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#1
The idea is that people who have cancer in a late stage or some other disease that'll kill them anyway should be able to choose to have their doctor hand them a terminal dose of pills so they die painlessly. I'm writing a paper on this **** and I can't think of any other reasons than:
-They should have the liberty (as in "life, liberty, and property", one of the most famous phrases in the constitution) to decide whether they want to die or not.
-Medical bills could be high, so basically you're forcing them to lose their property which would otherwise go to inheritors.
-The pain and suffering is unnecessary on their last days on Earth.

Can anyone else think of other reasons?

And in case you were wondering, life (as in "life, liberty, and property") is not being taken away by the state, which is what the constitution forbids.
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Last edited by asfastasdark at Aug 8, 2009,
#2
- it's their own choice (assuming they're mentally capable of making such a choice) should be enough imo...
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#3
How about you do your on work instead of relying on a bunch of fap happy 14 year olds to do it for you?

Answer anyway cause I'm bored: They should be allowed to die with dignity in the manner they want to with their family instead of alone at an unforseen point in time
.
Last edited by Nietsche at Aug 8, 2009,
#4
Quote by Nietsche
How about you do your on work instead of relying on a bunch of fap happy 14 year olds to do it for you?


Because I can't think of any other stuff... and my mind can't do more than it's capable of...
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#5
Well Kevorkian was groundbreaking in this subject, most others didn't have the balls. Just wikipedia him and copy and paste the whole page.
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#6
i don't have any other reasons, but be sure to add counterarguments. i can't see someone arguing against assisted suicide very convincingly.
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#7
Quote by vIsIbleNoIsE
i don't have any other reasons, but be sure to add counterarguments. i can't see someone arguing against assisted suicide.

I couldn't see anyone arguing against evolution, big bang and the pyramids being built by human hands a few years ago... oh boy was I in for a surprise.
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#8
Because, I guess, there are NO valid logical reason to why it shouldn't be legal. People have free will and if they wish to be dead, they should have to choice to be helped to end their life.


It's like Gay Marriage. No logical explanation at all to why you should ban it.
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#9
Quote by Kensai
I couldn't see anyone arguing against evolution, big bang and the pyramids being built by human hands a few years ago... oh boy was I in for a surprise.
+1
.
#10
Quote by Kensai
I couldn't see anyone arguing against evolution, big bang and the pyramids being built by human hands a few years ago... oh boy was I in for a surprise.

The pyramids being built by humans or the pyramids being built a few years ago? Whatever, people can be morons.
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You sir, have made my day awesome.


8/7/09

RIP Les Paul, I bet he's forming a kick-ass band up there to play The Great Gig in the Sky. Maybe we'll all have to use a Stairway to Heaven to go see them play. You know I'm funny.
#11
-Suicide=damnation in every religion I can think of
-Maybe the hospital could be sued if the person was handed the pills, and not all family members were contacted beforehand

These are against your arguement, but still..with my projects like that, I'd have to add both sides of the arguement, so maybe you do too
#12
Quote by Nietsche
+1




Quote by ripjoestrummer
The pyramids being built by humans or the pyramids being built a few years ago? Whatever, people can be morons.


The pyramids being built by humans

Although I wouldn't be surprised if people out there thought they were built a few years ago either
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#13
If the United States pass a law based on religious morales, it's wrong because the United States is a secular nation, even though it was found on Christian foundations.

UK is not a secular country, it has a state religion so it makes sense, but in a way Britain is much more secular and less puritanical than the US.
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#14
Great question man i actually wrote a paper about it a few months ago. Legally doctors have to try and resuscitate a patient, quite often they are successful but leaving the patient with very little quality of life. You can talk about terri schiavo and nancy cruzan in your paper, both fell into a persistent vegetative state and each brains became increasingly hydrocephalic basically meaning their brains turned into water, if you explain how horrible a persistent vegetative state is in your paper, that will make your point. Also, you can talk about oregon where physician assisted suicide is legal. oregon has the lowest in hospital death rate in the country. just some topics
#15
Quote by Kensai



The pyramids being built by humans

Although I wouldn't be surprised if people out there thought they were built a few years ago either

That reminds me of this guy I know who does not believe in almost anything that can't be proven (or theorized intelligently) by science.


And then he goes off on tangents about how the pyramids must have been built or designed by aliens.

Edit: On topic- I honestly don't see a problem with patients choosing to have a "dignified death." By forcing them to live, you're essentially taking their choice of life away.
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Last edited by Karvid at Aug 8, 2009,
#16
Quote by radomu
If the United States pass a law based on religious morales, it's wrong because the United States is a secular nation, even though it was found on Christian foundations.


This too, I was going to edit this in earlier, but didn't want to sound more ignorant than I already did.

Since suicide leads to damnation, helping somebody out with suicide should be against the law since US law is parallel to Christian morals (I don't believe that it should, but you know what I mean)
#17
You only need one reason : What right does anyone but the person involved (unless the person is deemed incapable of making reasoned decisions, which I think is one reason why it shouldn't be legal, as it would introduce a whole slew of legal issues with deciding that, and people trying to determine that someone wanting assisted suicide is unfit to decide because they can't let go, or so that they can decide to pull the plug and let them die to get inheritance or some ****) have to decide when said person's life ends?

