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#1
Question. Probably many answers and hard work to reach, but how does one reach the level where he can immediately play whatever pops into his head on the guitar.
Like you hear an epic solo or melody playing in your head, and then you can immediately apply it to the guitar. What are the best things to do to achieve this skill?
I smile because I have no idea whats goin on
#2
ya the answer is lots and lots of hard work, your skill has to be amazing and you also have to have lots of natural talent. i guess in order to do that you would need to know everything about the fretboard
It's always the last day of summer and I've been left out in the cold with no door to get back in
#3
Work on your technique, learn some theory, learn some songs, do a shitload of improv.

I estimate it would take at least 5-7 years, practicing any chance you get.
Quote by CrunchyRoll
So you would censor child porn.

This thread is so fukking fail.
#4
like you said, lots and lots of playing and learning why things sound how they sound.

personally i've found my best playing comes from a very zen state that i haven't reached but a handful of times.
#5
Quote by z4twenny
like you said, lots and lots of playing and learning why things sound how they sound.

personally i've found my best playing comes from a very zen state that i haven't reached but a handful of times.

This is so true. I was soloing before after an intense watchtower version transitioning into stairway, and I was playing licks I had never even imagined easily my best playing ever, but now I can't get back to that level
I smile because I have no idea whats goin on
#6
^ it happens to every one. i love when it happens and wish it would more often. theres a point where everything you know either directly or indirectly coalesces together and whatever that mental barrier you have just dissipates and you get removed from the equation its like your brain is talking directly to the guitar.
#7
You have to work on developing your ear. When you are playing, really listen to the notes that are coming out of the guitar, don't just get caught up in "my 3rd finger needs to move to x fret." When you get started improvising, keep your backing music at a slow bpm to give yourself time to think of an idea in your head. When you hear it in your head, try to duplicate it on the guitar. Also transcribing other peoples music helps. You basically want to hear something, either externally or in your head, and duplicate the sound on your instrument. Practice this daily, even if you are only duplicating simple melodies or commercial jingles.
#8
lots of improv,music theory would help but not essential amd listen intently to all the music u heear
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Tell me what nation on this earth, was not born of tragedy-Primordial
#9
by far the best exercise for this important skill i've found is to sing a couple of notes,
play those notes, sing some other notes, play those notes etc etc etc etc.
(the trick is to be able to sing what pops into your head)
it may take a couple of times to get it at first but this exercise works really fast
now you can gently increase the length and speed of those lines

also ofcourse as mentioned eartraining, if you know what you hear you can play what you hear

do bear in mind that this is a really tough cookie to swallow and takes most people years and years to completely grasp it, you could get satisfyng results within months though
#10
Quote by bellamy_morello
ya the answer is lots and lots of hard work, your skill has to be amazing and you also have to have lots of natural talent. i guess in order to do that you would need to know everything about the fretboard


Bull shit. If you work hard you WILL be able to play, you don't have to have natural talent, just the discipline and desire that it takes to become better.
Quote by acjshapiro

Quote by Vrstone87

meh, I've listened to every radiohead album and honestly don't get what everyone loves about them.....


cause you're ****ing stupid

#11
^That.

No such thing as natural talent.

Noone is born with the ability to play an instrument.
#12
Quote by fenderuser93
Question. Probably many answers and hard work to reach, but how does one reach the level where he can immediately play whatever pops into his head on the guitar.
Like you hear an epic solo or melody playing in your head, and then you can immediately apply it to the guitar. What are the best things to do to achieve this skill?


In a word...


Listen.


In a more detailed explanation...

Listen to, enjoy, study, learn, practice, play as much music as you have time and the desire for.

and be patient, it takes time. Have fun with it.


Quote by 3holepunch
Bull shit. If you work hard you WILL be able to play, you don't have to have natural talent, just the discipline and desire that it takes to become better.



Actually natural talent exists and is quite relevant. As a teacher I've seen the difference over and over again.

