#1
Hi UG!

Just a quick ask of you gurus!!

How would you define Rock Music musically? By that I mean, when you're playing Blues, some of the key things are, obviously, the blues scale and I-IV-V progressions etc.
But what things would you "look out for" when trying to play Rock?

I ask simply because, I seem to be stuck in the blues frame of mind, and as much as I love the blues scale, it can get a wee bit tiresome when every new solo you try and come up with sounds exactly the same.

Also, this question makes sense to ME obviously, but I may have worded it horribly. In which case, I apologize!

Tom.
Quote by strat0blaster
HA!

Well played, my friend.

I'm going to edit that awful grammar right now


Yay, I'm sigged!!
And a grammar nazi..
#2
-Heavy use of ostinatos as a primary rhythmic element
-"pop" song structure: verse, prechorus, chorus, verse, prechorus, chorus, bridge/solo, chorus

Now that I think about it, "Rock", even in the most traditional understanding of the word, has many forms and it's hard to classify a certain specific form that fits all, but I'd say the use of riffs is a significant defining factor.
#3
Was going to go into a long winded explanation but Sashki said it all really.
Just going to venture Bohemian Rhapsody as a song that breaks the rules a bit whilst being widely reputed to be the best rock song ever, Though i am a Queen fan so i'm biased.
#4
Quote by sTarbuck
Hi UG!

Just a quick ask of you gurus!!

How would you define Rock Music musically? By that I mean, when you're playing Blues, some of the key things are, obviously, the blues scale and I-IV-V progressions etc.
But what things would you "look out for" when trying to play Rock?

I ask simply because, I seem to be stuck in the blues frame of mind, and as much as I love the blues scale, it can get a wee bit tiresome when every new solo you try and come up with sounds exactly the same.

Also, this question makes sense to ME obviously, but I may have worded it horribly. In which case, I apologize!

Tom.


The SAME CHORD PROGRESSION EVERY FRICKEN SONG
Quote by theogonia777
and then there's free jazz, which isn't even for musicians.

Quote by Born A Fool
As my old guitar teacher once said: Metal really comes from classical music. The only difference is pinch harmonics, double bass, and lyrics about killing goats.
#5
For instance you can have a rock song with no guitar in it or at least only a little bit, and they can be ridiculously complicated or deceptively simple. Also some rock songs are melodic like Livin' on a prayer and its solo whilst others do follow a bluesy structure with a pentatonic solo.
#6
i used to have that same problem with all my solo's sounding too bluesy too.

i think it's because i used a lot of bends/vibrato/pentatonics. you know like standard blues things. i haven't heard your playing at all, but try to cut down on those things maybe if you use them often. also listen to non-bluesy music, and take some things from different styles.
#7
Quote by Tom63
For instance you can have a rock song with no guitar in it or at least only a little bit, and they can be ridiculously complicated or deceptively simple. Also some rock songs are melodic like Livin' on a prayer and its solo whilst others do follow a bluesy structure with a pentatonic solo.


Well then it's gunna be called 'Gay' and 'Wimp' by all the other Big mean "Bully" rock songs... And you wouldn't want that would you?
Quote by theogonia777
and then there's free jazz, which isn't even for musicians.

Quote by Born A Fool
As my old guitar teacher once said: Metal really comes from classical music. The only difference is pinch harmonics, double bass, and lyrics about killing goats.
#8
By that I mean, when you're playing Blues, some of the key things are, obviously, the blues scale and I-IV-V progressions etc.

When playing Rock, some of the key things are the blues scale and I-IV-V progressions
It's all about how you attack a piece that defines the genre.

i used to have that same problem with all my solo's sounding too bluesy too. i think it's because i used a lot of bends/vibrato/pentatonics.

David Gilmour would like a word with you.
#9
Rock is one of the broadest genres of popular music so is much harder to define than other more narrow genres (e.g. metal, drum'n'bass) but as such is subdivided into smaller genres within rock, soft-rock, pop-rock, blues rock, hard rock etc.

A main feature of rock music in general is the instrumentation. It focuses on vocals, Guitars (both electric and acoustic) bass (mainly electric) drums and pianos/keyboards. Though it can include other instruments as well. The vocals are often the centre point of rock music and often carry the main melody, the lyrics tend to be simple with repetition of both phrasing and melody.

