#1
Tittle ^


e|---10p9p7h9p7---7----------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
B|--------------------10-10p7h10p7--7-----------------------------------------------------------------|
G|-----------------------------------------9--9p7h9p7--7-------------------------------------------------|
D|---------------------------------------------------------9--9p7h9p7--7----------------------------------|
A|--------------------------------------------------------------------------9--9p7h9p7----7------------------|
E|-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------10--10p9-7---------|

If not, what technique would it help?
Does it worth practicing it?
Thanks.

Btw. I built it myself (I don't mean i created it, might exist somewhere else)
Last edited by rauLstradlinN at Aug 3, 2009,
#2
yea it would.play it backwards as well
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Tell me what nation on this earth, was not born of tragedy-Primordial
#3
it might help, but it looks like it's more something that would show off the skills that you have than something that would develop them. Playing bass really helps legato, and something simple like this helps a lot especially if you do it with your ring and pinky:

d d u u
g---------5-6p5--
d----5h6--------6

just do this for as long as you can, and then do it with other fingers, and do it from above the neck as well
#4
eddiewhatever you give the worst advice of all time.

Telling a guitarist to get a bass to improve legato? You might as well tell a pianist to go and bang drums to get better at playing scales.

TS; yes it will improve your legato as far as that run is concerned. To make it as good as possible, slow it right down, concentrate on getting each note to the same volume, evenly spaced and smooth (legato does mean smooth after all!). You want to do as many combinations of legato runs as possible, starting on one string, then moving across strings.
#6
Yawn. Oh god save us all for the future of music.

It's like me asking how to prepare myself for riding a fast motorbike, and you say 'oh just drive around a Bugatti Veyron for a bit, that'll prepare you'

It's totally ludicrous advice.
Last edited by Ikonoklast at Aug 3, 2009,
#8
Quote by Ikonoklast
Yawn. Oh god save us all for the future of music.

It's like me asking how to prepare myself for riding a fast motorbike, and you say 'oh just drive around a Bugatti Veyron for a bit, that'll prepare you'

It's totally ludicrous advice.


I think you're completely wrong about absolutely everything including the motorcycle haha

Playing the TS's run wouldn't help legato at all until he had it memorized, and even then it doesn't focus on individual fingers so it would be even less effective. You get better at a specific run the more you do it, but you don't get better at the technique it demands unless you, uh, actually get better at the technique it demands haha

If you said I don't think bass would help much, I'd still think you're wrong haha but you're actually saying No don't get a bass, playing bass couldn't possibly help your guitar playing, that's crazy.

That sounds ludicrous. Guitar and bass are not like piano and drums, or cars and bikes. While the instruments are played a bit differently, if you practiced guitar technique on a bass, it would help you much faster in a few ways than practicing them on guitar.

Bass is basically a more difficult to play guitar. The action is a bit higher, they're farther apart, and it requires a lot more strength.

You think that in order to be good at something you just have to do that specific thing over and over again? It isn't just about guitar, it is about getting better at anything requiring a physical effort. You're basically saying crosstraining doesn't help.

Bass, especially for a beginner, certainly helps with strength, which is more important for legato than non legato, but it also helps with technique in general too. Practicing proper guitar technique on bass is harder; therefore you progress faster.

If the TS did the exercise that I suggested, and especially if he did it on bass, he would develop awesome legato. Focusing on one finger until you feel the burn is the fastest way to build strength. If you do it on bass you have to make sure you're still using your fingertips otherwise it won't help that much, but that is exactly the point. It is harder to play with your fingertips on bass, so when you're trying to, you get better at doing it faster.

And I didn't say to get a bass. How do you know he doesn't have a bass? How do you know he doesn't have an acoustic guitar? Are you going to say acoustic doesn't help either? Really, if I said acoustic guitar instead of bass would you still call me crazy? You;re the first person I've ever heard say playing bass doesn't help, and you'd be the first to say acoustic guitar didn't help either.
#9
I didn't bother to read most of your post because you have the reasoning of a child.

So you're basically telling TS to go and buy a bass to get better at legato? You, and your advice, are pathetic and I sincerely hope nobody actually heeds it.

To TS, practice your legato ever so slowly on YOUR GUITAR.
If you get the technique right on guitar, you have no need to have 'stronger' hands, or to play it on a bass. Do NOT listen to the 'do it on A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT INSTRUMENT' advice.
#10
What is the point of telling me I'm pathetic?

