#1
Hey.

Well I posted on here a couple of days ago about a PA, because, really I was pretty bloody clueless. BUT! The good people of UG have educated me somewhat and now I just have a couple more questions.

I have been told that I should mic the guitar amps. So for this do I have to buy some kind of special mic?

And apparently I don't need an entire mixer.. Which is a relief.. Just an EQ. So for 1 bass, 2 guitars and probably 3 vocal mics how would you personally set it up with a PA? Or how do you think I should?

I reckon I'm in way over my head here... ANY help at all would be great.

Thanks in advance. Cheers.
Last edited by NothingButRock at Jun 27, 2009,
#2
Wheres your original post? You are missing a ton of info here.

WHat do you want the PA for? Outdoor stadium? Practice space?

What kind of music? Accoustic set? Death Metal?

How many players?
#3
you probably don't need to mic amps if you're in a small venue, which if you're running your own PA you probably are. I don't normally bother to start micing amps until you've got an audience of about people. (depending on amp size obviously)

As for mics, some will sound better with guitar amps than others, but again if you're doing small household esque events then you can just pt anything there. Generally the sound intensity of an amp is much greater than vocals, so you want a mic which can take a high level without peaking rather than a vocal mic. Sound is pretty much personally preference though, i tend to use slightly bassier mics on amps when i can/

For that set up i would have 3 vocal mics going into the mixer, ideally SM-58's or something similar. They take XLR cables, and i would put them in channel 1 2 3. with 1 on stage left and 3 on stage right. If i wanted to mic the amps i would place the mics slightly above centre of the speaker cone, about 6 inches from the speaker grille. they would be into channel 4 5. From the mixing desk i would then probably slightly boost the high end to get a more balanced sound. Finally with bass i would take a DI out of the bass amp and put it straight into the mixer. EQ from DI is a little random so i would use appropriate settings for the amp.

From there i would plug into a 3 way crossover, split my lows mids and highs, run them through 3 separate power amps, then run my bass amp to my subs, my mids to my mid speakers and the highs to my tweeters.

doubt you'll be dealing with that much kit though....
what kit have you got? how big is the venue? how big are the bands (in terms of notoriety)?
The only 6 words that can make you a better guitarist:

Learn theory
Practice better
Practice more
#4
Nothing annoys me more than pepople who tell you to mic amps when it's unnecessary. Unless you've got a damn good PA (I mean £1500+) it's not going to sound all that good.


Here's what I run through our system for most gigs/jam nights:

Small venue (50-100 capacity): Vocals, hand percussion, keyboard
Medium venue (100-250 capacity): Vocals, keyboard, bass drum, percussion and very occasionally, drum overheads
Large venue (250+ people): They should have their own sound engineer and house PA, or else we hire one.

Let us see your original thread/post - the 'good people of UG' might have inadvertently given you the wrong education!
#5
Who said you didn't need a mixer, only an EQ.

An EQ will only balance the frequencies (in a live situation they are mostly used for feedback correction unlike in a studio environment), and will NOT mix the signals from all the inputs. You shouldn't have to mike the guitars or the bass unless your in a very large venue, or you are using underpowered amps. Drums shouldn't be miked in a small venue, or even in a medium one, but the keyboard definitely should be fed into the mixer. There are a whole lot of topics like this one, use the search bar.
The Gear:

Guitars:
PRS Custom 24
Yamaha RGX A2
PRS Custom 24 SE
Amps:
VOX AD100
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WTB: Line 6 Vetta II
Rack:
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Line 6 Pod XT Pro
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Extra:
Line 6 Pocket Pod
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Last edited by sk1939 at Jun 27, 2009,
#6
Quote by sk1939
Who said you didn't need a mixer, only an EQ.

An EQ will only balance the frequencies (in a live situation they are mostly used for feedback correction unlike in a studio environment), and will NOT mix the signals from all the inputs. You shouldn't have to mike the guitars or the bass unless your in a very large venue, or you are using underpowered amps. Drums shouldn't be miked in a small venue, or even in a medium one, but the keyboard definitely should be fed into the mixer. There are a whole lot of topics like this one, use the search bar.

Good solid advice.

Don't believe everything you read on UG. In fact, it's usually best if you don't believe any of it.

Especially that bit just there about not believing anything.
#7
Wheres your original post? You are missing a ton of info here.
WHat do you want the PA for? Outdoor stadium? Practice space?
What kind of music? Accoustic set? Death Metal?
How many players?

Sorry, I could have been a lot more specific with this post.
Here is the link to my original post: https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1150136

We have a vocalist, two guitarist/backup vocals, bassist and a drummer. We would mostly be playing small pub gigs and in small halls. We play Aussie pub rock and classic rock with a bit of punk. We wanted the PA to mix and balance the sounds of the band for playing live. The gear we have right now is a 30 watt guitar amp, 30 watt bass amp and an 80 watt guitar amp.

Nothing annoys me more than pepople who tell you to mic amps when it's unnecessary. Unless you've got a damn good PA (I mean £1500+) it's not going to sound all that good.


Still in school and can barely afford the gear we already have.. So the best I think I could really hope for would be fairly low quality as our funds are restricted..

An EQ will only balance the frequencies (in a live situation they are mostly used for feedback correction unlike in a studio environment), and will NOT mix the signals from all the inputs. You shouldn't have to mike the guitars or the bass unless your in a very large venue, or you are using underpowered amps.


I'm fairly lost to be honest. As these would only be small gigs does that mean I would still need a mixer? Our amps are fairly underpowered for what they would be required to do.

I did use the search bar.. However my keywords were probably too specific.. Sorry about that.

Cheers again.
#8
What are the specific brands of amps you have? Cause a 30 watt tube amp is alot different then a 30 watt MG.

This is what I would do.

Sell your underpowered amps and get some decent ones that would be loud enough on there own. A 30-50 Watt tube combo should be enough to fill a small club/hall.

Get a couple powered speakers for Vocals.


OR just play at the pubs that have their own PA and put ALL the money you get from gigs into a gear fund.
Last edited by stangconv at Jun 27, 2009,
#9
Like it has been said before we really need to know the size of the venues you are playing. My band plays mostly in the 100-250 people range and mix of indoors and outdoors so we are running 5 vocal mics, a keyboard and the bass drum into the PA. I will probably end up mixing the bass in there soon since his amp is a bit underpowered. Guitar wise we have two guitar players using 6505 half stacks so no need to mic them really. We use a pair of yamaha S115Vs for speakers, QSC GX5 power amp and a mackie mixer. This setup is so when we play outside we have enough juice to really project everything.
#10
None of the pubs in town have their own PAs. If we want one our only options are to hire one from a town 250km away or have our own.

Our amps are all solid state and if we sold them we'd most probably only get a couple of hundred dollars. The rhythm guitarist is getting a new amp soon and is spending up to AUS$1500, so he be able to get a tube amp I would think.

The halls we would play would be only 100-300 people capacity aside from one place with 1500 capacity, however they do have their own PA. The main pub we would be playing has an outdoor area with a bit of a stage built up.

We simply can't afford to upgrade everything.. Particulary me, who owns most of the equipment.