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#1
I know they're both technically Fenders, but what the hell is the difference between the two besides almost $1000?
#3
No, the squire is NOT a fender.

Just like an epiphone is not a gibson

The difference, is pickups, hardware, electronics, and craftsmanship. Squires are decent strats to upgrade though.
Agile AL3000
Douglas WRL90
SX SR1 STD Plus
J&D Strat
Squier Tele
Sammick TR2
Douglas Draco
Peavey JSX
Bugera V5
TWANGED VJ
#5
Build quality, quality of the parts, quality of the pickups. A Fender is just higher quality in general.
Feed your mind.
#6
the expensive one is made in the u.s.a. which makes up for most of the price difference.
It's all about feel
#7
There isn't as much difference as you think. Main thing is Squires (and Epis) are mass-produced on CNC-type machinery and there is less (read that almost none) hand-work at the end of the process. But as far as "better woods" - that's a load of crap. Minute differences in "tone woods" honestly don't mean squat with a solid-body bolt-together guitar. I defy ANYONE to actually hear the difference between the body/neck of a 2010 'real' strat or LP and the Chinese equiv. Put the same pickups and controls in both of them and they will sound identical - or so close to identical it'll be a matter of personal preference, not quality.

Squires and Epis also have cheaper hardware and pickups in some cases - but a lot of the complaints such as "won't stay in tune" are due to set-up issues like a nut not being filed correctly so it catches the string. "Real" Gibsons and Fenders have exactly the same problems.... it's just that you're more likely to have a good guitar tech at a real guitar store fixing it before you ever see it - vs. a $200 Squire where nobody can spend any time on it before you get it.

Now, that said... a beautiful hand-sanded flamed maple top Gibson USA Les Paul is a thing of beauty compared to a painted Epi Les Paul. And.... "real" Gibsons and Fenders will almost always hold their value and escalate in price while the Squires and Epis are pretty much considered throw-away student instruments. I have a 1970 "real" SG that I paid $200 for in '78... now worth well over $2000. An Epi "SG" today will be worth the same or less what you pay for it today 30 yrs from now - unless some famous rocker decides to start using a China-made Epi SG.

The very lowest rank of Squires (the $200 ones) have very inepensive tuners, bridge, nut, and the most basic nondescript pickups they can find. But they're still very playable. I actualy Gigged on a Squire P-Bass that was just as "good" as my "real" Fender P-Bass - stayed in tune good enough - was fine.
#8
Quote by JoePerry4life
No, the squire is NOT a fender.

Just like an epiphone is not a gibson

The difference, is pickups, hardware, electronics, and craftsmanship. Squires are decent strats to upgrade though.

WRONG, it sais so on the headstock, squier BY fender, you still say you have a squier, and epiphone is made by gibson, epi is just gibsons version of fenders squier.
ಠ_ಠ
- Yes, My name is actually Terran -
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#9
Overall the Fender guitars are better made, play better and sound better than the Squire guitars. To get the most out of a Fender guitar they have to suit the way you play and you need enough experience to appreciate the difference. Squire guitars are fine and do vary in price and quality. The real choice is if you think the difference in price is worth it to you.
#10
Quote by JAHellraiser
I know they're both technically Fenders, but what the hell is the difference between the two besides almost $1000?

MIM Fender strats are about $200-$300 more, not $1000
Quote by pedromiles101
you're not gonna want to take a dump in a gross, off-colored, vintage toilet. you want something that is white and pearly; something that shines. something that you can put your cheeks against and say, "f*** yeah"
#11
Quote by moucon
There isn't as much difference as you think. Main thing is Squires (and Epis) are mass-produced on CNC-type machinery and there is less (read that almost none) hand-work at the end of the process. But as far as "better woods" - that's a load of crap. Minute differences in "tone woods" honestly don't mean squat with a solid-body bolt-together guitar. I defy ANYONE to actually hear the difference between the body/neck of a 2010 'real' strat or LP and the Chinese equiv. Put the same pickups and controls in both of them and they will sound identical - or so close to identical it'll be a matter of personal preference, not quality.

Squires and Epis also have cheaper hardware and pickups in some cases - but a lot of the complaints such as "won't stay in tune" are due to set-up issues like a nut not being filed correctly so it catches the string. "Real" Gibsons and Fenders have exactly the same problems.... it's just that you're more likely to have a good guitar tech at a real guitar store fixing it before you ever see it - vs. a $200 Squire where nobody can spend any time on it before you get it.