Quote by Ikonoklast
^That.

No such thing as natural talent.

Noone is born with the ability to play an instrument.


There certainly is. Human beings do vary in their talents. We are not all exactly the same in that regard.
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Oct 23, 2009,
#13
I never said that natural doesn't exist. What I said is you don't HAVE to have it. Yeah some people pick things up faster (that's natural talent imo), but if someone works hard they can play anything someone with 'natural' talent can.
Quote by acjshapiro

Quote by Vrstone87

meh, I've listened to every radiohead album and honestly don't get what everyone loves about them.....


cause you're ****ing stupid

#14
Quote by 3holepunch
but if someone works hard they can play anything someone with 'natural' talent can.


As a teacher of many years, I have to say this just isn't true. Working at your craft is beneficial of-course, but like it or not, some people just don't have the natural talent, and no matter how hard they try, they will likely not achieve the same success as someone with that talent. That's life.

I have found though that most people that have a desire to play, also have enough talent to be able to play and enjoy the instrument.
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Oct 23, 2009,
#15
this question is satisfying me, because though I was trying to figure it out, I mean, about how to be able to apply solos immediately after we hear musics...
#16
Quote by GuitarMunky
As a teacher of many years, I have to say this just isn't true. Working at your craft is beneficial of-course, but like it or not, some people just don't have the natural talent, and no matter how hard they try, they will likely not achieve the same success as someone with that talent. That's life.

I have found though that most people that have a desire to play, also have enough talent to be able to play and enjoy the instrument.


i have to disagree, only because i know me pretty well. when i started playing guitar i had absolutely no musical talent or latent predisposition towards music. i was god awful. in fact i was god awful for a long time (i thank my friends for putting up with it) but i kept practicing and praciticing and eventually i got good, not superb but im pretty decent and although i'm no sweep god yet im getting better at it slowly. while i would have probably learned quicker with a natural talent for it, i don't think it was above me capably acheiving my goals.

so i'd say the same could apply to anybody who wants to play, if you suck then practice even more and if you start to think you're sounding good do something to level yourself out and get back to practicing what you need to work on. if you put the hours in then you'll get out of it what you want, you just might have to put more time in than you initially planned.

tl;dr - if i can do it then ANYBODY (with 2 hands and an iq above 90) can do it
#17
Quote by z4twenny
i have to disagree, only because i know me pretty well. when i started playing guitar i had absolutely no musical talent or latent predisposition towards music. i was god awful. in fact i was god awful for a long time (i thank my friends for putting up with it) but i kept practicing and praciticing and eventually i got good, not superb but im pretty decent and although i'm no sweep god yet im getting better at it slowly. while i would have probably learned quicker with a natural talent for it, i don't think it was above me capably acheiving my goals.

so i'd say the same could apply to anybody who wants to play, if you suck then practice even more and if you start to think you're sounding good do something to level yourself out and get back to practicing what you need to work on. if you put the hours in then you'll get out of it what you want, you just might have to put more time in than you initially planned.

tl;dr - if i can do it then ANYBODY (with 2 hands and an iq above 90) can do it



I don't think it's fair to hold yourself as the benchmark for not having talent. It sounds modest to say "If I can do it anyone can", but in reality it doesn't pan out.

I can tell you that there are people that simply have less talent for music. It doesn't mean that can't learn anything, but in my experience, they generally don't take it too far.

Like i said, I've taught for awhile. I've seen it many many times, though I will say that most students I've had showed some degree of talent. The seemingly hopeless were a very small minority.

Anyway, the point is.......We do not all posses the same level of talent.
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Oct 24, 2009,
#18
thanks guys. I have great relative pitch, and yeah I do think that my ear training has helped me. but, when I improv I don't really think about where my fingers should go; It usually just comes to me and I'll play it. I guess my general music/theory knowledge/ ear is where tha comes into play.

and guys please don't turn this into a flame war and get it closed. I think topic could be helpful to others
I smile because I have no idea whats goin on
#19
Quote by GuitarMunky
As a teacher of many years, I have to say this just isn't true. Working at your craft is beneficial of-course, but like it or not, some people just don't have the natural talent, and no matter how hard they try, they will likely not achieve the same success as someone with that talent. That's life.

