#1
I'm the guitarist/singer for my band and we've been getting our songs ready for recording. I've been working on a 5 part song to put on the album. Here are two finished parts. Then here's a nearly finished part as well. Parts 2 and 5 are finished and part 3 is not. Is it good? my bassist has only heard parts 2 and 5 and he says they are really good, but I want some more opinions. (lyrics are in the score information (press F5)) the vocal notes are just there to help me with the idea of the sound, i won't be singing them necessarily like that.

EDIT: See post #4 for the most recent versions of The Fall and Redemption.
and post #23 for Repentance.
Attachments:
Pride Part 2_ Disdain.gp5
Pride Part 5_ Redemption.gp5
Pride Part 3_ The Fall.gp5
Last edited by Sonic Blast at Dec 30, 2009,
#2
Disdain - a nice upbeat little song, nothing much to crit. It seems kind of too jolly for the depressive-ish lyrics. It was alright. The riffs were good, the solo was great, but nothing really stood out. It was a great song though, pretty calm.

Redemption - I can swear I heard that somewhere before. It sounds like something I would hear on a soft-rock station, like from Bon Jovi or something. I really liked the guitar solo, but I didn't think bar 25 was necessary. 51-57 just seems like too much of nothing much happening. Verse 2 sounded really good because of the drum pattern. It just caught my attention. The ending was kind of weird, I didn't think it fit.

The Fall - Now this one's quite different. Nice, happy metal. Again, nice intro, but I don't know a bassists (especially a finger bassist) who can play bar 12. Correct me if I'm wrong (I'm no bass expert), but that looks insane. 27 on was a cool break. Then there were a few pretty cool dissonant verses, but after that, at 106, the prog-ish riff sounded kind of out of place to me. 110 takes a long time to transition into considering how short it lasts sounding "normal". 128 and 129 once again, is just out of place, it just cuts of into that. Anyway, great song, just some things sound a little out of place. The ending is pretty awkward too.

All in all, great "song", I would like to hear it finished and recorded.
Quote by RhyseOrtiz
Banned because.. that was brilliant, champayne


Some of My Recent Songs

[thread="1403441"]Synthetic Damage WIP[/thread]

[thread="1350364"]The Nightman Awakens[/thread]

[thread="1322579"]Into the Sunset WIP[/thread]

[thread="1296556"]Frost[/thread]
[thread="1247340"]The Butter Knife Massacre[/thread]
[thread="1253933"]Into The Sparta Pit[/thread]

[thread="1224038"]Untitled Tech Thing[/thread]
#3
Thanks!

With Disdain, haha... I really didn't have jolly in mind when I wrote that music! Just goes to show how different perspective is. I was going for a raunchy song with a kind of punkish attitude, but I couldn't really transfer that into guitar pro very well I had thought that would make it more memorable after we record it.

with Restitution, 51-57 is kind of a break, to change the mood and step back a bit. I agree with the ending section. I needed something, and it made sense at the time (the "ska" style playing). The final riff in that song is how the overture starts out. I did that to tie it together and essentially show how the cycle repeats.

with The Fall, yeah, it is fast at bar 12, but my bassist plays with a pick and can play relatively fast, but that may end up changing. Do you think it would sound good if I extended the section at 106? I could make a better transistion to 110. I was really at a loss on how to end this. So I just wrote what I did. Do you think an ending solo at 147 would be good? and then continue it over the ending chord progression. Any ideas on what I could do?
#5
Alright, Here goes.

Part 2 Disdain.

Now first I'll just say that this reminds me of Black Label Society

Alright, so I think this song was a pretty snazzy Rock-ish song. I did get a bit bored of the song but that's because I was listening to the MIDI and I am not generally into this type of music. I guess it would sound great as a recorded song so I won't complain.

You had some pretty catchy riffs in here and the bass during the solo was splendid. I think the solo could have gone for longer but If that's not what your going for I do agree that that particular part is great how it is, Short and Sweet .

I didn't really find anything in the song that I disagreed with, it was catchy and was put together well; 9/10.

Part 5 Redemption.

Great Intro; Great solo, Chords and the Bass is perfect.
I like the little break with just the drums, and later the Chords, I think it suits the song well. Nice solo during the calm part once again, I think this song definitely makes up for anything the previous song would be lacking. I think this song is a 9.8/10. Great ****ing work man.

Part 3 the Fall.

