Page 6 of 11
#201
Quote by iwannabesedated
Anything we would try and do would just be erased because that's what we people do. We take advantage of each other. We'd get rid of the ones we have now, others would be created, the cycle continues. Maybe we could make a small improvement, but that's it, and plus people don't have the will to change anything drastically, because it would be inconvenient.


I guess you're right, no matter what happens, my country will always be unjust.

No means maybe
#202
Kid is doing the right thing.

Problem is that many years ago we noticed rasicm was wrong coz it was descrimination.
Making fun of homosexuals is now well on it's way to being regarded as wrong and descriminating as rasicm. Sooner or later the misuse of the guitar as an icon to promote products will be condemned and we will call it discrimination. Times change.

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Quote by stratdud39
Thank you for your words of wisdom.
#203
I also find the pledge to be a little ridiculous. I do not like the "under god" part or the "I pledge allegiance". The under god part seems to kind of go against the separation of church and state. And the pledge allegiance part kind of says that like, I will support anything my country does. Even if that includes unjustified war, discrimination, violation of human rights, etc. Like, if I lived in the early 1800's, I would not pledge my allegiance to a country that endorses slavery, arrests homosexuals and calls them mentally insane, or denies women and minorities their rights. And I don't pledge allegiance to a government that sends troops into a country and takes it over for all the wrong reasons or discriminates against people for being Muslim or Middle Eastern.
#205
I stopped saying the pledge in like 8th grade. I stopped even standing for it in 9th. Now I just talk through the whole thing, including the moment of silence afterward.
#206
Quote by MedicreDemon
I stopped saying the pledge in like 8th grade. I stopped even standing for it in 9th. Now I just talk through the whole thing, including the moment of silence afterward.

I wish I had done that back then, ohh well. The pledge comes AFTER the silence in my school, so Ill stand up for the silence, then sit back down for the pledge
Bands I must see in concert
Silvertide
The Black Crowes
Jackyl
Black Stone Cherry
AC/DC
StoneRider
Freedomhawk
The Darkness and/or the sideprojects of the band members
Buckcherry
The Answer

Theres more. But those are the main ones
#207
He sounds like an idoctrinated little hippie shit head. Saying the pledge is respectful thing to do even though there are low points in the countries history, we had men and women die for this country. We've come a long away since slavery and racism and I believe that is something to be proud of. People in this thread sicken me. Major facepalm.
Last edited by JDawg at Nov 17, 2009,
#208
I bet his dads told him to do it....
Lets jump in a pool


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#209
hippie, at your service JDawg.

:p
Bands I must see in concert
Silvertide
The Black Crowes
Jackyl
Black Stone Cherry
AC/DC
StoneRider
Freedomhawk
The Darkness and/or the sideprojects of the band members
Buckcherry
The Answer

Theres more. But those are the main ones
#210
Right from the mouthes of children, a wisdom that can speak to us all.
Grammar and spelling omitted as an exercise for the reader.
#211
Quote by JDawg
He sounds like an idoctrinated little hippie shit head. Saying the pledge is respectful thing to do even though there are low points in the countries history, we had men and women die for this country. We've come a long away since slavery and racism and I believe that is something to be proud of. People in this thread sicken me. Major facepalm.

You don't think that being forced to say something goes against everything this country stands for?
#212
Quote by JDawg
He sounds like an idoctrinated little hippie shit head. Saying the pledge is respectful thing to do even though there are low points in the countries history, we had men and women die for this country. We've come a long away since slavery and racism and I believe that is something to be proud of. People in this thread sicken me. Major facepalm.


I don't think anyone's ever died for the Pledge of Allegiance.
#213
Quote by Dirge Humani
You don't think that being forced to say something goes against everything this country stands for?

of course being fored to say something is freedom, just like not being able to get married just becuase you are gay.
Bands I must see in concert
Silvertide
The Black Crowes
Jackyl
Black Stone Cherry
AC/DC
StoneRider
Freedomhawk
The Darkness and/or the sideprojects of the band members
Buckcherry
The Answer

Theres more. But those are the main ones
#214
If you don't respect the symbol and anthem of the country, then get the heck out of it. I'm atheist and i have no qualms with saying the pledge, its completely idiotic, tons of culture is rooted in history and historically, religion was a major portion of life so it only makes sense that it would be reflected in official documents from that time period. That said, it would be different if new documents were still written in such a way.

No respect whatsoever, the pledge should be mandatory, if you don't like it then leave.
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#216
Quote by Dirge Humani
You don't think that being forced to say something goes against everything this country stands for?



Did I say that?

Out of respect for your own country.... Why wouldn't you want to? To prove you're a hippie?
#217
Quote by battlespud
If you don't respect the symbol and anthem of the country, then get the heck out of it. I'm atheist and i have no qualms with saying the pledge, its completely idiotic, tons of culture is rooted in history and historically, religion was a major portion of life so it only makes sense that it would be reflected in official documents from that time period. That said, it would be different if new documents were still written in such a way.

