#1
Hello again everybody! It's been awhile, and I'm probably not remembered too much, but I have a progressive piece to give you all! Here it is :]

It clocks in at a little over 10 minutes I think... I haven't timed it, and this is only the first part. I've spent a good bit of time working on this song, and I feel that everything up to Verse III is really good... I think it goes downhill after that, but I would like everybodies opinions on that.

I would like to know about the flow, how good it is, typical stuff. And whether or not to end it right here where it ends. I'm not sure, as it doesn't offer resolution, which would be a good way to intro the second part, but it doesn't really tickle my pickle.

The part at the end where it says "Solo" but there is no solo... that's there cause I haven't begun writing the solo yet. And i'm kinda not looking forward to it, but I kinda am... it'll be hard.

Well, I hope you enjoy it, and I will C4C :] You give detailed crit, then so will I.

Have fun! ^^
Attachments:
Same new song as before.zip
#2
OK since you asked for a full crit, I'll give you one.

The intro was absolutely beautiful. It was very well written and the echoes to the guitar added a nice touch. The keyboard part actually worked. I thought it made the intro much more interesting, so keep the triplet patterns.

Enter Teh Metulz: This section would have a better effect if the guitar chords were also played by the strings maybe an octave up. It will sound much more epic.

Begin Piano: perfect, nuff said.

Pre Something: again sounded very nice, no suggestions needed

Build Up: the second best part of the Intro (next to the piano part of course). I like the dissonance and the controlled chaos you had going on there. I liked that you didn't go too crazy but still allowed the excitement to build. That crescendo on the strings at the end was spine-chilling by the way.

Keys/Guitar Duel: Great. Reminded me of Divine Wings of Tragedy. Don't change a thing.

Pre Verse: Again I heard some DWoT influence, which wasn't a bad thing. It was still very original. nice work

Verse 1: The pizzicato (spelling??) strings added so much to what would already be a really good part. It was a great idea to make them echo and it probably took forever.

Chorus 1: Great job on this. I liked how you added the piano the second time around to set up the break later. It wasn't too repetitive, but still very catchy somehow. It's just very memorable, and maybe you should think about returning to it if you figure out a way to do so.

Piano Break: What is there to say? Great job again. Oh and can you tell me the name of that arpeggiated chord? I couldn't figure it out.

Begin Dark Section: Good use of the bass and the strings. It's very haunting but still great. I liked the drums' use of the hi hat too and the way you used the synth. Reminds me of Symphony X's Incantations of the Apprentice.

Solo 1: It was very wierd but in a good way. You obviously love your diminished scales and you used them well in this solo. No sensless wanking here, just a well written solo. Good job on this.

Bridge: Nice job bringing back the 5/8 pattern from the beginning. I really liked the unison between the guitar and the keys.

Lydian Interlude: This was really cool how the guitar, bass, and keys all worked together. the alternations between instruments was the best part and it worked well to lead into verse 2.

Verse 2: It was about time we got back to the vocals :P I really liked the use of the choir. The riff was really heavy and you did a good job using the chord progression from the interlude to go along with it.

Breakdown: You don't see too many of these in prog but you used it well and the keyboard/guitar part afterwards was great too.

Bridge: This seems a little out of place to me. If you take out the first 4 measures then I think it works better because it stays up to speed. other than that, good work.

Verse 3: This section would work even better if you had the drums in a [kick-kick-snare-kick] pattern, making more use of the double bass and keeping the song driving. Good riffs though, I like it a lot.

Bridge: leave that as it is. It sets up the next verse very well.

Verse 4: again leave that alone it's very good.

Chorus: this is a very good section, keep it.

Solo: The riff is really cool, again, it reminds me of Symphony X. I hope you can write a good solo over it.

After the solo, it kinda falls off there. I suggest you work with the solo riff to continue the song, possibly writing a variation to it or maybe playing with the time sigs to see what you can do with it.

So that's it. Good luck on the song.
#3
Thank you for the crit progbass :]

I think imma have to try teh strings an octave up in enter teh metulz... that sounds interesting, like it would add another element.

The arpeggiated chord at the end, if I know what you're talking about, is called the Prometheus Chord, or the Mystic Chord. It's a tri-tone, with stacked fourths on top. I think it intros the next part nicely :]

Haha most of the solo is in the Whole-Tone scale... I love it for it's dreamlike qualities, and thank you for the compliment on the solo.

I'll try out the bridge without the first 4 measures, see what it sounds like.

I was thinking about the constant double-bass thing in verse 4. Thanks for the input.

