#1
I've been working on chords lately trying to understand how progressions work.

I came up with this little progression and I really like the sound of it but I don't know how or why it sounds good

Cm, Cmb6 (C,D#,G#), Csus2, Csus4.

Now based on my knowledge this progression doesn't follow something like a I-IV-V-I, or something like that, what do you call it (circle progressions)?

What's the theory behind this progression? Would this be a chord vamp?
Playing one chord and then altering it?
#2
There all alterations on a i chord in C minor.

And Cmb6 should be spelt (C Eb Ab), and would usually function as an Ab major chord.
#3
Quote by isaac_bandits
There all alterations on a i chord in C minor.

And Cmb6 should be spelt (C Eb Ab), and would usually function as an Ab major chord.


thanks but no thanks, you really didnt answer my question you kinda sidestepped it by just agreeing with what i said...

and you wanted to cover that up by saying that all letters need to be used in a scale, i only mixed letters because i'm trying to keep it simple, we don't have to be 100% exact all the time do we?

but its cool if you don't wanna explain how chords resolve, and how tension works, and why that progression sounds good
#5
Quote by Metallica rulz
Your in C minor? I dont understand the D# and G#. should be Eflat and A flat.

omg, you guys do realize that their is a logical progression that takes place in learning, for me to get to the level where I am at now in music theory, its ONLY COMMON sense that I must have learned that you can only have one of each letter (ABCDEFG) in a scale. I'm only sticking to sharp's for simplicity's sake, so CALM DOWN about it.

And Metallica rulz, I love people like you who come into a thread and troll/spam it by posting what's already been said.

And now people are gonna go ape **** over this post and how I'm being "mean" to posters /facepalm.

I'm sorry.
#6
Quote by 1979ckhtt
thanks but no thanks, you really didnt answer my question you kinda sidestepped it by just agreeing with what i said...

and you wanted to cover that up by saying that all letters need to be used in a scale, i only mixed letters because i'm trying to keep it simple, we don't have to be 100% exact all the time do we?

but its cool if you don't wanna explain how chords resolve, and how tension works, and why that progression sounds good


Considering you didn't give us any voicings we can't be sure how each alteration is function. Right now, my guess is that you have a i - VI - isus2 - isus4 progression.

Since you'll accuse me of "covering up", then I'll assume that you actually are playing a D# and G#. Your progression is i - #Vsusb4 - isus2 - isus4. The #Vsusb4 isn't at all a common chord in any theory. It makes no sense to use a #V chord in a minor key, since the diatonic bVI is enharmonic to a #V, and the #V would have no function. Its also very strange to suspend the 3 to a b4, which would be enharmonic, and serves no purpose, unless played along side a b3. In this case it is not, so that chord is wrong.

Another thing: If you don't want people to be a dick to you, don't be a dick to them when they help you.
#7
Scale: Cminor (C,D,Eb,F,G,Ab,Bb,C)
Chords:
Cm (C,Eb,G) 1,b3,5
Cm/5+ (C,Eb,Ab) 1,b3,b6
Csus2 (C,D,G) 1,2,5
Csus4 (C,F,G) 1,4,5

The C serves as the bass note for all chords.
So the progression really is an alteration of the C chord.

it seems that I have lots of options for picking scales, but I don't understand why this chord progression sounds good, its not a conventional progression similar to something like a 2-5-1 or a 1-4-5 progression and other similar "circle progressions".

So could someone describe how alterations function harmonically/melodically?
Last edited by 1979ckhtt at Sep 30, 2009,
#9
Quote by 1979ckhtt
Scale: Cminor (C,D,Eb,F,G,Ab,Bb,C)
Chords:
Cm (C,Eb,G) 1,b3,5
Cm/5+ (C,Eb,Ab) 1,b3,b6
Csus2 (C,D,G) 1,2,5
Csus4 (C,F,G) 1,4,5
it seems that I have lots of options for picking scales, but I don't understand why this chord progression sounds good, its not a conventional progression similar to something like a 2-5-1 or a 1-4-5 progression and other similar "circle progressions".