If you're terminally ill, really the only thing you still have any control over is your own life, you should have the right to determine if you want it to end or not. Suicide is not illegal, why should asking someone to help you when you can't do it yourself be?
#18
Yeah, a lot has to do with the hypocratic oath or whatever its called, I took a medical class a year ago and we discussed this. A doctor is legally obligated to never abandon his/her patient unless another being comes along who is "ranked" higher. Like if you're a doctor and you help a dude on the side of the road you cannot leave him unless someone better comes along, like jesus or something like that.
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You sir, have made my day awesome.


8/7/09

RIP Les Paul, I bet he's forming a kick-ass band up there to play The Great Gig in the Sky. Maybe we'll all have to use a Stairway to Heaven to go see them play. You know I'm funny.
#19
Quote by ripjoestrummer
Well Kevorkian was groundbreaking in this subject, most others didn't have the balls. Just wikipedia him and copy and paste the whole page.


Already did that, but couldn't find anything other than what I already had.

Quote by radomu
Because, I guess, there are NO valid logical reason to why it shouldn't be legal. People have free will and if they wish to be dead, they should have to choice to be helped to end their life.


It's like Gay Marriage. No logical explanation at all to why you should ban it.


I know, the only reason the supreme court ruled against it was because ancient British law (~1400) forbade it, and that's what the framers of the Constitution based it on... Ridiculous, if you ask me, but then again, it's the supreme court.

Quote by The Shroom420
-Suicide=damnation in every religion I can think of


But the Constitution says that the government is not allowed to condone any form of religion, so this could not be an argument used to forbid it.

-Maybe the hospital could be sued if the person was handed the pills, and not all family members were contacted beforehand


But it's still the one person's own will. If a person wanted his daughter not to get a tattoo, but she was over 21 and got it anyway, he can't sue the tattoo shop either, just because it's his family.
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#20
People usually launch the Hippocratic Oath at you with this kind of stuff.
One part says that:

"I will not give a lethal drug to anyone if I am asked, nor will I advise such a plan; and similarly I will not give a woman a pessary to cause an abortion."


Since the segment on abortion has changed, why not change the part on lethal drugs?
That makes a tiny bit of sense to me, so I'd put it in a paper.


Mind you, he also said that "I will preserve the purity of my life and my arts", so expect a bit of backlash for that one
I hope it doesn't seem, like I'm young, foolish, and green.
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Last edited by BlackLuster at Aug 8, 2009,
#21
Quote by BlackLuster
People usually launch the Hippocratic Oath at you with this kind of stuff.
One part says that:

"I will not give a lethal drug to anyone if I am asked, nor will I advise such a plan; and similarly I will not give a woman a pessary to cause an abortion."


Since the segment on abortion has changed, why not change the part on lethal drugs?
That makes a tiny bit of sense to me, so I'd put it in a paper.


Mind you, he also said that "I will preserve the purity of my life and my arts", so expect a bit of backlash for that one


Thanks man! I'll do that!
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#22
Quote by asfastasdark
Thanks man! I'll do that!

Look up a translation of the Hippocratic Oath and see how much you can write about it's manipulation in this current day and age: that'll give you thousands of words to write. You can bring in secularisation, modern practices, freedom of expression and so much more.
Good luck
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#23
Quote by asfastasdark
Already did that, but couldn't find anything other than what I already had.


I know, the only reason the supreme court ruled against it was because ancient British law (~1400) forbade it, and that's what the framers of the Constitution based it on... Ridiculous, if you ask me, but then again, it's the supreme court.


But the Constitution says that the government is not allowed to condone any form of religion, so this could not be an argument used to forbid it.


But it's still the one person's own will. If a person wanted his daughter not to get a tattoo, but she was over 21 and got it anyway, he can't sue the tattoo shop either, just because it's his family.


In theory. But any fool can realize that the American government is super biased towards Christianity.
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#24
Quote by itchy guitar
In theory. But any fool can realize that the American government is super biased towards Christianity.


The Declaration of Independence itself is very hypocritical and fishy, and the Constitution was a bit better but still with some loopholes.
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#25
Because i don't want to be a vegetable, and my organs can possibly save someone else's life.
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#26
Quote by vIsIbleNoIsE
i don't have any other reasons, but be sure to add counterarguments. i can't see someone arguing against assisted suicide very convincingly.
I did a little report on euthanasia a few years ago. heres just a few reasons people are against it:

-It is very difficult to keep record of whether or not a patient gave consent. Doctors fudge the rules sometimes.

-Some people believe that a person should die naturally. (as you can imagine, this often means: "the way God intended")

-Also, euthanasia is a scary step for some people. Back in the WWII days, there was apractice among some of the nazis where they would euthanize any baby that they deemed "deformed" or "mentally instable".


But yes, I do think that euthanasia is necessary in certain situations.
pretty controversial topic really.