Wow, hah Straight at ya. Fine way to start the track IMO. I find this track isn't as 'happy' as Disdain but it definitely is catchy. I got a bit confused and didn't really know where you were going with this track though. It seems like you were trying to force it to be progressive but it's very spontaneous and I like that. The song finishes rather quickly in my opinion but I don't see a problem with that so I'll give this one 8, maybe 9/10. Great work.
#7
Quote by Sonic Blast
I'm working on the 4th section (Repentance) and i'm stuck. It's just droning on, and I don't know where to take it! Help please!


Hm. Honestly, I got a little bored. Just because the slow tempo stresses the repetition in your main riffs. Glancing at most of these songs, it seems you have a decent grasp of structure, but something I think you could work on is your theory. There are a lot of sections, such as the intro of this song where you just didn't really pick a key, and it's bothersome. None of this is really my style, so don't blame yourself for me getting bored with it, but just take note that I think you should at least learn to keep things in a single key, and maybe a little bit of chord construction.
#8
By no means is this part of the song any good piece of work. The notes for the lyrics suck, and it just goes on and on and on... I kinda assumed you would get bored with it. As that's my problem. I don't know where to go with this part of the song. Do I make a different progression to go to after the verse? I'm not sure where to go structuraly speaking. That's where I think I really need help.

I didn't think the theory behind the intro to this song isn't very bad... But if i'm wrong, please prove it to me as theory is very important to me, but it's bm resolving to A# and then a#m resolving to B, thus creating a cycle. Then the main riff is in A# with the rest of the song (so far) following with a two chord progession of a# (tonic) going down to f# (the submediant of a decending melodic minor scale).
#9
Quote by Sonic Blast

I didn't think the theory behind the intro to this song isn't very bad... But if i'm wrong, please prove it to me as theory is very important to me, but it's bm resolving to A# and then a#m resolving to B, thus creating a cycle.


This part was what mainly caught my attention. I'm not sure what you mean by a "cycle," but A# to Bm to A#m to B is never gonna sound very good. Those four chords just don't share any keys together.
#10
Part 2
Crit as I go:

opening riff sounds like something out of tool or rage against the machine. cool. drums are kinda slow, could have been better to add a feeling of "building up", but idk where this song is going yet. with the bass and hi hats it kinda reminds me of doom music lol. Ok i skipped like half of the song once the 'singing' came in because it just repeated over and over and over....real boring dude! change shit up. ok and whats with the random wankage and dissonant chords? that didn't fit the song at all.

aha heres something cool! once you change up the original riff (~measure 141) that sounds real cool. like things are starting to pick up the pace.

but its a bit of a letdown, because the song kind of just drops out after that.


ok....you have 2 good ideas in this song: the original riff and the modified original riff. Those are both strong enough to write a legit song out of, but as of right now this one is poorly executed. And kinda slow and plodding. 3/10, 3 because I thought the riffs were sweet haha drums weren't too great
Kurzweil K2500xs
#11
PArt 5

dude the opening is sweet! it reminds me alot of something pink floyd would do. I liked the chords alot, however you could have used at least 1 more in there to spice things up, preferrably towards the end. the guitar solo was pretty melodic too, though i didn't like how it ended. I think a bass and key solo should go later in the song, possibly after the next song. And yea save the unison for later too actually, its too early in the song to tell whats going on IMO. and rewrite the key solo it sucks no offense.

I enjoyed the lyrics alot, they were a bit simplistic (words and melody), but that wasn't such a bad thing for this song in particular. Verse 2 sounded cool with the changed up drum rhythm, as well as the guitar riff.

2 chords following the next guitar solo were poor choice. pick better ones! and the random 8th note reggae thing you threw in kinda took the song off track. btw, wheres the chorus?????

6/10. much better than the first one, and has a good beat to it. A few sections need work
Kurzweil K2500xs
#12
part 3 the fall

WHOA DUDE where the hell did this metal junks come from? totally different than the other songs.

I really like the opening riff(s), the guitar could use a bit of work. I liked the verse? where the vocals came in, but the transition could use some work. The next riff, idk what it is, sounds great as well, but again there was almost no transition to flow between the two riffs. also theres a pretty long space between the two singing sections, maybe you could shorten the gap? I like how you referenced the melody from part 5 in this riff as well.

Again, without transition another riff is introduced. Good riff, and the drums sound like part 5 again which is a cool throwback. Guitar is poor. drums are average. And another riff. then end? you should end with a better chord progression IMO

5/10 this song has the most potential out of the three. However you strung like 5 unrelated metal riffs by litarlly just putting them one after the other. I would reccomend looking at the song structures and creating more of a flowing progression of ideas to get the point across.
Kurzweil K2500xs
#14
thanks for the crit flounder, but I think you listened to the listened to the wrong files... The ones in the original post are a bit outdated. *original post edited

and no offence, as it was a very thorough crit, but the "next riff" labling is kinda hard to work with.

