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#1
I don't like the way this country is headed -- the throathold the media has on society, the political scene, and I dont even fit in with most of the people Ive met here in my life. I had no choice to be born here. I want to leave here, and as many many other people have told me "if you dont like this contry, well then you can get out" and I plan to actually go through with that.

yes, I truly believe there is greater opportunity for me abroad. I need to be in a radically different situation, socially, politically, and economically, and the only true way I see is to leave.... well this is becoming a rant so I'll get to the point.

After this year I will be headed to a two year community college, and after, Im considering either finishing up here or transferring abroad (and attempt to gain permanent citizenship) in either canada or england.

if that doesnt work, I can finish pursuing my education here and then attempt to immigrate.

but how hard is it? I know doors aren't just wide open -- I actually want to gain permanent citizenship -- and I'm pretty sure its possible.

and the reason I mention only England and Canada, its that my primary language is English, and adapting to a new dialect of English than to work on a foreign language.

yeah I know there are other english-speaking countries, but I havent done much research on them.

anyway, what are your experiences/what do you think?
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#2
i don't know much about england and all i know about canada's policy is from hearsay, but you have a good chance of gaining citizenship by studying abroad.

from what i've been told about canada, you have to either have family that lives in the country or you have to already have a job set up before you can move there (unless you're studying there, of course).

but leaving isn't a bad idea, best wishes
#3
have you ever actually been out of the country?

its not that different....
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I have no opinion on this matter.
#4
I think when you leave the country for another, it's emigrate, not immigrate. Just FYI.

That said I don't know how hard it is to move. I assume you start with a work or student visa, depending on what you do. But even those are limited, having gone through the process myself. Can be expensive, as well. Celebrities do it as they please, so I'll also assume that it's a fairly common (if not long and tedious) practice.

Think about it. From the sounds of it you're still in high school---just know that a lot of opportunities arise as you get older. Or you can be like a lot of the rest of us in the Pit and allow expensive guitars, slutty women, and cheap alcohol tie you down here at home.
#5
Then you don't want England or Canada or Australia...you want Finland, or Estonia.
#6
Gaining citizenship? Very very difficult. I could be totally off with this, but I think it's a process that takes somewhere around two years.
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Last edited by BigFatSandwich at Jan 6, 2009,
#7
You won't find noticeable differences other than people driving on the wrong side of the road or igloos as major housing developments.
#8
Immigrants must obtain a visa from the Canadian Visa Office and fill out an application for permanent residence from the Consulate General of Canada. Applications take an average of 25 months to process. Bush dodgers arriving in Canada must also provide a valid passport, two copies of a detailed list of all personal items brought into the country and two copies of a list of all items on the way, and proof of enough funds to cover expenses for the first six months.

http://www.slate.com/id/2109135/
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#9
if you give up your U.S. citizenship. you will NEVER GET IT BACK!!!! you better think hrd on that one before you do it. do your research on this kinda thing.
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#10
Quote by BigFatSandwich


"Bush dodgers" part made me lol. Boy do we hate that ****.
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#11
Funny, I was thinking of something similar. I am in Community College now (just finished my first semester) and although I'd love to go overseas (to Britain, just for the sake of not having to learn a new language) but I think Canada is a better or more realistic option. I'd use work as an excuse to get out of the US. Basically my plan is to gradually move north. I live in Philadelphia now, so I might just skip up to Boston when I'm done school, then maybe Toronto. Although that goal sort of clashes with my plan to have my own business someday, or maybe it doesn't. Gaining experience in my field and earning/saving money to start up the business might actually be easier if I go city to city so I can really sink my teeth into the industry.

I guess the main thing is that I have to agree that the US is no longer a place where I can feel secure... or even sane. Everything has just gone wrong here and unless things change, I'm out.
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#12
Probably is harder than coming INTO the United States... i mean for **** sakes look at texas.... WERE GETTING OVERTHROWN
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#13
of course your in community college. go to a real college, then maybe you will have enough education to realize that our country is a HELL of alot better then the ones your trying to go to. have fun in socialized canada where medicine is about as crappy as the doctors who practice it. uneducated idiots, unless you want to live under socialism where your ACTUALLY not safe, id suggest living in america...
#14
Quote by HIM%(^
of course your in community college. go to a real college, then maybe you will have enough education to realize that our country is a HELL of alot better then the ones your trying to go to. have fun in socialized canada where medicine is about as crappy as the doctors who practice it. uneducated idiots, unless you want to live under socialism where your ACTUALLY not safe, id suggest living in america...


I'm pretty sure you're the reason he wants to leave.
#15
well, looks like HIM proved hes a moron. dont feed the trolls....


but anyway, for the people who are wanting to leave the us, on what are you basing your opinion that canada or the UK is better?
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I have no opinion on this matter.
#16
Quote by Josh Shiells
Then you don't want England or Canada or Australia...you want Finland, or Estonia.


possibly, I'm not 100% set on anywhere yet, and I am in highschool.

