#1
if it is, then what's the reason? and sometimes i pick by moving my wrist and my thumb and index finger? are all these wrong?


thanks in advance.
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#2
You can pick with just the movement in your thumb and finger or with the movement in your wrist or with the movement from your arm. None are "wrong", all of them have their advantages and disadvantages. Try all three and see what works for you. As you progress you will find favourites for different situations.
#4
Quote by Frankie_Stone
You can pick with just the movement in your thumb and finger or with the movement in your wrist or with the movement from your arm. None are "wrong", all of them have their advantages and disadvantages. Try all three and see what works for you. As you progress you will find favourites for different situations.

You can apply this to almost any subject in music. Well said without all the snotty remarks.
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#5
Quote by Frankie_Stone
You can pick with just the movement in your thumb and finger or with the movement in your wrist or with the movement from your arm. None are "wrong", all of them have their advantages and disadvantages. Try all three and see what works for you. As you progress you will find favourites for different situations.

I would be inclined to disagree with you there, with regards to it being okay to pick from your arm (I'm assuming you mean the elbow there). Doing that can cause a lot of tension which can lead to injury and inaccurate playing, even if it's relaxed it's not an efficient way to pick.
Wrist or fingers are okay though.
Speed is a by-product of shut the fuck up.
#7
Quote by tenfold
No, it's called circle picking and it's actually a lot better but it's probably the hardest one to master.

Circle picking, whilst good isn't better. Think about it, if you're moving the pick in a circular fashion you're wasting motion moving the pick horizontally along the string; a pure down, up motion is more economical.
Plus you can still pick using the thumb and finger without doing circle picking.
Speed is a by-product of shut the fuck up.
#8
It's alright, if it's well-executed. I tend to do that a lot, unless I need to cram more notes into one space, in which case I pick using either a combination of my fingers and wrist, or just my wrist.
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#9
Quote by Aleksi
Circle picking, whilst good isn't better. Think about it, if you're moving the pick in a circular fashion you're wasting motion moving the pick horizontally along the string; a pure down, up motion is more economical.
Plus you can still pick using the thumb and finger without doing circle picking.

When I referred to circle picking, I don't necessarily mean a circle. If you think about it, it's more like oval picking, but I was just referring to the name of the technique you use to pick with only the thumb and index not really the direction. Think of how annoying it would be to tell someone you "pick with only your thumb and your index finger vertically straight" instead of just saying "circle picking."
It feels more relaxed when you pick in a circle from the thumb and index rather than straight back and forth anyways.
#10
Quote by tenfold
When I referred to circle picking, I don't necessarily mean a circle. If you think about it, it's more like oval picking, but I was just referring to the name of the technique you use to pick with only the thumb and index not really the direction. Think of how annoying it would be to tell someone you "pick with only your thumb and your index finger vertically straight" instead of just saying "circle picking."
It feels more relaxed when you pick in a circle from the thumb and index rather than straight back and forth anyways.

If you're going to say circle picking you should actually be referring to the technique which as the name suggests involves moving your pick in a circular fashion. There's a big difference between circle picking and just alternate picking with the motion coming from your thumb and index finger.
Personally, I would be more annoyed at the person that told me to circle pick and ended up complaining because my pick was moving in a circular pattern rather than straight down, up, down, up.
I find it equally easy to do both circle picking and alternate picking with my finger and thumb, though I can see that the latter uses less movement. However, I do usually pick from my wrist.
Speed is a by-product of shut the fuck up.
#11
Basically, the muscles for your finger and thumb are weaker than those for your wrist and have a smaller range of motion - plus they're already taken up with holding the pick. While it's not wrong to move from finger and thumb occasionally, it's never going to be as fast or as loud as picking from the wrist. I've only ever seen 1 guy actually circle pick well at all, compared to hundreds of people moving from the wrist.
#12
I pick from a combination of wrist motion and finger motion. basically, smaller motions = faster.
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#13
Usually people who pick with the up-down motion from their index and thumb wiggle their wrist around too. I don't think I've ever seen someone pick with only their index finger and thumb.
#14
Quote by woodenbandman
basically, smaller motions = faster.

Not if you're tense, that can actually make smaller motions slower.

Quote by Aleksi
If you're going to say circle picking you should actually be referring to the technique which as the name suggests involves moving your pick in a circular fashion.

Playing with only the thumb and fingers always slightly involves moving in a circle. No one plays exactly 0 degrees straight up and down all the time with that kind of picking. If they move a little right, they would have to make some sort of slight circle to move back left.
Last edited by tenfold at Nov 6, 2009,
#15
Quote by izzizz
is it wrong to move the pick with the thumb and index finger?
I really don't care if it's right or wrong.
That's the primary method I use and it serves me well.
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#16
Quote by SomeoneYouKnew
I really don't care if it's right or wrong.
That's the primary method I use and it serves me well.

