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#1
Except better? Am I right in saying this?

For my next guitar I'm really debating whether I should get an Ibanez with a tremolo or something else, but if a FR can do anything a strat trem can do I'm pretty much dead locked on the Ibanez.
Breaking stereotypes by playing indie on a metal guitar.

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#4
Well yeah that's what's really got me going eeeeeeh about it. I want something that almost completely contrasts my Les Paul (tremolo, brighter woods, but I still want humbuckers), and I've recently been into Vai's insane welrhwerwerhhwerhwer tremolo style thing, and I don't really play in other tunings so I figure it'll be ok.
Breaking stereotypes by playing indie on a metal guitar.

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- Epiphone Les Paul Standard (Plus Top)
- Crappy Strat Copy (Redecorated, looks snazzy)
- Ibanez Acoustic/Electric Guitar
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#5
Quote by Guitar2theface
Well yeah that's what's really got me going eeeeeeh about it. I want something that almost completely contrasts my Les Paul (tremolo, brighter woods, but I still want humbuckers), and I've recently been into Vai's insane welrhwerwerhhwerhwer tremolo style thing, and I don't really play in other tunings so I figure it'll be ok.

Yeah, then you should be good to go. Just mind what trem the Ibanez has, though. Some of theirs are good, others are sub-par.
#6
Well I'm aware that the Edge III can't stand up to the kinda stuff I wanna do, and I'm planning on spending $1500 give or take $300, so I'm sure I won't be getting anything bad by any means.
Breaking stereotypes by playing indie on a metal guitar.

Current Gear
- Epiphone Les Paul Standard (Plus Top)
- Crappy Strat Copy (Redecorated, looks snazzy)
- Ibanez Acoustic/Electric Guitar
- Ibanez RG1570 Mirage Blue
- Peavey Vypyr 30 Watt
#7
Quote by -Blue-
Unless you want to change tunings. Then you're screwed.


Not really takes me 5 mins to tune my FR guitar's and set it up for a new tuning.
#8
Can someone list all the disadvantages of FR/floating trems? I just wanna make sure there's nothing I don't know.
Breaking stereotypes by playing indie on a metal guitar.

Current Gear
- Epiphone Les Paul Standard (Plus Top)
- Crappy Strat Copy (Redecorated, looks snazzy)
- Ibanez Acoustic/Electric Guitar
- Ibanez RG1570 Mirage Blue
- Peavey Vypyr 30 Watt
#9
Tuning and restringing can be annoying. Setting up the guitar is a lot more annoying.
That's about it really. They're expensive too. :/
#10
Setting up as in like intonating and fixing the action?

Restringing I"m prepared to spend an hour if it takes me that long, so that's not a problem.

Ok sounds like I'm set.
Breaking stereotypes by playing indie on a metal guitar.

Current Gear
- Epiphone Les Paul Standard (Plus Top)
- Crappy Strat Copy (Redecorated, looks snazzy)
- Ibanez Acoustic/Electric Guitar
- Ibanez RG1570 Mirage Blue
- Peavey Vypyr 30 Watt
#11
Every guitar I currently own (or have owned) with a Floyd sits in its case. In a lot of cases the Floyd robs the guitar of some tone, with some of them you can't use heavier strings and I don't really like the style of bends it does.

Make sure you need it, because I have found it's a love/hate thing.
#12
Well I prefer light strings, 9s and 10s, and I'll be trying before I'm buying, so if I don't like it I won't use it.
Breaking stereotypes by playing indie on a metal guitar.

Current Gear
- Epiphone Les Paul Standard (Plus Top)
- Crappy Strat Copy (Redecorated, looks snazzy)
- Ibanez Acoustic/Electric Guitar
- Ibanez RG1570 Mirage Blue
- Peavey Vypyr 30 Watt
#13
Unison bends are basically impossible to do with a floating vibrato. In fact manual bends of any kind can become problematic, depending on just how you have the bridge set up. If it's really 'loose', it can go out of tune from the slightest bend. On the other hand it is of course possible to make the vibrato action so tense, normal playing won't be effected but then it'll be next to impossible to dip the vibrato bar without excess force. It can be tricky to work out the exact balance you need.
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#14
Whoa wait really? That sucks. Will I have to get it set up regularly?
Breaking stereotypes by playing indie on a metal guitar.