I have found though that most people that have a desire to play, also have enough talent to be able to play and enjoy the instrument.


It sounds to me like your confusing natural ability with a desire to become good. I seriously doubt you've ever had a student who has truly devoted themselves to becoming better, practiced constantly (real practice) for years, and got no where. It's just not possible. Some people may have to work harder, but they can still become just as good. And not to be rude, but a teacher with a predetermined idea that some students just cant do it, probably shouldn't be teaching. Anyway, this debate could go on for a while but it will end with an agree to disagree, so feel free to leave a counter post and we can let this rest.
Quote by acjshapiro

Quote by Vrstone87

meh, I've listened to every radiohead album and honestly don't get what everyone loves about them.....


cause you're ****ing stupid

#20
defining natural talent in all its degrees can be a just cause to involve lawyers...and then where do you place a 7yr old prodigy that can play the classics without fault and have all the composers intentions intact...is that "super talent"...the definition is elusive to most..

for most of us....its hard work..study and daily practice...if you don't practice for a few days you can feel/hear the difference...its the desire to grow and be patient in the process..

i have not one drop of talent...could sure use some though...but i know i do not posses it..i don't consider it a "gift" no more than having blue eyes is a gift...

we may have all met students that never have to study and ace a test and they seem to go through live like that..and some that study every day and barely get B- grades...

i have met players that have talent...they are scary...and when you meet them and play with them you "know" they have talent...

to some talent is a user defined ability...you don't need anyone to tell you..its crystal clear in your being...

play well

wolf
#21
Quote by 3holepunch
It sounds to me like your confusing natural ability with a desire to become good.


It sounds to me like you didn't comprehend my post. I'm not at all confused about the difference.

Quote by 3holepunch

I seriously doubt you've ever had a student who has truly devoted themselves to becoming better, practiced constantly (real practice) for years, and got no where.


You may doubt it, but I've witnessed it, and I'm not a lier as your statement accuses.
Quote by 3holepunch

It's just not possible.


I'm sorry but it is actually.

Quote by 3holepunch

Some people may have to work harder, but they can still become just as good.


Again, this just isn't true in all cases.

Quote by 3holepunch

And not to be rude, but a teacher with a predetermined idea that some students just cant do it, probably shouldn't be teaching.


Wow, that is pretty rude as well as incorrect, but not unexpected. Ya know the best way to "not be rude" is to do just that.

btw, I'm not the one with a predetermined idea.... I developed my opinion based on experience.

Understanding that people have varying levels of natural ability is a positive thing for a teacher to have. It allows them to better assess a students individual needs.



Quote by 3holepunch

Anyway, this debate could go on for a while but it will end with an agree to disagree, so feel free to leave a counter post and we can let this rest.


Of-course it could, this is UG afterall. You really want to do that though?


I mean if you really want to debate a specific point, and can state it without the accusations/insults, Id be willing to reply to that. Otherwise, I think my point was clear enough. If not...

Talent exists. It varies from person to person. It's a factor (not the only factor) in ones abilities to learn and perform music on an instrument.

Those are my only points.
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Oct 24, 2009,
#22
Quote by GuitarMunky

Anyway, the point is.......We do not all posses the same level of talent.


this i can definately agree with...

im looking AT YOU PAUL GILBERT!!!!
#23
Quote by GuitarMunky
Talent exists. It varies from person to person. It's a factor (not the only factor) in ones abilities to learn and perform music on an instrument.


I hate for this to sound so much like a personal attack because it is written in the most civil manner possible, but this is your only valid point. I highly doubt that your observations as a teacher support your views, because anyone that has a desire to learn anything can do it with some work and proper discipline. Beyond that, any argument that could state exactly what is wrong in your reasoning and why would be much too long to be worth writing.
Quote by CrunchyRoll
So you would censor child porn.