Now, that said... a beautiful hand-sanded flamed maple top Gibson USA Les Paul is a thing of beauty compared to a painted Epi Les Paul. And.... "real" Gibsons and Fenders will almost always hold their value and escalate in price while the Squires and Epis are pretty much considered throw-away student instruments. I have a 1970 "real" SG that I paid $200 for in '78... now worth well over $2000. An Epi "SG" today will be worth the same or less what you pay for it today 30 yrs from now - unless some famous rocker decides to start using a China-made Epi SG.

The very lowest rank of Squires (the $200 ones) have very inepensive tuners, bridge, nut, and the most basic nondescript pickups they can find. But they're still very playable. I actualy Gigged on a Squire P-Bass that was just as "good" as my "real" Fender P-Bass - stayed in tune good enough - was fine.
Except for limited edition and custom shop models, no Gibson today will be worth more in 30 years than it s today. And yes, tone wood makes a difference. If it didn't then you wouldn't be able to hear the difference between a $1000 les paul studio and a $5000 1959 historic.
#13
Quote by MetalHead916
A Squier isn't a Fender. They are made by a subsidiary of the Fender company.


Chevrolet is a Subsidiary of General Motors.

So by your logic, a Corvette is NOT made by General Motors??

2001 Ernie Ball Music Man Axis Super Sport
2001 MIM Standard Strat
Peavey Classic 30 112 Combo.
My Gear
Last edited by jonmo1 at Jul 20, 2009,
#14
the name on the headstock - makes all the difference.
Quote by slash11896
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#15
Quote by jonmo1
Chevrolet is a Subsidiary of General Motors.

So by your logic, a Corvette is NOT made by General Motors??


damn...he has a point.
squier is a fender. just a crappy one. if it wasnt fender then it wouldn't say stratocaster on the headstock because fender owns the stratocaster name.
#16
Quote by jonmo1
Chevrolet is a Subsidiary of General Motors.

So by your logic, a Corvette is NOT made by General Motors??
subsidiaries are not all the same.

Squiers are made in the same overseas factory as other cheap strat style knockoffs. I guess those are Fenders too?
#17
Quote by jonmo1
Chevrolet is a Subsidiary of General Motors.

So by your logic, a Corvette is NOT made by General Motors??


Kind of a weird comparison

A corvette is made by a company that is owned by General Motors .. so yes it's a GM

A squier is made by a company that is owned by Fender ... but in no way do I see it as a true fender guitar. But by all means, you can call it a fender. I won't (for at least ones with affinity or bullet on them), but you can.

Dunno, I may have stated that all wrong. Who cares. Care to help me

/confusion?
#18
From Wikipedia...

Squier is an entry-level brand of the Fender Musical Instruments Corporation. It produces models mostly derived from the Fender line.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squier

Fender Owns Squier, therefor by default, a Squier is made by Fender.


The same can be said for Epiphone, it is owned by Gibson
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epiphone

2001 Ernie Ball Music Man Axis Super Sport
2001 MIM Standard Strat
Peavey Classic 30 112 Combo.
My Gear
#19
The same people who make Epiphone also make Jay Turser guitars.

Is a Jay Turser a Gibson?
#20
Quote by jonmo1
From Wikipedia...

Squier is an entry-level brand of the Fender Musical Instruments Corporation. It produces models mostly derived from the Fender line.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squier

Fender Owns Squier, therefor by default, a Squier is made by Fender.


The same can be said for Epiphone, it is owned by Gibson
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epiphone



You know I can edit that page to say that Squier's aren't Fender guitars right? Although Wikipedia is highly informative, it still can be edited by ANYBODY. But I see what you're getting at, but al makes good points as well.

I would be pretty pissed if I was standing with another guitarist, I had a MIJ strat and he had a Squier and somebody came up and said, "dang you both have nice fenders. "

Not to mention how much time I would save from clicking on Craigslist ads that say "Fender Guitar - $200" only to find out it's a starcaster.
#22
Quote by al112987
The same people who make Epiphone also make Jay Turser guitars.

Is a Jay Turser a Gibson?


