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#1
So I get St. Anger (Metallica), and listen to the tracks, and it pisses me off how the bass is inaudible, Or at least on the studio version. The only section where to my ears I can hear is that soft little bit in after the heavy thrashing. I don't understand, they got their new bassist in the time of St Anger, obviously, he would accept, as it was 1 million dollars, but wouldn't he be a bit pissed off that his basslines are ****ing inaudible, making little ****ing difference in the studio version? I can hear some parts say, when he plays one note, with the others, but then he fades away when the thrashing comes in. I don't think he scoops his mids does he? Or may it be the fact that they're in drop c? I dunno, but I think its a bit pointless to have him playing, when hes making **** all of a difference.

/Rant over.

What do you guys think? And what ways can I improve the bass in the song, other than new headphones, as I have got new ones.

EDIT: Fine Bob Rock then. Makes no difference, If I was Rob, I'd be pissed off, entering at a time when this POS comes out, and he can't even be heard when playing it.
Last edited by TonalPerfection at Feb 18, 2009,
#2
Point of thread being?
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#3
Rob Trujillo did not play on this album
He was hired after it was recorded I think
Bob Rock the producer played the bass on St. Anger
You can't really improve the sound because you can't change whats in the file
Although changing EQ settings might help
#4
you failed within the first 5 words.
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#5
It's the same with AJFA, and alot of other metal albums
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#6
Quote by TonalPerfection
So I get St. Anger (Metallica), and listen to the tracks, and it pisses me off how the bass is inaudible, Or at least on the studio version. The only section where to my ears I can hear is that soft little bit in after the heavy thrashing. I don't understand, they got their new bassist in the time of St Anger, obviously, he would accept, as it was 1 million dollars, but wouldn't he be a bit pissed off that his basslines are ****ing inaudible, making little ****ing difference in the studio version? I can hear some parts say, when he plays one note, with the others, but then he fades away when the thrashing comes in. I don't think he scoops his mids does he? Or may it be the fact that they're in drop c? I dunno, but I think its a bit pointless to have him playing, when hes making **** all of a difference.

/Rant over.

What do you guys think? And what ways can I improve the bass in the song, other than new headphones, as I have got new ones.


Bob **** played the bass on that album, not Robert Trujillo. Doesn't change the fact Trujillo isn't nearly audible enough on Death Magnetic, though.
#7
Its always been like that
btw why would you buy St. Anger?
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#8
Quote by Sakattack75
Its always been like that
btw why would you buy St. Anger?

Everyone calls it ****, one way to find out for myself is to actually buy it.

Oh, and on Death Magnetic, I can hear it, but yeah, its not as audible as it could be.

And to the guy who asked what the point of the thread was, I don't understand why these metal bands have bassists for no reason. Its barely "filling out the sound" if you can hear none of it.
Last edited by TonalPerfection at Feb 18, 2009,
#9
Quote by TonalPerfection
Everyone calls it ****, one way to find out for myself is to actually buy it.

Oh, and on Death Magnetic, I can hear it, but yeah, its not as audible as it could be.

And to the guy who asked what the point of the thread was, I don't understand why these metal bands have bassists for no reason. Its barely "filling out the sound" if you can hear none of it.


Like it or loathe it, Metal is generally a guitar dominated genre. Yes, some bands have prominent bass players (e.g. Maiden), but they're the exceptions. There's nothing to understand, and if you don't like it you can either sit and complain or go out and form a bass-prominent metal band.

Bass in metal comes into its own Live, IMO. Studio recordings played at home probably won't be going through a powerful subwoofer system like at a live gig, where even a heavily scooped bass following the guitar will be felt.
#10
Quote by GaijinFoot
you failed within the first 5 words.


Haha +1
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#11
Quote by Jateca
Like it or loathe it, Metal is generally a guitar dominated genre. Yes, some bands have prominent bass players (e.g. Maiden), but they're the exceptions. There's nothing to understand, and if you don't like it you can either sit and complain or go out and form a bass-prominent metal band.

Bass in metal comes into its own Live, IMO. Studio recordings played at home probably won't be going through a powerful subwoofer system like at a live gig, where even a heavily scooped bass following the guitar will be felt.

