#3
Personally, I would go for the JCM800, but there are a lot of people who swear by Orange.
Best bet is to try them out yourself.
#4
Having played extensively through both the amps in question here's my opinion on those. I like the Orange a little more, personally. I think it's a little more flexible and sounds a little more lively. BUT, if you wanted an even BETTER AMP than those (and it's still in the same price range), check out the Fargen Olde 800 (check the signature). You may have to ask Ben to add a little extra gain to it (it's about the same as an original 800), but it beats the pants off of both of the amps you're looking at.
Fargen Olde 800 1x12 Combo
Ernie Ball/Musicman Axis Super Sport Rosewood with custom HighOrder Pickups
#5
I've played both as well and also prefer the Orange. However the Orange is always going to be loads more expensive, so take that into consideration =/

Gear:
Agile AL-2000 > Maxon OD808 > Boss DD-20 > Strymon blueSky > Splawn Pro Stock > Emperor 4x12

the lives to come

#6
Quote by OUTR4GE666
MARSHALL.....the best sound you can find!

th3 øverdrive eez c®øøøøshing.


fail.


OP: this is the type of thread that makes me wanna jump off of a cliff. for the hundred millionth time, what genres?
I'm putting my GAS on hold
for a couple months in order to pimp my ride.


Don't judge me.
#7
Quote by OUTR4GE666
MARSHALL.....the best sound you can find!

Eh, no.
I prefer Orange
Better tone, less cookie cutter, and also I liek t3h 0r4ng3 t0l3x.
#8
I know that as human beings we kind of have creative license with the language we use on a day to day basis. But for Heaven's sake, WRITE CRAP THAT I CAN READ!! lol
Fargen Olde 800 1x12 Combo
Ernie Ball/Musicman Axis Super Sport Rosewood with custom HighOrder Pickups
#10
Quote by OUTR4GE666
MARSHALL.....the best sound you can find!

Agreed. Every band that I like has wall of Marshalls behind them.
they are like sex for the ear
Quote by juniorlbj
Gentlemen...

It's fap time!
#11
Ugh, don't buy an amp because it's a Marshall (like a lot of the less informed posters are). Buy it because you like how it sounds.


The amps are different beasts so there isn't really a 'better' amp to choose from. It's all preference.


I would go Orange though just because you can get Marshallesque tones out of it but you can't get Orange tones out of a Marshall.
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#12
Only similarity at all is that they're both classic British voiced amps mid-gain amps. Oranges tend to have this kind of soft, fuzzy kind of feel at crunch settings that I just can't seem to get used to. They also don't quite have that same kind of bright grind that Marshalls are typically associated with. They're just darker and growlier sounding in general.

Oh it should also be noted that the JCM800 and JCM2000 don't really sound that much alike.
Last edited by al112987 at Mar 19, 2009,
#13
Quote by OUTR4GE666
MARSHALL.....the best sound you can find!


Quiet back there!

Apart from the SJ, the actual tone of Orange generally outweighs that of Marshall in every respect.
#14
Quote by davedoom
Quiet back there!

Apart from the SJ, the actual tone of Orange generally outweighs that of Marshall in every respect.
How so? While I certainly understand why people like Oranges, they definitely have their own distinctive sound and feel, as do Marshalls, which makes it hard to say that one generally outweighs the other in every respect.
Last edited by al112987 at Mar 19, 2009,
#15
Quote by al112987
How so? While I certainly understand why people like Oranges, they definitely have their own distinctive sound and feel, as do Marshalls, which makes it hard to say that one generally outweighs the other in every respect.