I feel the government is terrible here, and yes, I've researched into various types and forms of government, and I feel that the Parliamentary systems evident in many other nations actually are better then our 3-branch system.

I also don't like the ideas on which this country was based. I have no problem with democracy, but in reality I don't feel our representative democracy represents very well. I also kind of like a bigger mix of socialism as well, and while the US may be on its way there slowly, I still think it will be quite awhile. Some things need to be regulated by the government -- Canada's healthcare system being an ever famous example.

and no, this country was not truly established by and for the people. It was established by a rich minority. I'm not making things up when I say the "fore fathers" were wealthy businessmen who wanted more money and realized that if they rebelled against England they could multiply their trade opportunities with other nations, and become much much richer.

not to mention Americans have a warped idea about our history. I've had people tell me things like "America's always had open doors to immigrants". This, friends, is BS. Ever hear about the Chinese exclusion act or the gentleman's agreement? Oh and there have been quotas for people from certain nations that were extremely biased since the beginning.

and in all reality the way our system is set up, to me it feels more like a representative Oligarchy rather than democracy. Sure, we can vote, the voting is legitimate, but the people who truly gain political opportunity are almost always rich and are ALWAYS extremely biased and probably corrupt. and yes, I know this is the nature of government everywhere, but we are the only nation to outright lie about this and MORE that Ive ever seen, at least to this extent.

And then there's the current issues -- war and terrible foreign entanglements -- I'm not against foreign policy, I'm all for it, but the way we've handled things just doesn't work. We really have acted as "world police" and bullies in the past and the present.

to be honest, I truly and honestly feel that America will fall someday, long, long before other nations. and that it will fall hard. And even if it doesn't, that doesn't change how I feel about it.

I just kind of actually want to act on my beliefs. I don't wanna be someone who complains and doesn't go through with it. I may end up staying in the end, but at this point its something Im seriously considering...

just thought I'd sum up how I feel
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Last edited by spiroth10 at Jan 6, 2009,
#17
I'm pretty sure England isn't exactly all too different from Canada/the States compared to the rest of Europe. If you really want some place that's different, you would do better actually learning the basics of a different language while you're still relatively young and going on a vacation to the place you're interested in before you move there.
#18
Quote by spiroth10
I just kind of actually want to act on my beliefs. I don't wanna be someone who complains and doesn't go through with it. I may end up staying in the end, but at this point its something Im seriously considering...

just thought I'd sum up how I feel

Why not stay here and help do a little bit to change things?
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#19
Quote by PaperStSoapCo
Funny, I was thinking of something similar. I am in Community College now (just finished my first semester) and although I'd love to go overseas (to Britain, just for the sake of not having to learn a new language) but I think Canada is a better or more realistic option. I'd use work as an excuse to get out of the US. Basically my plan is to gradually move north. I live in Philadelphia now, so I might just skip up to Boston when I'm done school, then maybe Toronto. Although that goal sort of clashes with my plan to have my own business someday, or maybe it doesn't. Gaining experience in my field and earning/saving money to start up the business might actually be easier if I go city to city so I can really sink my teeth into the industry.

I guess the main thing is that I have to agree that the US is no longer a place where I can feel secure... or even sane. Everything has just gone wrong here and unless things change, I'm out.


yeah I pretty much totally agree with you there. Guess I'm not the only one who felt that way.
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#20
instead of bitching about the country..you should probably be filling out the common application so you can actually go to college and make money. our country is fine...its actually the european countries that are falling. look at iceland...
#22
sure, america has pretty much peaked, but britain pretty much peaked a few hundred years ago when they were oppressing people on every continent. and canada? well, theyve got the best hockey teams in the world, and thats nothing to shake a stick at.

if you were intelligent you would go to a country that will be important in the next century, like china.
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I have no opinion on this matter.
#23
You do know, over here in 'England' there are OTHER regions besides England?

I hate it when people refer to the UK as England -.- It's like Wales, Scotland and N.Ireland don't exist or something...

Btw, cities like London and Bracknel = very expensive to live in.
#24
Quote by Zugunruhe


if you were intelligent you would go to a country that will be important in the next century, like china.


Of course, that place is fucking hard to get anywhere in, and the cost of living can be ridiculous.
#25
Quote by Avedas
Of course, that place is fucking hard to get anywhere in, and the cost of living can be ridiculous.



hard to get anywhere in? they do have trains and buses and airplanes and boats and taxis and subways.....

and the cost of living only really applies to hong kong. i found the rest of it to be very very cheap. you could get by on half of what you would have to spend in america or canada.
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#26
Quote by HIM%(^
of course your in community college. go to a real college, then maybe you will have enough education to realize that our country is a HELL of alot better then the ones your trying to go to. have fun in socialized canada where medicine is about as crappy as the doctors who practice it. uneducated idiots, unless you want to live under socialism where your ACTUALLY not safe, id suggest living in america...