So could someone describe how alterations function harmonically/melodically?


Give us the voicings already. We don't know how they're functioning if we don't know how they're voiced.

Why are you putting a b6 in a chord with an augmented fifth?
#10
Quote by Metallica rulz
Lol I didnt read those posts fully. Well there's no real theory I've run into using those chords. But many songs Alternate Between Sus 2 and Sus 4. It just sounds cool man.

:P

tru dat, thats why I got into using sus chords

and sorry about being a dick
#11
Quote by isaac_bandits
Give us the voicings already. We don't know how they're functioning if we don't know how they're voiced.

Why are you putting a b6 in a chord with an augmented fifth?

I don't know how to notate that chord, Guitar Pro says Cm/+5
but I think its a b6.

what is it?
#13
Quote by 1979ckhtt
I don't know how to notate that chord, Guitar Pro says Cm/+5
but I think its a b6.

what is it?


Its almost certainly an Ab chord, not a Cm#5 or Cmb6. Is there a G and Ab in it? If not, then there's no reason to call it a Cmb6, since the sixth won't be heard as a sixth unless the fifth is also present (Even then it would probably function as an Abmaj7). Is there a reason to call it a G# rather than an Ab? If not, and looking at your progression, there probably isn't, then there's no reason to call it a Cm#5.

I'm almost certain that its functioning as an Ab. Give the voicing so I can clarify.


You also can't go by guitar pro's chord namer function. It can give you a general idea sometimes, but for the most part, it gives messy, if not wrong names, and it doesn't help you understand the function of the progression.

Quote by Metallica rulz
Probably suspended sixth. No need to augment a chord unless needed.


You don't suspend a fifth to a sixth. The "sixth" becomes the root, and you have a different chord, in first inversion.

Your augmented statement is very redundant
Last edited by isaac_bandits at Sep 30, 2009,
#14
Quote by 1979ckhtt
I don't know how to notate that chord, Guitar Pro says Cm/+5
but I think its a b6.

what is it?



could you just tab out the chords?
#16
Quote by Metallica rulz
It wouldnt be Cmb6^ 6 is already flatted. So yes it would be funcitonal to name it Cmsus6.


No it wouldn't. A suspension was originally used to describe a note held (suspended) from the previous chord, in one voice, and was almost always a 4th or 2nd replace the 3rd. This dissonance of a major second would then resolve to the third, creating a consonant chord. Nowadays the preparation and resolution of a suspension are not considered mandatory, to receive the name, but it still holds that a suspension is when the third is replaced to create a chord, where none of the chord tones are a third apart from any other chord tones. Sus6 does not exist.

And, a m6 chord has a major six, however counterintuitive that may be. TS is correct in calling C Eb Ab Cmb6, on the assumption that C is functioning as the root.
#17
Quote by isaac_bandits
No it wouldn't. A suspension was originally used to describe a note held (suspended) from the previous chord, in one voice, and was almost always a 4th or 2nd replace the 3rd. This dissonance of a major second would then resolve to the third, creating a consonant chord. Nowadays the preparation and resolution of a suspension are not considered mandatory, to receive the name, but it still holds that a suspension is when the third is replaced to create a chord, where none of the chord tones are a third apart from any other chord tones. Sus6 does not exist.

And, a m6 chord has a major six, however counterintuitive that may be. TS is correct in calling C Eb Ab Cmb6, on the assumption that C is functioning as the root.

You know whatttttt!!!!!. Your right I have no idea why I thought there was a suspended six chord lol.

It was called an add6 chord my bad. Thats what we called it in theory class.
#18
Quote by Metallica rulz
You know whatttttt!!!!!. Your right I have no idea why I thought there was a suspended six chord lol.

It was called an add6 chord my bad. Thats what we called it in theory class.


