#1
If I just repeat a C7 over and over, what scales can be played over it ??


also, minor and major chords only have 3 notes. what are chords called that have 4 or more? i know there names (diminished, augmented, suspended, etc) , i mean like, are they called extended, or what?
#2
just flatten the 7th
Originally posted by PedroLesPaulVM
"My guitar is always in tune because all the tuning heads face the same way."


LOL
#3
C E G Bb

resides in the scale of F major and D minor

im sure there are more, but those two are the only ones i can figure out quickly from CoF
#4
Quote by mick13
If I just repeat a C7 over and over, what scales can be played over it ??


also, minor and major chords only have 3 notes. what are chords called that have 4 or more? i know there names (diminished, augmented, suspended, etc) , i mean like, are they called extended, or what?


Over just a droning C7, you would probably play C mixolydian. C D E F G A Bb. You can play any note over any type of chord, but a droning C7 implies C mixolydian.

(@ShoeFactory: Yes, those scales contain the correct notes, but with the context TS has provided, the tonal center is C, which (for once, in this forum) makes it modal.)

3 notes played at one time is called a triad. Anything more than 3 notes played at one time is called a chord. Chords with extensions (add11, add9, etc.) are called extended chords. Chords with alterations (#9b13, b5, etc) are called altered chords.
Last edited by timeconsumer09 at Jul 12, 2009,
#5
oh,

you are right

i had initially thought of c myxolydian but i dismissed the idea because these threads rarely requires thinking modally; i also assumed he wouldnt know what it is, but you would be correct
#6
Triads are the basic chords made by stacking major and minor thirds from a root.

Another third on top gives four notes and is a seventh chord.

If it isn't a seventh chord it is an add chord.

If it is extended past a seventh chord to a 9th 11th or 13th it is an extended chord.

If it is any of the above with altered notes it is an altered chord. (usually the 5th, 9th, 11th).

If the third is left out for a second or fourth it is a suspended chord.

There is only one major scale in which the C7 chord is diatonic and that is the F major scale.

That doesn't restrict you to just the F major or one of it's relative scales you can use all sorts of things depending on how the C7 features in the song you're playing. If you are just playing a C7 vamp then like Maton said play C major but flatten the seventh.
Si
#7
Quote by ShoeFactory


im sure there are more, but those two are the only ones i can figure out quickly from CoF

can someone explain how you can find this using the circle of fifths? i don't understand how.

AND So, major and minor chords are all just triads, and anything with 4 or more notes is a chord?

Quote by ShoeFactory
i also assumed he wouldnt know what it is, but you would be correct

i actually do
Last edited by mick13 at Jul 12, 2009,
#8
Quote by mick13
can someone explain how you can find this using the circle of fifths? i don't understand how.

AND So, major and minor chords are all just triads, and anything with 4 or more notes is a chord?


i actually do


Well, a major chord CAN be a chord. But not if it only has 3 NOTES. Say you finger the open E chord on your guitar. It's a CHORD because it contains 6 notes (even though some of the notes are doubles). If you just played a E, G#, and a B, and only one of each, that would be a TRIAD because it only contains 3 notes.

About the circle of fifths. I assume he just used the key signature. I.E. a C7 has one flat (Bb) and the only keys with one flat are F major and D minor. I don't put too much stock into the circle of fifths, though. Just memorize your keys and you're golden.
#9
AND So, major and minor chords are all just triads, and anything with 4 or more notes is a chord?


A chord is anything that contains 3 or more notes. A triad follows a general foruma- 1-3-5.
#10
my chord question was misunderstood.

all i was asking is what it is called if a chord has more than 3 notes (INCLUDING OCTAVES), extended or what?

i meant major and minor only consist of 3 notes (WITH OCTAVES) so what are chords with more called.

i didnt mean just 3 notes being played total
Quote by Zvahl
A chord is anything that contains 3 or more notes. A triad follows a general foruma- 1-3-5.

im not that much of a n00b
Last edited by mick13 at Jul 12, 2009,
#11
^I think he was talking to the other guy that said triads aren't chords, he was clarifying that triads are a specific type of chord. other chords have other names.
Si
#12
There's pretty much 2 main approaches you can take to a dominant 7th vamp. You can either play the mixolydian scale or you can play the minor pentatonic/blues scale. Well you can do both actually and it should sound fine. Your typical major blues is made up entirely of dominant 7ths. You can get away with murder over dominant 7ths, but that's the most common stuff to do.

Chords with 7ths and no more are just plain old 7ths. As for the triad thing, I'm pretty sure a chord voiced C E G C is no longer a triad because there are four notes, even if one is a duplicate. It's just a plain old chord then. Anything that goes beyond 7ths would be extended.
Last edited by grampastumpy at Jul 12, 2009,
#13
In a situation like this I think it's best to forget about scales and concentrate on chord tones. Obviously, there are 4 notes you can play over a C7 that are definate safe bets - the notes in the chord, C E G Bb. With that in mind, you can "fill in the blanks" however you like. Resolving your phrases to any of those 4 notes is going to sound fine. It's a much more flexible approach. Thinking "My only options here are to play either a C mixo or pent minor" (or whatever) is likely to result in stiff sounding playing, IMO.

So many of you can play all your scales up and down, but how many can arpeggiate a given chord all over the neck? It's a much, much, much more useful ability when it comes to improvising.
#14
Quote by Beserker
In a situation like this I think it's best to forget about scales and concentrate on chord tones. Obviously, there are 4 notes you can play over a C7 that are definate safe bets - the notes in the chord, C E G Bb. With that in mind, you can "fill in the blanks" however you like. Resolving your phrases to any of those 4 notes is going to sound fine. It's a much more flexible approach. Thinking "My only options here are to play either a C mixo or pent minor" (or whatever) is likely to result in stiff sounding playing, IMO.

So many of you can play all your scales up and down, but how many can arpeggiate a given chord all over the neck? It's a much, much, much more useful ability when it comes to improvising.
I'm not advocating an approach like that all. I said those were the two main approaches I've come across and what most people seem to do. I figured giving him an idea of what people already do will help him learn for himself why. I'm hoping he'll take them and gradually get a feel for how each note sounds over the chord so he can come up with things on his own, and things to "avoid"(hanging on a B natural over that chord, for instance).

Depending, of course, on how specifically that was directed at me.

For the record, TS, I've been thinking, and I can't think of a lot of stuff with a Mixolydian tonality. More often than not, a 7th chord not used as part of a V-I or similar motion implies something blues based.
#15
^It wasn't particularly directed at you, just a coincidence I guess that you were the last poster before me. You're right in saying that those are perhaps the only completely 'safe' scales to play over a C7 vamp. There's nothing really wrong with thinking in terms of scales like that either. I just think taking the approach that I described, and putting scales to the back of your mind, will result in better playing.
#16
Quote by Beserker
^It wasn't particularly directed at you, just a coincidence I guess that you were the last poster before me. You're right in saying that those are perhaps the only completely 'safe' scales to play over a C7 vamp. There's nothing really wrong with thinking in terms of scales like that either. I just think taking the approach that I described, and putting scales to the back of your mind, will result in better playing.


this is good advice.

chord tones help you identify notes on the fret board, and help your ear.