You hope no one heeds my advice? It is as if you think playing bass would actually hurt your guitar playing.

This is something that is a proven fact. Any time any guitarist plays bass for even a short amount of time, when they pick up a guitar, they are better at fretting. Unless you're already insanely amazing at both so it makes no difference. Maybe I'm wrong on that. Maybe I should make a poll and find out what others think.

You really don't believe one instrument could possibly make you better at another? Maybe it doesn't help you, maybe you just haven't tried it, but it has certainly helped me. If I didn't play bass, and acoustic, and electric guitar, I wouldn't be as good as I am at saxophone, or piano, or even trumpet, specifically legato on those instruments.

It's an immediate and permanent improvement. I can play bass for one day (especially left handed) and I'm faster at every other instrument, and I'm not using more strength, I'm using the same amount or less, and it is easier. It requires more finger strength than any other instrument I know, which is why it helps with basically every other instrument.

Even with things seemingly far away from each other in technique are helpful, such as piano and drums. I don't think playing piano helps much with drumming, but drumming DEFINITELY helps with certain techniques on piano.

I really don't understand how someone could logically say that playing one instrument couldn't possibly help someone with another instrument, especially when it is in regard to strength. You reach a certain limit with strength or technique alone. If one of them is lacking, you have to work on it. Because the TS is asking about legato, it is more likely that strength is an issue.

If you don't have a bass, again, I wouldn't suggest you go buy one just to get better at guitar (I would suggest you buy one anyway because bass is a LOT of fun haha), but there are faster ways to develop strength and technique for playing guitar than just playing guitar. Playing very specific exercises until your muscles are sore helps. (that is why they're called exercises. If you don't get tired, you're not getting an exercise)

Doing the exercise I suggested (for a long time, and with your weak fingers especially) alone is good enough. You don't have to do it on bass. However, if you do it on bass you will get stronger faster.

To say that what I said is crazy, is itself so crazy that I think you're just getting a kick out of saying that something that is obviously true is not.I don't know why your brain works like this. Every other person I know would say at least it is possible that bass would help. I think you're just messing with me, or you're actually trying to prevent the TS from improving.

I could make a list of things that are not guitar but do in fact help with technique and strength. I've done them myself and I've suggested them to other people and they all worked for them.

I just want to know what you think about other things that help.
What do you think about acoustic guitar? What about nsd powerball?
I don't need to touch the guitar at all when I pick. I know another person who has a powerball, and he plays mandolin. He said that after the very first time he used it, he didn't have to touch the mandolin at all. He went from anchoring and resting his arm on the bridge to floating completely. Is he insane as well?

What about doing all upstrokes to get better at other types of picking? Is that crazy?

What about this guy. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDRKHR5hKBk&feature=channel_page
'if you really wanna work out your fingers cause it's harder to play'

Gripmasters? those aren't helpful either?


Maybe the TS doesn't need more strength. Maybe he just needs better technique. If he's looking to get better technique, he could try fretting from above the fretboard. I told someone to do that recently, he said he only played a few notes like that but he immediately had better technique. I think it has to do with your fingers naturally having a more demanding, but more proper position, and it exercises your extensors and forces you to lay with your fingertips. I bet you think that is crazy too haha
#11
Again i didn't bother to read any of that, apart from you saying bass wouldn't hurt your guitaring. I'm not saying it would, i'm saying playing bass isn't a solution to a guitar problem.

EDIT: actually i just read it, because i'm in a confrontational mood. I will address your points, and then prove them wrong.

What is the point of telling me I'm pathetic?

Because you're giving bad advice to people that need to be helped, not hindered.

This is something that is a proven fact. Any time any guitarist plays bass for even a short amount of time, when they pick up a guitar, they are better at fretting.

Proven fact? Do you have sources to back this up?
Because frets are spaced and sized differently on a bass, which also has thicker strings. Technique is also very different, they're two completely separate instruments.

Unless you're already insanely amazing at both so it makes no difference. Maybe I'm wrong on that. Maybe I should make a poll and find out what others think.

Make a poll, most people (here or anywhere) are morons, so i don't really care what they think.


You really don't believe one instrument could possibly make you better at another? Maybe it doesn't help you, maybe you just haven't tried it, but it has certainly helped me. If I didn't play bass, and acoustic, and electric guitar, I wouldn't be as good as I am at saxophone, or piano, or even trumpet, specifically legato on those instruments.