This thread is so fukking fail.
#24
Well, I'm kind of like z4...years and years of sucking, despite lots of hard work, eventually resulting in becoming decent. But a lot of that was being self taught...I think back to some of the things that were holding me back in the suck years, and think to myself "if I could travel back in time, I could teach me how to fix that in no time...". Yeah, a teacher would have been good.

Natural talent...I'm kind of divided on it. I believe it exists in music. You see it a lot in other subjects, and it is not such a hotly debated subject...for example, some people just "get" math. Not that they don't have to study, but it comes fairly naturally to them.
In music, I think a lot of what natural talent is, is having an ear, and being able to make mental hooks, visuals, feelings, etc, for what things sound like. If you have that, you will be able to learn something faster, and appear to have more natural talent.
The biggest factor is hard work though, so that's what I worry about. Naturally talent doesn't mean squat if you don't work on the craft side and learn how to express it.

Back to the OP's question. Hearing something and playing it right off the bat? Listen to tons of music. Learn to play tons of music. Transcribe a ton of music. Do tons of ear training. Improvise a lot. Work on your technique. The cool thing is that you don't have to be able to recognize every single note - you learn to be able to recognize common devices and lick fragments, and if you know what key it is in, then oftentimes you can find them right off the bat.
#25
Quote by Erick vonZipper
I highly doubt that your observations as a teacher support your views, because anyone that has a desire to learn anything can do it with some work and proper discipline. .


You're suppositions about my honesty are simply wrong, as well as offensive.

Sorry if what I've experienced makes you insecure in any way. It shouldn't.

Some people are smarter than others, some people are bigger than others. Some people are more rude than others. That's how it is. This fact doesn't minimize the relevance of practice & dedication and shouldn't be viewed as discouraging...... it is what it is.
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Oct 25, 2009,
#26
Quote by GuitarMunky
You're suppositions about my honesty are simply wrong, Sorry if what I've experienced makes you insecure in any way. It shouldn't.

Some people are smarter than others, some people are bigger than others. Some people are more rude than others. That's how it is. This fact doesn't minimize the relevance of practice & dedication ...... it is what it is.


I have no insecurities about my playing. What prompted me to disagree is the fact that I've known several teachers from when I was beginning to play, one who was certainly no one new to the scene, say the exact opposite. In fact, "anyone that has a desire to learn anything can do it with some work and proper discipline", from my last post, is a direct quote from him.
Quote by CrunchyRoll
So you would censor child porn.

This thread is so fukking fail.
#27
Quote by GuitarMunky
You're suppositions about my honesty are simply wrong, Sorry if what I've experienced makes you insecure in any way. It shouldn't.

Some people are smarter than others, some people are bigger than others. Some people are more rude than others. That's how it is. This fact doesn't minimize the relevance of practice & dedication ...... it is what it is.


You get really defensive when people disagree with you. And no one feels insecure about the bull shit you keep going off on.

And your examples are all completely retarded.

Some people are smarter than other is both relative (in the same way a musician being 'better' is relative), subjective to different contexts, and often the difference is how much time someone has spent trying to learn more on a subject, not how much they're born with.

Just because someone is bigger than someone doesn't mean they're better. Even in basketball if someones shorter but works hard, works out, and devotes themselves to becoming better they can be just as good, or better than the big guy.

And no one was being rude or directing insults at you, jesus h christ. The whole point behind saying no offense, and not to be rude, is to inform you that what's coming next is not meant as an insult but an opinion that can't be said in any other way so stop being so defensive. Oh and if you'll notice this post doesn't include any such warnings
Quote by acjshapiro

Quote by Vrstone87

meh, I've listened to every radiohead album and honestly don't get what everyone loves about them.....


cause you're ****ing stupid

Last edited by 3holepunch at Oct 25, 2009,
#28
Quote by 3holepunch
You get really defensive when people disagree with you. And no one feels insecure about the bull shit you keep going off on.

