#1
Ok I was told yesterday when I said something about playing a Am progression such as "Am C G Am" <----- WRONG. I see that I was indeed wrong and that most likely comes from the key of C or G. Ok so to clear this up, an Aminor progression would come from the minor key of A? May contain something like F#minor, A, E, correct? Also a minor progression of a paticular scale will not contain a minor chord of the root of that scale. Like a C minor scale progression would never contain a Cm and so on with the rest of the minor scales and chord progressions.

To some up that last part a minor progression is formed from the minor scale of whatever your wanting it to be in. WOW I cant spit it out right lol. What I'm trying to say is if you WANT a Cminor progression, it will have to be conducted from the scale of Cminor(which doesn't contain a c minor chord), no other scale.

scale of Cminor(which doesn't contain a c minor chord), THATS WHAT CONFUSES ME!
#2
the last few posts in your last thread answered this, didnt you see them?

long story short... your Am->C->G->Am progression is i->III->VII->i in the key of Aminor and the scale of Cminor has Cm as it's initial chord.......
http://www.all-guitar-chords.com/chord_progressions.php?scch=C&scchnam=Natural+minor+triads+i-ii*-III-iv-v-VI-VII&get2=Get

there you go
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#3
Yes I did and this is what confused me
First off, just because you're playing 'metal' does not mean you need a 'crunch.' Write with your creativity, not with the stereotypes a genre of music prescribes you to write.

Also, that's not a minor progression. Am isn't really established as the tonal center, which is what's needed for a progression in Am. Depending on how each chord is voiced, that progression could either be in C or G. It's very unlikely (but not impossible) for that song to be in Am.


So I began thinking an Am progression would have to be based of the scale of A. And Am, C, G was just formed from the scale C or G.

If someone could clear up the difference between a key and a progression that would be nice. I know that a progression is formed from a key so, I want to say that Am, C, G is a Aminor Aeolian "progression" in the KEY of C or a Aminor Dorian "progression" in the KEY of G.

Heres another thing I'm thinking that makes the previous idea wrong. If a Minor progression is built from the A Ionian scale such as Bm, D, A. This would not be called an "A minor" progression? Or to follow formula I iii vii A, C#m, G#dim?<---- wouldn't that be called an Aminor progression? Or is it called an Amajor progression in the key of Aminor?
Last edited by rebel624 at Mar 21, 2009,
#4
^^

Learn about intervals and chord building, and everything will make more sense.

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#5
Thanks, after looking at the website you posted, I realize that I am getting my chord progression formulas mixed with my scale formulas. I have to realize that just because the root note C in the scale of C minor isnt a minor it does not mean that the chord which is formed is a minor.
Last edited by rebel624 at Mar 21, 2009,
#6
Quote by rebel624
Thanks, after looking at the website you posted, I realize that I am getting my chord progression formulas mixed with my scale formulas. I have to realize that just because the root note C in the scale of C minor isnt a minor it does not mean that the chord which is formed is a minor.



no note is minor or major.

It's an interval step.

5 semitones is a Major 3rd and 4 Semitones is a minor 3rd.

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#7
Semitones are just half steps so I can't figure that out.

C Dm Em F G Am Bdim ---> C C#/Db D D#/Eb E 1C 2Db 3Dm 4Eb

C Dm Em F G Am Bdim ---> C C#/Db D D#/Eb E F 1C 2Db 3Dm 4Eb 5Em

Guess I can figure it out lol. You guys always drag me into some sort of critical thinking. Isn't it strange how somethings you have to right out and some you can figure in your mind. I guess thats what makes music kinda mathematical, like division. I bet them people that can do them huge multiplication and division in there head would be excellent musicians.
#8
Quote by xxdarrenxx
no note is minor or major.

It's an interval step.

5 semitones is a Major 3rd and 4 Semitones is a minor 3rd.