Haha, I did alot of time sig playing with that riff. :]

I'm probably gonna drop the ending and start part two of the song with it, or use it at some other time.

Thank you again for the crit, it really helps :]
#4
Love the intro, the bassline is really cool too. Adds a sort of groove to it. Wasn't fan on the triplets though, it didn't sound really good to my ear.. Might be just me.

You should really use strings, it would add such an epic feeling into the "Enter teh metulz".

The piano part was incredible, I adored it! I simply loved the progression. Except when the guitar came in with those power chords.. It sounded.. Nasty..

The pre-something and build up are very melodic, very progressive sounding, love the keyboard "solo".

The keys/guitar duel was awesome, but I don't think it fitted right. Try to work on your transitions. Don't take that as a bad thing, but they are a bit too harsh sometimes :P

The pre-verse was beautiful, love the Pizzicato Strings!!! Such a mystery feeling, wow..!!

The verse I, same thing.. Beautiful. Those pizzicato do add such an awesome feeling! The chorus was superb, love your chord progression on the acoustic.

The piano break was.... wow.. Words can't really express the beauty of the piece. You should teach me how to write piano stuff like that :P

The dark section was cool, loved the bass and strings, which added a haunting feeling to it.

Solo 1 was really weird, but it fit right in so I guess I don't have much to say about it...

The bridge was alright, nothing too fancy, but the interlude was beauty! Loved the bassline yet again, the keys were nice and the guitar work was really cool too.

Verse II and the breakdown were ok. Loved the lead guitar though. It would definitely sound better with vox

Bridge, verse III, bridge and verse IV were cool, nothing much to say about it. It did the job very well.

Loved the drums in the chorus and the solo (Too bad there's no actual solo yet )

The ending was good, loved the weird time sigs, hehe!

Finally done :O! That was long :P But anyways, very good song. Very progressive indeed hehe..

9/10, try to work on some transitions, add that solo and fix some minor things and it'll be a masterpiece!

Cheers for the crit!
#5
Thanks for the crit DarkTom :]

Yeah... the transition to the guitar duel is pretty rough... I wanted to change that, but I dunno what to do to change it other than a quick sudden thing.

About the part in the first piano thing, the guitar was supposed to build chaos, I guess I just did it wrong xD I'll probably go back and change that.

And I did add strings to the beginning and it DOES sound much more epic so thank you both for that idea.

I'm working on the solo right now. I'm trying to get it to be as good as all the other solo's. And the "Solo 1" is supposed to be weird ;] It's actually my favorite solo in the whole piece.
#6
damn, that just seems so random, kinda like the abstract art in the museums that you think your 2 your old kid can make. the only difference is you have to know musical theory for this abstract vision. I don't like it simply because the weird time signatures make the melodies hard to follow, and i can't hum to them.
#7
Oh my god.

Yeah, so um, lemme know when I can see you live in concert okay? Haha seriously though that was amazing.

You must have gone to juliard or something because I cant even begin to crit that its so beyond my level. All I can say is that whatever you write for the solo, it had better be no less than perfect. Otherwise the song is just too long. People are going to want something pretty amazing at the end of a song that long.

Sorry for the weak crit, but if you feel up to it Id be curious to see what someone with your musical knowledge would think of my work.

But again, fantastic job.
Last edited by semitone36 at Mar 17, 2009,
#8
The acoustic parts remind me a bit of the Interludes to the Divine Wings of Tragedy by Symphony X

One hell of a composition.
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#9
Intro-I dig the chord progression, but everything's a little to allover the place for me and not matching well.
Sloooww, Begin Piano- Transitions well. Instruments all fit together a lot better. 33 to 42 are particularly awesome. Then the br00talz come in and are pretty epic, though I was hoping they were going to something more epic than they did.
The buildup is nothing short of epic.
The duel is even more so epic, and I think the transition into it is perfect.
I think you need a better way into the pre-verse, though there's nothing wrong with the pre-verse
I think the verse has the same problem of things not collaborating well.
The chorus is good, but it doesn't really have a memorable quality to make it feel like a chorus.
Both of the returns are delicious. =)
The piano break is great. Especially once the strings come in.
The dark section is great. Particularly the transtion into it, and the guitars coming back. But, I don't like the video gamey feeling of156 through 158.
Nothing bad to say about the solo. I really like the transition into it.
The ongoing dissonance in the bridge was really cool.
The lydian didn't really entertain me, but there's nothing in particularly bad with it.
Same to say about Verse 2
The mathcoreish breakdown is pretty sweet. I would do something to make a buildup to the next section though.
III. may be my favorite sections so far. Especially the percussion in the very beginning
Nothing wrong with this verse, but nothing I particularly like either.
Same with the bridge and fourth verse. Sorry, lazy critting now. Long song. Haha.
Chorus sounds like something that could happen if THA was more funky. Haha. Good.
I won't say anything about the solo since it's missing.
The very end sounds like it's leading into something epic, so I hope that's not the end. Haha.
Overall I would say the only problem is a couple cluttery parts. And the darker sections are all pretty epic. I'm not gonna give you a number rating because prog isn't really my style, though. Haha.
#10
I don't even know where to start.