Current Gear
- Epiphone Les Paul Standard (Plus Top)
- Crappy Strat Copy (Redecorated, looks snazzy)
- Ibanez Acoustic/Electric Guitar
- Ibanez RG1570 Mirage Blue
- Peavey Vypyr 30 Watt
#15
Dont let people tell you set up is a pain, Its not at all, setting int. can be a pain if you dont get one of intonation keys. But the overall setup its real EASY to do. Here is what I do to setup my FR guitars, It used to take me a long time , tune, lock, adjust springs, rinse repeat, Until I found this Vid on youtube. Now it takes less than 5mins to setup,tune,adjust springs on all my FR guitars.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPCtZN80L64
#16
Get an OFR, you will love it (and hate it) But mostly love it. It adds a lot of expression when used properly.
#17
Its the not being able to bend that's really getting me thinking because my style is using a lot of bends.
Breaking stereotypes by playing indie on a metal guitar.

Current Gear
- Epiphone Les Paul Standard (Plus Top)
- Crappy Strat Copy (Redecorated, looks snazzy)
- Ibanez Acoustic/Electric Guitar
- Ibanez RG1570 Mirage Blue
- Peavey Vypyr 30 Watt
#18
Quote by Guitar2theface
Its the not being able to bend that's really getting me thinking because my style is using a lot of bends.


I do bends just fine, I mean, look at Jeff loomis, Laiho, Vai, Sach, dime for example.
#19
I have an Original Floyd and I can bend all day.... just make sure the floating trem is high quality and not a licensed.
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#20
Quote by -Blue-
Unless you want to change tunings. Then you're screwed.


Get a Tremol-no.
Get a Carvin. Do it.
#22
So uh are the Lo Pros, and the ZR trems good for bending?
Breaking stereotypes by playing indie on a metal guitar.

Current Gear
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- Ibanez Acoustic/Electric Guitar
- Ibanez RG1570 Mirage Blue
- Peavey Vypyr 30 Watt
#23
Quote by ferretface
Get a Tremol-no.
Tremol-no sucks ass.

Quote by Guitar2theface
So uh are the Lo Pros, and the ZR trems good for bending?
There's no trem which is as good for bending as a fixed bridge. LoPro is a straight out knife edge bridge which sits in free balance of strings and springs. While it's an awesome machine, bending will inevitably upset its balance, and you'll probably hear it if you use the techniques mentioned in prior posts.

ZR (as well as EZ) put additional counterpressure against the strings, and will stand up to bends better, especially if you use lighter strings.
Fender Japan Stratocaster Ibanez Pro540 Power Ibanez Pro540 Saber Ibanez 430S Ibanez S540 Charvel LSXIII w/GraphTech Ghost MIDI Parker Fly Artist Ibanez S1220 Mesa F30 Roland GR20 Roland Microcube + IBANEZ TREMS STILL SUCK!
#24
Ok, what about the Edge Pro? Also I'm doing mostly a lot of 1/2 and full bends, rather than a few huge bends.
Breaking stereotypes by playing indie on a metal guitar.

Current Gear
- Epiphone Les Paul Standard (Plus Top)
- Crappy Strat Copy (Redecorated, looks snazzy)
- Ibanez Acoustic/Electric Guitar
- Ibanez RG1570 Mirage Blue
- Peavey Vypyr 30 Watt
#25
Quote by Guitar2theface
Ok, what about the Edge Pro? Also I'm doing mostly a lot of 1/2 and full bends, rather than a few huge bends.
EP would be essentially the same as LP. I'd personally suggest getting your hand on a guitar with an EP, ZR, and EZ, just to see which one feels best to you. Edge Zero might be what you want here - it's a more or less traditional knife edge trem, but with a Zero Point system (what keeps your bends in check in a ZR), and in addition they're dead stable in my experience.


Having said that, I believe the horrors of Floyds regarding bends are largely exaggerated. If your playing relies extensively on double stops then you're plain looking for a wrong guitar, but most casual bending works just fine on any Floyd.
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#26
If worst comes to worst I can just use my hardtail for excessive bending songs and my Ibanez for everything else. Thanks.
Breaking stereotypes by playing indie on a metal guitar.