Good point, buy tbh, classic metal, death metal, probably the most prominent genres of metal itself, very audible. Death, Atheist, Cannibal Corpse, Necrophagist, and fo classic metal bands like Black Sabbath, just to name a few, have very audible bass,not necessarily as dominant instrumetns, but to the level of being easy to hear, and I wouldn't call these bands exceptions at all. In fact, thrash metal, black metal and few others are the only ones I would see as without audible bass. When metal comes to my mind, I think of the bass. IMO, the bassist gives metal its oomph, but what i don't like is when there is no point of it even being there, such as the case of St. Anger.
Last edited by TonalPerfection at Feb 18, 2009,
#12
Quote by TonalPerfection
Everyone calls it ****, one way to find out for myself is to actually buy it.


All you needed was to go to youtube and watch the music video for "St. Anger".

You would have drawn the same conclusions instantly.
#14
Am I the only one that got a giggle out of that title?

Quote by TonalPerfection
EDIT: Fine Bob Rock then. Makes no difference, If I was Rob, I'd be pissed off, entering at a time when this POS comes out, and he can't even be heard when playing it.


Glad you're not Rob then.
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#15
I can hear the bass pperfectly in st. anger and death magnet. Metallica for me has always been one of the only metal bands i can hear the bass in.
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#16
Its always been like that
QUOTE]
Ummm...Cliff Burton,Jason Newstead?You could hear them fine.
#17
Quote by TonalPerfection
Any more opinions


Is that a question? I'm confused.

Anyway - I think Bob Rock will always be the best bassist Metallica has ever had.
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#18
Quote by Nutter_101
Is that a question? I'm confused.

Anyway - I think Bob Rock will always be the best bassist Metallica has ever had.

No way, he is one arrogant ****.
#19
Quote by TonalPerfection
No way, he is one arrogant ****.


He did exactly what a bassist is meant to do - his playing was perfect. His arrogance is entirely justified. He makes Burton, Newstead and Trujillo look like rank amateurs.
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#21
Quote by Deliriumbassist
Bob Rock is the sh*t. What are you on about?


Some may say better than Lighting Wentz himself
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...It's the last place I was seen before I lost myself



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#23
are you sure you can't hear the bass? It's been a while since i listened to it, but I don't remember it lacking bottom end.
#24
Quote by Deliriumbassist
Bob Rock is the sh*t. What are you on about?


Oh god, not this again, atleast it's not wentz this time.

No one's forcing you to listen to st anger, right TS? So why don't you just pop in kill'em all, sit down, shut up and enjoy some good ole' audible basslines.(this message was not meant to be offensive.)

On the subject of st anger though, didn't Bob Rock mix out himself? So he probably wouldn't be pissed and doesn't feel bass should be prominent.
Last edited by Sylvanus at Feb 18, 2009,
#25
I have great respect for Bob Rock - he managed to make a Alembic bass almost completely inaudible, and when it was audible, he managed to make it sound like a someone screwing a giant rubber band.
Quote by thefitz
That's because you're a 13 year old who only focuses on guitars. I bet most people can't tell the difference between your voice and your mother's.
#26
Quote by TonalPerfection
Everyone calls it ****, one way to find out for myself is to actually buy it.

Oh, and on Death Magnetic, I can hear it, but yeah, its not as audible as it could be.

And to the guy who asked what the point of the thread was, I don't understand why these metal bands have bassists for no reason. Its barely "filling out the sound" if you can hear none of it.


because you cant officially be a band with out atleast one drummer one guitar player and one bassist, im sure if it was up to 80% of metal bands there would be no bass player at all but they cant so they make sure the bass player is as close to useless as they can in hopes that someday all bass players will just stop playing metal at all
#27
Quote by bass-boy-garith
because you cant officially be a band with out atleast one drummer one guitar player and one bassist, im sure if it was up to 80% of metal bands there would be no bass player at all but they cant so they make sure the bass player is as close to useless as they can in hopes that someday all bass players will just stop playing metal at all

Here's hoping
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#29
Quote by bass-boy-garith
because you cant officially be a band with out atleast one drummer one guitar player and one bassist, im sure if it was up to 80% of metal bands there would be no bass player at all but they cant so they make sure the bass player is as close to useless as they can in hopes that someday all bass players will just stop playing metal at all


I seriously doubt that. I play bass in a metal band, and I have no problem with the genre. Some of the best bass players around (ever?) have played metal.

I think the level of the bass on metal records is to do with wanting to achieve a crushing guitar tone. As has already been stated, metal is a guitar-driven genre, so the guitars are pushed up front in the mix. Then you have the classic "mid-scooped" metal guitar tone, with heaps of bottom end. so that eats up part of our frequencies, as does the kick drum.

