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#1
Hey there, I'm Dan, 14, and I'm just starting up, I signed up to Ultimate Guitar today.

I've always loved Classic Rock & Roll, (my favourite bands: Led Zeppelin, The Rolling Stones, The Beatles.)

It's what I love most, so my parents decided to buy me a cheap electric guitar. They got me a red Encore Stratocaster, with a small 10 watt practice amp, the gig bag, and all the other stuff you get in the beginner packages. Well, I've been playing it for about a week now, and looking on the internet, I've discovered that the Encore isn't the best guitar ever, but hey, I'm just learning.

I can play a couple of VERY simple riffs, such as Smoke on the Water by Deep Purple, Iron Man by Black Sabbath, Sunshine of your Love by Cream, Heartbreaker by Led Zeppelin and Aqualung by Jethro Tull. I haven't really moved on to chords yet, but I hear they're important. Anyway, I really do have a lot of time to dedicate to learning, so I'm definitely aiming to be in a Rock & Roll cover band eventually, (Maybe a Led Zeppelin tribute) as Lead guitarist or Rhythm guitarist.

Well anyway, my birthday's is November, and then there's Christmas a month later, and I'm hoping to upgrade my gear, so the questions I have for you experienced lot are these:

What should I try to learn next?

When I upgrade my equipment, what should I get? (Try to keep it relatively cheap, maybe under £300 altogether)

By the way, if it's important to what I should buy, I would like my sound to be inspired by that of Jimmy Page and Led Zeppelin, I really want to use strats, so would like to stick to the strat design.

Also, I hear Marshall amps are the best? Is that true? (Or atleast, for the Led Zeppelin influenced sound)

Thanks for your help

PS - Cannot afford lessons, we are going on holiday soon, and would prefer to teach myself.
#2
At your price range, forget marshalls, all you will get is their solid state line. (Not good at all)
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---

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#4
For guitars, try the Squier Classic Vibe Series. Play both Strats and find out which one you like best.

'50s Stratocaster: $300 USD/£177 - Will keep you possibly set for life
http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Squier-CLASSIC-VIBE-Stratocaster-50s-Electric-Guitar-?sku=519338&src=3WFRWXX&ZYXSEM=0&CAWELAID=341943555


'60s Stratocaster: $300 USD/£177 - Will keep you possibly set for life
http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Squier-CLASSIC-VIBE-Stratocaster-60s-Electric-Guitar-?sku=519339&src=3WFRWXX&ZYXSEM=0&CAWELAID=343618946



For amps, try an Epiphone Valve Junior Combo, or half stack.

Combo: $130 USD/£94 - the ultimate begginer's combo
http://www.zzounds.com/item--EPIEPABKJR

Half Stack: $250 USD/£147 - SWEET stack, this will possibly keep you set for life
http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Epiphone-Valve-Jr-HalfStack?sku=481475&src=3WFRWXX&ZYXSEM=0&CAWELAID=60968511
Gear:
Epiphone G400/L6 Spider III 15
Squier CV J-Bass/Acoustic B20
Misc. pedals

Currently saving for:
Acoustic B200

Funds:
$125/$350


Quote by m4l666
I play hard, like death metal hard

Last edited by chaazums at Aug 3, 2009,
#5
Welcome to UG, and to the world of electric guitar.

rule 1, this is a VERY expensive hobby, get used to it.
rule 2, learn the term GAS (Gear Aquisition Syndrome)

Now, for upgrading gear, upgrade the AMP first.
The AMP makes more difference in your tone than the guitar does.

If you have 300 Pounds, that's about 500 US right?
And you're not into Metal...

Go for a used Fender Hot Rod Deluxe.
If you want new, save a little bit more, and get a Peavey Classic 30.
If you want new, and can't get any more cash, go for either

1. Fender Blues Jr.
2. Peavey ValveKing

These amps will still do for metal, but you'll need a distortion pedal of some kind.


Now, for learning more...
Learn the Pentatonic Major and Pentatonic Minor Scales.

When I learned those, my skill level soared through the roof. Seriously, at least tripled my skill, if it's possible to really quantify it like that.