Part of the problem here is that this is a complete work, once all the parts come together. I think more things will make a lot more sense in the end (chord progressions and placement wise).

Merry Christmas everyone!
Last edited by Sonic Blast at Dec 25, 2009,
#15
Well, I'm not really an expert of music theory, and I'm not into progressive rock so my "critics" will do you basicly no good. I've listened to all the parts of your song, and apart from the 3rd part, every part seemed to me like an atmosferic ambiental piece, and a really chillin' one. xD I'd like to hear it recorded someday.
#16
Alright I'm going to do this song by song.

Pride 1: Disdain.

Clean intro is nice though the A# sounds out of place. I think it should be an A but that's me. And no I don't have any theory to support my suggestion it's just how it sounds to my ears.

Onto the distortion... and the drums... and bass. I like the bass in bar 24, not following the guitar and sort of standing out a bit. You need some cymbal hits/fills in the drums on bar 24 to make it sound like the tension of the song has increased.

I think bar 33-48 is your verse. I like the idea of the bass playing the riff and the guitars just hitting the open but if that continues for the whole time, it gets... redundant. Maybe put a few notes at the end of every two bars... sort of like:

     PM PM PM PM PM PM PM PM  
     E  E  E  E  E  E  E  E   
E||--------------------------|
B||--------------------------|
G||--------------------------|
D||--------------------------|
A||--------------------------|
E||--------------------------|
B||--0--0--0--0--0--0--0--0--|


  PM PM PM PM PM PM        
  E  E  E  E  E  E  Q      
--------------------------|
--------------------------|
--------------------------|
--------------------------|
--------------------------|
--------------------5~----|
--0--0--0--0--0--0--------|


  PM PM PM PM PM PM PM PM  
  E  E  E  E  E  E  E  E   
--------------------------|
--------------------------|
--------------------------|
--------------------------|
--------------------------|
--------------------------|
--0--0--0--0--0--0--0--0--|


  PM PM PM PM PM PM         
  E  E  E  E  E  E  Q       
--------------------------||
--------------------------||
--------------------------||
--------------------------||
--------------------------||
--------------------------||
--0--0--0--0--0--0--3~----||


Obviously not exactly that but you get the idea.

Bar 49-64 would be a pre-chorus? Again the redundancy thing. The thing is that you're approaching a chorus and your music isn't becoming tense enough to release yet. So before the chorus, I'd say increase the tension. Maybe get the guitar to change a bit in bars 57-64? Or perhaps the bass could noodle around a bit in the second half of the prechorus. And maybe towards the end the drums could do a fill or use cymbals a bit more. Just basically increase the tension.

65-80 is probably your chorus. I like the syncopation here (I think that's what it is, lolz). The only real issue I have is with one note. Yes, one note, haha.

You play it as:
     Q    E  E  E  E  E  E   
E||-------------------------|
B||-------------------------|
G||-------------------------|
D||-------9-----7--9-----7--|
A||-------9-----7--9-----7--|
E||-------7-----7--7--7--5--|
B||--0----0--0--------0-----|


  Q    E  E  E  E  E  E   
-------------------------|
-------------------------|
-------------------------|
--L----7-----5--7--------|
--L----7-----5--7-----2--|
--L----5--5--5--5-----2--|
-------------------3--0--|


and I think it would sound much better as:

     Q    E  E  E  E  E  E   
E||-------------------------|
B||-------------------------|
G||-------------------------|
D||-------9-----7--9-----7--|
A||-------9-----7--9-----7--|
E||-------7-----7--7--7--5--|
B||--0----0--0--------0-----|


  Q    E  E  E  E  E  E   
-------------------------|
-------------------------|
-------------------------|
--L----7-----6--7--------|
--L----7-----5--7-----2--|
--L----5--5--5--5-----2--|
-------------------3--0--|


Nice fill there in bars 81-82. And now I'll jump to bar 131 since the verse-prechorus-chorus are just repeating. I like you solo pattern in 131-132 (btw, why is the tempo changing from 120 to 120?) Between bars 133 and 140, there is a sort of empty feel after every bar because well... the lead guitar is empty. That's not too great an idea I think because the lead guitar takes center channel and dominates the mix usually (like vocals) and if it is left empty in the middle of a "solo section" it sounds... odd. So you might wanna add some stuff in the middle.

