#1
I was thinking of selling my Line 6 Spider Valve 212 and buying a different amp. I'm tired of getting **** on for owning it and even though it's a jack of all trades, I don't think it does many of them excellently, decently yes, but anything more than that is giving it too much credit. The only thing is I LOVE having pretty much any amp style to go, whether it's clean, blues, rock, metal, etc. And it's really convenient having those effects and presets built in. It's good to have a foundation to then tweak with. I SUCK at working with equalizer settings, so it's pretty difficult for me to find the right tone. And if I had a new amp, I would have to buy tons of pedals to get so and so effect, when instead I have it built into the amp.

However, I rarely play any gigs anymore since I'm in college, and even then I have never used the 40 tube watts to it's full potential. Just turning it a few millimeters and my floormates at college get pissed. At 50-100 ppl gigs, I turn it up a quarter way up and I'm already loud enough. It's too big and bulky and I don't think I'll ever use it all the way since I would be mic'ed up at any show anyway.

As you can see I'm split about this 50/50.

If it helps, I like to play metal, whether it's 80s stuff like Metallica, metalcore, and prog/shred metal like Dream Theater. I also dabble in classic rock and contemporary rock. Would a used Mesa Boogie fulfill those criteria? I don't know too much about them and after playing with them in Guitar Center, all the extra switches and knobs compared to my amp really confuse me. Or maybe I should look into a Peavey 5150?

The point is my amp is WAYYY too powerful so it's pointless. I'd rather have a 30 watt tube or even a 15 watt tube amp. I just don't know if I would be ready for the change given all the points previously stated.

(By the way, if I sell my amp and shortboard pedal, I can probably get $500-600 and I would be willing to add in about $300. So let's say I have about $1000 to spend on an amp, used preferably, what would be the best bang for my buck? Preferably without spending it all. Something small, combo, compact and a quality product.)
#2
Quote by gack513
I was thinking of selling my Line 6 Spider Valve 212 and buying a different amp. I'm tired of getting **** on for owning it and even though it's a jack of all trades, I don't think it does many of them excellently, decently yes, but anything more than that is giving it too much credit. The only thing is I LOVE having pretty much any amp style to go, whether it's clean, blues, rock, metal, etc. And it's really convenient having those effects and presets built in. It's good to have a foundation to then tweak with. I SUCK at working with equalizer settings, so it's pretty difficult for me to find the right tone. And if I had a new amp, I would have to buy tons of pedals to get so and so effect, when instead I have it built into the amp.

However, I rarely play any gigs anymore since I'm in college, and even then I have never used the 40 tube watts to it's full potential. Just turning it a few millimeters and my floormates at college get pissed. At 50-100 ppl gigs, I turn it up a quarter way up and I'm already loud enough. It's too big and bulky and I don't think I'll ever use it all the way since I would be mic'ed up at any show anyway.

As you can see I'm split about this 50/50.

If it helps, I like to play metal, whether it's 80s stuff like Metallica, metalcore, and prog/shred metal like Dream Theater. I also dabble in classic rock and contemporary rock. Would a used Mesa Boogie fulfill those criteria? I don't know too much about them and after playing with them in Guitar Center, all the extra switches and knobs compared to my amp really confuse me. Or maybe I should look into a Peavey 5150?

The point is my amp is WAYYY too powerful so it's pointless. I'd rather have a 30 watt tube or even a 15 watt tube amp. I just don't know if I would be ready for the change given all the points previously stated.

(By the way, if I sell my amp and shortboard pedal, I can probably get $500-600 and I would be willing to add in about $300. So let's say I have about $1000 to spend on an amp, used preferably, what would be the best bang for my buck? Preferably without spending it all. Something small, combo, compact and a quality product.)



If you like it keep it. if the only reason you are getting rid of it is because ppl are busting you b**ls that's kinda dumb. You want something smaller and not as loud but your looking at mesa's and 5150??? .... just get a decent practice amp and save yourself a lot of time and money.
Gear:
Ibanez RG1527M Prestige
Martin DX1
Agile-2000
#3
See why I'm asking for advice? Because I don't know enough about amps. Those are just recommendations I keep hearing about.

