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#1
So, I've noticed many people on the internet preaching against piracy and how it's the same as stealing a cd off the shelf. I myself have about 50gb of pirated music, including a lot of hardcore, dance, metal, hip hop and compilations, and probably 2gb of uploads from cd's.

I know a few of you guys pirate as well, but to what extent? Will you spend days at a time going through torrent pages finding stuff to get/is your bookmarks part of firefox filled with blogs like ARISE MY SOUL AND SING and Deathcore is Sexy v.30? (I know that's dead)

For me, it helps with checking out bands. eg Break Even are touring Australia, bringing two bands I haven't heard of before. I listen to the two songs they have on myspace. One short fast song, one three-minute down tempo heavy song. Get their album, decent. Go to their show, buy the album on vinyl, maybe a shirt. To me, that well makes up for it.

American bands I download the shit out of, because I know that our cd stores don't sell it, or it costs $35USD to get it imported over here. Bands who are dead, which take up 60% of my listening, I don't care about either. I go to every show I can, because I think everyone here agrees that hardcore is better live than on disc. I think taking the effort to pay $30 and sit through 3 shit support bands to see the one band shows a lot more than buying a piece of plastic.

Vinyl is amazing, it's big, sounds cool and you get free shit inside the sleeves, deathwish bands with free downloads, some with epic posters and resist bands with free cd's (Ruiner and Carpathian). It's collectable and can be rare, and is awesome. All good hardcore bands release on vinyl. Buying vinyl to be means more than cd. It takes more money and effort to print on vinyl, and there's a lot of work going into it. I don't buy CD's anymore, because vinyl rules. Who here buys/collects vinyl?

Merch is there for support. It's not like buying an album that you listen to at home once, rip to your computer, put on your ipod and then leave on your bookcase in your room until your computer breaks and you have to do it all again. You can't wear a cd to a show.

I find a lot of bands by the band shirts being worn by kids at shows. I found Break Even because of that, and they're now one of my favourite ever bands. Usually bands get $10 per shirt to keep, and if they sell 40 shirts, and 15 hoodies that they make $20 profit from, that's $700 profit. Plus, the added advertisement of the name of the band.

TL;RD. Hardcore is about the live aggression and anger. Releasing 500 cds and having 10,000 kids having a copy of it doesn't matter in the long run, its about live support.

Download an album, buy it if you can (preferably on vinyl so you can look croosh as a substitute for your lack of beanie, rolled up jeans and joy division shirt), get a shirt and score mic grabs when you see them.

Stay HxC
#2
Piracy is bad mmkay. It's illegal, just like mariwana.

Seriously though, I buy records and go to shows, but I pirate a lot of music as well. I feel like there's always a ton of albums that I need to listen to, and there's no way in hell I could buy all of them.
#3
My point exactly. I put my ipod on shuffle every day and rarely skip a track. It's not like I download for the sake of downloading. I might miss a few months, then go and get everything that came out that I'm interested in. And with my vast tastes, that's a lot.
#4
Bands make almost no money of record sales, unless your like 50 cent or something. Bands make there money off touring. I have almost 3,000 pirated songs on my laptop over the course of a couple years but I also own about 35 albums. I just like to be able to hold a copy idk. Whenever a band I like releases an album with a DVD I usually buy it. I also highly doubt the bands are complaining the music is getting out like it never would before. They lose a couple thousand dollars but their music reaches fans it never would before. Think about some of the bands you listen to and think if it wasn't for the internet would I ever no they existed.

