Their fret work are worse than lower gibsons.

Just because some metal bands use schecters doesn't automaticly make them better for metal. Distortion and amps are about 90% of what matters, they both have humbuckers but I'll tell you now, the gibsons will sound much better when clean.
#12
Keep the Gibson.
Install a Bigsby.
[quote="'[VictorinoX"]']
There are people in this world who don't feel it necessary to vomit sunshine 24 hours a day. I'm one of them.

Current Gear
Yamaha EG 112
Esteban American Legacy
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#13
you can get a LP with a floyd if that helps sway you lol
=BROLY - HIS POWER IS MAXIMUM=
#14
Wouldn't the installation of a floyd rose cost me a fortune?

Ideally, if I could have any guitar, I would opt for a Gibson Les Paul Silverburst, but that retails for $2.5k new, which is wayyy out of my range.
#15
Quote by sashki

If you just want to fool around with a whammy bar, why not get a cheaper axe and put an OFR in it.



Fixed.
You can call me Aaron.


♠♣♥♦
Out on parole, any more instances of plum text and I get put back in...
#16
Quote by nan0
Gibson - Better resale value in the Futre.
- Quality
- Better Tone
- No Whammy

Schecter- Cheaper wood used
- Cheaper pick ups
- Floating Tremolo


The Gibson is much better quality, getting a guitar with a good trem around 1000, you'll probably have to shoot for an Ibanez with an edge pro, or something with an original floyd rose.

Btw, the amp you have is horrible. Seriously you need to look into getting rid of it ASAP.

As for the floyd difficulty, at first it'll seem hard and long (no pun intended) but people show you how to set it correctly on youtube so it floats right. Once you lock it in right, it stays in tune longer than any other type of guitar (most people wouldn't think so) but you've seen someone like Joe Satriani play live, he beats it to death after multible songs and it stays in tune.


Don't listen to this guy, the hellraiser has an original Floyd rose on it, do your home work next time.

Anyways this was the two the sales guy said were in my price range that were the best and I got the schecter, it's also made of mahogany and the Floyd on mine never goes out of tune don't listen to these people that are Gibosn fanboys. And the pickups are EMG's more expensive than most sets of Gibson crap.

I think you should sit down with each of em and take turns and find the right one for you
Gear
Schecter C1 Hellraiser FR
1967 Ventura Les Paul Copy
Marshall JCM 2000 Dual Super Lead
Last edited by .Jamison at Jan 2, 2009,
#17
I have to say the vintage/worn gibson guitars as of late have started sucking, mine is like an 03/4 sg and the finish feels a lot different, now they feel like cardboard to me, I say save up an extra couple hundred and get an LP studio or standard

EDIT or see if you can find a used one like I did for $850 so nice
#18
Looks like there isn't much helpful information here.
I own the same Gibson Les Paul "Vintage" and I am happy with it. So is everyone else I have ever talked to.
I agree with Sashki in their response.

Oh by the way I have a Line 6 Spider III 75. I think it is just fine, but who am I? I spent all my Money on a higher end Acoustic to play when I need a real guitar.
LOL!
#19
Quote by .Jamison
Don't listen to this guy, the hellraiser has an original Floyd rose on it, do your home work next time.

Anyways this was the two the sales guy said were in my price range that were the best and I got the schecter, it's also made of mahogany and the Floyd on mine never goes out of tune don't listen to these people that are Gibosn fanboys. And the pickups are EMG's more expensive than most sets of Gibson crap.

I think you should sit down with each of em and take turns and find the right one for you


Yeah it says original floyd rose until you see it in the store, with a big fat "licensed" on it.

It's funny, because you own this guitar, so you'd kinda have to admit defeat and that your guitar sucks if you gave the Les Paul credit.

Btw, don't listen to this guy, he has a spider III for his amp. Oh and the sales guys told him to pick it, so it must be good. Countless times whenever I go into the store the "sales guys" are inexperieced (they're salesmen, they aren't going to give you a fair price) same with car dealers. Do you think they know how to be a mechanic? No. Does that mean all sales men are Jimi Hendrix's?

Go ahead, keep trying to be "hardcore" but don't forget what music is about hearing, and not look.
Last edited by nan0 at Jan 3, 2009,
#20
They're apples to oranges. I guess an SG would be right in the middle...
RIP Jasmine You.