I was however thinking of getting a Mesa Boogie Express 5:25, it seems like the perfect size and it can do a wide range of tones. The only problem is the price: $1100 is the cheapest I found it new. I don't know about Ebay because I haven't checked.

It's not only because of the criticisms, in fact, that's just a minor annoyance. The main thing is the size/weight and unnecessary power. I wanna downgrade but have an amp capable of doing potential gigs in the future. Are there any Line 6 tube amps that are less powerful than the Spider Valve 212? I know there's the 112, but is that much quieter with one less speaker? There are smaller Line 6 amps but they're purely digital and I'm not crazy about those.
#4
Would you not just keep the Line 6 and buy a small 5 watt combo? Be it SS or valve.

The way you describe your practise space, getting a practise amp sounds like the only option. No point in getting rid of an amp that you actually like.
Last edited by False_God at Nov 13, 2009,
#5
Quote by False_God
Would you not just keep the Line 6 and buy a small 5 watt combo? Be it SS or valve.


What would be the point of holding onto the Line 6 then? I want a versatile amp that I can use for practicing and for gigs if need be.
#6
Quote by gack513
What would be the point of holding onto the Line 6 then? I want a versatile amp that I can use for practicing and for gigs if need be.

You answered your own question. Hold onto the line 6 for the gigs/band practise.


Get a small practise amp for the bedroom or wherever you practise.
Last edited by False_God at Nov 13, 2009,
#7
Quote by gack513
See why I'm asking for advice? Because I don't know enough about amps. Those are just recommendations I keep hearing about.

I was however thinking of getting a Mesa Boogie Express 5:25, it seems like the perfect size and it can do a wide range of tones. The only problem is the price: $1100 is the cheapest I found it new. I don't know about Ebay because I haven't checked.

It's not only because of the criticisms, in fact, that's just a minor annoyance. The main thing is the size/weight and unnecessary power. I wanna downgrade but have an amp capable of doing potential gigs in the future. Are there any Line 6 tube amps that are less powerful than the Spider Valve 212? I know there's the 112, but is that much quieter with one less speaker? There are smaller Line 6 amps but they're purely digital and I'm not crazy about those.



i would keep your amp if your planning gigging again... you said your not familiar with tweaking amps, the Express 5:25 you would have to tweak a lot to get the sound you want,But that's the thing about mesa's; you have to constantly tweak but you can get a better and better sound if you do. Get a small practice amp if your playing in a dorm room or bed room whatever... your not playing a show in your room who are you trying to impress? Im not trying to sound like a dick, its your money...but i cant justify this move
Gear:
Ibanez RG1527M Prestige
Martin DX1
Agile-2000
#8
Why not get a little tube combo and a Pocket Pod for practice?
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#9
If you plan on gigging in the future and you find the Spider Valve usable, hang onto it. For dorm room purposes, since your tastes are mostly in the rock/metal range, I suggest looking into the Roland Cube series. You'll have a good amount of effects and whatnot that you can play with, in a smaller package, and it won't break the bank even if you keep your current amp.
Ibanez RGA121 | ESP LTD H-1000
Axe-FX Standard
#10
dude 30W tube would probably be louder than the spider. tubes are usually a lot louder in Watts than the SS.

but anyway, saw you mentioned MB express, that should be a good choice. its a great amp.
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#11
Quote by drying out
dude 30W tube would probably be louder than the spider. tubes are usually a lot louder in Watts than the SS.

but anyway, saw you mentioned MB express, that should be a good choice. its a great amp.



although the mesa express is a good amp.Why would you recommend a $1000 amp for practice?

30w tube is louder then a 30w SS? i don't think so,there is no difference in volume
Gear:
Ibanez RG1527M Prestige
Martin DX1
Agile-2000
Last edited by dogtags99 at Nov 13, 2009,
#12
Quote by drying out
dude 30W tube would probably be louder than the spider. tubes are usually a lot louder in Watts than the SS.

but anyway, saw you mentioned MB express, that should be a good choice. its a great amp.