Current Gear
- Epiphone Les Paul Standard (Plus Top)
- Crappy Strat Copy (Redecorated, looks snazzy)
- Ibanez Acoustic/Electric Guitar
- Ibanez RG1570 Mirage Blue
- Peavey Vypyr 30 Watt
#27
Quote by Guitar2theface
Well yeah that's what's really got me going eeeeeeh about it. I want something that almost completely contrasts my Les Paul (tremolo, brighter woods, but I still want humbuckers), and I've recently been into Vai's insane welrhwerwerhhwerhwer tremolo style thing, and I don't really play in other tunings so I figure it'll be ok.



What i suggest is buying an Ibanez now and keep it in whatever tuning you use the most and then at later time get another guitar with a floyd rose tremelo, and keep that at a constant tuning too. Like you can have 1 at E standard tuning and then another one at D tuning. The reason for doing this is not just because it takes forever to tune a floyd rose guitar, but also because it is generally bad to detune a guitar constantly as it can damage the neck and/or tuners.

This will probably be debated by some people but trust me, if you are like me and like to change tunings alot, eventually the guitar will be affected :P
#28
Not a big deal to me because any alternate tunings I'll just use my hardtail for, and I rarely change tunings for anything other than Guns N' Roses (which I'll just use my Les Paul for).
Breaking stereotypes by playing indie on a metal guitar.

Current Gear
- Epiphone Les Paul Standard (Plus Top)
- Crappy Strat Copy (Redecorated, looks snazzy)
- Ibanez Acoustic/Electric Guitar
- Ibanez RG1570 Mirage Blue
- Peavey Vypyr 30 Watt
#29
Quote by Guitar2theface
So uh are the Lo Pros, and the ZR trems good for bending?



ZR trems are good for bending, although they aren't as good for hard whammying as an OFR or Edge are. It's kinda like in between a Strat trem and a floyd rose: it can change pitch more than a strat trem, but not as much as a floyd rose or an ibanez edge. In fact really it's just useless, only good thing is the ball bearing system.


The Lo pros are okay, but for what you've stated you want out of your trem I'd suggest an Edge Zero. The whole thing about tremelos being bad for bending isn't true, really only liscensed floyds and original floyds are the only ones that suck when it comes to bending.

Overall i'd suggest either an Edge Pro or an Edge Zero. Edge Zero's are a little hard to come by(for me anyways) and have the same ball bearing system as a ZR trem, only difference is that the setup is like an OFR, not a ZR, and it can dive a little more. And an Edge pro is just a great tremelo system overall so i'd suggest those.
#30
Quote by Nirvana00125
In fact really it's just useless, only good thing is the ball bearing system.
Huh?

Quote by Nirvana00125
Edge Zero's are a little hard to come by(for me anyways) and have the same ball bearing system as a ZR trem...
Huh?
Fender Japan Stratocaster Ibanez Pro540 Power Ibanez Pro540 Saber Ibanez 430S Ibanez S540 Charvel LSXIII w/GraphTech Ghost MIDI Parker Fly Artist Ibanez S1220 Mesa F30 Roland GR20 Roland Microcube + IBANEZ TREMS STILL SUCK!
#31
Quote by pifty
Huh?

Huh?


okay, on a floyd rose guitar, they have a knife point thing on it to keep it in tune when you whammy. on most floyd rose models, after a few years of use the knife starts to dull and the strings don't stay in tune as much. This can be fixed by simply sharpening the knife point.

On a ZR tremelo and Edge Zero tremelo, they have a ball bearing system instead of the knife point. Because it is not a blade/knife, it never dulls. So the guitar will always stay in tune, even after elongated tremelo use, and after years of using the same guitar. Unfortunaately there are setbacks to these tremelo units......
#32
Quote by Nirvana00125
blah blah blah and Edge Zero tremelo, they have a ball bearing system instead of the knife point blah blah blah
Except they don't.
Fender Japan Stratocaster Ibanez Pro540 Power Ibanez Pro540 Saber Ibanez 430S Ibanez S540 Charvel LSXIII w/GraphTech Ghost MIDI Parker Fly Artist Ibanez S1220 Mesa F30 Roland GR20 Roland Microcube + IBANEZ TREMS STILL SUCK!
#33
Quote by Nirvana00125
ZR trems are good for bending, although they aren't as good for hard whammying as an OFR or Edge are. It's kinda like in between a Strat trem and a floyd rose: it can change pitch more than a strat trem, but not as much as a floyd rose or an ibanez edge. In fact really it's just useless, only good thing is the ball bearing system.