The riff in141-148 I love. 149-154 sound... trippy. That's a good thing. Though the Solo/Overdubs sounds like it's about to go into a solo. I'd take that direction somewhere. I don't think you've completed the song yet so yeah. and if it is complete, the ending is much too abrupt.

The song is jazzy and upbeat and I don't mind that at all. The only problem that I really see (besides occasionally the drums but I think you were writing drum parts not to perfection but just as an outline) is the repetition and the lack of release and tension. Your verse and prechorus should increase the tension gradually and the chorus serves to release it. Or vice versa, but your song follows the former. Because your verse and prechorus are static and not gradually increasing in tension, the chorus doesn't have the impact it could have. Also, since your verses, prechorus and chorus are all about 16 bars (8bars * 2) the song starts feeling long because of the average 120 tempo. I think vocals could probably make up for that. The song also begs for some sort of solo after the point where you stopped writing.

Anyways, this took forever to write so I'll do part 3 in a bit.
Last edited by Limaj_daas at Dec 25, 2009,
#17
haha... the end will make so much more sense when you hear part 3...

Part of the redundancy, is that it's supposed to have that raunchy feel with the vocals added. and you just can't write that into guitar pro. btw, the vocals are in the score (hit F5)

I do like the idea about spicing up the verse every couple measures. and I'll most likely end up doing that live, if not in the studio as well.

that one note... haha... I like it a lot, but it doesn't quite fit the mood for me. I'll have to save that for some other song. if it's not copyrighted of course...

oh, and I hope you are listening to the most recent tracks... see the edit in the original post if you haven't already.

and when you get there... I'm working on part 4 while checking UG for your posts so it's not quite what is on there, but crit it the same I guess.
Last edited by Sonic Blast at Dec 25, 2009,
#18
Alright, onto part 3, the fall. The intro reminds me a LOT of This Dying Soul by Dream Theater. Just how a heavy chord followed by epic amounts of double bass. The rifff that starts at bar 5 is very nice... I'm starting to think that this is very inspired by the Train of Thought album. Oh, bass moved up an octave in bar 7... and you compliment it in bar 9. Btw, the way you're playing the riff two octaves up is... not too advisable in a live situation. You'll be all filled with energy and possibly head banging but your mind will be like "oh dayum, gotta fret from 12 to 20!" haha. It might be better to play it on both the B and the high E. Bar 12 requires the drummer to go wild, he should compliment you and your bassist.

Aha, another heavy riff from bar 13 onwards. And your bassist joins you with some nice stuff... Well except for the A at the end of his bar 17 and 18 fills. They sound good when the bass is playing alone, but it is too dissonant (in a very bad way) when played with the guitar. You might wanna figure something out.

Bars 19-22 are nicely done. No complains.

The guitar chord in bar 23-24 should continue onto bar 27 (though fade out obviously, or better yet, evolve into epic amounts of feedback).

The bass in bars 30-47 is very nice. Reminds me of Quo Vadis. And yes, you didn't make the mistake you made in part 2. Part 48-49 nicely build up to bar 50's riff.

The riff is... weird, but in a good way. Nice use of diminished chords there. The only thing is that the bend was... odd. Maybe change the notes there but right now, it just seemed very out of place. It gave a very pentatonic feel out of nowhere.

My favorite part of the verse riff is the bar 82-85 part. Love it.

106-113 the guitars are pretty nice and quirky. The only problem i see is that your drummer gets standard on bar 108 and the bass starts on bar 110 and that makes it... odd. I'd have em both start on the same bar.

Bar 120-126 is a nice buildup. But the bar 127-135 hmm... i think it's the G#. If it were a G it would sound better. Unless you're trying to give it a happier feel.

The fill in bar 136-137 needs more... form and gradual increase of tension. It can be used in a very good way.

Bars 138-141 sound sweet. The solo that follows has way too many notes that aren't on the scale. This isn't usually an issue, I just can't tell if you're doing it on purpose which is the problem. It should be more easily discernible otherwise it seems like you don't know how to run scales (which is probably very unlikely ).

The outro is nice... kind of abrupt as the solo could've lasted longer... or maybe the outro could've lasted longer. Anyways, how you hold bar 150's chord will be a mystery to me.