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#21
Getting a guitar just for a whammy bar is a bad idea.
Keep the les paul.
I regret buying my guitar with a tremolo, i never use it, I'd much rather just have one with a string through bridge/ stop bar bridge.
you'll probably mess around with it a bit but it won't be worth it to get a completely different guitar for
Gear:
Fender CP Jazzmaster
Schecter PT Custom w/ Dimarzio crunch lab/liquifire
Marshall JCM2000 DSL+Orange 4x12
Orange Tiny Terror+Mesa Electra Dyne 2x12
Boss TU-2/NS-2/DD-6
Maxon OD808



MY BAND!
#22
Quote by nan0
*stupid BS that isn't true*

You, sir, fail on levels i rarely experience.

The hellraiser does in fact have an original floyd rose. I don't know which one you were looking at, but it obviously wasn't a hellrasier.

Please sir, i must be sight impaired. Please point out where the "big fat 'licensed'" is?



Also, the pickups are by no means cheap. EMG 81tw/89s? Cheap? Since when?

Also, i doubt the wood is cheaper. They use the same exact type of wood, except the hellraiser has a quilted maple top.

The hellraiser has 24 frets, a longer scale neck, and a heel so small you'd swear it's neck-thru.

And seriously, discrimination because he has a spider 3?
I'm sure if you knew next-to-nothing about a car and went into a car dealership, you'd trust the car dealer guy's advice more than your own.

Also, he never really gave the LP credit, just said that it was suggested to him because of the specs and price range.

Also, the spider valve series is not that bad, so screw off.

And .Jamison, the pickups on the LPVM that are stock are burstbucker pros, which actually cost more than EMGs, so i suggest you take your own advice and do your own homework too.


That is all.
#23
Quote by Pac_man0123
*schecter praise*



Yeah, the Schecter is great, but for what he wants to play, not so much. He's looking for classic rock/metal, black sabbath, etc.

The lp is more suited towards his tastes.
Gear:
Fender CP Jazzmaster
Schecter PT Custom w/ Dimarzio crunch lab/liquifire
Marshall JCM2000 DSL+Orange 4x12
Orange Tiny Terror+Mesa Electra Dyne 2x12
Boss TU-2/NS-2/DD-6
Maxon OD808



MY BAND!
#24
Quote by gucio93
Yeah, the Schecter is great, but for what he wants to play, not so much. He's looking for classic rock/metal, black sabbath, etc.

The lp is more suited towards his tastes.



Again with the stupid comments.

I wasn't praising the hellraiser, i was justifying the fact that nan0 was spewing false information about it, among other things.

I own a LPVM. Wouldn't trade it for a hellraiser.
#25
Quote by Pac_man0123


Again with the stupid comments.

I wasn't praising the hellraiser, i was justifying the fact that nan0 was spewing false information about it, among other things.

I own a LPVM. Wouldn't trade it for a hellraiser.


Maybe instead of calling everyone in this thread an idiot, and picking at their replies, it would be a better idea to give some constructive suggestions to the TS, instead of trying to inflate your own ego and showing everyone how smart you are.
Gear:
Fender CP Jazzmaster
Schecter PT Custom w/ Dimarzio crunch lab/liquifire
Marshall JCM2000 DSL+Orange 4x12
Orange Tiny Terror+Mesa Electra Dyne 2x12
Boss TU-2/NS-2/DD-6
Maxon OD808



MY BAND!
#26
Quote by gucio93
Maybe instead of calling everyone in this thread an idiot, and picking at their replies, it would be a better idea to give some constructive suggestions to the TS, instead of trying to inflate your own ego and showing everyone how smart you are.

*sigh*

I never called anyone an idiot. And, call me crazy, but i think disproving false information someone gives to someone else that's looking for advice IS helping. Maybe i'm just weird though.
#27
Quote by nan0
Gibson - Better resale value in the Futre.
- Quality
- Better Tone
- No Whammy

Schecter- Cheaper wood used
- Cheaper pick ups
- Floating Tremolo


The Gibson is much better quality, getting a guitar with a good trem around 1000, you'll probably have to shoot for an Ibanez with an edge pro, or something with an original floyd rose.

Btw, the amp you have is horrible. Seriously you need to look into getting rid of it ASAP.

As for the floyd difficulty, at first it'll seem hard and long (no pun intended) but people show you how to set it correctly on youtube so it floats right. Once you lock it in right, it stays in tune longer than any other type of guitar (most people wouldn't think so) but you've seen someone like Joe Satriani play live, he beats it to death after multible songs and it stays in tune.