2001 Ernie Ball Music Man Axis Super Sport
2001 MIM Standard Strat
Peavey Classic 30 112 Combo.
My Gear
Last edited by jonmo1 at Aug 3, 2009,
#6
your english right
for a guitar
under 300 quid
your very best bet is to get a vintage(brand not age) les paul heres a link
http://www.guitarampkeyboard.com/en/72458 on par if not better with epiphones
that is your very best bet
GEAR
94 Fender Stratocaster Plus
02 Gibson Les Paul Special (modded)
Orange AD-30 Combo


The SG Thread pwns your thread.
#7
If you want to sound like page, les paul or telecaster guitars are the ones he used. I don't think he ever used a strat, but I could be mistaken.

A laney vc15 would be a good amp upgrade in your budget
#8
Another tip:

Finger exercises.

http://www.5min.com/Video/Guitar-Tricks-14-Reggae-and-SkaPunk-Style-Rhythm-Guitar-143444893

Only watch the first part of that video unless you're interested in actually learning how to play reggae
Gear:
Epiphone G400/L6 Spider III 15
Squier CV J-Bass/Acoustic B20
Misc. pedals

Currently saving for:
Acoustic B200

Funds:
$125/$350


Quote by m4l666
I play hard, like death metal hard

#9
Quote by KoenDercksen
I would save up longer, get some more cash and then buy some good gear that will serve you for a long time.


+1 to that. Any of the classics are a good way to go. Listen to Jeff Beck, Hendrix, Clapton (old Creme), etc. Most importantly, just learn to play songs. Get one of this big all song bibles and learn everything you can.

DBZ Barchetta Eminent FR
DBZ Bolero ST
DBZ Imperial FM
DBZ Venom Matte Black
Dean '79 V
Dean '79 ML
Fender Princeton Chorus
Behringer V-Tone 2/12
Asterope Cables
Dunlop Cry Baby Wah
Digitech Hardware Metal Distortion
#10
Look up Justin Sandercoe and Marty Schwartz on youtube. they each have a few channels, then look up their beginner lessons (especially justin sandercoe) They give great lessons online for free and they are some of the best guitarists/teachers out there.
#11
Yeah it might be better to save up longer for gear. From what I've seen it's best to upgrade about a year after you start, because then you have a better understanding of what you are looking for in a guitar, and a better understanding of the parts, or what to look for in a guitar. Your gear is likely to be good enough as a start, to get you practicing and to get comfortable.

I'd say a great way to start learning is just to play songs you like, like you're doing now. Since you love the songs you'll be more motivated. Learn some chords and scales inbetween, too, and practice switching between chords.
#12
Welcome to the Wonderful World of Guitar!

Indeed this is a very fun and rewarding hobby you've started, but as stated before...expensive! For a beginner however, I would say that an old Squier strat is completely fine for quite a while. They're cheap and don't sound too bad unless you're going for extreme metal, which it sounds like you're not. As for the amp, VOX puts out a line of modeling amps, the VT series in 15, 30, 50, and 100 watt combos. They're pretty cheap, have a wide range of tonal capability, and for a beginner who doesn't really need to focus on the minute differences in S.S./valve amps, I think it'd be worth a look.

As for the music, it sounds like you have the greatest in your mind already...Zeppelin!! A few others might be Cream (Clapton), Hendrix, Steppinwolf, The Who...just find songs you love and try to learn them. These early days are going to take hard work and endurance, but when it pays off (and it will), the rewards are so sweet! Best of luck!
#13
One step at a time is the key to getting good. and getting good gear. You have good advice on music to listen to and play along with but remember The Who. Their songs are simple but very effective.
I've played Encore Strats and they are not so much worse than cheap Squier or MIM Fenders. All the people you want to emulate played Gibsons. Les Pauls, SG's and a V in the case of Hendrix. Even David Gilmour used an old Les Paul for recording. As I say, the guitar you have is okay enough for now but all the bundled amps are pretty poor. That should be your first upgrade and I'd expect some nice offers to be coming along this Xmas time. A small valve amp will give you a good tone but they are comparatively expensive. A decent Solid State amp may be a better investment while you are learning. Peavey Vypyr and Roland Cube ranges are among the best with lots of built-in effects. You'll see lots on here about different amps and time is on your side, so no rush.
When the time comes for a better guitar, you could do a lot worse than the Vintage V100 Les Pauls or the same brand VS6 which is their SG type. A new supplier has come to light in Wales and the products look great but sell about £100 more than Vintage. I'd say keep away from the more specialised guitars with floating bridge trem systems until you decide you have to play that style. Meanwhile keep your Encore for the lighter sounds it is capable of.
I pick up my guitar and play
Just like Yesterday