And your examples are all completely retarded.

Some people are smarter than other is both relative (in the same way a musician being 'better' is relative), subjective to different contexts, and often the difference is how much time someone has spent trying to learn more on a subject, not how much they're born with.

Just because someone is bigger than someone doesn't mean they're better. Even in basketball if someones shorter but works hard, works out, and devotes themselves to becoming better they can be just as good, or better than the big guy.

And no one was being rude or directing insults at you, jesus h christ. The whole point behind saying no offense, and not to be rude, is to inform you that what's coming next is not meant as an insult but an opinion that can't be said in any other way so stop being so defensive. Oh and if you'll notice this post doesn't include any such warnings


When people accuse you of lying, what reaction would you have?

You say "no one was being rude", but you just called my statements "retarded".


Like I said, if you can make a point..... a simple, clearly stated point without all the person bullshit..... then maybe we can converse. That's the best way to not have a pointless, endless debate just for the sake of doing it.


here I'll help you out.

Your point:

If 1 person can do it, every single other living human being can do it just as well. All people are equally intelligent, equally athletically gifted.....ect.


correct that point if you feel otherwise.


Quote by Erick vonZipper
I hate for this to sound so much like a personal attack.


If you're a man of your words, you wouldn't have to say things like that, because you wouldn't be making personal attacks..... like you did.
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Oct 25, 2009,
#29
Quote by GuitarMunky
When people accuse you of lying, what reaction would you have?

You say "no one was being rude", but you just called my statements "retarded".

Like I said, if you can make a point..... a simple, clearly stated point without all the person bullshit..... then maybe we can converse. That's the best way to not have a pointless, endless debate just for the sake of doing it.

here I'll help you out.

Your point:

If 1 person can do it, every single other living human being can do it just as well. All people are equally intelligent, equally athletically gifted.....ect.


correct that point if you feel otherwise.

If you're a man of your words, you wouldn't have to say things like that, because you wouldn't be making personal attacks..... like you did.


lmao, it's like you didn't understand anything at all in my last post. For instance, you notice how at the end of my post I said how in that specific post I said nothing about not being rude in that post? "Oh and if you'll notice this post doesn't include any such warnings."

And you're not even talking about the same thing anymore. We were talking about the ability to become something with hard work and dedication (specifically guitar). You're comparing everyone with each other based on exactly how they are right now. What I'm saying is that if someone truly applies themselves to a certain thing they can become great at it. Yes, anyone can become an amazing musician if they truly devote themselves to it. What you're saying is it doesn't matter how much someone practices or applies themselves they have a predetermined level of skill they'll never overcome. "Oh looks like we've reached barre chords johnny, this is where you're just no longer capable. Have fun with your life, we're done here."

None of your posts have any validity, especially when the way you act after each post that doesn't agree with you, is that of a 12 year old boy that cries when he doesn't get his way (oh look this is an actual insult, remember what it looks like please).

Oh and you saying that Erick's post is a personal attack because he disagrees with you is just lawl. Grow up. And please god tell me you're forty something, that would make my day.
Quote by acjshapiro

Quote by Vrstone87

meh, I've listened to every radiohead album and honestly don't get what everyone loves about them.....


cause you're ****ing stupid

#30
Quote by GuitarMunky
When people accuse you of lying, what reaction would you have?

If you're a man of your words, you wouldn't have to say things like that, because you wouldn't be making personal attacks..... like you did.


No one said you were lying, we're merely suggesting that you're misinterpreting what you've seen as a teacher.

...And you interpreting my post as a personal attack only helps everyone else's case of "you're not seeing things correctly."
Quote by CrunchyRoll
So you would censor child porn.

This thread is so fukking fail.
#31
Quote by 3holepunch
lmao, it's like you didn't understand anything at all in my last post. For instance, you notice how at the end of my post I said how in that specific post I said nothing about not being rude in that post? "Oh and if you'll notice this post doesn't include any such warnings."