You know this is something I have often wondered about. Having previously made a hobby of collecting something which was primarily made in Chinese factories (swords fyi) there were essentially two factories in china which pumped out swords though there were no less than 10-20 brands which distributed them through out North America as something different. So having this preconcieved idea about mass production from Chinese factories I have wondered about companies selling the same product for different prices and under different labels in guitars as well.

This issue actually came up while I was looking at some LPs at a local shop. I was testing out a Stagg LP and talking with one of the salesmen about it. He was telling me how he owned one and that he though it was a solid guitar to pick up and customize. He went on to tell me what he had done to his, then he told me something interesting. He said that when he switched out the pups in the guitar he found the original pups to have Epiphone labeling plastered all over them. Just some food for thought.
#23
Take the finish off ten squier and ten american standard bodies, weigh them, take measurements, and see the difference. Then compare the necks, fretwork, and look at how it fits in the pocket.

I say ten because there's always some jackass who will say 'well my squier is superior to a mim, mia, etc.'
#24
Quote by al112987
The same people who make Epiphone also make Jay Turser guitars.

Is a Jay Turser a Gibson?


If that were true, I would probably agree, however...
Where do you get that information??

Jay Turser Guitars is owned by a company called "American Music and Sound"
http://www.americanmusicandsound.com/

I don't see anywhere in their company info website that says anything about Epiphone...
But you can however find Epiphone on Gibson's website...
http://www2.gibson.com/Products/Electric-Guitars/Epiphone.aspx

2001 Ernie Ball Music Man Axis Super Sport
2001 MIM Standard Strat
Peavey Classic 30 112 Combo.
My Gear
Last edited by jonmo1 at Jul 20, 2009,
#25
Wow you really don't get how this works do you?

Do you see how American Music and Sound is a DISTRIBUTOR? The manufacturing of all the instruments are outsourced to a small number of large factories in Asia which make guitars for several brands. Gibson does not have it's own little factories in China dedicated to Epiphones.
#26
Let's just say that both sides of the argument are correct, it's a fine line...

I'm defiantely not saying that a squire strat is the same as a fender strat. Far from it.
All I'm saying is that a squier strat is indeed a fender,
it's not a fender STRATOCASTER, it's a Squier Stratocaster made by the Fender Musical Instruments Company..

just the same as you can say a chevrolet cavellier is indeed a GM, but it's not a GM Cavellier, it's a Chevrolet Cavellier, made by the GM motor company.

2001 Ernie Ball Music Man Axis Super Sport
2001 MIM Standard Strat
Peavey Classic 30 112 Combo.
My Gear
#27
Quote by al112987
Wow you really don't get how this works do you?

Do you see how American Music and Sound is a DISTRIBUTOR? The manufacturing of all the instruments are outsourced to a small number of large factories in Asia which make guitars for several brands. Gibson does not have it's own little factories in China dedicated to Epiphones.


Sure I'll give you that, I'm definately not a businessman...

So if you say Epiphone and Jay Turser are made by the same company, What company is that? And where did you get that information?

2001 Ernie Ball Music Man Axis Super Sport
2001 MIM Standard Strat
Peavey Classic 30 112 Combo.
My Gear
#28
Jay Turser is it's own brand and Epiphone is it's own brand, which Gibson has the rights to and milks by allowing Epiphone to use the Gibson name, trademarks and also the "correct" body styles. But both brands contract with manufacturing plants overseas. I don't know who makes Epiphones now, but a few years ago back when they were still being made in Korea, all Epiphones, along with several other "American" brands were all made in the Samick factory, until it closed down a few years back.

Epiphone is owned by Gibson, but they are not made by Gibson.
Last edited by al112987 at Jul 20, 2009,
#29
Quote by al112987
Jay Turser is it's own brand and Epiphone is it's own brand, which Gibson has the rights to and milks by allowing Epiphone to use the Gibson name, trademarks and also the "correct" body styles. But both brands contract with manufacturing plants overseas. I don't know who makes Epiphones now, but a few years ago back when they were still being made in Korea, all Epiphones, along with several other "American" brands were all made in the Samick factory, until it closed down a few years back.


The Key sentence is bolded. They have CONTRACTS with a manufacturing plant to produce the guitars. That does not mean that the manufacturing plant owns (or gets credit for making) them, it's still made by Epiphone, or Jay Turser or whatever..

