#1
first and foremost, anybody know where to get some sheet music for Schoenberg or Webern? just wanna get a little more edumacated on some 12 tone theory, see it in action.

also, is there anyone out there these days coming up with some innovative theories, something in the grain of Schoenberg or Harry Partch? or has all of that kinda been left in the past?
#2
12-tone is dead.
Fender '72 Telecaster Deluxe Reissue -> Korg Pitchblack Tuner -> Boss PS-5 -> EHX Big Muff -> MXR EVH Phase 90 -> Menatone Pleasure Trem 5000 -> Line 6 Verbzilla -> MXR Carbon Copy -> Boss RC-2 -> Peavey Classic 50
#4
Ron Jarzombek has a new style of tone rows which he uses, check him out on youtube he explains it and all. Lol why are you guys knocking the 12 tone row, just because its not melodic or too dissonant for you?
Last edited by diminishedtobme at Oct 7, 2009,
#6
Quote by onethreesixfive
Dissonant is not synonymous with innovative.

could 12 techniquely be considered dissonant? i mean aside from abolishing the idea of a tonic, isn't it supposed to suppress the traditional idea of dissonance as well? i mean this is relatively speaking, since you have this song with no tonic or candencial movement, it would become hard to describe what would be consonant or dissonant?

but yeah ur right, just because its dissonance doesnt mean that its innovative. but thats the same with anything else.
#7
"St. Patrick's Day" by John Mayer, in the bass notes alone, uses 11 of the twelve notes, and I'm sure that F shows up somewhere, so it's pretty safe to say this song uses 12 tone theory.

Unless I'm misunderstanding something...
Only play what you hear. If you don’t hear anything, don’t play anything.
-Chick Corea
#8
Quote by food1010
"St. Patrick's Day" by John Mayer, in the bass notes alone, uses 11 of the twelve notes, and I'm sure that F shows up somewhere, so it's pretty safe to say this song uses 12 tone theory.

Unless I'm misunderstanding something...


12 tone theory is not just using every note. Read the wikipedia article on 12 tone technique for starters.
#9
Quote by food1010
"St. Patrick's Day" by John Mayer, in the bass notes alone, uses 11 of the twelve notes, and I'm sure that F shows up somewhere, so it's pretty safe to say this song uses 12 tone theory.

Unless I'm misunderstanding something...


12 tone theory is using the 12 tones in a single pattern with no repeats. So something like E-F-E-F#-E-G-E-G#-etc. wouldn't be 12 tone theory.

Or at least that's how I was taught .
#10
Quote by GuerillaGorilla
12 tone theory is using the 12 tones in a single pattern with no repeats. So something like E-F-E-F#-E-G-E-G#-etc. wouldn't be 12 tone theory.

Or at least that's how I was taught .


Yeah. For twelve tone music, all notes must be sounded before any are repeated.
#11
Quote by isaac_bandits
Yeah. For twelve tone music, all notes must be sounded before any are repeated.

That is the rule for writing tone rows, but twelve tone music isn't as simple.

In music by twelve tone composers many rows will be playing at the same time, so it's actually quite unlkikely that no note would be repeated before all others have been played, as all the rows have different notes in different places.

TS, Schoenberg, Webern and Berg are really the big three (all part of the second vienese school) in terms of twelve tone music. For sheet music try googling it, I'm sure there will be quite a lot from these three composers out there.
Last edited by 12345abcd3 at Oct 8, 2009,
#12
Quote by onethreesixfive
Dissonant is not synonymous with innovative.


Sculptured would like to have a word with you.


One of the prefixes of 12 tone is to set a neutral point of "pure" atonality. You don't give any specific note preference, so there is no tonal certain to resolve the piece.
I think 12 tone pieces use a lot of tone clusters instead of using "standard" chords. I could be wrong, but I'm sure that tone clusters and 12 tone go hand in hand. I'm going off the top of my head; I should have probably researched this before rambling.

onethreesixfive, the correct answer would be that 12 tone on it's own is not automatically innovative. How it's incorporated is (but that goes along with any other idea in music).