And you're not even talking about the same thing anymore. We were talking about the ability to become something with hard work and dedication (specifically guitar). You're comparing everyone with each other based on exactly how they are right now. What I'm saying is that if someone truly applies themselves to a certain thing they can become great at it. Yes, anyone can become an amazing musician if they truly devote themselves to it. What you're saying is it doesn't matter how much someone practices or applies themselves they have a predetermined level of skill they'll never overcome. "Oh looks like we've reached barre chords johnny, this is where you're just no longer capable. Have fun with your life, we're done here."

None of your posts have any validity, especially when the way you act after each post that doesn't agree with you, is that of a 12 year old boy that cries when he doesn't get his way (oh look this is an actual insult, remember what it looks like please).

Oh and you saying that Erick's post is a personal attack because he disagrees with you is just lawl. Grow up. And please god tell me you're forty something, that would make my day.



Wow, you just can't do it can you? It's really not that hard. You just state your point clearly without all the personal bullshit.


Quote by 3holepunch
What you're saying is it doesn't matter how much someone practices or applies themselves they have a predetermined level of skill they'll never overcome. "Oh looks like we've reached barre chords johnny, this is where you're just no longer capable. Have fun with your life, we're done here.".


No, thats not at all what I'm saying. You've misrepresented my point as well as my attitude.




Quote by Erick vonZipper
No one said you were lying, we're merely suggesting that you're misinterpreting what you've seen as a teacher.


based on what experience? how long have you taught lessons for?

btw, suggesting that someone misinterprets what they've seen over and over again, is suggesting that they are stupid, which interestingly directly conflicts with your point, and is also a personal attack.
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Oct 25, 2009,
#32
I agree with Munky. As a teacher, you can spot natural talent, you can also spot the ones who will work for it and you will definitely spot the ones who will, invariably, waste your time along with theirs. Not every person can play music and hitting the play button on a cd player does not count at all.

That adage of "If I can do it, you can do it" is not one to hold your head up high with. Thats like saying "All 'tards, follow me in a straight line"... its not gonna work. I had a student that understood all I gave him, agreed wholeheartedly with all i said... had a real "passion" for music... well, put the metronome on and he flunked by playing kruuuaaaangggg....click. Ask him to tap his foot and follow the strokes with his feet... up down up etc... well, quite a tard in the end. The school I was teaching for at the time wouldn't let me kick him out or send him to another teacher... video evidence was called for. Use the phone, take a clip... showed them... they burst out laughing and still refused as it was "income" for the school.

Not everyone has equal talent... no matter how hard they try. I have one more testicle than Lance Armstrong... doesn't mean I'll be the next cycling god. A "desire to become good" is just that, a desire. It won't move into fruition if its not matched with skill, patience and action... even that is a long shot. You either have it or you don't. You could go the Vai route of 9 hours a day... or you could go the Segovia route of 18 hours a day (only managing 15 hours a day in his eighties)... it still does not mean you have what it takes. Sure, if you play 18 hours a day only to sound like a cat in a tumble dryer... then you have surely mastered the art of wasting your time. You get some scary players out there... some will rip your face off with an earth shattering groove... while others will scare the life outta you because they think they're good... people weren't brave enough to tell them they smell funny when they play.

You get talent... and you don't. Idols across the world is proof of that. People have vocal lessons for years, only to be shot down cos quite frankly, they suck. Then a pleb gets up, rips with some amazing angelic sounding vocals... no training, only a shower singer.

Some hae it. Some don't. Regardless of the hours put in, if you are bad... then you are bad. Some brutal honesty is needed within yourself to admit it... or someone who is straightforward will let you know, and not too gently. We are not all equal... that was the underlying theme of munky's post... I think you missed it.

