#1
if you take this seriously.................


____________

Napkin

I fold this shit carefully like
it could hold some kind of meaning
like I talk to that waitress
as if she had something to say

or was she the one talking to me?
haha, that last line was so typical of
you guys
while, well
I write, with a smile in hand
white as a sail and light as sand
oscillating like sea-weed
when I'd kill for weed alone

I don't care for relevance so
there's this guy in the staff. with
the same name as me,
same pronunciation,
I thought I'd write it down like it has
some value ; ironic or
some shit
ah-ah
ha....

Hieroglyphs underwater
good luck deciphering
you daughter of an author
or you
shadow of a writer,
1h04 long drunk calls
and I-don't-know-how-much
cell bills
It's 2:45 and
the UFC guys
are laughing
while I order my last drink
thinking only of
.............you
only hoping you are
dreaming of
.............me.

ahahah!
____________________


you're an s+l writer.
Last edited by circular.parade at Sep 14, 2009,
#2
I really like this, only complaint is the "ahas" and the "hahas", maybe it's just me though.
Quote by icaneatcatfood
On second thought, **** tuning forks. You best be carrying around a grand piano that was tuned by an Italian
#3
This is just fantabulous stuff.
マリ「しあわっせはーあるいってこないだーからあるいってゆっくんだねーん 
いっちにっちいっぽみーかでさんぽ
 さーんぽすすんでにっほさっがるー 
じーんせいはっわんつー!ぱんち・・・


"Success is as dangerous as failure. Hope is as hollow as fear." - from Tao Te Ching

#5
I think only you call pull this off without sounding like a pretentious bitch, and you did. We're not all that bad, are we?
#6
This was really cool Mat. Seriously.

Though I disagree with Kyle. You still sounded like a pretentious bitch.

#8
I agree with what everyone else has been saying, except that I don't think you sounded like a pretentious bitch. More like a pretentious bastard, to be honest.
#9
Vintage X Metal, honestly, why did you delete your post??
somebody showed common sense, at last.

To all those who thought it was "cool", I really don't get you guys. Call me pretentious for this, but yeah, ahah. Anyway.
#10
Meh, you achieved what you wanted. A shoddy pretentious piece for laughs. I know we never see eye to eye on..... anything; but I guess I always expected better of you than cheapshots on people who don't write to the same "standard" as others because they just aren't as interested in "real" writing.

Maybe I'm reading it wrong; but it certainly seems like that to me. I'm not saying you can't have that opinion... hell if I care, just didn't expect you of all people to call it out.

*prepares flame shield for people who aren't Mat that will yell at me for this*


Edit: Suppose I should add this; I know a lot of you poetry "purists" think that those of us who aren't serious about writing should stop polluting your art and specifically a lot of people hate the way I write because I refuse to take my own perspective out of other people's lives. I understand that, but I'm of the opinion that the only major difference between S&L and many other writing forums is the fact that a good portion of the users here don't take themselves to seriously and pretend like their writings are a gift to mankind. We all are aware that we don't write as well as others... and that breeds the freedom to try different things and post "stupid" pieces like the mish-mash of ideas and whatnot that you posted above. That aire of freedom is what makes S&L different and lovely... I just don't see why so many of you "older regs" attack that. **** I'm drunk; I'm gonna stop rambling in your thread now Mat. More than likely I'll re-read this tomorrow and realize that none of my post makes sense.

re edit: and don't get me wrong Mat, I still have a lot of respect for you as a person and author (even if I never really get your stuff)... I just would expect a shot at S&L in this form to come from the other Matt or some of hte other older regs.
#11
^I understand, Zach. In fact, I completely agree. and btw, I don't consider myself a "purist" by any means. My main problem is with you thinking that I am not accepting the fact that this place is for amateur writing, i know that ****.

It's merely about the fact that this place has created it's own clichés and easy writing patterns/models. I can still understand that. It's first and foremost about the continuous terrific ****-stroking between users when really all they publish are thematically empty pieces, with often no message nor poetic value.Edit : It's not about the result, but about the research and intention. It seems like people want more comments about their lives / relationships / trips / phantasms than about their writing in itself. That's not what this place is for. no.


Instead of complaining and polluting other people's threads, I decided to verify my hypothesis by posting something very uninspired and empty. Results are quite obvious. The only person to actually bash this deleted her own comment when I didn't answer right away.