I believe playing an instrument can improve general ability to play, but it's not specific. It's like saying everytime you want to improve on guitar, just go and pick up your bass.


It's an immediate and permanent improvement. I can play bass for one day (especially left handed) and I'm faster at every other instrument, and I'm not using more strength, I'm using the same amount or less, and it is easier. It requires more finger strength than any other instrument I know, which is why it helps with basically every other instrument.

Being strong has absolutely nothing to do with playing an instrument. Once you develop relaxed and good technique being strong has nothing to do with it. If you think you have to be stronger to play a bass you have bad technique yourself.

I really don't understand how someone could logically say that playing one instrument couldn't possibly help someone with another instrument, especially when it is in regard to strength. You reach a certain limit with strength or technique alone. If one of them is lacking, you have to work on it. Because the TS is asking about legato, it is more likely that strength is an issue.

Good legato is being relaxed and having excellent finger independence. Strength has nothing to do with it.

If you don't have a bass, again, I wouldn't suggest you go buy one just to get better at guitar (I would suggest you buy one anyway because bass is a LOT of fun haha), but there are faster ways to develop strength and technique for playing guitar than just playing guitar. Playing very specific exercises until your muscles are sore helps. (that is why they're called exercises. If you don't get tired, you're not getting an exercise)

I can't believe you're trying to prove me wrong whilst advocating guitar as a physical exercise. You shouldn't play until you are sore, and if you have very good technique you shouldn't get sore even after hours of playing. This is the worst advice i've ever seen.

To say that what I said is crazy, is itself so crazy that I think you're just getting a kick out of saying that something that is obviously true is not.I don't know why your brain works like this. Every other person I know would say at least it is possible that bass would help. I think you're just messing with me, or you're actually trying to prevent the TS from improving.

I could make a list of things that are not guitar but do in fact help with technique and strength. I've done them myself and I've suggested them to other people and they all worked for them.

I just want to know what you think about other things that help.
What do you think about acoustic guitar? What about nsd powerball?
I don't need to touch the guitar at all when I pick. I know another person who has a powerball, and he plays mandolin. He said that after the very first time he used it, he didn't have to touch the mandolin at all. He went from anchoring and resting his arm on the bridge to floating completely. Is he insane as well?

Won't dignify this drivel with a response.

What about doing all upstrokes to get better at other types of picking? Is that crazy?

Your comparison is completely pointless and ridiculous.


Maybe the TS doesn't need more strength. Maybe he just needs better technique. If he's looking to get better technique, he could try fretting from above the fretboard. I told someone to do that recently, he said he only played a few notes like that but he immediately had better technique. I think it has to do with your fingers naturally having a more demanding, but more proper position, and it exercises your extensors and forces you to lay with your fingertips. I bet you think that is crazy too haha

This post just makes you look like a fool, so i don't know what you're laughing about.
Last edited by Ikonoklast at Aug 4, 2009,
#12
I didn't say proper technique isn't a necessity. It certainly is. And I agree that it is more important than strength almost all the time; however, I didn't say that bass only improves strength. It improves technique, too. So telling me that bass is useless because technique is more important doesn't make sense. You'll have to either show that bass doesn't improve technique, or that technique doesn't matter lol

Since when was strength not important? My right hand technique (my fretting hand) is about is perfect as it gets, as far as not having any bad habits. If I push the speed too fast then yeah I get less accurate, which is why I practice haha. My pinky doesn't fly away, my fingers are in the ideal range of motion, I don't use any extra strength, the fingers that I'm not using are like less than a centimeter away from the strings, I play right behind the frets with my fingertips, and I don't even need to use my thumb. Those things really don't have much to do with strength, but strength is still a factor. The only way that I can get better is by doing accuracy exercises, and strength exercises; both of which, when done on bass, will improve faster.

Sources? Well, there's me, everyone around me, and everyone on the internet except you (probably wrong on that one lol)

Actually you addressed practically nothing I said, and didn't disprove any of it. This is like talking to a religious person, just a lot of insults.

At the very least answer one thing: Practicing on acoustic guitar: Would it help more, less, equally, not at all, or hurt?