T C Ellis Series 2 LP w/Skatterbrane Quiescence pups
Cort EVL-K6
Yamaha RGX211 modded
H&S Electric 12-string
Shaftsbury Ricki 4001
'84 Fender Yale
Roland Cube 15x

#14
Jimmy Page is notorious for his sunburst Les Paul, if I'm not mistaken... you may want to get an Epiphone Les Paul, if you want a classic tone.

http://www.guitarcenter.com/Epiphone-Les-Paul-Standard-Plus-Top-Electric-Guitar-518341-i1149990.gc

After reading your story, this guitar pretty much speaks to me. You don't want light guitars, you want thick, bulky, classic Gibson style guitars. So get the Epiphone!
Epiphone G-400
Roland Cube 30X
#15
Hey, thanks guys, you're all really friendly, and don't worry, I have heard all of those classics that you lot reccomended.

Well anyway, I am going to look at ALL of the guitars you good folks listed, and try to play as many of them as I can before I buy one. Thanks for the information about upgrading the Amp first, Jonmo1, I must confess I did NOT know that the amp is more important to the tone. Also Chaazums, you mention a half stack? what is a half stack?

Yeah, well you know I just love playing those iconic riffs, Heartbreaker is the most fun to play for me thus far, you know that satisfaction you get from hearing it sound just like the original? It's awesome.

So do any of you live in Bristol? From the looks of it a good lot of you are American. Well, if anyone does do you know any good guitar/music shops in the area, cause' I really want to go to one instead of just browsing online and looking at the instruments at my school.

Thanks guys
#16
Quote by steve!
your english right
for a guitar
under 300 quid
your very best bet is to get a vintage(brand not age) les paul heres a link
http://www.guitarampkeyboard.com/en/72458 on par if not better with epiphones
that is your very best bet

I can give a massive backing to this, I own one, they are simply brilliant guitars for the price. (Vintage V100's)

If you are getting a Les Paul, don't bother getting an Epiphone just because they are made from Gibson (Quality control is horrible, the one's I've played are terrible, and tbh, Vintage V100's are better allover)

Also, stay well away from Marshalls in your price range. Amps are way more important then guitars. If you buy the guitar for 185, you've a healthy sum to buy a good amp. I'll leave it to the rest of the ol' Electric Guitar forumers to help you on amps, because tbh I'm not too wise on them, unless your into Heavy metal that is

Wishing you many years of guitar fun, its a great instrument don't you think?

EDIT: Epic failure grammar
Last edited by Lollage123 at Aug 3, 2009,
#17
What is a half stack?

There are 2 main parts to making the sound come out of an electric guitar.
1. Amplifier
2. Speaker

A half stack is when you 2 seperate components.
1. is the amplifier (also called a Head)
2. is the speaker (also called a Cabinet, can have 1,2 or 4 speakers)
http://mikebryant.files.wordpress.com/2007/01/marshall_half_stack_big.jpg

A FULL Stack is when you have a Head and 2 Cabinets.

A combo amp is when the Amplifier and Speaker both exist within the same enclosure.
http://www.blamepro.com/gifs/mar/4211.jpg

Hope that helps...

2001 Ernie Ball Music Man Axis Super Sport
2001 MIM Standard Strat
Peavey Classic 30 112 Combo.
My Gear
Last edited by jonmo1 at Aug 3, 2009,
#18
Quote by jonmo1
What is a half stack?

There are 2 main parts to making the sound come out of an electric guitar.
1. Amplifier
2. Speaker

A half stack is when you 2 seperate components. 1 is the amplifier, the other is the speaker
http://mikebryant.files.wordpress.com/2007/01/marshall_half_stack_big.jpg

A combo amp is when the Amplifier and Speaker both exist within the same enclosure.
http://www.magdonmusic.com/amps/Fender/images/product/lg/fender_hotrod-deluxea.jpg

Hope that helps...