I agree. One isn't really "better" than the other IMO, it's just better at what? Almost all of my favorite classic rock songs were recorded with Marshalls, but newer Marshalls are inferior to the old ones. When opened up, a JCM 800 is a beast of an amp, esp w/ a slight boost in front of it. The Oranges are a bit darker & looser in general, although they do have a VERY live feel to them, & don't seem to require the boost in front of them-they get enough drive on their own.
I already have a Marshall-esque amp, so now I'm shopping for a Tiny Terror or a cheap used Rocker 30. I like both, so why not? It's very subjective, so the TS needs to try some amps & see which HE prefers.
To directly answer the TS's question- I'd prefer Marshall tone, which is why I didn't buy an Orange FIRST !
Quote by 311ZOSOVHJH
Riffhog for President


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#16
Quote by properpat
Having played extensively through both the amps in question here's my opinion on those. I like the Orange a little more, personally. I think it's a little more flexible and sounds a little more lively. BUT, if you wanted an even BETTER AMP than those (and it's still in the same price range), check out the Fargen Olde 800 (check the signature). You may have to ask Ben to add a little extra gain to it (it's about the same as an original 800), but it beats the pants off of both of the amps you're looking at.


Don't mean to hijack the topic, but how much is a Fargen Olde 800 1x12 combo? I just checked them out, and they sound great.
#17
Quote by sweet_inc
bump

Are you kidding? Your post barely gives any information and your bumping your thread after not expanding at all?

Ugh. For starters, what genres of music do you play?
#18
Quote by al112987
How so? While I certainly understand why people like Oranges, they definitely have their own distinctive sound and feel, as do Marshalls, which makes it hard to say that one generally outweighs the other in every respect.


Having owned most models of the 800, every model of the 900, gigged countless 2000s and played many of the older and newer models - JTM, JVM etc etc....

The S.J felt right for me and I owned one for a long time before selling the combo - due to back problems and money problems.

Many of the models (even the 600s) were very cool - but then I went to the Engl Blackmore which did everything better (in terms of Marshall - Marshall Major circuit btw) and more.

Then the Rockerverb did high gain as good if not better - but Zep stuff a lot better - then I had it modded and messed about with (KT88 etc) and it out does everything for me - Id still have an SJ as an extra head with an extra cab though....

EDIT - yeah, the cleans are much better - less sterile
Last edited by davedoom at Mar 19, 2009,
#19
The ENGL Blackmore is a Marshall Major circuit? That's like my dream amp.

On topic - I've played several Rocker 30s, JCM800s and both DSL and TSL JCM2000s, and:
a) The 2000 is nothing like the other two, it's designed more for modern metal and hardcore. It doesn't have that British crunch the other two have.
b) Out of the other two, if I played hard rock or classic metal I'd probably go for the Rocker above the JCM800, just because it has a bit more gain, however with the JCM I found it sounds good throughout where as I felt with the Orange, it has a certain "sweet spot" where the gain sounds best. Not to say it doesn't sound good throughout (it does) but it sounded best here.
If cleans matter, I also thought that even though it has less wattage, the Orange also had a touch more clean headroom than the Marshall.
Quote by Cathbard
If all you had to go on was the forum you'd think a Decimator could cure noise caused by dodgey stage lighting and restock the ocean's population of sperm whales
Last edited by shadow__666 at Mar 19, 2009,
#20
Quote by shadow__666
The ENGL Blackmore is a Marshall Major circuit? That's like my dream amp.


If you research it....well....it's a Blackmore sig. amp - and what did he consistently use? Yep...
#21
Quote by davedoom
Having owned most models of the 800, every model of the 900, gigged countless 2000s and played many of the older and newer models - JTM, JVM etc etc....

The S.J felt right for me and I owned one for a long time before selling the combo - due to back problems and money problems.

Many of the models (even the 600s) were very cool - but then I went to the Engl Blackmore which did everything better (in terms of Marshall - Marshall Major circuit btw) and more.

Then the Rockerverb did high gain as good if not better - but Zep stuff a lot better - then I had it modded and messed about with (KT88 etc) and it out does everything for me - Id still have an SJ as an extra head with an extra cab though....

EDIT - yeah, the cleans are much better - less sterile

We'll have to disagree then.