Its a genre of extremes, the vocals, drums and guitars all have to be turned up so it sounds "metal". Im more than happy to have a mid-heavy bass tone to cut through, and to turn myself down a bit in the mix to have a great sounding record. Except during my solo, thats gotta be loud

Edit: Bob Rock better than Burton or Newsted? Hmm. I hope I'm missing the sarcasm...
Last edited by to_the_grave at Feb 19, 2009,
#31
The best bassist doesn't need to be heard. That's the guitarist and singers job.
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#32
Quote by Nutter_101
The best bassist doesn't need to be heard. That's the guitarist and singers job.

I'm sorry, this is my fault, and don't call me a complete spazztard, but can you go a bit deeper?
#33
Quote by bass-boy-garith
because you cant officially be a band with out atleast one drummer one guitar player and one bassist, im sure if it was up to 80% of metal bands there would be no bass player at all but they cant so they make sure the bass player is as close to useless as they can in hopes that someday all bass players will just stop playing metal at all


Two people can be a band.

The definition of band is 'a group of musicians,' and a group is any collection or more than one object. Autechre is a band, even though neither of them play a traditional instrument.

Pig Destroyer doesn't have a bassist, their guitarist tunes super low, crank the bass and points a cab facing down into the stage to help cover those bass frequencies.

GOOD metal bands realize the importance of a solid bass foundation. Maybe the bands YOU listen to don't. But even Meshuggah, who tune their 8-string guitars to F# over the low E on a bass if I recall correctly, still have a bassist. They logically could easily do without one, but they don't.

And besides, Metallica has always ALWAYS had **** production.
#34
Quote by Wonthefu
Two people can be a band.

The definition of band is 'a group of musicians,' and a group is any collection or more than one object. Autechre is a band, even though neither of them play a traditional instrument.

Pig Destroyer doesn't have a bassist, their guitarist tunes super low, crank the bass and points a cab facing down into the stage to help cover those bass frequencies.

GOOD metal bands realize the importance of a solid bass foundation. Maybe the bands YOU listen to don't. But even Meshuggah, who tune their 8-string guitars to F# over the low E on a bass if I recall correctly, still have a bassist. They logically could easily do without one, but they don't.

And besides, Metallica has always ALWAYS had **** production.


notice how said 80% of metal bands, not all metal, and not all metal bands are crappy, when i said to be considered a band i meant a conventional "mainstream" normal band, which the 80% of metal bands i was referring to supposedly are. and the bands i listen to ARE good metal and none metal bands and the bass has its equal and fair share; unlike the 80% of metal bands i was referring to.
#35
most bass lines are inaudible these days.

but, believe me you would notice the difference if it wasnt there.
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#36
Whats this with bassiest always having to play complicated basslines, and being the front man. We fit in the mix which metal bassist's do. The bassist for jimmy eat world fits perfectly with the band, yet he seems to play just straight root notes. And i really like it. Give not cutting through a slack, next you know bassist's will be wanting to be the main man, and having their own gigs with people supporting them. Would the world end?
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#37
Quote by fatgoogle
Whats this with bassiest always having to play complicated basslines, and being the front man. We fit in the mix which metal bassist's do. The bassist for jimmy eat world fits perfectly with the band, yet he seems to play just straight root notes. And i really like it. Give not cutting through a slack, next you know bassist's will be wanting to be the main man, and having their own gigs with people supporting them. Would the world end?

It's not a straight choice between boring root notes and TEH WILD UNTAMED BASS SOLO WIZ MAXIMUM DISTORITON. If you can't give roots notes interesting melodic fills that slot under the band and make it groove, frankly you're just being lazy. Bass is not about being the frontman, however it's also not about doing the boring job or being the "crappy third guitarist".

Bass is a subtle instrument, it doesn't need to be in the foreground at all, but don't underestimate that it can and should be interesting and musical whenever possible. Now, if only all bassists thought like that...
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#38
Im not, im saying bassist should play their role in a playing situation, like a guitarist and a drummer, singert, and not complain about other people's choices.
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#39
Quote by fatgoogle
Im not, im saying bassist should play their role in a playing situation, like a guitarist and a drummer, singert, and not complain about other people's choices.

Oh, in that case I agree.
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#40
Im very bad, at woring things, and take a hugely round about way of saying it. But i hope people get the general jist. But i can still hear the bass perfectly in metallica songs.
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