Oh and another point for your paper TS, is that people often want to die with dignity and by their own terms, rather than at the hands of some disease which will turn them into a vegetable. "Dignity" is the key word there, I would say.
Balls.
Last edited by rmr024 at Aug 8, 2009,
#27
Quote by Karvid
That reminds me of this guy I know who does not believe in almost anything that can't be proven (or theorized intelligently) by science.


And then he goes off on tangents about how the pyramids must have been built or designed by aliens.




He's clearly infected by the buddhist mind-worm.
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#28
Quote by itchy guitar
In theory. But any fool can realize that the American government is super biased towards Christianity.


Of course, but that would still not be an argument the Supreme Court could use to ban assisted suicide.

OK, I found another reason: the Supreme Court's main argument in the case was that in the original country of the framers of the Constitution (England/UK/whatever) assisted suicide wasn't allowed. However, abortion wasn't allowed there either, so this is not a true reason (in their mind, that is). Also, it's a form of discrimination against handicapped people, because a person with no arms, for example, can't kill themselves but a person with arms can. That's like not placing ramps for wheelchairs, if you think about it--the handicapped people can't do something that others can, and the problem could be solved with a simple solution: allowing assisted suicide (or building wheelchair ramps). After all, there is no law against suicide so in that mindset you're discriminating against handicapped people.

What do you think of that?

Edit:
Just for self-satisfaction, I'm going to give counterarguments...
Quote by rmr024
-It is very difficult to keep record of whether or not a patient gave consent. Doctors fudge the rules sometimes.

Could be solved with a simple thing like a contract with a signature of the patient.

-Some people believe that a person should die naturally. (as you can imagine, this often means: "the way God intended")

But it's not really their right to decide how someone else would die. If I decided I believed that a person should die by being thrown off a building, then that doesn't allow me to do that either.


-Also, euthanasia is a scary step for some people. Back in the WWII days, there was apractice among some of the nazis where they would euthanize any baby that they deemed "deformed" or "mentally instable".

Of course it would only happen with consent of the person about to die.

Thanks, though!
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Last edited by asfastasdark at Aug 8, 2009,
#29
Reason for: Which is more humane, letting me live five more years pissing and shitting myself, or killing me now if it's my wish?

Reason against: How can you tell I'm not just depressed and suicidal?

[IN PHIL WE TRUST]


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#30
Quote by SteveHouse
Reason for: Which is more humane, letting me live five more years pissing and shitting myself, or killing me now if it's my wish?

Reason against: How can you tell I'm not just depressed and suicidal?

We have psychologist for a reason.

They can help figure out number 2
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#31
Quote by ExtremeMetalFTW
We have psychologist for a reason.

They can help figure out number 2


And we have doctors for a reason too: to figure out whether the patient is terminally ill in the first place.
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#32
Another thing, someone said suicide isn't illegal. Im about about 85% sure that it actually is Illegal... just not in the same realm as youre average "crime". Don't quote me on this, but look into that, cause I can't quite remember what the rule is.
Balls.
#33
Quote by rmr024
Another thing, someone said suicide isn't illegal. Im about about 85% sure that it actually is Illegal... just not in the same realm as youre average "crime". Don't quote me on this, but look into that, cause I can't quite remember what the rule is.

Suicide is legal, however attempted suicide is not. as you could damage property and/or others in the process.
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#34
Quote by ExtremeMetalFTW
We have psychologist for a reason.

They can help figure out number 2

Quite right, I'm just helping him with the good ol' "concession" bits

[IN PHIL WE TRUST]


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#35
Quote by ExtremeMetalFTW
Suicide is legal, however attempted suicide is not. as you could damage property and/or others in the process.
yeaah! that's what I was thinking. thanks
Balls.
#36
Quote by ExtremeMetalFTW
Suicide is legal, however attempted suicide is not. as you could damage property and/or others in the process.


Yea, whats the point in making successful suicides legal? Are they gonna let the corpse rot in jail?
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#37
Quote by SteveHouse
Quite right, I'm just helping him with the good ol' "concession" bits

Oh.


Ok.


nevermind
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I clicked System Restore and it said "System Restore Is Unable To Protect You".

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#38
Quote by itchy guitar
Yea, whats the point in making successful suicides legal? Are they gonna let the corpse rot in jail?

"Damnit J-Man, the po-po are gonna lock up another stiff with us!"
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I clicked System Restore and it said "System Restore Is Unable To Protect You".

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#39
Quote by itchy guitar
Yea, whats the point in making successful suicides legal? Are they gonna let the corpse rot in jail?

I always thought that was kinda funny. They used to bury suicides face-down under intersections though, many many moons ago.

[IN PHIL WE TRUST]


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#40
It's really up to the person. when someone is on their deathbed they can;t do anything. they **** themselves, they can't feed themselves, or bathe themselves etc. very damaging to their self-esteem and makes the person appear to be helpless in their remaining days.

for me though i don't believe in assisted suicide only because i like to think there is always a chance to recover. there are SOOO many stories (including some personal ones in my family) where they would tell the patient they have a few weeks/months to live and thus should just end it now. Then that person ends up living several years longer.
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