You've obviously never played a Schecter if you're calling them cheap guitars. They also don't have cheap tremolos, they come with OFR, thanks. Cheap pick ups? EMG 81/85, thanks! Neck-thru mahogany and mahogany body with rosewood fret boad, THANKS!

Gibson is not better quality, simply a more famous name.
#28
Quote by nan0
Yeah it says original floyd rose until you see it in the store, with a big fat "licensed" on it.

It's funny, because you own this guitar, so you'd kinda have to admit defeat and that your guitar sucks if you gave the Les Paul credit.

Btw, don't listen to this guy, he has a spider III for his amp. Oh and the sales guys told him to pick it, so it must be good. Countless times whenever I go into the store the "sales guys" are inexperieced (they're salesmen, they aren't going to give you a fair price) same with car dealers. Do you think they know how to be a mechanic? No. Does that mean all sales men are Jimi Hendrix's?

Go ahead, keep trying to be "hardcore" but don't forget what music is about hearing, and not look.


You're a totally ignorant twat, you know that? Your username might as well be GibsonFanboiiii

You have obviously never played a Schecter, they are amazing guitars and YES it is an OFR, you probably saw some lower end model and told yourself they all suck. Any Gibson made in the past 5 years is horrific that I have played (see? I actually play / know something about the instruments I critique, thanks) and have felt cheap and have had numerous flaws in the paint etc.

Look hardcore? Yah dude nothing screams hardcore like maple tops and abolone sea-shells with a strat body shape.

You're such a bias tool.
#29
^^ You're being quite a tool yourself, mate. Not only are you repeating most of what i say, you're also getting some facts wrong. The new hellraisers come with the EMG 81tw/89 combo, which are coil tapped.

They are not neck thru (i believe the c-1 classic is the only one that is, or one of the few), they are set neck with their "ultra access" joint.

You must also be very biased against Gibson because i have a les paul vintage mahogany model and i love it. Great stock pickups, all mahogany, etc. etc. If gibson really made all their guitars as bad as you make them out to be, why would people like Slash, Jimmy Page, that one dude from journey whose name i forget, and the like still play them?

And yes, the maple top and abalone is on the guitar to make it geared towards metal guitarists. Look at ESP guitars for example.
#30
I personally disliked a Schecter I played with active pickups.. From the sound of it, it probably won't fit the style you are looking for.
#31
Play both and you should know which you like. Simply because they are apples to oranges. The LP has a fat neck joint, and certain techniques, especially sweeping above the 15th, are tougher because of that (for me anyway). I am comfortable with the neck sizes and fretsizes of both (LP=thicker neck, think D vs Hellraiser's C), but prefer the Schecter's 24 frets, because although I only go up to the 22nd usually, i like not having to play at the very end of the board, and i can fit my whole fingertip in there =D

But they are very different and that'll strike u when u play em.

Personally I would prefer the Schecter, but I dislike EMGs, so i'd go a Blackjack ATX FR instead. And yes the Hellraiser C1 FR and Blackjack ATX FR both have Original Floyd Rose's, none of this cheap licenced crap. Hold tune with whammy abuse fine, just more tedious to restring/retune. And the sustain is better with my Blackjack ATX FR than with my EMG-equipped Hellraiser non-FR.

I have a Blackjack ATX FR and a Hellraiser Avenger and think they're both tops. I play em both heaps. But I also mainly play Hard Rock/Progressive Rock/Metal[insert variant], rhythm and lead.
#32
When you guys say the Hellraiser is built for metal, are you talking about like death metal or hardcore, etc?

Because the heaviest I'll go is Metallica, Megadeth, and Pantera. I think my vintage LP can pull it off, but what is everyone's opinion?

As for my Spider Valve, people say it's not that bad. But does that mean I can get better for my price and my musical tastes?
#33
Quote by .Jamison
Don't listen to this guy, the hellraiser has an original Floyd rose on it, do your home work next time.

Anyways this was the two the sales guy said were in my price range that were the best and I got the schecter, it's also made of mahogany and the Floyd on mine never goes out of tune don't listen to these people that are Gibosn fanboys. And the pickups are EMG's more expensive than most sets of Gibson crap.


