#1
Consequentialism = The ends justify the means. Is it okay to do something wrong or evil or what-have-you in order to achieve a positive better end goal?

What I'm not sure is, is a bad deed always a bad deed or is there gray area in it? And does the end result change the nature of the action?
Whatever happened to sweet Jane?
#4
*Chug chug chug chug*
Am I eevvvvillll...
*Chug chug chug duunn duun*
Yes I am!!

Anywho, I just do evil/bad **** because it's fun.
Meh.
Quote by SteveHouse
This thread is officially about sucking Sleaze off for a sig.


Quote by tayroar
Hey Sleaze I'll give you a blowjob if you sig me. Maybe even some nudey photos?


Quote by crazy8rgood


Sleaze, that made me lulz in my pants.


Quote by 36mikeyb36
hahaha Sleaze i'd give you my mom for that one.
Last edited by Sleaze Disease at Mar 9, 2009,
#5
it depends on the circumstances, but, generally speaking, no, the ends do not justify the means.

edit:IMO
You're using UG classic, congratulations.
You should be using UG classic.




E-Married to Guitar0Player

http://the llama forum because its gone forever which sucks and I hate it.
#6
It's OK for ME to do evil things to others for a better end goal. But not for anyone to do evil things to ME, for any reason.
#7
Quote by Sleaze Disease
*Chug chug chug chug*
Am I eevvvvillll...
*Chug chug chug duunn duun*
Yes I am!!

Anywho, I just do evil/bad **** because it's fun.
Meh.

What?
Whatever happened to sweet Jane?
#9
Quote by MightyAl
It's OK for ME to do evil things to others for a better end goal. But not for anyone to do evil things to ME, for any reason.

I actually think it is that way for the most part, which is why I kind of have the problem with it. It's only good when you are part of the end goal, not the means.

Edit: It's not grey!
Whatever happened to sweet Jane?
Last edited by DoTheEvolution at Mar 9, 2009,
#11
There's an example of this: if you could go back in time to when hitler was a baby would it be OK to kill the little fuc ker?
#14
Quote by Giamancat
There's an example of this: if you could go back in time to when hitler was a baby would it be OK to kill the little fuc ker?

No. Causality isn't something to screw with.
#17
Quote by uk.mace
It's a song by Diamond Head, covered by Metallica.
And it's always been grey for us Brits, and we invented this goddamn language. Get your sh*t out of it!

I understand, American's ****ed everything up.

Forgive us? Well, me at least.
Whatever happened to sweet Jane?
#18
Quote by Flipaningage
did you just go see watchmen?



lol, i was just thinking that as i was scrolling down through this thread, and saw this.
Quote by wlcm2themachine
Does this rag smell like chloroform to you?





Quote by ChemicalFire
You sir, are a god amongst men



MY GEAR:
...apparently, i have too much. i cant list it without going over the character limit.
#19
It's fine, for example if somebody breaks a toe or manages to get to adulthood without learning to read properly, killing them is acceptable and should be rewarded, as it puts them out of their misery and makes the world a better place.
I've Made You A Drawing of a Giraffe Fucking an Elephant. Notice How His Moustache Looks Just Like Mine.

Your Mother's Got a Penis
#20
great movie and great novel ...... and its there is a grey space in the good evil thing but also its subjective
Peavey XXX
B-52 AT 100
Peavey XXl cab
Boss Gt10
Jackson dinky
PRS Paul Alender SE
#22
Quote by MightyAl
No. Causality isn't something to screw with.
I was reading up on some theories and stuff, and let me tell you, I read somewhere that if you did go back in time to kill Hitler than someone else would have eventually done the same thing he did anyway. If something is meant to happen, it will, doesn't matter who.
#23
Quote by jetfuel495
I was reading up on some theories and stuff, and let me tell you, I read somewhere that if you did go back in time to kill Hitler than someone else would have eventually done the same thing he did anyway. If something is meant to happen, it will, doesn't matter who.

Ah, but if you went back in time to kill baby Hitler, then adult Hitler would never have been Chancellor, so you wouldn;t have known to go back in time to kill baby Hitler, so then adult Hitler would become Chancellor, and then you'd go back in time to kill baby Hitler, which would prevent adult Hitler from becoming Chancellor, and I'm getting dizzy with this circular argument.
#24
Quote by jetfuel495
I was reading up on some theories and stuff, and let me tell you, I read somewhere that if you did go back in time to kill Hitler than someone else would have eventually done the same thing he did anyway. If something is meant to happen, it will, doesn't matter who.



well... since it's either way not going to happen (timetravel + your destiny theory being proven right) we might as well just call it grey.

sorry for the useless comment but it's gray

0000000000000 <- gray

yep, that's gray alright
#25
I think this thread now is just about the dilemma of is it grey or gray?
Whatever happened to sweet Jane?
#26
Quote by DoTheEvolution
I think this thread now is just about the dilemma of is it grey or gray?


it's "gray" in USA and canada and "grey" in UK and australia.
#27
So.....there is gray area on the word gray?

See what I did there?


/cuts
Whatever happened to sweet Jane?
#28
Quote by DoTheEvolution
it's "gray" in USA and canada and "grey" in UK and australia.


or is it?


hmmm spose that could be like a gray/grey area in the english language.
just keep it confusing man. tis good for the pit.
Last edited by Will-kun at Mar 9, 2009,
#30
I think I should just start alternating which one I use from post to post. Just to play it safe, you never know, it could be something God asks of you when you die.