No respect whatsoever, the pledge should be mandatory, if you don't like it then leave.


That's totally reasonable. Just like if Washington and Co. didn't like the way the Brits were running things, they could take their bitch asses to Indian country, right? You little patriot.
#218
Quote by JDawg
Did I say that?

Out of respect for your own country.... Why wouldn't you want to? To prove you're a hippie?

I respect the country by standing when it's said, or when the anthem is, or anything else of that sort. But nobody will be able to force me to say anything, ever.

Also, since when is hippie an insult?
#219
Quote by Dirge Humani
Shut up, I actually want to have a serious discussion with him.

Unless he doesn't respond in a few minutes, because then I'll go to sleep. Then you can do whatever you want.

hey, so do I.

Theres no reason to have to say the pledge. If it makes someone feel more american to say it, then fine. But saying a poem every morning gives me (and I assume you) no more reason to feel American, it shouldn't be mandatory.

EDIT:
sometimes sarcasm is needed to get a point across
Bands I must see in concert
Silvertide
The Black Crowes
Jackyl
Black Stone Cherry
AC/DC
StoneRider
Freedomhawk
The Darkness and/or the sideprojects of the band members
Buckcherry
The Answer

Theres more. But those are the main ones
Last edited by Aerokizzombie at Nov 17, 2009,
#220
Quote by Dirge Humani
I respect the country by standing when it's said, or when the anthem is, or anything else of that sort. But nobody will be able to force me to say anything, ever.

Also, since when is hippie an insult?


This. I stand, but I don't say anything. There's too many **** ups in that "pledge" for me to even utter it out of my mouth. It's like a presidential candidate in the primaries: Makes promises it won't keep.
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#221
Quote by Dirge Humani
I respect the country by standing when it's said, or when the anthem is, or anything else of that sort. But nobody will be able to force me to say anything, ever.

Also, since when is hippie an insult?



Nobody is forcing anyone... I don't condone that.

But anyone who finds the words:"I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands: one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all." offensive is an idiot.

As far as I know, most schools who still say the pledge isn't forcing anyone to say it. They are welcome to leave the room or just sit there.


EDIT: Sidenote, the pledge was written by a socialist if that satisfies the socialists of UG...
Last edited by JDawg at Nov 17, 2009,
#222
Quote by JDawg
Nobody is forcing anyone... I don't condone that.

But anyone who finds the words:"I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands: one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all." offensive is an idiot.

As far as I know, most schools who still say the pledge isn't forcing anyone to say it. They are welcome to leave the room or just sit there.

I take issue with that. It isn't offensive, but I don't think it belongs there.

Also, I get shit all the time for not saying the pledge at school. Teachers aren't very tolerant of free thinking.
#223
Quote by Dirge Humani
I take issue with that. It isn't offensive, but I don't think it belongs there.

Also, I get shit all the time for not saying the pledge at school. Teachers aren't very tolerant of free thinking.



They probably think you're an idiot then. They're free to say what they want just as you are.
Last edited by JDawg at Nov 17, 2009,
#224
Quote by JDawg
They probably think you're idiot then. They're free to say what they want just as you are.

Lolirony.

And I know they are free to say what they want, but they should keep some opinions to themselves. I don't go off on everyone who does say the pledge, but almost everyone who does goes off on me.

Also, goodnight.
#225
Quote by JDawg
They probably think you're idiot then. They're free to say what they want just as you are.


But a school (and teachers are part of the school) isn't free to coerce people in any way to conform to something of this nature.

That sounded ridiculously teen angsty.
#226
Quote by Zoot Allures
Yes it does. Apparently your constitution is meant to keep church and state seperate and rightly so. The place isn't meant to be able to turn into a theocracy.


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#227
Quote by Dirge Humani
I take issue with that. It isn't offensive, but I don't think it belongs there.

Also, I get shit all the time for not saying the pledge at school. Teachers aren't very tolerant of free thinking.

1)same here first paragraph
2)used to be the same with my teachers, but my new homeroom/physics teacher believes in free speech, freedom of expresion and the like just like me. Hell, I have **** you written on the side of my shoe, he thought it was great.
Bands I must see in concert
Silvertide
The Black Crowes
Jackyl
Black Stone Cherry
AC/DC
StoneRider
Freedomhawk
The Darkness and/or the sideprojects of the band members
Buckcherry
The Answer

Theres more. But those are the main ones
#228
Quote by Dirge Humani
Lolirony.

And I know they are free to say what they want, but they should keep some opinions to themselves. I don't go off on everyone who does say the pledge, but almost everyone who does goes off on me.

Also, goodnight.