I personally do not feel like Orange's have a bright enough high end grind or the same high mid bark of a Marshall plexi to really pull off Zeppelin convincingly, it's just my opinion. Besides, Page used a Marshall 1959 for most of Zeppelin. The only time he used an Orange was post-Zeppelin, and by the time he was running a much higher gain rig and had a tone that really sounded nothing like his Zeppelin tone at all.

And I'm surprised that the Blackmore is a Marshall Major based circuit, especially since the Marshall Major is a 2 channel, 3 ECC83/4 KT88 amp and the Blackmore is a 4 channel amp with 4 ECC83s and 4 5881s in the power section. The Marshall major is a very clean amp and really just does not get that distorted stock, until you really gas it up, but even then it still gets less gain than say... a stock super lead, and the Blackmore's overdrive is just way too tight and grainy sounding to really sound much like a Major imo.
Last edited by al112987 at Mar 19, 2009,
#22
That's exactly what I thought. I've never played an ENGL Blackmore, but I've heard clips and the cleans don't even sound Marshally - I always felt they were more American voiced.

Wikipedia tells me it's based on the ENGL Savage 120 with modified voicing to suit Ritchie Blackmore.
Quote by Cathbard
If all you had to go on was the forum you'd think a Decimator could cure noise caused by dodgey stage lighting and restock the ocean's population of sperm whales
#23
Quote by al112987
We'll have to disagree then.

I personally do not feel like Orange's have a bright enough high end grind or the same high mid bark of a Marshall plexi to really pull off Zeppelin convincingly, it's just my opinion. Besides, Page used a Marshall 1959 for most of Zeppelin. The only time he used an Orange was post-Zeppelin, and by the time he was running a much higher gain rig and had a tone that really sounded nothing like his Zeppelin tone at all.

And I'm surprised that the Blackmore is a Marshall Major based circuit, especially since the Marshall Major is a 2 channel, 3 ECC83/4 KT88 amp and the Blackmore is a 4 channel amp with 4 ECC83s and 4 5881s in the power section. The Marshall major is a very clean amp and really just does not get that distorted stock, until you really gas it up, but even then it still gets less gain than say... a stock super lead, and the Blackmore's overdrive is just way too tight and grainy sounding to really sound much like a Major imo.


You better start talking to Page and Blackmore - rather than bleating like Mr ToneUnhappy.

Have you actually played these and have you heard Page and Blackmore recently? Why do you think they use these and still grasp the tones out of them - yet modern - but still their tones. The are not wildly different amps - they are amps based on something.

I know more about Page's tone than 99% of people on here. The evolution of tone will always happen - but it should always be based on something. You can spot the Page change from Tele and Supro to L.P and SLP etc

If you have played a Blackmore at a cleanish setting at max and an Orange AD and OR 50 at high levels and still disagree - I am not the one you should be talking to.

EDIT: Lord knows why you say this to me when your tone on the 45 sounds lame and the playing is terrible. You need to do a bit more with that amp - and the main tone comes from your fingers (a long way off)
Last edited by davedoom at Mar 19, 2009,
#24
Can't everyone just agree that both Marshall and Orange make some amazing amps?
Quote by Cathbard
If all you had to go on was the forum you'd think a Decimator could cure noise caused by dodgey stage lighting and restock the ocean's population of sperm whales
#26
Quote by davedoom
You better start talking to Page and Blackmore - rather than bleating like Mr ToneUnhappy.

Have you actually played these and have you heard Page and Blackmore recently? Why do you think they use these and still grasp the tones out of them - yet modern - but still their tones. The are not wildly different amps - they are amps based on something.

I know more about Page's tone than 99% of people on here. The evolution of tone will always happen - but it should always be based on something. You can spot the Page change from Tele and Supro to L.P and SLP etc

If you have played a Blackmore at a cleanish setting at max and an Orange AD and OR 50 at high levels and still disagree - I am not the one you should be talking to.