Melodies use often focus around the pentatonic scale in both major and minor keys as opposed to the "less obvious" diatonic scale. They are very rarely modal but can incorporate notes from outside of the scale (the blue notes being particularly common)

Rhythmic patterns tend to be quite simple and often played as a straight rhythm with little swing. the tempo varies considerably depending on the song, but most stick to moderate tempos ~120bpm.

Songs can either be riff based, where a repetitive melody repeats throughout or based around a chord sequence. (or a combination of both)

The song structure is typically a simple pattern of alternating verse and chorus parts with breakdowns providing a variation to the structure. These are typified by a instrument [typically a guitar] playing the melody line for a number of bars, with a break in the vocal line (though described as solos they rarely are actually "solo").

i won't go into performance things here because it is not really relevant to the OP. now to the point:

In terms of trying to write rock, i find it difficult on my own, whereas in a band situation it flows more easily. Rock is simple, and because each part is simple it sound rather "empty" on it's own, thus it's easy to dismiss something as "rubbish" just because you are only hearing one part of it. if you play on your own to most rock songs, they will sound dull and lifeless (seriously - play the guitar part to wonderwall - oasis on it's own - most of the time nothing is happening without the vocals) If you want rock music accept it'll be simple and you probably need more people to play it to make it sound good!
The only 6 words that can make you a better guitarist:

Learn theory
Practice better
Practice more
#10
Quote by sTarbuck
Hi UG!

Just a quick ask of you gurus!!

How would you define Rock Music musically? By that I mean, when you're playing Blues, some of the key things are, obviously, the blues scale and I-IV-V progressions etc.
But what things would you "look out for" when trying to play Rock?

I ask simply because, I seem to be stuck in the blues frame of mind and as much as I love the blues scale, it can get a wee bit tiresome when every new solo you try and come up with sounds exactly the same.

Also, this question makes sense to ME obviously, but I may have worded it horribly. In which case, I apologize!

Tom.


I wouldn't try to define it. Especially considering "rock" music is a vague term, that covers alot of styles.


You like a certain type of music and you want to know what it's about.....
listen to it, learn it, play it, study it, enjoy it.
shred is gaudy music
#12
well, being that just like my beloved grunge, classic rock is dead, along with punk, hair, nu metal, new wave, psychedelics, and most gateway metal- we have to look at the NOW when defining a word. i tend to include dead (see definition 'good') music as part of the definition for modern (scream/emo, hardcore, nintendocore,screamcore,metalcore,whatever other 'core' there is, that idiotic yngwie neo-classical stuff, indie rock, whatever obscure bull**** you're going to tell me i missed) rock 'n roll- because it's all INSPIRED by it. black parade(mcr) wants to be black flag wants to be the clash wants to be the sex pistols wants to be the stones wanted to be the beatles wanted to be buddy holly wanted to be big poppa wanted to be frank garccello wanted to be..........
the point is, every artist decided to become an artist by hearing another artist when they were younger. but it's a big game of telephone, because you never know what ABOUT dimebag or cobain or ozzy or hendrix or ... unfortunately gerard way, is going to inspire the next big thing- it's evolution- what's GOOD is ripped off and carried over to the next band and what people don't like about them is omitted, people who like what was omitted take it and turn it into a sub-genre that dies after about 6 years when one or more of it's movement heroes retires or dies. there is no set idea or emotion in rock, although rebellion is probably the most common theme, and while the 'rip off the band before you' mentality leads to a million compositional memes, there is no REQUIRED instrument or technique for rock. it can be pissed off or passive, pentatonic or power chord.
isn't that what we like the most about it?
#13
after readin guitar munkys post i partly agree with him.

The definition of a musical genre is partly musically defined and partly socially defined - by saying you like xxxxxx you put yourself within a social group. This social group has little connection with the music, but could adhere to specific social codes e.g dress codes with punk or emo. Thus a genre is partly defined by the taste of it's members. Someone could say they like Rock music and like the band incubus. Incubus however don't always stick to simple rock patterns and pentatonics etc. so the group/genre definition has been distorted to fit this.

i don't really think you are really asking about what rock music is though - you know that already. Do you actually want to know how to WRITE rock music? if so than my post above should be handy. Rephrasing your question may get better responses too.
The only 6 words that can make you a better guitarist:

Learn theory
Practice better
Practice more
Last edited by doive at Sep 2, 2009,
#14
Quote by doive
If you want rock music accept it'll be simple and you probably need more people to play it to make it sound good!


I've yet to be able to play any genre and make it sound 'good' without other musicians.