Sounds good to me lol. If you can do it relaxed and without pain, I say do it.
#17
Quote by tenfold
Not if you're tense, that can actually make smaller motions slower.


Playing with only the thumb and fingers always slightly involves moving in a circle. No one plays exactly 0 degrees straight up and down all the time with that kind of picking. If they move a little right, they would have to make some sort of slight circle to move back left.

If I force myself to play with movement of only fingers and thumb, I notice that the line that my pick follows looks somewhat like this: \ with the string running through the middle of that line of motion. My pick will travel along this line back and forth consistently. There is a big difference between \ as a line of motion and O as a circular motion. The circle is less motion-efficient.
Speed is a by-product of shut the fuck up.
#18
Iv heard a lot of people say that the one constant in a professionals technique while playing FAST is to never move your thumb and index finger, and let the movement come from either the wrist or a combination of the wrist and elbow.
#19
I used to pick with just my fingers but after switching to my wrist it became a lot faster and cleaner. Tremolo picking comes more naturally too. Twitching one wrist muscle is easier than twitching two digit muscles afaics.
#20
When I pick, I use my wrist for picking single notes or just a group inbetween legato runs with the left hand, but when I'm picking a lot of the notes I tend to use more of my elbow. It's entirely by accident and I have no idea where I picked it up. It's very comfortable for me and I can easily hit 10 NPS without warming up, give me a half hour and i can do 12-15 NPS.

My elbow nor wrist on my picking hand has never given out on me, my left hand finger joints are the only ones that ever really end up feeling like they got a workout.

Other people do entirely different things and can play at the same speeds (or faster.) I think Eric Johnson plays with the picking motions you're describing, and if you've ever heard him go off with Shawn Lane you can tell how great that works for him. Do whatever is comfortable, if someone is telling you something is 'wrong,' thats only if it's obviously strenuous on you, or your motions are too big or uncontrolled to be efficient.
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#21
Quote by Aleksi
If I force myself to play with movement of only fingers and thumb, I notice that the line that my pick follows looks somewhat like this: \ with the string running through the middle of that line of motion. My pick will travel along this line back and forth consistently. There is a big difference between \ as a line of motion and O as a circular motion. The circle is less motion-efficient.

Well it's no point arguing because neither are faster than wrist motion.
#22
Takayoshi Ohmura pick that way using thumb anf index finger movement and he can shred effortless. Just watch some videos of him on Youtube.

I use a combination of wrist and index/thumb movement and in my experience is better than using just wrist motion, because with the former the pícking motions are smaller and therefore less tension. It takes some time to grab a natural feel, but it worths it.
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#24
Quote by leephan
Buckethead does it as well.


That's quite contrary to my observation of Brian whenever he has played. I'm curious if you could perhaps provide a video or two in order to back your claim, for I've only seen him apply the gilbert style (if you wish to attribute it to him) primarily translative wrist picking.
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#25
go on to youtube and search for guthrie govan alternate picking lesson, then you will have some expert adivce
#26
It would be more wrong not to use it at all, and just lock your fingers in a fixed position. You should be changing the angle of your pick all the time with your fingers so it means your fingers end up doing a lot of work if you solely use your fingers for your picking motion.
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#29
For the first video, whatever thumb movement there is is clearly not the driving force behind his picking, even if I were to be totally convinced he's actively moving and not just deforming a loose thumb under the pickstrokes or changing his pick angle.

Regarding the second, that's the same optical illusion that MAB creates - theres very little finger and thumb motion there, if you watch my picking mechanics vid you can see it demonstrated here - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VkeyHyIgqvY at around 7:40.
#30
Well I didn't say that it was the main driving force behind his picking technique. Just sayin' that BH moves his wrist, index finger and thumb when he picks.

In regard to the illusion, BH's technique in the second vid is different from your demonstration, in which the finger and thumb appear to move like this:

But in the second video he is clearly bending his thumb at the first knuckle, and I don't see how one could do that without moving the finger as well.
#31
Sure, but the motion is smaller and less forceful than it appears at first. Nearly everyone's thumb moves a little to adjust angle or because it's simply deforming - but to say that someone like Buckethead is picking from that motion is a little misleading.
#32
Well, making a statement regarding Brian's picking in a topic about using the fingers as the primary source of motion for said picking does tend to imply that you are stating that this principle of motion is being applied by Brian as well. Not to be crude, but I would suggest that you consider your posts in context of the topic just as to avoid arguments, or heaven forbids flame wars.
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