To the TS... The best skill is to listen. Inside. After playing for a while, I can't put it in years cos thats not right, you will be able to summon up exactly what you wanted. Practice, enjoy, play with your heart and wrinkled mushroom in hand in the meantime. One day it just happens. Thats all I can say for now.
#33
Well seeing as when people state a point that disagrees with you, you take offense for no reason, I might as well start inserting something offensive if I'm going to be accused of it anyway.

And evolucian... "I have one more testicle than Lance Armstrong... doesn't mean I'll be the next cycling god." Ah... in what possible way does that have anything to do with what we've been discussing?

And so what if a kid can't keep time. Maybe it will take him a few years to finally get it, but I guarantee that if he works at it for 3 hours everyday for a year or two he will. You're post is just as empty as Munky's have been. And Munky assumes that for some reason his personal experience is the law of the land and anyone disagreeing with him just has to be a complete asshole.

Even if it takes someone years longer to learn something, they can still do it unless they have a an actual physical handicap that makes it completely impossible, so yeah I'll agree with you guys, the people with no hands, feet, or brains (literally) just aren't cut out for playing guitar.

Quote by evolucian

To the TS... The best skill is to listen. Inside. After playing for a while, I can't put it in years cos thats not right, you will be able to summon up exactly what you wanted. Practice, enjoy, play with your heart and wrinkled mushroom in hand in the meantime. One day it just happens. Thats all I can say for now.


But remember TS, according to the same guys who wrote this (as well as munky) you just may not have the ability to develop your ear. And even after playing for a while, you'll never be able to summon up exactly what you want, because it doesn't matter how much time and effort people put into things, sometimes it's just impossible. In fact if you're following their advice you should probably quit if you don't get it after a while, because you're just wasting your time.
Quote by acjshapiro

Quote by Vrstone87

meh, I've listened to every radiohead album and honestly don't get what everyone loves about them.....


cause you're ****ing stupid

Last edited by 3holepunch at Oct 25, 2009,
#34
Quote by GuitarMunky
based on what experience? how long have you taught lessons for?


Did you miss my last post? You don't have to have your own experiences if you can draw from someone else's pool of knowledge. Interestingly, the 4 teachers I've talked to about this have suggested that you are wrong.

btw, suggesting that someone misinterprets what they've seen over and over again, is suggesting that they are stupid, which interestingly directly conflicts with your point, and is also a personal attack.


What is this? You are disagreeing with me? I feel highly insulted and regard this as a personal attack.
Quote by CrunchyRoll
So you would censor child porn.

This thread is so fukking fail.
#35
Lol... you guys definitely can't read

Quote by 3holepunch
And evolucian... "I have one more testicle than Lance Armstrong... doesn't mean I'll be the next cycling god." Ah... in what possible way does that have anything to do with what we've been discussing?


perhaps this:
Quote by 3holepunch
but I guarantee that if he works at it for 3 hours everyday for a year or two he will.


So you reckon if I practice for 3hours a day, every day, for a year or two... I may just win the tour de france?
Last edited by evolucian at Oct 25, 2009,
#36
Quote by Erick vonZipper
Did you miss my last post? You don't have to have your own experiences if you can draw from someone else's pool of knowledge.


so your arguing about something that you have no experience of your own in.

That's what I thought.


Quote by Erick vonZipper

What is this? You are disagreeing with me? I feel highly insulted and regard this as a personal attack.


I'm sorry you feel that way. I did take care though, to talk to you respectfully, and haven't said anything about you personally. so there really is no need for you to feel insulted.


Quote by 3holepunch
And Munky assumes that for some reason his personal experience is the law of the land and anyone disagreeing with him just has to be a complete asshole.


Law of the land? LOL
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Oct 25, 2009,
#37
Quote by evolucian
Lol... you guys definitely can't read


perhaps this:

So you reckon if I practice for 3hours a day, every day, for a year or two... I may just win the tour de france?


Maybe that, maybe more. If you train as hard as you can and devote yourself to it you could.

And PLEASE tell me what it was I couldn't read. I'd love to know.