4 semitones from a note is a major 3rd, 3 semitones is a minor third.

what you just gave was a Fourth and a Major 3rd
#9
Why can't a progression that uses Am C G be in Am???

Sounds Am when I play it.
I can play it differently and bring out the C more making it sound like it's in C.

It's a little ambiguous in my opinion and could go either way.

An Am progression is built from the Am scale. The Am scale is relative to C major (they share the same notes and the same diatonic chords). If you create a progression using the chords of the Am scale and do it wrong it will simply sound like C is the tonic chord.

For Example if you were in Am you have the chords:
i=Am, ii=Bdim, bIII=C, iv=Dm, v=Em, bVI=F, bVII=G

if you put together a progression that was something like i-bVI-bVII-bIII then it would no longer sound minor because the bVII-bIII movement would be a perfect "down by fifth" movement that would tonicize the bIII.

That progression i-bVI-bVII-bIII would be Am-F-G-C. The G to C movement will make the C feel like the tonic. There is nothing there to reinforce the Am as the tonic sounding chord so we would hear it in retrospect as a vi chord in relation to the C and not as a tonic itself. The progression Am F G C would then sound like vi IV V I in C and not i bVI bvII bIII in C.

Your progression however Am C G Am is a little different. There is nothing there to tonicize the C above the Am nor the Am above the C. The minor third root movement between Am and C is an ambiguous movement to start with that could go either way. C to G is a plagal movement which can really cool leading back to a tonic but it doesn't in itself tonicize the second chord (in this case the G). The final movement bVII-i is a common progression to close off a minor scale but it isn't a powerful resolution that definitively tonicizes the Am.

The progression could go either way. It could be Am it could be C. It's kind of ambiguous and really up to your harmonic phrasing and melodic techniques as to what will start to stand out as the tonic chord.
Si
#10
Quote by rebel624
Semitones are just half steps so I can't figure that out.

C Dm Em F G Am Bdim ---> C C#/Db D D#/Eb E 1C 2Db 3Dm 4Eb

C Dm Em F G Am Bdim ---> C C#/Db D D#/Eb E F 1C 2Db 3Dm 4Eb 5Em

Guess I can figure it out lol. You guys always drag me into some sort of critical thinking. Isn't it strange how somethings you have to right out and some you can figure in your mind. I guess thats what makes music kinda mathematical, like division. I bet them people that can do them huge multiplication and division in there head would be excellent musicians.

The chords in a key are created using the notes from that key.

So for C major the notes are C D E F G A B. To get the chords you take the first note, C, skip a note then take the next one, E, skip a note then take the next one, E. This will give you the basic triad which can be added to.

If you do this for every note in the C major scale you get these triads:
C E G
D F A
E G B
F A C
G B D
A C E
B D F

Which, when named, are the chords C Dm Em F G Am Bdim.
These chords are the chords that are diatonic to the key of C. They are chords that usually sound good in chord progressions in C (though sometimes they do not, and chords that are not diatonic can sound good to).

If you do this to a minor key, A, you get these triads:
A C E
B D F
C E G
D F A
E G B
F A C
G B D

Which gives you the chords Am Bdim C Dm Em F G.
These are the chords that are diatonic in the key of A minor, so these are commonly found in the key of A minor (though E is often used to give a powerful i-V resolution).

Hopefully that answered that question.
One thing to remember is that the only condition for something in a key is that it resolves to the tonic chord (unless you're playing modally, which doesn't happen that often).

This means that to be in the key of C, all a progression has to do is resolve to the C major chord. It doesn't matter if their are chromatics everywhere, if it revolves to C major it's in C major.

The same goes for your progression. If it sounds like it should end on Am then it's in Am. However, the key can change depending on how you play the progression.

A good example of a non-diatonic progression is one that was in a song I wrote recently:
F Ab Bb Db
At once I could tell that it was not diatonic because I knew that no key has four major chords. However, despite the fact that there were so many chromatics, I could safely say it was in F major because it resolved strongly onto the F chord.