I think he'd be better off with a good practice amp, Christmas isn't that far away, I've been playing 6 months, and by then he's nto going to benefit much from a half stack. Look into combos like the Roland Microcube, Peavey Vypyr etc. NO MARSHALLS OR LINE 6 III AMPS
#19
Quote by Lollage123
I think he'd be better off with a good practice amp, Christmas isn't that far away, I've been playing 6 months, and by then he's nto going to benefit much from a half stack. Look into combos like the Roland Microcube, Peavey Vypyr etc. NO MARSHALLS OR LINE 6 III AMPS


Dude, I was just explaining the difference between Half Stack and Combo Amp.
I made no recommendation one way or the other...

2001 Ernie Ball Music Man Axis Super Sport
2001 MIM Standard Strat
Peavey Classic 30 112 Combo.
My Gear
#20
Quote by jonmo1
Dude, I was just explaining the difference between Half Stack and Combo Amp.
I made no recommendation one way or the other...

yeah I just realised sorry Just don't want him to pick up on the wrong thing

Sorry mate
#21
Welcome Dan,

As a UG'er from england I've quickly discovered that small second hand shops and eBay are you're best friends. For example, the for £300 I managed to get myself a Marshall JCM 900 which I adore, fantastic amp, fantastic tone. Shop around all the used places you can think of as you can get some amazing deals.

Also stay away from the low end Marshall & Fender amps (i.e MG & Frontman) as a new guitarist they might seem like really good deals, but actually you could get something much, much better for your money.
LesPaul
Pedals
OrangeRocker30
My band
PBT Native: Resident Graphics Monkey

#22
Ok, thanks for explaining about half stacks, Jonmo1, that was really helpful. Anyway, you're all reccomending Les Pauls, and I know Page used one, but isn't it possible to emulate his sound using a strat with the right amp? (I really love the look, practicality and the way all six tuning pegs are on the same side of the head)

Anyway, I'd like to know, does this half stack include both the head amp and the speaker? Cause it looks like it's just the head from one of the pictures, I might be wrong!

http://www.andertons.co.uk/EpiphoneValveJuniorStackinstock/pid16360/cid557/EpiphoneValveJuniorStackinstock.asp?utm_source=googlebase&utm_medium=pricecomp&utm_campaign=GoogleShopping

I've been reccomended that one, but if I get it, I'm supposed to change the tubes or something? What are the tubes? Is it a good buy?

Anyway, after that I'd be left with about £130 pounds, which is about $220 US Dollars. Is there a good guitar (Preferably strat or maybe tele!) I could get for that price? Also, why is everyone telling me to stay away from Marshall amps?

By the way, with £130 pounds I can definitely buy a brand new Fender Squier Affinity series strat, Would this and the half stack be a good purchase?

Oh yeah, and I'm thinking about the Sg as well, are there any good Sg's you can get for that price (Page DID use an Sg, except it had two necks.)

Thanks,
Last edited by Eurozeppelin at Aug 4, 2009,
#23
A Strat has single coil pickups. These are bright and sharp.
http://cachepe.samedaymusic.com/media/quality,85/brand,sameday/p44057h-7b37631e1ccd9acc166f32f6f9856dda.jpg

Les Pauls have humbuckers. These are basically two single coil pickups paired together. The combined output when wired together matched with the slight difference in position means it cancels out hum, allowing it to be used quietly with high gain (doesn't help if it's microphonic). Humbuckers also have a round, warm tone. Ballsy, if you like.
http://www.wizardpickups.co.uk/images/humbucker4_large.jpg

Also that is a half stack, you can tell because there are two parts. The top is the head and the bottom is the cab.

EDIT: You live in the UK right? See if you can get a copy of last month's Guitarist. It comes with a DVD with videos of loads of different sounds. If you can't or just not bothered, I'll rip it :shh: and send it to you.