See if you're saying that is its IMPOSSIBLE for some people to become better, and it will NEVER happen, you're with munky. If you think that with work (whether it's 2 months or three years) someone can improve, than you're with me and pretty much everyone else in this thread. See if you actually read what we've written, I've said natural talent exists (it's when people grasp things easier, improve faster) but to say someone just can not become better is completely absurd.

And remember music is relative, comparing the speed of a bike race is not at all applicable to comparing peoples' abilities as musicians.

And munky please fill us in how accomplished you are. And teaching for a certain number of years does NOT mean you have any more to say about the subject than anyone else in this forum. There's no way to determine if you're a good teacher or not, though based on your posting here I bet not (OMG ANOTHER PERSONAL JAB, I JUST CANT POST WITHOUT THEM!!!).
Quote by acjshapiro

Quote by Vrstone87

meh, I've listened to every radiohead album and honestly don't get what everyone loves about them.....


cause you're ****ing stupid

#38
Quote by 3holepunch


And munky please fill us in how accomplished you are.


What would be the point in that? You'll just find a way to trivialize it.


and why do you keep making things personal?


Quote by 3holepunch


And teaching for a certain number of years does NOT mean you have any more to say about the subject than anyone else in this forum.


Yes, you've proven that to be true.


Quote by 3holepunch
(OMG ANOTHER PERSONAL JAB, I JUST CANT POST WITHOUT THEM!!!).


Well, when you got nothing, a personal jab always makes ya feel good.
shred is gaudy music
#39
What would be the point in that?? Well why don't you tell us why you asked Erik about his credentials?

So far out of the two of us I'm the only one with something.
Quote by acjshapiro

Quote by Vrstone87

meh, I've listened to every radiohead album and honestly don't get what everyone loves about them.....


cause you're ****ing stupid

Last edited by 3holepunch at Oct 25, 2009,
#40
ok... if you spend three years playing and can eventually do a hammer on and meet two beats of a metronome that goes to four... you will have definitely improved. By how much though? 3 years on an A chord and one hammer on.... that would be the message for you to give up. By the time you are 80.... you may have just learned a verse riff. Do you then break open the champagne and celebrate that feat?

Talent is talent. Ability is ability. If I practice for "3" hours a day, every day on a bicycle... you reckon I'll do more than win the tour de france? So you are not taking into account the balance factor? I fall off bikes very easily... others will hurt themselves on guitar. Others will fail miserably on guitar.

Quote by 3holepunch
"because it doesn't matter how much time and effort people put into things, sometimes it's just impossible"

That word "sometimes" is adequate as is the "impossible" one. For some it will be, for others it won't. To discourage someone is not the aim... I never said the TS will never get it. I never said you will never get it. For the reason that I have never met you, dont know your temperament. The students that I have met... that is who I will give the option to. Some have it, some don't.

Chess is a talent too. You have naturals and you have failures... I'll be in the latter. I'll never pretend I can beat Bobby Fischer or Kasparov or Karpov. Like cycling and chess, music has a mental aspect too. Some have it, some really don't. In the forums I don't disregard anyone's ability in playing the instrument, for to be "here" in the first place definitely shows some form of dedication to an instrument and a gathering of "musicians".

But if an individual whom I've met, does not have the ability to remember a note or a chord shape, for 3 or more months... then what is your suggestion? Would you continue teaching them by saying they are "late bloomers... you WILL be able to do it cos I was able to do it" or will you recommend they give up? If you teach, then you will know what to say... if you don't teach, then you will think the teacher is mean and cannot teach and say whatever bad things you can to make em feel worse.

It is impossible for some and they will NEVER get it. But pay attention to the word "some"... it definitely does not mean ALL. And I do recall munky saying they fall in the minority... not the majority. Minority means a few, so out of 100 there may just be 4 to 15 who don't get it. There also may only be 2. Compared to the majority, it really is a minority.
Last edited by evolucian at Oct 25, 2009,
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