He DOES have the Spider VALVE 212, which is 40 watts of TUBE.

And on the topic of the Mesa Express, it can't really pull off the modern metal/shred IMO. It's voiced pretty dark.
Ibanez RGA121 | ESP LTD H-1000
Axe-FX Standard
#13
Quote by drying out
dude 30W tube would probably be louder than the spider. tubes are usually a lot louder in Watts than the SS.

but anyway, saw you mentioned MB express, that should be a good choice. its a great amp.

Note the 'Spider Valve'?
Can't say I'm a fan of the Express, massively overpriced and not a patch on the old DC/F-series.

Here's the thing: a 30W or 15W tube will be just as loud as a 50W or 100W. A valve amp will never sound its best at low levels, due mostly (I reckon) to the speakers. You've also got a lot of psychoacoustic shit to contend with; remember your Fletcher-Munson curves!
Incidentally, I think the Spider Valve is one of the better-sounding valve amps at low levels, certainly much better than most Boogies (which, watt-for-watt,are some of the loudest amps in the business).


If you want great tone at bedroom levels, use a POD or software like Revalver/Guitar Rig etc. Or buy an iso cab.
#14
I think I'm leaning towards sticking with the Spider Valve 212, but do you think downgrading to a 112 will make much of a difference in volume? (The 212 is 2x12 combo and the 112 is a 1x12 combo).

And how does a POD work? Do I connect it to my computer and it uses the speakers as an amplifier?
#15
Quote by gack513
I think I'm leaning towards sticking with the Spider Valve 212, but do you think downgrading to a 112 will make much of a difference in volume? (The 212 is 2x12 combo and the 112 is a 1x12 combo).

And how does a POD work? Do I connect it to my computer and it uses the speakers as an amplifier?


No difference in terms of tone... just more bottom end and presence
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#16
Quote by drying out
dude 30W tube would probably be louder than the spider. tubes are usually a lot louder in Watts than the SS.

but anyway, saw you mentioned MB express, that should be a good choice. its a great amp.

im pretty sure 40w tube beats 30w tube volume wise:p its the spider valve he's on about
however if you like the amp maybe spend your money on an attenuator?
if you want to change amps what about the krank rev pro jr
only 20 watts and if you get the mini stack you should have enough left over for a multi fx pedal or something
Gear
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Line 6 Flextone III+
Line 6 Spider III 120 (for sale £90)
#17
I bought the new 60w 6505+ 112 for $599, mine comes in Monday. Its made in China but I hope its ok. I guess it's too much power for what you want though.
Last edited by Tempoe at Nov 13, 2009,
#18
Quote by gack513
I think I'm leaning towards sticking with the Spider Valve 212, but do you think downgrading to a 112 will make much of a difference in volume? (The 212 is 2x12 combo and the 112 is a 1x12 combo).
Absolutely zero difference in volume.


Anyway, I suggest you hang on to the Spider Valve (great gigging/jamming amp).
Go and download a demo copy of Revalver III right now.
You'll need some way on plugging your guitar into your computer's line in port, you can pick up one of these little adapters for about $1 from any electronics/hardware store:



You'll also need to download a simple bit of software called ASIO4ALL so you can hear your guitar in realtime - if you have any trouble getting it to work, be sure to ask in the recording forum!
#20
The funny thing about Peavey amps (6505 and 5150, namely) is that they sound surprisingly good at low volumes; you play it at a shop and your pinch harmonics ring out, your mistakes are blurred. But that's at 'cannot talk normally' volumes - not quiet. And the harder you push them, maybe till about 10 o'clock, they sound even better, but after that point they tend to turn harsh and coarse. All that preamp gain doesn't quite mix properly with the poweramp section of the amp being overdriven so hard. A true valve amp, so to speak, sounds better and better the harder the valves are driven.