NOTE: I may be completely wrong in this post.
I have a ponytail fetish.
..And a labcoat fetish. SCIENCE!
Last edited by AntiG3 at Aug 4, 2009,
#24
if u noticed my post on the previous page the vitnage les paul was going to sound way bettter for the stuff u like
and a hell of alot better quality then squire
GEAR
94 Fender Stratocaster Plus
02 Gibson Les Paul Special (modded)
Orange AD-30 Combo


The SG Thread pwns your thread.
#25
I really would like to use a Fender design. Page uses a telecaster, And I don't like Les Pauls as much. The Fender designs are what inspired me to pick up the guitar, Is there no way I can emulate Page's sound with a Fender design?

Here Jimmy Page is using his Lake placid blue stratocaster, a Fender design

http://www.zeppinhood.net/lzequip/60strat.jpg

Here he's playing his telecaster (Which has a picture of a dragon painted on it)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eIwfym0TbY


So can't I do it? I really do want the tone to be as sound to be as close to his as possible, but also want to use a Fender model.
Last edited by Eurozeppelin at Aug 4, 2009,
#26
Well if you really want to stay with Fender designs, do so, just make sure your guitar has a humbucker, since it's quiet mandatory for the listed bands. I'd look into HSS Strats or a Squier Jagmaster. I have some experience with the Jags and they are great guitars for the money, both in quality and tone.
#27
You have only been playing a week. Even if you buy a Mesa Boogie amp (a very expensive amp) you will not sound much different than you do now due to the short time period you have been learning.

If you must spend money on something in a month, guitar lessons will be the most valuable contribution to your sound. If you'd rather teach yourself buy guitar books and dvds to teach yourself how to play.

Most people will drop the guitar after 3 months, so I highly recommend that you wait until Christmas rather than your birthday before buying more gear. At that point if you must buy new gear buy a new amp like suggested before. Don't buy a half-stack like someone suggested before, they're too loud to be playing in your house.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
Soundcloud
#28
Yeah, don't worry about that. I realise that that it would be unwise to buy expensive equipment sooner rather than later, I'm just talking about what I should get eventually, on my Birthday or at Christmas as you've said. All I'm trying to say is WHEN I upgrade my sound, later, what I should do to sound the most like Page I can, while still using a strat or tele. I'm just a beginner and when I eventually upgrade my gear, I just want advice so I don't end up getting bad stuff.

Thanks for your advice!
#29
Quote by steve!
if u noticed my post on the previous page the vitnage les paul was going to sound way bettter for the stuff u like
and a hell of alot better quality then squire

+1000000
#30
Quote by Eurozeppelin
Yeah, don't worry about that. I realise that that it would be unwise to buy expensive equipment sooner rather than later, I'm just talking about what I should get eventually, on my Birthday or at Christmas as you've said. All I'm trying to say is WHEN I upgrade my sound, later, what I should do to sound the most like Page I can, while still using a strat or tele. I'm just a beginner and when I eventually upgrade my gear, I just want advice so I don't end up getting bad stuff.

Thanks for your advice!


Cool. You can't really get Page's tone with a Strat, although you can get close. However there's no reason that you can't amass a couple of guitars in the future to eventually achieve every tone you could ever want.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
Soundcloud
#31
Well I reckon I'll have to get close for now, and then yeah, maybe get a Les Paul in the future, because I REALLY want to use the strat.

What do you think to getting a Fender Squier Affinity Series Strat? They're quite cheap but are they any good? I'm not rushing to buy this stuff now, you know, I'm just finding out what I'm gonna buy so I can save up a bit if need be. Thanks.
#32
Quote by Eurozeppelin
Well I reckon I'll have to get close for now, and then yeah, maybe get a Les Paul in the future, because I REALLY want to use the strat.

What do you think to getting a Fender Squier Affinity Series Strat? They're quite cheap but are they any good? I'm not rushing to buy this stuff now, you know, I'm just finding out what I'm gonna buy so I can save up a bit if need be. Thanks.


Oh there's literally thousands of threads on this, but I'd get a Yamaha Pacifica 112 - it was my 1st good electric guitar.

I don't like Squires. I still use my Pacifica for gigging now, despite the fact I have far more expensive guitars and I bought it 10 years ago
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
Soundcloud
#33
Keeping in mind my goal is to base my sound on that of Jimmy Page, what amp would you suggest to go with the Yamaha Pacifica 112? (Or at least as close to the Zep sound as I can!)