I had a statement to make, and I think it got through. Now complain about this all you want, I think I got all to prove me right.


edit : and it's not like I didn't make it obvious.

edit : by re-reading your own edit, it doesn't make sense. Stop pushing your vision of old writers here to the "extreme". Nobody here sees their writing as a "gift to mankind", except maybe Something_Matt who did at some point, but even then, it was a character. You are right when you talk about "not writing seriously", etc. If you "write" only to generate social activity, go to livejournal or, hell, the Pit, the profiles!! Isn't that what blogs are for? Idc, go wherever. If there is no artistic research or intention, why post it here, in a place where constructive criticism is put forward as a pursuit of achievement? I can't critique constructively someone's activity over the weekend. I can critique their attempt of putting into artistic form through writing, but if all they want is a comment aimed at how they think or who they are, I firmly, strongly believe this is the wrong place.
Last edited by circular.parade at Sep 17, 2009,
#12
I see your point much more clearly now.

And yeah, my vision of older regs is skewed because the main user from that era I have dealt with is Something_Matt and his e-penis. So, I realize I do have a skewed vision of that; but the extremum also makes the greatest point.

As to your final point, some of us aren't "serious" about writing in the sense that we feel like we absolutely must write to survive or can make a living at it, but still want to have other people critique it and actually critique not just gloss over. There can be a balance; as you said amateur writing i guess.

At this point I agree with you now; I mis-understood what you were getting at. Honestly, I hadn't realized how soft this place has become in the last year.
#13
Quote by circular.parade
Vintage X Metal, honestly, why did you delete your post??
somebody showed common sense, at last.

To all those who thought it was "cool", I really don't get you guys. Call me pretentious for this, but yeah, ahah. Anyway.
Why do you feel it's a necessity to shit on people?

Instead of being overly forward and blunt (rude) why don't you simply say, "I don't understand what you mean by 'cool'? Explain why you said what you said?"

Writing reflects who you are. If you act like an erect dic all the time, every piece of writing you then compose and show to me feels like an erect dic, just that it's actually quite a pretty dic. And that's the only difference.

I have no problem with the piece. If you want to bash people, go ahead, it's just your thoughts and I love to see that. But please use manners when you're talking to people normally (not through your writing) I'm asking that you show respect, even if you have non.

Back to the topic... I love the tone's coolness (cockiness). It was, as you explained concerning Something_Vague, cocky for the sake of it. It made a point. Which I admire the gusto of.
There is nothing I'd change personally, it's quite unique and belittling, but humorous and done jokingly. Unfortunately, though, your personality as of late has made me think that this is very serious and you mean every word of it, as if to purposefully insult.

#14
^the discussion was going fine until your post. Me and Zach were explaining opposite points of views. I don't think he took offense, and I didn't take offense in anything he said. If you are insulted by me saying "I don't get you guys", I can't do anything about it. If you are insulted by the fact that you liked the writing while it's insipid and soul less, and feel insulted or tricked, I can't do anything about it. The post you quoted is in no way overly blunt or rude. I even drawn myself back from explaining a few things, to not offend.

what did you want me to say? I had a point to make and got it through. If you don't agree with that, voice an opinion on the matter or leave the thread. Your entire post was on about me being a dick. Great, what do you want me to say? This isn't about personal issues. Do you honestly think that I care about what you think of me? Staying there complaining isn't helping making things go forward. I really don't get what you're trying to get across?

let me back at you, sir. Hopefully, this won't get closed, as it ain't out of hand yet, and we were discussing the theme of the piece. If it does get out of hand, mods, feel free to close according to your standards, etc.

edit :

Quote by ZanasCross

As to your final point, some of us aren't "serious" about writing in the sense that we feel like we absolutely must write to survive or can make a living at it, but still want to have other people critique it and actually critique not just gloss over. There can be a balance; as you said amateur writing i guess.


See, this is not quite what I meant yet. I must not write to survive, nor I don't plan on making a living out of it. I really don't think anybody here does. Let me also say that everybody here is an amateur writer. Let me voice what I'm trying to get across in one sentence.

What I find discouraging is people exchanging words of praise on effortless and soulless pieces when clearly there is no effort put either on the writing, nor on the critical reading.

It's not about capacity. It's not about categorizing "good" and "less good" writers, it's about the very purpose of the place, and us using it at about 20% of it's potential. People don't want critiques. Hell, look at this, I critique the very place and get called out for being a dick? Now honestly Zach, have I been offending at all? Aren't we ill? Have I gone mad?!

Edit again : let me also say that most of the new people here, the unknown noobs, actually are looking for criticism. take what you want out of that.

edit again to steve2
Quote by bassbeat77


Anyways, as someone who thought (and still thinks) this piece was "cool" I didn't find your comment offensive, though Dan and I must have read into it different ways. I will say though, that maybe what's "cool" about the piece is the point you were making and the fact that you got it across. That's more or less what I was getting at personally. I wasn't implying that I thought this was some kind of literary masterpiece or anything.


don't worry, I got that. I just found it funny that people were just sitting around stating "cool", which I thought very very ironic. we were (nearly) all on the same page
Last edited by circular.parade at Sep 17, 2009,
#15
I wouldn't say this is out of hand yet, but I've got my eye on you Mathieu!