You don't miss a thang do ya.
#229
Quote by JDawg
He sounds like an idoctrinated little hippie shit head. Saying the pledge is respectful thing to do even though there are low points in the countries history, we had men and women die for this country. We've come a long away since slavery and racism and I believe that is something to be proud of. People in this thread sicken me. Major facepalm.

We shouldn't stop trying to improve our country because we've done well so far. The kid is standing up for what he believes in, that the citizens do NOT share equal rights. He's not saying the pledge because he doesn't want to pledge allegiance to a country that doesn't offer such rights. Makes sense to me. I'm proud of my country and its progress but I'm not going to stop trying to continue it.

And the pledge is unimportant anyway. I don't say it either, mainly because it doesn't hold any meaning to me. Plus the addition of 'under god' has always bothered me.
#231
Theres nothing wrong with not saying the pledge. I heard from my little cousin that at the elementary school I used to go to (which he now attends) they changed to say "I pledge allegence to our leader" which in my opinion is bullshit (flamesheild rissen) and I wish people would respect gays. Gay marriage is banned in California and it could get worse. Yet people think of them as worhtless monsters. I know gay people who are discrimated constantly. Its not fair and IMO violates religous freedom,they can beleive being gay is ok if they want, and these religous people contradict themselves by being anti-gay. *flamesheild*
#232
Good on him, man. I agree with this. We should start a movement
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#233
Quote by jimmyled
I never got it, why does the U.S. still have the "In God We Trust" quote on their dollars? Aren't there enough non-Christians and atheists to justify a change?

STOP PERSECUTING MY RELIGION!

Also you aren't aloud to be gay, Atheists should die in hell, and religion should be a part of government... always.
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Thats not even sensible I base myself like this I like power I don't understand emotion. Knowledge is key and fire pokemon own.

#234
Quote by blackthought
But a school (and teachers are part of the school) isn't free to coerce people in any way to conform to something of this nature.

That sounded ridiculously teen angsty.



The pledge is like kryponite to you people... I don't get it. Respecting the country you live in and takes care of you is offensive to you? Strange.
#235
Quote by slipknot5678
Theres nothing wrong with not saying the pledge. I heard from my little cousin that at the elementary school I used to go to (which he now attends) they changed to say "I pledge allegence to our leader" which in my opinion is bullshit (flamesheild rissen) and I wish people would respect gays. Gay marriage is banned in California and it could get worse. Yet people think of them as worhtless monsters. I know gay people who are discrimated constantly. Its not fair and IMO violates religous freedom,they can beleive being gay is ok if they want, and these religous people contradict themselves by being anti-gay. *flamesheild*

WHAT THE FUCK!!! Thats beyond messed up
and Im with you on the gay thing.

EDIT: why would you need a flameshield for any of that
Bands I must see in concert
Silvertide
The Black Crowes
Jackyl
Black Stone Cherry
AC/DC
StoneRider
Freedomhawk
The Darkness and/or the sideprojects of the band members
Buckcherry
The Answer

Theres more. But those are the main ones
Last edited by Aerokizzombie at Nov 17, 2009,
#236
I dont say the pledge either. But not because I have any moral stand; I just dont feel like standing up or saying it. School starts at 7 20 for me. Im too tired to worry about saying a pledge that I dont really care about
#237
By the time I got to high school no one in class said the pledge...Am I the only one or are other peoples school's the same way?

EDIT: Ohh yeah while in high school I always seemed to have my "Morning Stretch" right when it was time to say the pledge... Anyone else have that?
Originally posted by arrrgg
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Last edited by Led man32 at Nov 17, 2009,
#238



if our own ****** "leader" doesnt have to, than neither should anyone else
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#239
Quote by RockinRyan13



if our own ****** "leader" doesnt have to, than neither should anyone else

very very good point

and for some reason I found your post + sig really really funny
Bands I must see in concert
Silvertide
The Black Crowes
Jackyl
Black Stone Cherry
AC/DC
StoneRider
Freedomhawk
The Darkness and/or the sideprojects of the band members
Buckcherry
The Answer

Theres more. But those are the main ones
#240
[quote="JDawg Nobody is forcing anyone... I don't condone that.

As far as I know, most schools who still say the pledge isn't forcing anyone to say it. They are welcome to leave the room or just sit there.



EVERY time I haven't standed for the pledge the teacher gets pissed and eithor says go to they office or 'get the **** out of my class'(Might aswell have said it that way).

I think its bullshit that they MAKE us stand for the pledge, if they just said it everytime for people whom believe what they want I'd be ok with it. People can believe what they want, I'm not one to judge. But having people say something that they don't want to against their will and or religion/beliefs which inevitably interferes with their education. Is that not ****ing bullshit?

I mean really, between teachers and students its just a bitching boss fight.

"SAY THE PLEDGE"

"**** YOU!"

I don't like people making me say or do something I don't want to. Another reason why I hate how teacher's think Freedom of Speach doesn't/shouldn't apply at school.