Cmadd6 = Cm6
Cadd6 = C6

Cm6(no5) = Adim
Cmb6(no5) = Ab
C6(no5) = Am
#20
im playing the chords on a piano so the voicings are very simple played from c to the last note of the chord all in one octave, im also playing an octave, a c below the c in the chords, i would tab it out but im not at c pc ;( but still i wanna know what is the purpose of augmented and suspended chords
#21
Quote by 1979ckhtt
thanks but no thanks, you really didnt answer my question you kinda sidestepped it by just agreeing with what i said...

and you wanted to cover that up by saying that all letters need to be used in a scale, i only mixed letters because i'm trying to keep it simple, we don't have to be 100% exact all the time do we?

but its cool if you don't wanna explain how chords resolve, and how tension works, and why that progression sounds good

holy **** dude.
#22
Quote by 1979ckhtt
im playing the chords on a piano so the voicings are very simple played from c to the last note of the chord all in one octave, im also playing an octave, a c below the c in the chords, i would tab it out but im not at c pc ;( but still i wanna know what is the purpose of augmented and suspended chords


So you've got a C pedal throughout, establishing the tonality, with partial chords above.

The first chord adds b3 and 5 above the bass note, which, along with the pedal, makes a i chord. This is a consonant chord which works well as the first chord of a progression.

The second chord adds b3 and b6 above the bass note, which, along with the pedal, makes a bVI chord. This is very similar to the i chord, as there are two common tones, and the unique tones only differ by one semitone. This triad serves as a tonic prolongation.

The third chord adds a 2 and a 5 above the bass note. These two notes form a fourth, which is an inverted fifth, which implies a (thirdless) voicing of v, and, if it weren't for the underlying pedal, would be quite consonant. With the pedal it wants to move.

The fourth chord adds a 4 and 5 above the bass note. These two notes are a major second apart, which is an inverted minor seventh. Again, this implies a (thirdless) voicing of v, only, this time it is a v7 or V7 being implied. This is the typical dominant chord of a perfect cadence, and leads nicely back to the i.

tl;dr You are implying a i - bVI - V progression over a 1 pedal.
Last edited by isaac_bandits at Oct 2, 2009,
#23
Quote by isaac_bandits

This is a consonant chord which works well as the first chord of a progression.

This triad serves as a tonic prolongation.

The third chord adds a 2 and a 5 above the bass note. These two notes form a fourth, which is an inverted fifth, which implies a (thirdless) voicing of v, and, if it weren't for the unbderlying pedal, would be quite consonant. With the pedal it wants to move.

The fourth chord adds a 4 and 5 above the bass note. These two notes are a major second apart, which is an inverted minor seventh. Again, this implies a (thirdless) voicing of v, only, this time it is a v7 or V7 being implied. This is the typical dominant chord of a perfect cadence, and leads nicely back to the i.


Wow thanks for taking the time to explain that, that's exactly what i was looking for, sincerest apologies for being a dick

Could you further expand on the bolded words?

Also, if chords are named based on their root notes, then why do you say that C,C,Eb,Ab is a bVI chord and not a i chord alteration? I'm guessing its just to explain how I can replace the alteration with that chord and get that sound right? But technically you are supposed to name them based on their root notes?
Last edited by 1979ckhtt at Oct 1, 2009,
#24
Quote by 1979ckhtt
Wow thanks for taking the time to explain that, that's exactly what i was looking for, sincerest apologies for being a dick

Could you further expand on the bolded words?

Also, if chords are named based on their root notes, then why do you say that C,C,Eb,Ab is a bVI chord and not a i chord alteration? I'm guessing its just to explain how I can replace the alteration with that chord and get that sound right? But technically you are supposed to name them based on their root notes?

Consonant essentially means it sounds stable and "nice."

A perfect cadence is a movement from the V chord to the I (or in this case, i) chord. It's called "perfect" because it's the most final sounding cadence.

C Eb Ab could be see as the first inversion of an Ab chord (Ab C Eb).
Quote by dudetheman
So what? I wasted like 5 minutes watching DaddyTwoFoot's avatar.


Metalheads are the worst thing that ever happened to metal.