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#1
The countless metal subgenres and subsubsubgenres have been really getting on my nerves lately, as have metal fans themselves who are constantly judging what is metal and what is not, and what form of metal a band falls into should it be deemed worthy of the title "metal".

Now I was talking to an uncle of mine, who grew up with Motörhead, Metallica, Judas Priest etc, rides a motorcycle and used to go (his wife won't let him anymore) to the many, many concerts. This guy knows a thing or two about music, at least from the late 70s and 80s.
So I was talking to him with a friend of mine who plays drums, and my uncle says "yeah, I saw alot of metal bands when I was your age, like Metallica, Judas Priest, AC/DC and Motörhead", my friend says "Well they're not really metal" which he instantly regrets, because my uncle gives him his I-could-beat-up-a-raging-bull look because he dared to question his metal-ness.

But that got me thinking, were there the same kind of people back then? The people who would meticulously categorize bands, as if they were some kind of music-biologists? I doubt anyone ever said "Jethro Tull aren't hard rock, they're post-modern-avant-garde-myfluteisapenis-folk-rock!"

but then again, maybe there were.
Is it simply our generation of headbangers has turned into a bunch of nerdy elitists sorting bands more carefully than a librarian, or have they been around forever?
Last edited by CoreysMonster at Aug 27, 2009,
#2
They've always been around, how do you think genres get invented?
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#3
Is the Earth round?

Well, some say it's not. I guess that didn't help...
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#6
I've always wondered this. I'm sure there was, just on a much smaller scale. However, I'm pretty sure the folk community in the 60s was kind of elitists, based on the whole Bob Dylan going electric thing.
#7
There probably were, I think it's more the case that Metallica, Judas Priest and Motörhead simply are metal.

Quote by Minkaro
All genres have elitists.

Except maybe Yugoslavian folk rock.

every form of folk music i have encountered has elitists, so wouldn't be surprised if yugoslavian folk rock does.
Last edited by korinaflyingv at Aug 27, 2009,
#8
They probably weren't as abundant, since there weren't really many subgenres yet.
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#9
As soon as a concept leaves a kid's garage for the first time and someone else copies them, a third party (who usually don't know the inventors in any way) will decide which music is "pure" based on pedigree, even disregarding actual musicality.

'Tis the nature of nerds.
#10
kill 'em all

haha, puns
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#11
After re-reading, I have only one to say.

Make your friend listen to this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60Iv_kAjMLk.
Then let him tell you Judas Priest ain't metal.
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#12
Elitists have and always will existed

It's everyone else's job to keep them isolated from anyone who might see their opinion as worth a damn and totally not influenced by a desire to appear "more-*insert genre*" than the next person

I hate elitists
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#13
Quote by CoreysMonster

So I was talking to him with a friend of mine who plays drums, and my uncle says "yeah, I saw alot of metal bands when I was your age, like Metallica, Judas Priest, AC/DC and Motörhead", my friend says "Well they're not really metal"


The fuck...?
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#14
Quote by Minkaro
All genres have elitists.

Except maybe Yugoslavian folk rock.

Don't go there. You just might wake one up. :P

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#15
given metal music has not existed for all eternity, their elitists have not.

bluegrass elitists are funny though.
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#16
Everyone likes to feel that their taste is better than everyone else's. And if the yardstick you measure music by is 'purity' then you have to consider the bands that you like as being purer than the bands everyone else listens to.
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#18
I think the whole elitism thing is more recent, especially with the development of metalcore/deathcdore.
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#19
It seems that, at least in rock music (rock being the OVERLAPPING genre that covers ANYTHING that would be discussed here) elitists were born with Bob Dylan.

So they've been around for over 40 years.
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#20
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Quote by metal4life592
I think the whole elitism thing is more recent, especially with the development of metalcore/deathcdore.


It's definitely been more prevalent, but it's always existed.
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You could always just sleep beside your refrigerator.

Guitar:
- Ibanez S670FM w/ JB
- Fender 'Lite Ash' Stratocaster
- Fender '72 Deluxe Telecaster
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Amp:
- Laney VC15

'72 Tele Appreciation Group
RIP DIO
#21
pretty sure back in like the 70's there was guys like "screw all that black sabbath ****, you gotta get into iron butterfly"
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#22
Quote by IHATECHILDREN
It seems that, at least in rock music (rock being the OVERLAPPING genre that covers ANYTHING that would be discussed here) elitists were born with Bob Dylan.

So they've been around for over 40 years.

why this? please elaborate.
#23
well yes, but I would say it's just because of ALL the genres.
to me, there are only the following for metal:

Death metal
Melodic death metal
Black metal
Melodic black metal
Power metal (as much as I don't like it)
Nu-metal (as much as I don't like it)
Thrash metal
Speed metal
Industrial metal
and Doom metal

I don't belive as you said in the "symphonic nu- blackened melodic industrial doom death metal". That kind of sub-sub-sub genre type of stuff is just BS to me.
Sure, some are more Brutal, and more Heavy then the other genres, But that doesn't nessacairly make them more "metal", to me it somewhat does, but that's just my opinion. As far as facts go, I still say they arn't any more METAL, because i'll take the facts over my own opinion. Metal is Metal, regardless if the vocals are growled, screamed, who can tune down the lowest, etc etc. So to me, metal is metal, regardless how heavy, I prefer the heavier stuff, but thats just me.
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#24
Quote by CoreysMonster
I doubt anyone ever said "Jethro Tull aren't hard rock, they're post-modern-avant-garde-myfluteisapenis-folk-rock!"