The Lo pros are okay, but for what you've stated you want out of your trem I'd suggest an Edge Zero. The whole thing about tremelos being bad for bending isn't true, really only liscensed floyds and original floyds are the only ones that suck when it comes to bending.

Overall i'd suggest either an Edge Pro or an Edge Zero. Edge Zero's are a little hard to come by(for me anyways) and have the same ball bearing system as a ZR trem, only difference is that the setup is like an OFR, not a ZR, and it can dive a little more. And an Edge pro is just a great tremelo system overall so i'd suggest those.



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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrjwaqZfjIY&feature=PlayList&p=633F1DDA3CBDA00F&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=25


to TS, with 1500, take a look at the RG 3750. My friend just got one and it is quite a pleasure to play and has an EZ
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#34
Quote by MrFlibble
Unison bends are basically impossible to do with a floating vibrato. In fact manual bends of any kind can become problematic, depending on just how you have the bridge set up. If it's really 'loose', it can go out of tune from the slightest bend. On the other hand it is of course possible to make the vibrato action so tense, normal playing won't be effected but then it'll be next to impossible to dip the vibrato bar without excess force. It can be tricky to work out the exact balance you need.

It's not, I use my guitar with a floating Wilkinson for unison bends all the time.
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Quote by Anonden
You CAN play anything with anything....but some guitars sound right for some things, and not for others. Single coils sound retarded for metal, though those who are apeshit about harpsichord probably beg to differ.
#35
They are a lot more sensitive. It's hard to do a basic vibrato if you are used to Strat trems. You have to be really light on them. Otherwise they are fine. I'd get one if I had the money
#36
Quote by 1nSingularity
They are a lot more sensitive. It's hard to do a basic vibrato if you are used to Strat trems. You have to be really light on them. Otherwise they are fine. I'd get one if I had the money

Very true, though 2 points in general are more responsive than their 6 point counterparts.
Current Gear:
LTD MH-400 with Gotoh GE1996T (EMG 85/60)
PRS SE Custom 24 (Suhr SSH+/SSV)
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Audient iD22 interface
Peavey Revalver 4, UAD Friedman BE100/DS40
Adam S3A monitors
Quote by Anonden
You CAN play anything with anything....but some guitars sound right for some things, and not for others. Single coils sound retarded for metal, though those who are apeshit about harpsichord probably beg to differ.
#37
If you're paying $1500 for Vai type stuff, you'll probably be looking at the RG3550Z and RG3570Z. They pretty much have the same specs as JEMs minus the Edge Pro. And Vai has a couple trem stabilizers in his JEMs so they don't work like a regular Edge Pro anyway. They probably operate closer to the Edge Zero. The Edge Zero is amazing. It never goes out of tune because it sits in a groove instead of balancing like other trems. There are no problems with bending or palm muting. The bridge only moves if you touch the whammy bar. You'll never need a screwdriver and changing tunings is very easy. You just have to turn a knob a couple of turns and tune accordingly. There are even visual cues. The negative to the Edge Zero is that it doesn't flutter like floating trems. But you can take the ZPS out and it will function like a regular trem. But tone and sustain will suffer. And you have to deal with doing the harder trem setup and string bending problems. I find that the Edge Zero has better sustain and tone than the other ones I've played (Original Edge and Edge Pro) because there's more rigid contact between the body and bridge. You can feel even feel an increase in the body's vibrations when played acoustically. Hermal Li put an Edge Zero in the EGEN18 so that should say something.
http://ibanez.com/ElectricGuitars/model-RG3550MZ
http://ibanez.com/ElectricGuitars/model-RG3570Z
#38
Do those models surpass the prestiges?
Breaking stereotypes by playing indie on a metal guitar.

Current Gear
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- Crappy Strat Copy (Redecorated, looks snazzy)
- Ibanez Acoustic/Electric Guitar
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- Peavey Vypyr 30 Watt
#39
The ones I showed are Prestiges. The only non-Prestige guitars with Edge Zeros are the J. Customs, which are higher quality than the Prestiges. But you may not like their specs
#40
Quote by DimeLvR
Not really takes me 5 mins to tune my FR guitar's and set it up for a new tuning.



And you don't get intonation problems?

The bridge will go deeper in the body, or up, and this will affect intonation.

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