Page's tone is completely different from how he sounded during Zeppelin. I don't see how that is even arguable, who cares if he is running Orange amps these days. That means that Oranges do Zeppelin better than super leads? That's like saying a Peavey 5150 does Van Halen I tones better than a super lead. Saying that an amp like the Blackmore can sound "similar: to a Marshall can be said about half the amps on the market these days. Regardless, you said that the Blackmore was a Marshall Major circuit which is not, just by looking at specs you can tell that it's not. But do notice how I never said Orange amps sounded bad, I just said that they don't sound like Marshalls, which they don't. Call me Mr. Toneunhappy if you wish, maybe my ears are bad, but every Orange that I've played, from the Tiny Terror to the AD30 has had the same characteristic Orange sound and feel that sets it distinctly apart from Marshall. Not in a way that is "better" unless it is the type of difference that just floats one's boat. If Jimmy Page likes that amp, more power to him. I'm just saying that if you pull out TSRTS, don't expect an Orange to sound closer to that than a Super lead, because it won't.

EDIT: Lord knows why you say this to me when your tone on the 45 sounds lame and the playing is terrible. You need to do a bit more with that amp - and the main tone comes from your fingers (a long way off)
You know, I almost feel bad for not caring about my playing enough about my playing to give actually be bothered by this, but in reality I don't. Am I a bad musician because of it? Maybe, but I'm not a musician.

Regardless, it's a youtube video filmed on a $70 digital camera on an amp that is running an impedance mismatch with el34s and a JTM45 OT. Of course it doesn't sound spectacular. As for my playing, sure it could be better, but I'm a student who took a hiatus from playing guitar to focus on school when I started college. But do more with the amp? LOL it's a hobby, I built the amp to learn about how they work and have something to play around with whenever I go home from school to my otherwise boring home town. I play guitar for fun, not to be better than anyone else, I post on this site because I like talking about guitars and amps. I guess I'm not a "real" guitarist because I don't feel super inclined to improve my playing, but I'm already better than most other people at things that actually matter to me, so outside of looking like an asshole, I don't see how this comment is relevant at all.
#27
I'm sorry, but the "I love Orange" bandwagon is getting out of hand. They are overpriced and sound mediocre. A JCM800 is much better than a Rocker 30.

EDIT: DaveDoom, do you really think that criticizing someone's playing in an argument about gear makes you seem intelligent? It makes you seem like an idiot, seeing as you are going off topic. You know why people change the topic?( and go for a low blow, in your case) Because they know that they are losing the argument. Basic human psychology, but I'd doubt that you would know that; you're obviously too busy being a better guitarist than everybody.

You have expensive gear, I'll give you that; but your tone is utterly abysmal. I did not think that someone could sound so bad with such an expensive setup.

EDIT3: I just re-read my post and realized that I might have been a bit harsh. Sorry if I offended you, but your comment was unnecessary and mean.
Last edited by Mike! at Mar 19, 2009,
#28
Quote by Mike!

You have expensive gear, I'll give you that; but your tone is utterly abysmal. I did not think that someone could sound so bad with such an expensive setup.


No, please criticize that all you want - if you read the bit below the photos - you might realise that is nothing to do with the setup....

I really need to post clips of the Orange so as to not make people think Im stone deaf...

Twas but a Boss GT10 (that I had no say in setting up btw) - if you have a go at the playing....well that is fair enough, each to his own!

al112987 - that was a fair reply - I accept I strayed from the original point.
Though I feel that I can get a plexi sound, then high gain and hot-rodded Marshall and then more - The DSL and TSL says that, but doesn't deliver - I apologise that I am extremely arrogant about my tone....and I am - if I could, Id have even nicer hand wired stuff, but im in the middle range of budget I feel and I have seen nicer amps on here than mine.
Note to everyone - new Marshall AND Orange amps have despicable build quality - I have had mine re-done inside. Orange has got too big for its own good.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5A-g_pKx8tU&feature=PlayList&p=CEA39346824340BB&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=9

Best if other people give their views on that...
Last edited by davedoom at Mar 20, 2009,