The song has a lot of potential. A lot of the riffs are wicked and the bass is not cowering behind the guitar and imitating its every move. It stands out. The drums were kind of meh. They were... too standard for a complex/syncopated rhythm. They need to be less hard rock, more metal. The biggest problem here is that despite being filled to the brim with great ideas, they're not pieced together too greatly. Transitions seem jerky and hmm some passages could be exploited more. Imo, if you have something great going on, do it just enough. Don't over or under do it. If you don't play a very catchy passage enough, the listener gets irked. They want that passage. If you play it too many times, the listener gets bored.

Work on the transitions, maybe add a few more parts. Just make the song flow a bit better and it would be amazing.

Edit: That's two detailed crits! I deserve one more! https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1208677
Last edited by Limaj_daas at Dec 25, 2009,
#19
haha fair enough. I'll crit yours.

This Dying Soul is my second fav DT song (arguably first). And yeah, it has influenced a lot. Though I've tried to stay very different. I don't have really any time to work on my stuff more tonight. So I'll work on it tomorrow. But a couple final notes... have you ever seen my hands? that last chord is a bit of a stretch, but really not much. and I can hold down frets 12 and 20 with my first and second fingers if I want These are the most detailed crits i've ever gotten. thank you so much saad. it's helped a lot. but keep em coming!

Part of me wants to go all out, but I also have to look realistically. my band is going into the studio this spring (we have our time booked already) and we have to be perfect on this when we get there. we have the chemistry, we're good but what we don't bring in technicality we bring in style. and that's helped us a lot in the past. So we'll see. haha, maybe i'll edit the heck out of it even if we play it easier just to say I have a kick butt suite written.
#20
Alright, part 5... if I have time, I might help you out with pt 4.

Nice mellow intro, bass spices up things and hmm nice, guitar solo! Me likes. Very fitting. Though the lack of rhythmic changes (ie all eights or sixteeths) make it a bit redundant. perhaps add a bend or a slide. oh wait, nvrmnd, bends coming. Hmm, you could have the drums do a cymbal crash w/bass drum and then bass and piano play a chord. All whole notes. That would make it better imo. right now it's just *music...* *sudden emptiness* you know?

Bass solo: Hmm, it'd be nice if the guitar did a slide out from 22nd fret of high e. I like the bass solo quite a bit. Who wrote it?

Keyboard solo: You might wanna keep the left hand of the keyboard going as the right does the solo. Or get a clean guitar to do arpeggios of whatever chords you were using.

Altogether Solo: it's nice though the bass and lead sound at times as if they're fighting with each other rather than working with each other but that's only for like, half a sec. So no biggie.

Bar 50 needs... a conclusion. Resolve on the tonic/D with the guitar. Preferably the 22nd fret.

In bar 51-57 you could have Seymour (I think he still drums for you?) play some jazzy fills here and there. That would work well.

Vocals enter: This part is pretty nice but it feels slightly... eerie? maybe a soft strings/synth strings section in the background would give it more color.

Verse 2: The hi-hat got annoying really fast. But again, I think this is just the outline of the drums so no prob.

Solo 2: It's quite nice and fitting. I like.

Bass solo/Unison thing: I like this too, but a synth in the background would fill up so much empty space. Btw, in the fadeout, drums should be there too.

This is by far the best song. My only complain is that it feels empty at times but a soft synth/strings background would fix that really fast. Kind of reminds me of a stripped down version of Ayreon.
#21
thanks mate

I think I'll add more piano in with the "empty sections." I see what you mean though with the synth. I'm just trying to keep it as easy to play live as possible.

I wrote the bass solo thanks. I kinda like the emptiness of the keyboard solo right before the together solo. So that might stay as is.

thanks again!
#22
Hey, thanks for the crit.

-Pride Part 2: It's a good guitar riff, liked the way the vocals sound, but personally I enjoyed bass lines. Good work.
-Pride Part 3: Metal power! Liked the riffs and the first chord, though I can't really see how part 2 will connect with part 3. I liked the riff that starts on 110. Nice one.
-Pride Part 5: Beginning with the solos was AMAZING, best of them all. But that drums transition was a bit repetitive. I liked the the guitar solos and bass solos, and the fade out with bass and clean guitar was really good.
#23
hey thanks!

I've just finished part 4. so here it is.

EDIT: the Overture (part 1) is finished too. here it is. I'm wondering if I should play a trumpet solo in there, or a piano solo. you'll see the spot there. I wrote a trumpet solo in, but i'd play something better in real life. it's set so you only hear the keys in that part, but you can change it to hear the trumpet solo (which it will not be played like in the studio). tell me what you think.
Attachments:
Pride Part 4_ Repentance.gp5
Pride Part 1_ Overture.gp5
Last edited by Sonic Blast at Jan 8, 2010,