Do you really think EMGs are better than stock Gibson Les Paul pickups? Because that would be such a wrong statement


Anyway. If you still have the Epiphone SG you might consider the Hellraiser, simply for versatility's sake - but! if you already have the Les Paul it would be madness to get rid of it now. So for your current situation, I simply recommend waiting a while - if you're not sure you'll ever need the whack tremolo system, surely you don't need it rightaway - and then get a quality FR-type next to your LP.

Edit: about the spiders - no matter how good they become, they will always be modelling amps. And to some people that's just not as awesome as a real amp (much in the same way I prefer to listen to vinyl records over CDs, or worse, mp3). However, if that doesn't apply to you and you like the Valve-Spider's sound, the better for you because you already own it ^^.

That said, I use a Lin6 POD for practice sometimes and it doesn't do my guitars any justice, at all. But I think half the people on here bashing spider amps have never tried them (the same way Gibson's quality control is bashed, Squier guitars, etc).
Not to say there's no truth in that but. Well. Jimmy Page didn't even use an amp on Black Dog and that's a pretty awesome sound. So if you can make it work, good.

/rant
Phrases Label
The Bohemes
---
The White Strat w/Dimebucker
Tokai Explorer Korina
Ibanez RG570 Purple Neon
Gibson Les Paul Deluxe Ebony
Fender Telecaster Apple Red
Dano '59 Burgundy
Ibanez Artcore AM-73
Last edited by bornfidelity at Jan 3, 2009,
#35
to the first question i own a shecter hellrasier fr it has an origanall floyd rose emg active pickups and its an ovarall buitiful guitar. Gibsons are very well known for their greatness but i would go with the hellrasier if you want a floyd rose.
#36
Both great guitars for rock/metal... Gibsons are a little overpriced, but they're still good.

I say go with the LP if you don't need the Floyd Rose... if you want the Floyd, get the C1.
#37
Come on dude, don't even think about getting a Schecter over your Les Paul. The Vintage Mahogany is a fine guitar, I've played a few of them (as well as a few Schecters) and I must say they are worth the price. Sure they look a little bleh, but does the pointy Schecter brutal metal guitar really look that much better? And honestly, how much are you going to use the whammy bar? Who do you think you are?

But in any case, the decision should be up to you. Don't really listen too hard to me or any of the other idiots on this forum. Go to Guitar Center, bring your LP, play it and a few Schecters through the same amp, and see which one calls to you more. That's the best way to pick. Trust me, if you always took the advice of the nitwits on this website, you'd end up with some gay Ibanez or Schecter, an ISP Decimator, and and some over priced Hi-gain Peavey head, because thats what the poor souls languishing on these forums have been led to believe by a few geniuses who spend more time on the internet than they do with a guitar in their hands.

And by the way, your amp is fine. It's really, really hard to go wrong with any tube amp. Just goes to show how smart these people are. Before they finish reading your post they're already foaming at the mouth, telling you ZOMG SCHECTER FTW GIBSONS R OVERPRICED POOR QUALITY GARBAGE AND CHANGE YOUR ****TY LINE 6 AMP LOLOL
Jimi Hendrix > All

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Epiphone Les Paul (SD JB + 59)
Epiphone Dot (Dirty Fingers + 57 Classic)
Yamaha FG700S Acoustic

Crate V-18 212

Dunlop Original Crybaby
EHX Sovtek Big Muff
Boss DS-1
Boss BD-2
Boss BF-2
#38
^^ Erm.. the hellraiser c-1 isn't that pointy... and it's not a "br00t4lz metal g33t4r 1337" either... Quilted maple top? 3 per side tuners on a conservative headstock? abalone inlay? not exactly screaming "DEATH METAL" to me.
#39
Why does everyone think that the Hellraiser plays metal and nothing else? It's one of the most versatile guitars I can think of.

And to the above poster... Gibsons aren't poor quality garbage, but they ARE overpriced.
#40
Quote by slickerthnsleek
Why does everyone think that the Hellraiser plays metal and nothing else? It's one of the most versatile guitars I can think of.

And to the above poster... Gibsons aren't poor quality garbage, but they ARE overpriced.

Tbh, EMGs aren't that versatile, even if you do have a coil tap. I know someone that owns the guitar. He says the coil tap does help reduce a lot of excess noise but isn't that noticeable on cleans.

And if a guitar is great and feels good to you, can you really call it overpriced?
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