I think I'll have to sig that
#25
Yes. As a staunch metal elitist, my collection consists of only the finest tungsten and platinum. You won't find ME meddling with the likes of those lousy Lanthanide and Actinide noobs.


#26
Quote by InvaderTSN
Your friend thinks Metallica, Judas Priest, and Motorhead aren't metal? What the fuck?

agreed
your friend is a moron and he should shut his mouth...


ten bucks says he is an avenged fan
huh??
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#27
Quote by CoreysMonster
why this? please elaborate.


Basically, in the 60s, he was the folk community's savior. He was making the whole folk scene mainstream. By now, let's say there are two groups, A and B. A loved Dylan, B resented him for being mainstream. B wanted to be different, you see. Then he went electric, and within Group A came Group C. Gruop C resented Dylan for going electric, they thought he was playing rock to make more money, because he was selling out. The rest of Group A still loved him.

Anyways, B hates him because mainstream = the devil . C hates him because "ZOMG he betrayed us!". So with all the greatness that is Dylan, he sure did make elitism more prelavant.
#28
I really don't pay too much attention to sub-genres. Every now and then I'll think or say to myself "I love thrash-metal" or "Melodic Death metal rooooocks", but as far as detail goes, I honestly don't care. Metal is metal and it kicks ass. That's why serious metal elitists piss me off.
#29
Quote by Zaphikh
Yes. As a staunch metal elitist, my collection consists of only the finest tungsten and platinum. You won't find ME meddling with the likes of those lousy Lanthanide and Actinide noobs.



take that back! the Lanthanide's and Actinide's are the most hardcore and metal, they scream radioactivity all the time, they have their guitars slung below their feet ffs!
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#30
Quote by Zaphikh
Yes. As a staunch metal elitist, my collection consists of only the finest tungsten and platinum. You won't find ME meddling with the likes of those lousy Lanthanide and Actinide noobs.



wait... join date May 2009?? haven't you been here for ages??
#31
Quote by diofan88
agreed
your friend is a moron and he should shut his mouth...


ten bucks says he is an avenged fan
huh??



...I'm an avenged fan, and I know those bands are metal. I also know avenged are metal.

Backk in the 70's no other types of metal really existed, so you couldn't really say those bands weren't metal. Although, I'm sure people back then said, "oh, deep purple and ac/dc aren't metal."
#32
There's elitists for every music genre/sub genre metal is one thats just more prominent.
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#34
Quote by Minkaro
All genres have elitists.

Except maybe Yugoslavian folk rock.


Funny how, just like Yugoslavia broke down into many countries at the end of the Cold War, Metal is breaking down into many, many sub-genres.
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#36
Your friend needs to be beat, sodomized and then burned alive and awake.


That's what I'd say if I were an elitist and fanboy of Metallica, Judas Priest, etc. But in all seriousness he does sound like a jerk. "That's not metal, grandpa".


EDIT: Also, from what I see metal has more elitists than anybody else b/c metal isn't as popular as pop, hip hop and other music that sounds anything but metal and they feel the need to defend themselves and their interests even when nobody is attacking them. They get angry about how not many other people listen to their kind of music and can't stand it so they fight about it. It's really emo if you think about it.
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Last edited by Misticalz at Aug 27, 2009,
#37
Quote by pantera456
...I'm an avenged fan, and I know those bands are metal. I also know avenged are metal.

Backk in the 70's no other types of metal really existed, so you couldn't really say those bands weren't metal. Although, I'm sure people back then said, "oh, deep purple and ac/dc aren't metal."



i'll quote my friend on this

"Just because they have double bass dosen't mean they are metal"

besides

Comparing the godness of Judas Priest to the up and coming prepubescents of avenged is fail waiting to happen


i'll leave it at that
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#38
Quote by Misticalz
Your friend needs to be beat, sodomized and then burned alive and awake.


That's what I'd say if I were an elitist and fanboy of Metallica, Judas Priest, etc. But in all seriousness he does sound like a jerk. "That's not metal, grandpa".


EDIT: Also, from what I see metal has more elitists than anybody else b/c metal isn't as popular as pop, hip hop and other music that sounds anything but metal and they feel the need to defend themselves and their interests even when nobody is attacking them. They get angry about how not many other people listen to their kind of music and can't stand it so they fight about it. It's really emo if you think about it.

No that's not it.


It rises from people thinking anything with screams equals metal, and people mixing black and death metal and mixing metalcore with metal
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#39
Quote by ExtremeMetalFTW
No that's not it.


It rises from people thinking anything with screams equals metal, and people mixing black and death metal and mixing metalcore with metal



That's ****ing retarded anyways. ZOMG h0w culd u!!!!!11. Dat's Metalcore, not hardcore metal u dumbass!!!!!111

#40
Quote by ExtremeMetalFTW
No that's not it.


It rises from people thinking anything with screams equals metal, and people mixing black and death metal and mixing metalcore with metal

case in point.

OH HOW DARE YOU CALL *insert band here* METAL!
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