I also own a ridiculous amount of band t-shirts that I never wear.
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Last edited by NY_FootBall49 at Dec 21, 2009,
#5
i pirate whatever i can. this is why my band isn't making cd's unless whatever label we are on wants to put em out for us without us having to buy any. no one buys cds. kids collect records, so we are putting a record out. if you dont buy records and you wanna pirate it, whatever. thats why bands sell t-shirts and shit too.

if you go to shows (and pay for them), support the bands, go off, whatever, and buy a t-shirt or some shit.. then pirate shit without feeling bad. if you just sit in your house all day trying to collect as much music as possible and then dont support bands in otherways, you suck
#6
My "method":
Hear about band -> check myspace -> download their bestseller -> listen -> buy if I like, preferably on vinyl/the most limited format (although I'm fairly new to this; started about a month and a half ago, have about thirty on 12", ten on 10" and twenty or so on 7", with about twenty releases on their way(got about 100 CDs))
-> go to their shows and buy merch (I almost always buy at least one item per item, depending on what they got, and what they're charging), and occasionally ordering merch online if I really, really like the band and/or the design.

At the moment, doing this got me to about 367 albums on iTunes, which means I own about 50% of the music I got readily available.

As for the whole ethics thing: I don't feel guilty for downloading an album I'm only gonna listen to once or twice, as in reality, no one lost money on me downloading their album. If I hadn't downloaded it/got a chance to listen to all of it, chances are I wouldn't have bought it anyway. It's no different for me than going to the record store and ask to listen to an album (except I actually have a chance in finding it online, lol).

I'm totally with OP on the "vinyl is better"-thing. Limited releases, awesome packaging, artwork and so on is just a great way for the artist to say "Thanks for buying our record, here, have something awesome".


(Probably a very messy post with loads of bad grammar and typos, but it's late :P)
#8
Quote by willingvictim
damn dude what the **** do you do for a living


lol, nothing. I've spent a lot of my high school scholarship, which I didn't spend a lot of. I also have taken advantage of the dollar being as low as it is, and ordering carefully so I avoid customs. I also don't spend a lot of money anyways.
The CDs are gained over about three years though, and about 70% of them are from gift certificates, so I haven't really spent that much, even though it may sound like it. I also only got money for my birthday which was the 30th of September, I got about 400 bucks just from that, which buys a lot.

It'd be another story if I had bought all of it in Norway, lol.
#10
Fuck prices man. I have to travel nearly two hours to get to my closest hardcore record store. I've been collecting for 6 months, have 11 7", 11 12" and a 2x12", not to mention the ones I'm getting for christmas. The $AUS is worth .9USD at the moment which is good. You American's get 12" there for $10 when it's $25 here. After christmas I'm doing a huge deathwish and bridge9 order, just gotta wait to see what the girlfriend has gotten me.
#11
I pirate EVERYTHING before I buy. Period. There is nothing logical about buying a CD you can't hear for $15+ and not liking it. That said, I buy CDs that I really like (BTBAM, The Faceless, etc) and I own at least 35-40 band shirts. I also go to shows probably once or twice a month and pay to get in, so that's enough support from me.

I'm lucky, however, in that if I review a CD for Decoy, I usually get sent a physical promo copy a month or two afterward. In the past few months I've probably received over 30 CDs from Decoy, so that accounts for me not buying stuff, as well.

I support artists when the support is due.
#12
I've bought about 4-5% of my collection in Norwegian stores. 90% of my CDs are from sellers with free international shipping, and there are one store close to me (about an hour total) that sells hardcore stuff, and they only have like two hundred releases in stock at one time and are fairly ridicoulosly priced (stuff retails at about 35 USD).

Edit: I just counted and I have 39 12", 23 7", 8 10" included the stuff that haven't gotten here yet, so slightly under my estimations. Yes, I'm close to broke now lol.
Last edited by boffen at Dec 21, 2009,
#16
Yeah I've downloaded around 200 GBs worth of music over the past few years... I'M A BAD PERSON
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#17
My music collection is at about 115gb atm and I don't feel shame at all.

People always say "It'll be different when you're selling music. You'll hate people downloading your music blah blah blah"
Get. Fucked.

As a recording and working musician, I can tell you, I don't give a shit. My last band was selling our debut EP for $10 each. The EP itself cost us about $8000 to release. It was up on several blogspots within a week. Did I get mad, start ranting about anti-piracy and tell people to buy it instead because it's "destroying the music industry"?
No. I told people that if they wanted to download it, go for it, and then if they wanted to buy it, that would be awesome.