Is the guitar just a strat copy, or is it different at all? and is it one of the really heavy ones, or the lightweight ones?
#34
Try and get a Vox Valvetronix VT30, its the best for classic rock.

The Pacifica is basically a strat copy, its pretty lightweight, but yeah, it's a respectable strat copy, maybe better than most squiers.

I still would prefer a LP though, they are mm.
#35
Here's a list of Jimmy's gear;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Page#Equipment_details

There's a lot of it. A SSH Strat Bodied Guitar and a good practice amp like the Peavy Vypr or Roland Microcube will give you a large range of sounds including something similar to Page. In the meantime start learning some Led Zep songs and the like - people will recognise the Stairway intro regardless of your tone if you do it right.
#36
I would avoid trying to "Sound" like someone else in the beginning. Because you're not going to.
As posted above, you can play a Zeppellin song, and your friends will recognize it even if your tone is nowhere near the same as Page's.

No matter how much gear you get, even if it's exactly the same gear as Jimmy Page, you won't sound exactly like him. Because your sound begins within you, in your head and heart, and goes through your fingers to the guitar, then to the amp. And Jimmy Page's sound begins within HIM...

Yes, you can get close, but not the same.
Even the best of guitar players have trouble emulating another players sound exactly, again becuase alot of the way you sound comes from within you, and no one can copy that.

So if you really like the Strat, get the strat.
Getting a guitar you love goes a long way to building that sound within you.
It's about playing for yourself, you have to enjoy it.
If you start with a certain guitar because your Idol uses it, and you want to sound like him, you will be dissapointed.

You'll get pretty close to the sound you're after with an HSS strat (HSS stands for Humbucker / SingleCoil / SingleCoil).
A les paul won't really get you that much closer, again because of the "within you" thing..


And that Epiphone Valve Jr is a good amp for that price range. And yes, it includes the whole deal, Amp(head) and speaker(cabinet).

2001 Ernie Ball Music Man Axis Super Sport
2001 MIM Standard Strat
Peavey Classic 30 112 Combo.
My Gear
Last edited by jonmo1 at Aug 4, 2009,
#37
Quote by jonmo1
No matter how much gear you get, even if it's exactly the same gear as Jimmy Page, you won't sound exactly like him. Because your sound begins within you, in your head and heart, and goes through your fingers to the guitar, then to the amp. And Jimmy Page's sound begins within HIM...
Oh yeah, this.
I can't believe I forgot to mention this.

After all, say you make an album. Why would I listen to your cover when I can listen to the original? Some of the best covers are the ones radically different (e.g. Tears for Fears, Gary Jules - Mad World, is the first to mind).

However, remember that some songs don't fit with some tones... Single Coils and Humbuckers aren't the only differences, it also depends on the magnets. I like to play Rocky Mountain Way (Joe Walsh) on my Squier Affinity Strat (Single) or my Ibanez (Buckers), as opposed to my older Squier Strat. The reason being that the latter has a slightly lower output, so it doesn't really get enough gain...

Note: I wouldn't exactly recommend you to buy the Affinity, it's pretty thin compared to the standard Fender design. However, the Valvetronix, I have heard great stuff about it.
I have a ponytail fetish.
..And a labcoat fetish. SCIENCE!
Last edited by AntiG3 at Aug 4, 2009,
#38
Quote by Eurozeppelin
Also Chaazums, you mention a half stack? what is a half stack?


A half stack is composed of a head (the tone) and the cabinet (the volume). The Epi Valve Jr. has only 1 speaker in the cabinet, so that makes it a 1x12. 1x12 means 1 12 inch speaker. So, I assume you understand what a 2x12, 4x12, etc. is.
Gear:
Epiphone G400/L6 Spider III 15
Squier CV J-Bass/Acoustic B20
Misc. pedals

Currently saving for:
Acoustic B200

Funds:
$125/$350


Quote by m4l666
I play hard, like death metal hard

#40
I'm pretty sure a HSS is classified as a fat strat.

Edit: I'm pretty sure that HSS are fat strats.
I have a ponytail fetish.
..And a labcoat fetish. SCIENCE!
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