The top of the food chain for Epiphone is Gibson.
The top of the food chain for Jay Turser is ??? <--NOT Gibson.

The top of the food chain for Squier is Fender

2001 Ernie Ball Music Man Axis Super Sport
2001 MIM Standard Strat
Peavey Classic 30 112 Combo.
My Gear
Last edited by jonmo1 at Jul 20, 2009,
#30
Quote by moucon
There isn't as much difference as you think. Main thing is Squires (and Epis) are mass-produced on CNC-type machinery and there is less (read that almost none) hand-work at the end of the process. But as far as "better woods" - that's a load of crap. Minute differences in "tone woods" honestly don't mean squat with a solid-body bolt-together guitar. I defy ANYONE to actually hear the difference between the body/neck of a 2010 'real' strat or LP and the Chinese equiv. Put the same pickups and controls in both of them and they will sound identical - or so close to identical it'll be a matter of personal preference, not quality.

Squires and Epis also have cheaper hardware and pickups in some cases - but a lot of the complaints such as "won't stay in tune" are due to set-up issues like a nut not being filed correctly so it catches the string. "Real" Gibsons and Fenders have exactly the same problems.... it's just that you're more likely to have a good guitar tech at a real guitar store fixing it before you ever see it - vs. a $200 Squire where nobody can spend any time on it before you get it.

Now, that said... a beautiful hand-sanded flamed maple top Gibson USA Les Paul is a thing of beauty compared to a painted Epi Les Paul. And.... "real" Gibsons and Fenders will almost always hold their value and escalate in price while the Squires and Epis are pretty much considered throw-away student instruments. I have a 1970 "real" SG that I paid $200 for in '78... now worth well over $2000. An Epi "SG" today will be worth the same or less what you pay for it today 30 yrs from now - unless some famous rocker decides to start using a China-made Epi SG.

The very lowest rank of Squires (the $200 ones) have very inepensive tuners, bridge, nut, and the most basic nondescript pickups they can find. But they're still very playable. I actualy Gigged on a Squire P-Bass that was just as "good" as my "real" Fender P-Bass - stayed in tune good enough - was fine.



Epic comment, all of this is pretty much correct.
Wait.



Roger Waters - 12th May!
#31
Quote by jonmo1
The Key sentence is bolded. They have CONTRACTS with a manufacturing plant to produce the guitars. That does not mean that the manufacturing plant owns (or gets credit for making) them, it's still made by Epiphone, or Jay Turser or whatever..

The top of the food chain for Epiphone is Gibson.
The top of the food chain for Jay Turser is ??? <--NOT Gibson.

The top of the food chain for Squier is Fender


But they're not made by Gibson. Gibson guitars are made by Gibson, in the Gibson factories, by the Gibson workers, on the Gibson machines. Epiphones are owned by Gibson, and thus licensed to use to use Gibson owned trademarks, and stamp Gibson on their truss rod covers, nothing else. They're not made in Gibson factories, they're not even made on the same continent that Gibsons are, they're not even made on the same hemisphere, so how can you say that they're made by Gibson?
Quote by LezPaulEpiphone
Epic comment, all of this is pretty much correct.

If you honestly believe his comment that you go buy a Gibson les paul standard and in 30 years it's going to be worth more than it does today (barring a major catastrophe on Gibson's behalf) you're a complete idiot. Very few modern made guitars will escalate in value. Not price, but value. Gibson's have made some very expensive, limited runs of guitars, the 2005 Page signature, the earlier Duane Allman signature, are examples of this, that will escalate in value, but in this day of mass production, they will not increase in value the same way the way that vintage les pauls have.
Last edited by al112987 at Jul 20, 2009,
#32
I get you're point completely.
Like I said it's a fine line...Call it a push.

Licensed would be like

Company B wants to make guitars just like Company A.
Company A holds the Patents
Comapny A DOES NOT own Company B
Company A gives it's permission for Company B to make guitars the same as company A.

That's a Licensed Copy.

Epiphone is NOT a licesnsed copy of Gibson.
Gibson DOES own Epiphone.

Epiphone is an Econemy line of guitars produced by Gibson.


What country/continent/hemisphere a guitar is made in has nothing to do with the the name of the company that made it.
It's called outsourcing and it happens in pretty much all products (cars, computers, tvs, etc...).