I'm not going to say anymore in this thread just because there's no reason. Unless you actually prove this wrong. Then I'll say I'm wrong.
Last edited by eddievanzant at Aug 4, 2009,
#13
I didn't say proper technique isn't a necessity. It certainly is. And I agree that it is more important than strength almost all the time

There's no such thing as 'strength' on a guitar once you get past the general playing positions your hands have to be in. For example, once you get used to a certain barre chord shape it is all to do with good technique, not being 'strong' enough to do them.

; however, I didn't say that bass only improves strength. It improves technique, too. So telling me that bass is useless because technique is more important doesn't make sense. You'll have to either show that bass doesn't improve technique, or that technique doesn't matter lol

Will i? I know i'm right, and people that know what good technique is will know you're wrong.

Since when was strength not important? My right hand technique (my fretting hand) is about is perfect as it gets, as far as not having any bad habits. If I push the speed too fast then yeah I get less accurate, which is why I practice haha. My pinky doesn't fly away, my fingers are in the ideal range of motion, I don't use any extra strength, the fingers that I'm not using are like less than a centimeter away from the strings, I play right behind the frets with my fingertips, and I don't even need to use my thumb. Those things really don't have much to do with strength, but strength is still a factor. The only way that I can get better is by doing accuracy exercises, and strength exercises; both of which, when done on bass, will improve faster.

Again, what's your point? I take it from this that next time i want to learn a 9th barre chord i'll go and do gripmaster and a few chin-ups and deadlifts, because now i know i have to be strong to play the guitar.

Sources? Well, there's me, everyone around me, and everyone on the internet except you (probably wrong on that one lol)

99% of people are idiots, which means that 99% of people on the internet are morons, as you have proved.

Actually you addressed practically nothing I said, and didn't disprove any of it. This is like talking to a religious person, just a lot of insults.

Well you still have no decent comeback, you're merely repeating yourself.

At the very least answer one thing: Practicing on acoustic guitar: Would it help more, less, equally, not at all, or hurt?

It wouldn't hurt. But my original point was that you shouldn't address technique problems on guitar by playing something else. Being the best acoustic player in the world doesn't make you great on electric.

I'm not going to say anymore in this thread just because there's no reason. Unless you actually prove this wrong. Then I'll say I'm wrong.

I don't need to cite sources or anything to prove you wrong, it's basic common sense.

It's like saying being a great boxer will make you a great MMA fighter. It's only one element of it. Playing bass, although similar in some aspects is not an end to playing guitar. And while playing it isn't going to hurt your guitaring, it's not a solid way to improve it either.

Now if you can prove that statement wrong, then go ahead.
#14
OK after this post I'm done haha

I'm not trying to insult you or make comebacks. I'm telling you that you are insulting me and there's no point. Even if I said something like, squats will improve your vertical leap, as crazy as that is, there's no reason for you to call me an idiot. Wait hold on, squats do increase your vertical leap lol

That's a bit too subject of a statement to actually prove wrong, but here's what I'll do: I think I need to improve my r/l hand coordination, and I also want to improve the efficiency of the movement of me planting my finger perfectly on the string and pressing them straight down to the fret. So I'm going to sweep some finger permutations on bass, over the top of the fretboard too lol. Because my electric guitar has little bitty .08 gauge strings and as little action as possible, and my bass has big slippery strings and much higher action, I will improve much faster on bass.

update...
yep, improving noticeably faster lol
Last edited by eddievanzant at Aug 4, 2009,
#16
I played guitar for 10 years, stopped and then played bass for 2 years, then stopped and came back to guitar....guess what...more finger strength.

Bass may not make you better at just legatto, but it does increase your finger strength, therefor making legatto easier to do. It also made bends a lot easier to do.
#18
Quote by srob7001
I played guitar for 10 years, stopped and then played bass for 2 years, then stopped and came back to guitar....guess what...more finger strength.

Bass may not make you better at just legatto, but it does increase your finger strength, therefor making legatto easier to do. It also made bends a lot easier to do.


i dont see anything wrong with this theory, its the same when playing piano i find that my fingers feel a lot stronger and are easier to move on guitar as well
My Beginner setup:
Ibanez rg321mh
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#19
even with the strength thing put aside and the skills like legato and ect ect playing bass helps with developing rhythm ^_^ and I get to be the first to point that out you can be a allright guitarist with ****ty rhythm so long as you play a good melody but playing the bass you cant get good unless you has the rhythm I'm planing on picking one up just for that.....besides......bass is pretty badass