I have a lot of negative things brewing, so I'll just get the positive stuff out of the way first. First of all, the riffs weren't atrocious. There were various riffs wether they were guitar or bass riffs or even drum beats that are salvageable by themselves. Mostly bass riffs. The flow wasn't that bad either given the nature of the riffs and genre.

Now on to the negative elements:

Ok, first of all, it lacked any bearing of "structure" even in a loose sense. Progressive has never been about throwing riffs together in odd time signatures, it's never been about speed, it's never been about making the longest song and it's certainly never been about layering as many instruments as possible in attempts to confuse the listener.

I would love to crit on a riff by riff basis, but I feel that it's necessary to clear that up first.
What I mean is that everything seems so forced. Like you intentionally sat down and thought "hmm....how could I make this sound progressive?" or "ok, time to make really long songs and layer instruments because that's what progressive bands do".

What I think any musician, regardless of what genre they're trying to create, should do is clear their mind first of all. Don't think "how could I make this sound more progressive" or "no, this section is too straightforward for progressive music". Think on a very basic level. That's what Dream Theater and Symphony X do. In short, just play what comes to mind instead of racking your mind trying to force melody that really doesn't sound good.

There were a lot of parts that simply didn't need to be there. They interfered with the power of the song. And again, a lot of these melodies didn't sound memorable in the least bit. The harmonies were completely forced, and overall, I couldn't get to the end of the song. It was rather painful.

Given the lack of memorability, the way you layer and structure the actual riffs was a positive now that I think about it. They just don't work with each other at all.

So, my advice is think more basic. Don't force a lot of things to happen, don't force length and realize that a prog song can be made with fewer riffs.
I've found Jesus
#11
Haha thank you for all your feedback guys. :]

And now for Contraband:
I know what you mean by think basic, and that't what I tried to do. I didn't just throw random time sigs in (even if that's what i felt/looked like); that's usually just how it came out. I understand what you're trying to say. This song was going to be long either way, cause of what I was trying to do with it. My cousin is going to write lyrics about a video game (yes, a video game) and tell a story about the story of it... if that makes sense. It's a long game, so it was going to be a long song.

It does kind of go everywhere... and I recognized that. There's alot of parts where I would like to do things differently (like the piano thing to the guitar part early on), but I couldn't come up with a good way for a good sounding transition, or an entire section just kind of comes out of nowhere. I guess I get a bit anxious when a song takes me over a week or two to complete. I also wanted to try a bunch of things (like the Lydian thing) cause I had never done it before, and then I liked it, so I kept it.

Most of that in there is the closest thing to what came to mind I could get. Alot of the stuff I want to play, doesn't get in there because 1) I can't figure it out, or 2) I can't play it. And thinking simple is really hard for me (it affects everything in life... school, friends, family, so on) cause I tend to overthink things. Maybe I need to just sit down and just write some melodies, or something and just practice song constructing.

And part of me was just trying to break out of my "Death Metal/Deathcore/Metalcore" box (that I hate writing), maybe I tried too hard? xD Well, thank you for your comments Contraband, i'll definitely think about them.
Last edited by DiminishedFifth at Mar 19, 2009,
#12
If you're not able to play those parts/have other people play those parts to ultimately record it/play it live, then don't bother writing it. It sounds like a bitch to record and it isn't memorable. If you ever do manage to assemble some chaps and record this, you'll see how difficult everything will be to
A) EQ properly
B) Play perefectly (and then think about playing that live...)
and
C) To get it to sound good after you've got EQ and accuracy and tone and such out of the problem. It's going to be mud.

It might be a challenge for you, but try writing really simple songs. Like radio rock/pop. That'll force you to follow structure. The philosophy is "If you don't know how to front crawl, how do you expect to get to the other side of the river?" You can do it, but it won't be pretty. Once you're able to write simple songs, just build on that until you're comfortable with writing songs that have plenty of parts but still go somewhere.
I've found Jesus
Last edited by Contraband at Mar 19, 2009,