2001 Ernie Ball Music Man Axis Super Sport
2001 MIM Standard Strat
Peavey Classic 30 112 Combo.
My Gear
#33
Quote by Tango616
WRONG, it sais so on the headstock, squier BY fender, you still say you have a squier, and epiphone is made by gibson, epi is just gibsons version of fenders squier.

actually you're wrong - squiers are fender designs, built to fenders specs, in factories which are not owned by fender - infact the indonesian factory that makes squies also makes the lower end bolt-neck ibanez guitars. are ibanez made by fender? i think not.

the same applies for epiphone. not made by gibson. they are gibson designs and built to gibsons specs, but they are produced by someone else.
I like analogue Solid State amps that make no effort to be "tube-like", and I'm proud of it...

...A little too proud, to be honest.
#34
I've never really found much difference...apart from fenders having a better build quality. The wood on a fender strat doesnt make much difference, because all the parts are connected to a peice of plastic, not like with a gibson where its all attached to the wood.

It all depends on the sound you want. I'm happy with Squier, the main difference I can see is the name, and the price.
#35
When most people say Fender guitars they do not refer to the Squier guitars. Makes no real difference a good guitar is a good guitar whatever the name on it.
#36
Quote by chainsawguitar
I've never really found much difference...apart from fenders having a better build quality. The wood on a fender strat doesnt make much difference, because all the parts are connected to a peice of plastic, not like with a gibson where its all attached to the wood.

It all depends on the sound you want. I'm happy with Squier, the main difference I can see is the name, and the price.

it makes more difference than that although you have a valid point about the wood making a negligible difference compared to gibson despite your reason for it being misinformed. fenders don't have as good acoustic properties as gibson because of the way for example a strat's trem transfers very view vibrations to the body and the bolt-on necks on fenders aren't much good at transfering vibrations from one piece of wood to another, but it still does make a difference as huge as the difference in the quality of the wood.
I like analogue Solid State amps that make no effort to be "tube-like", and I'm proud of it...

...A little too proud, to be honest.
#37
Quote by jonmo1
I get you're point completely.
Like I said it's a fine line...Call it a push.

Licensed would be like

Company B wants to make guitars just like Company A.
Company A holds the Patents
Comapny A DOES NOT own Company B
Company A gives it's permission for Company B to make guitars the same as company A.

That's a Licensed Copy.

Epiphone is NOT a licesnsed copy of Gibson.
Gibson DOES own Epiphone.

Epiphone is an Econemy line of guitars produced by Gibson.


What country/continent/hemisphere a guitar is made in has nothing to do with the the name of the company that made it.
It's called outsourcing and it happens in pretty much all products (cars, computers, tvs, etc...).
Yeah, I think we just differ on how we define ________ is made by ______
#38
Some interesting pics and tidbit from Epiphone's website: http://www.gibson.com/en-us/Lifestyle/Features/epiphone-inspection-401/
Did you know that every single Epiphone instrument — be it electric or acoustic guitar, mandolin or banjo — that leaves the Epiphone factories in Asia undergoes a rigorous inspection process before hitting stores?

It’s true!

In 1969, Epiphone moved most of its stringed instrument production from the U.S. to Asia in an effort to meet the rising demand for superior instruments at affordable prices. Today, almost all Epiphones are made in Asia, with the bulk coming from the company’s very own state-of-the-art production facility in Qingdao, China.

After they’re finished, however, each instrument bound for U.S. retailers is first shipped to Epiphone’s Nashville, Tenn., headquarters, where it must successfully pass an exhaustive 15-point inspection process before being shipped to its final destination. It should be noted that all Epiphone instruments bound for E.U., U.K. and Japan customers are subjected to an identical inspection process at dedicated Epiphone facilities in the Netherlands (Gibson Europe) and Japan (Gibson Japan). All Epiphone disbributors that serve other markets are also required to conduct similar inspection processes on all Epiphone models.
#39
they must've changed production locations then after the Samick factory closed down and opened their own factory. A couple of years ago they were still being made in Korea.
#40
Quote by herrotim
damn...he has a point.
squier is a fender. just a crappy one. if it wasnt fender then it wouldn't say stratocaster on the headstock because fender owns the stratocaster name.

it doesnt say stratocaster, squiers say Strat.
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