My point is, if you like preamp gain - used mostly for metalcore, hardcore punk, 80's metal, etc. - then either stick with your Line 6 - which has plenty of preamp gain - or sell it and buy something like that new Peavey 6505+ 60 watt. You lose your effects, but do gain an easier amp to deal with and dial in.

Then you have the low wattage amps like the Blackstar HT-5, which is the only high-gain, low wattage amp I've played.

It depends a lot of your budget, actually?
#21
Quote by dogtags99
although the mesa express is a good amp.Why would you recommend a $1000 amp for practice?

30w tube is louder then a 30w SS? i don't think so,there is no difference in volume

Wrong. The tube will appear louder than the SS because of how the human ear perceives sound. We hear the tubes better since the sound is more organic. SS amp waveforms are generated in a way that the ear doesn't intercept them as well as a tube's waveform.

Tubes are also generally more powerful than SS amps, hence why you would need a 30 watt SS to compete with a 15/20 watt tube (or something like that).

In short, there is a difference in volume. A 100 watt tube is louder than a 100 watt SS.
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#22
Quote by stratman_13
Wrong. The tube will appear louder than the SS because of how the human ear perceives sound. We hear the tubes better since the sound is more organic. SS amp waveforms are generated in a way that the ear doesn't intercept them as well as a tube's waveform.

Tubes are also generally more powerful than SS amps, hence why you would need a 30 watt SS to compete with a 15/20 watt tube (or something like that).

In short, there is a difference in volume. A 100 watt tube is louder than a 100 watt SS.



no SS and tube at the same wattage are the same...i understand your ear notices a difference and that's true....but to put it down on paper they are the same volume wise


also i know a tube amp is going to be a little bit louder, but needing a 30 wat ss to compete with a 15/20 wat tube? that doesn't sound right
Gear:
Ibanez RG1527M Prestige
Martin DX1
Agile-2000
Last edited by dogtags99 at Nov 13, 2009,
#23
Wow, their a lot of trash talking and misinformation in this thread, so let me chime in. I was in the same boat as you, I had a spider valve, it was a nice amp, very versatile, but after a year I was ready to to some thing different.


I ended up selling mine and using a Pox X3 live. When I play live it goes into the effects return of a hot rod deluxe. Many people get very good results with this setup. Think of it as a spider valve on 'roids. All the spider Valve is a POD 2.0 plugged into a power tube section. This is a the same setup as a POD X3 live in the hot rod. Both the spider valve and the Hotrod share a very similar tube circuit design. THe upside is that 1 the pod x3l preamp models are way better then the pod 2.

When you need to practice, headphones out of the Pod X3 or run the pod X3 into a cheap pair of studio monitors. The x3 will give you the versatilly you like with your valve, while letting you use it for a multitude of applications.

Heres all the ways I use the POD x3 for

Pod X3 live into Hot Rod for live gigs
Pod X3 live into PA for when I don't want to lug an amp
Pod X3 live into headphones for lat night practicing
Pod X3 live into Studio monitors for not so late night practicing
Fender Hot Rod Deluxe and Pedals when I want to play the true tube route


This setup will cost you less then a grand and give a you a good starting point to build and expand your rig as you go, while not sacrificing anything now
#24
Quote by dogtags99
no SS and tube at the same wattage are the same...i understand your ear notices a difference and that's true....but to put it down on paper they are the same volume wise


also i know a tube amp is going to be a little bit louder, but needing a 30 wat ss to compete with a 15/20 wat tube? that doesn't sound right

Strange, but true. Play the two side by side, and hell. The tube may even be louder.
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#25
Quote by stratman_13
Strange, but true. Play the two side by side, and hell. The tube may even be louder.



agree to disagree
Gear:
Ibanez RG1527M Prestige
Martin DX1
Agile-2000
#27
Quote by stratman_13
Indeed.


But you were right

And to be honest If I were you i'd just get a small practice amp. For example Roland Cube. You don't like your amp and its too powerful, so why keep it?