GOD: Which way did you spell grey?
Me: G-R-A-Y
GOD: WRONG! Hell!
Whatever happened to sweet Jane?
#31
I would certainly vote for gray. cause grey sounds like ghey (no homo...foob) and gray sounds like.... gnarly or something.
#32
As far as I am concerned their is no epitome of "evil" or "bad." There are deeds society deems inappropriate (such as rape and murder), but most things have a time and place. Even murder is justifiable in many cases. I suppose the only "evil" that could never really be justified is rape, unless of course you follow the Bible. But that is another story.

In reality, the ends should justify the means. That is how I live my life. Occasionally I will cheat on a test because it is justified by passing. Some may have a dilemma with this, but I do not. In more extreme situations, I have heard: would you steal money to buy medicine for your dying wife? In this case, yes. I try to live an ethical life, but ethics and morals as a whole are too black and white for one to properly live and enjoy life. This is why I am not religious, as it just insights fear into the believers to live in a black and white world.
Check out Hear the Indie for music reviews, interviews, and more.

Want a review? Send me a PM or email through the contact form on my site.
#33
Quote by Ulalume
As far as I am concerned their is no epitome of "evil" or "bad." There are deeds society deems inappropriate (such as rape and murder), but most things have a time and place. Even murder is justifiable in many cases. I suppose the only "evil" that could never really be justified is rape, unless of course you follow the Bible. But that is another story.

In reality, the ends should justify the means. That is how I live my life. Occasionally I will cheat on a test because it is justified by passing. Some may have a dilemma with this, but I do not. In more extreme situations, I have heard: would you steal money to buy medicine for your dying wife? In this case, yes. I try to live an ethical life, but ethics and morals as a whole are too black and white for one to properly live and enjoy life. This is why I am not religious, as it just insights fear into the believers to live in a black and white world.

I tend to agree with this actually. I guess there is a time to everything and nothing is really set in stone as this or that I suppose.
Whatever happened to sweet Jane?
#34
Quote by Ulalume
As far as I am concerned their is no epitome of "evil" or "bad." There are deeds society deems inappropriate (such as rape and murder), but most things have a time and place. Even murder is justifiable in many cases. I suppose the only "evil" that could never really be justified is rape, unless of course you follow the Bible. But that is another story.

In reality, the ends should justify the means. That is how I live my life. Occasionally I will cheat on a test because it is justified by passing. Some may have a dilemma with this, but I do not. In more extreme situations, I have heard: would you steal money to buy medicine for your dying wife? In this case, yes. I try to live an ethical life, but ethics and morals as a whole are too black and white for one to properly live and enjoy life. This is why I am not religious, as it just insights fear into the believers to live in a black and white world.


you're spamming the thread, this has nothing to do with grey/gray!
#35
Quote by Ulalume
As far as I am concerned their is no epitome of "evil" or "bad." There are deeds society deems inappropriate (such as rape and murder), but most things have a time and place. Even murder is justifiable in many cases. I suppose the only "evil" that could never really be justified is rape, unless of course you follow the Bible. But that is another story.

In reality, the ends should justify the means. That is how I live my life. Occasionally I will cheat on a test because it is justified by passing. Some may have a dilemma with this, but I do not. In more extreme situations, I have heard: would you steal money to buy medicine for your dying wife? In this case, yes. I try to live an ethical life, but ethics and morals as a whole are too black and white for one to properly live and enjoy life. This is why I am not religious, as it just insights fear into the believers to live in a black and white world.


This. Almost any means can be justified in some situations, it depends on context.
#36
you're spamming the thread, this has nothing to do with grey/gray!


That was the epitome of gray!
Check out Hear the Indie for music reviews, interviews, and more.

Want a review? Send me a PM or email through the contact form on my site.
#38
Quote by DoTheEvolution
Consequentialism = The ends justify the means. Is it okay to do something wrong or evil or what-have-you in order to achieve a positive better end goal?

What I'm not sure is, is a bad deed always a bad deed or is there gray area in it? And does the end result change the nature of the action?


The end cannot justify the means.

EDIT: UNLESS it drastically affects someone else and it's a good thing when you do the bad thing. see below.

Quote by Ulalume
In more extreme situations, I have heard: would you steal money to buy medicine for your dying wife? In this case, yes.


Here's a spot where i can say that my post just failed. if someone told me that the only way to save my wife was to steal money for her, i probably would do it. i would fail at actually getting the money, because i would be too shaken at the fact that i was stealing , but i would try small things that only affect myself, like cheating on a test, however, i would never do.

CONTRADICTORY EDIT: but then if u think about it from the POV of the person being stolen from, it's a bad thing again. confusing...
Hell has a 2-for-1 deal and i'm inviting you!

IT'S TIME TO TAKE THE TIME!


We're all waiting
For something

A whisper of silence
A reflection of darkness

Something lost to be found
Last edited by hauntu4ever at Mar 11, 2009,
#39
It truly depends on what is going to be done to get the end goal, some things are worth doing, even if they are wrong, if it helps you reach the end goal. But some things are not worth doing to get to the end goal.

selling your soul is worth it, so meet me at the crossroads.


lol
::type i'm here to stir the $h!t

#40
i think i should have authority on whether it's grey or gray....

it's grey,
let's face it, grey just looks kooler than gray

edit: it's grey, i mean on the whole good n evil thing....
it's all about proper judgement....
i.e. If your buddy is about to jump off a cliff koz he's drunk, it's perfectly fine to punch him in the face n lay him out.... n if u decide to get a few cheap shots in on the bastard while he's out....

well, i wont tell
Last edited by greyeyedfire at Mar 11, 2009,