Anyways, as someone who thought (and still thinks) this piece was "cool" I didn't find your comment offensive, though Dan and I must have read into it different ways. I will say though, that maybe what's "cool" about the piece is the point you were making and the fact that you got it across. That's more or less what I was getting at personally. I wasn't implying that I thought this was some kind of literary masterpiece or anything.

#16
Quote by circular.parade
^the discussion was going fine until your post. Me and Zach were explaining opposite points of views.
I'm sorry, circular. I didn't mean to ruin the thread. Apologies to you Steve/Zach as well.

I don't think he took offense, and I didn't take offense in anything he said. If you are insulted by me saying "I don't get you guys", I can't do anything about it. If you are insulted by the fact that you liked the writing while it's insipid and soul less, and feel insulted or tricked, I can't do anything about it. The post you quoted is in no way overly blunt or rude. I even drawn myself back from explaining a few things, to not offend.
For clarifications sake, I was insulted by this "somebody showed common sense at last", not by anything else. That's the only thing I was offended by.

Once again, sorry for assuming the worst.
#17
Quote by circular.parade
See, this is not quite what I meant yet. I must not write to survive, nor I don't plan on making a living out of it. I really don't think anybody here does. Let me also say that everybody here is an amateur writer. Let me voice what I'm trying to get across in one sentence.

What I find discouraging is people exchanging words of praise on effortless and soulless pieces when clearly there is no effort put either on the writing, nor on the critical reading.

It's not about capacity. It's not about categorizing "good" and "less good" writers, it's about the very purpose of the place, and us using it at about 20% of it's potential. People don't want critiques. Hell, look at this, I critique the very place and get called out for being a dick? Now honestly Zach, have I been offending at all? Aren't we ill? Have I gone mad?!


I'm so god-damn offended that I've cried myself to sleep and woke myself up by crying.

I'm coming at this from a personal level, Mat. I know I have used more than 20% of the capacity of S&L. I know I came in thinking that because I rhymed every other line I had made a meaningful piece of poetry and now I don't find meaning in something I write unless it expresses a part of me. The piece everyone bashed a couple weeks ago (condom in sig) expressed something for me. Frankly, my fiance brought home a porno for us to watch together; and as we were watching it I could see in the girl's eyes and movements that she didn't want to be there. It was so striking to me and all I could do was imagine what she was thinking. That's where that piece came from. Two years ago that would have never happened.

I also know that I've given more than 20%. I've gone through pieces and spent hours sometimes scouring through and hopefully causing the writer to re-evaluate their point of view. There are still people that do that. S&L has grown; there is still a core to it of people who genuinely want to keep it a "strenuous place to be" for amateur writers... but there is a lot of **** stroking in between the comments that core can leave because there are a lot of other people who just float in and out without being serious about keeping the core of S&L. Is that what you are striking out at? The people who are just praising things because they happen to read it instead of searching for strength and heart in a piece? Because if so, you are fighting a battle you can't win because S&L isn't just 10 people sitting around trying to make each other cry anymore.

The point this piece made to me was striking at the wrong people. It was striking at the core when it's not the core that is the problem. Sure, some regs fellatiate (is that a word?) each other... but when you do have a concept of who the person is behind the words its easy to find a spring board in to relating to the piece. I guess I think you are failing to see that there is still a core of users who will call each other out. I know kdownes (just as a singular example) has told me straight forward that a lot of my pieces suck balls... and I've done the same to him. That spirit isn't dead yet, and it seems like you're already mourning it.
#18
Quote by circular.parade
Vintage X Metal, honestly, why did you delete your post??
somebody showed common sense, at last.

wat
I don't remember posting anything
Quote by Arthur Curry
it's official, vintage x metal is the saving grace of this board and/or the antichrist




e-married to
theguitarist
minterman22
tateandlyle
& alaskan_ninja

#19
anyone (no matter how good) who plans on making their living on writing these days is going to be VERY disappointed. I've been trying to sort out what kind of dispute is going on here but I can't make any damn sense of it. guess I haven't been here long enough. Anyway, I thought the piece was boring. It was disjointed and seemed like a mediocre flow of cognitions, HOWEVER, it seems to have garnered a lot of attention by being pretty controversial, and if you want to make ANY money whatsoever writing poetry, that's how you do it. If people read something nice, they say, oh that was nice. And they move on with their life. If they read something that they find controversial, they'll be like, hey, read this. Thus the controversy spreads. I guess that would only apply to a piece that has controversy outside of the forum, though.
what comes up comes out