Quote by Kapps
I'm pretty sure you're the reason he wants to leave.


+1, Kapps. Blind nationalism is on par with blind faith on the list of things I despise. Both are good enough reasons for someone to leave this country, because those two values are held up pretty high and I can't understand why more people don't see how phony they are.

And community college is just college for people who either A) wanted to go back to school after a long period of time or B) can't really afford all four years of a "real" college. The curriculum really isn't different. And many of the smartest people I know have either gone to or currently attend CC.
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#27
Quote by PaperStSoapCo
+1, Kapps. Blind nationalism is on par with blind faith on the list of things I despise. Both are good enough reasons for someone to leave this country, because those two values are held up pretty high and I can't understand why more people don't see how phony they are.

Isn't it the same in other nations?
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#28
Quote by BigFatSandwich
Isn't it the same in other nations?


Your probably right, but the amount of ignorance that goes along with it probably varies greatly.
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#29
Quote by Kyle.E
You do know, over here in 'England' there are OTHER regions besides England?

I hate it when people refer to the UK as England -.- It's like Wales, Scotland and N.Ireland don't exist or something...

Btw, cities like London and Bracknel = very expensive to live in.


yes, sorry if I made that blatant error. although I didnt think I referred to it as the UK, I thought I specifically stated England?

although that would most likely be very difficult, as I'm not ignorant of the overcrowding issues there.

and as for a CC, Im going to one because 1) I can get in free 2) I'm poor and pretty much cant afford it if its not free 3) I can get higher grades there then I did in highschool and transfer to a better school later.

Sure they're easier to get into, but they're not a bar to opportunity as everyone seems to think, they're the opposite! If used correctly you can land yourself the same place as the highest professionals at half the cost. hell, you could transfer to an ivy league school if you keep a 4.0, and then youd STILL have a great diploma.
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#30
Quote by spiroth10
I feel the government is terrible here, and yes, I've researched into various types and forms of government, and I feel that the Parliamentary systems evident in many other nations actually are better then our 3-house legislature.

I hope that was a typo, because you really shouldn't complain about the government when you don't even understand the basics. Our legislature is 2 houses.

I completely understand your wanting to get away from this government though. Just know that government is corrupt and self serving everywhere and given the choices, America's a pretty good place to make a life for yourself. Not saying it's the best, but it's near the top.
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#31
Quote by PaperStSoapCo
Blind nationalism is on par with blind faith on the list of things I despise. Both are good enough reasons for someone to leave this country, because those two values are held up pretty high and I can't understand why more people don't see how phony they are.

so come to california. we have so many people jumping onto the "i hate america" trend, its rediculous. theres unfunny ironic bumper stickers as far as the eye can see.
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#32
You're going to find that those countries are full of assholes as well. At least Bush didn't try to suspend congress like the country north of the border.
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#33
Come to Australia! just sneak in on an Illeagal fishing vesel!
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#34
Quote by pr0pedestrian
I hope that was a typo, because you really shouldn't complain about the government when you don't even understand the basics. Our legislature is 2 houses.

I completely understand your wanting to get away from this government though. Just know that government is corrupt and self serving everywhere and given the choices, America's a pretty good place to make a life for yourself. Not saying it's the best, but it's near the top.


yes it was, I meant 3 branch system, but for some reason the house system was on my mind, so freudian slip.

I was actually consciously trying to stop myself from typing that cuz I knew I was thinking about it, but I guess I epic failed, and my subconscious won out.

I'll edit it and fix it.
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Last edited by spiroth10 at Jan 6, 2009,
#35
As much as I don't mean to be nationalist or whatever, but Australia is a pretty cool place to live.

Everyone here just likes living and we are very well spirited sort of people. Well the majority, anyway. You can take a walk in nearly every town at 2am and feel completely safe. The Government is probably one of the best here, we had the option to turn into a republic but we decided to stay westminster because we pretty much like it the way it is.

Again, I don't mean to brag, but seriously, some people really need to look at Australia as a place to live.
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#36
Quote by zacharydak
As much as I don't mean to be nationalist or whatever, but Australia is a pretty cool place to live.

Everyone here just likes living and we are very well spirited sort of people. Well the majority, anyway. You can take a walk in nearly every town at 2am and feel completely safe. The Government is probably one of the best here, we had the option to turn into a republic but we decided to stay westminster because we pretty much like it the way it is.

Again, I don't mean to brag, but seriously, some people really need to look at Australia as a place to live.


But isn't australia home to the most dedliest spiders, snakes, etc?
#37
Quote by guiTardif123
But isn't australia home to the most dedliest spiders, snakes, etc?


& Crocodiles, don't forget the crocodiles!
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#38
I'm more worried about Russel Crow
Quote by Article
She pulled off his left testicle and tried to swallow it, before spitting it out. A friend handed it back to Mr Jones saying "That's yours"

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#40
Quote by gunners fan
& Crocodiles, don't forget the crocodiles!


And sting rays.
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