A real musician wants his music heard, not his pockets filled.
#18
Quote by boffen
For a 12". CDs retails at about 30USD.

Damn dude. For us, 12"s are like 10-12 and CDs are usually around 15. 7"s are usually like 3-5, which rules.
#19
Lowest I've paid for a 7" is $7, highest $12.
Lowest for a 12" is $20, highest $26.

At shows its 7" - $10, 12" - $20, no matter what the band
#20
Going with Aus prices, lowest I've paid is $10 for a 7". Highest was $15.
Lowest for a 12" was... $22 or something, highest was $48 haha.
CDs all average around $20-30 in Aus.
#23
I pirate the shit out of music, but if i see a band I like live guarantee i'll buy some merch to support them.
Quote by seeneyj
I thought the whole idea of post-hardcore was to mix techno and hardcore.....
#24
I decided to stop pirating music about two months ago. Not because I feel like it's wrong, but because I fail at pirating and always manage to get my computer a virus.
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#25
Quote by saxaxe
Damn dude. For us, 12"s are like 10-12 and CDs are usually around 15. 7"s are usually like 3-5, which rules.


I know, which is why I've ordered 95% of my vinyl from American stores. It's funny that I can buy two 12" and get it shipped for less than it costs me to get it in Norway.
#26
usually if i download something and i really like it i'll buy their vinyl or a shirt or something. i will never pay to download music, it's pointless cause there are so many ways around it. but i will continue to buy records. i'd say it's a lot different for hardcore music than it is for any other genre. i mean, your not gonna go out and buy kanye's new cd on vinyl after downloading it.
Quote by alm0st a skat3r
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#27
I've paid over $20 for a few 7"s. I've got an old Adicts EP that I got for $25 and a limited edition Coalesce 7" as well. I just sold a Saetia 7" for about $80, but I only paid $10 for it haha.
#28
i almost dropped $65 on a cro-mags OG press of age of quarrel. but I was like 500 miles from home and decided spending all my money was a bad idea
Quote by alm0st a skat3r
yeah i remember when i had a good conscience. now i dont give a ****

xxx
smoke weed, drink 40's, **** titties
#29
Phew. Probably a good call haha. I almost bought Jane Doe off ebay last year for like $95, but decided against it. I also really want the Norma Jean/mewithoutYou split REALLY badly, but whenever it pops up on ebay, it sells for over $75.
#30
OH SHlT ITS THE FBI
AHHHHHHHHH

but seriously i'll pirape bands that have dead people in them
psshhh i dont care.. im not payin money for a nirvana cd if courtney love is just gonna get all the money
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#31
I have like a dozen blogs bookmarked on Firefox and get a considerable amount of music from the internet. Alternately, there are a couple really good guys that bring their distros to shows, an excellent record store in Edmonton that is allegedly renowned around North America, and Ebullition records sells some of their stuff as low as a dollar, so I've amassed a decent record/cd collection to offset my downloading.

I always just assumed that the bands I like wouldn't mind my downloading, rather they would be happy that their music is getting out.
#32
Quote by Shaggy_420
OH SHlT ITS THE FBI
AHHHHHHHHH

but seriously i'll pirape bands that have dead people in them
psshhh i dont care.. im not payin money for a nirvana cd if courtney love is just gonna get all the money



is anyone else kinda puzzled by this??^
Quote by alm0st a skat3r
yeah i remember when i had a good conscience. now i dont give a ****

xxx
smoke weed, drink 40's, **** titties
#33
The thing is, if I didn't download an album, I probably wouldn't like the band enough to go see them play.

So either I download their record and they get my $10 (dep got my $20, sooo no merch that night) if they come by, or I don't download their record, they don't get my $10, they get one less person at their show, and they don't sell any merch to me.

If they plugged in the numbers to an expected monetary value equation, they come out on top if I download the record. So if anyone doesn't want me to do download their album, I'm fine with that. The next band will, and they'll also see me at their shows.
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#34
I never got the buzz over vinyl, it's seems to be a extra step in production. Isn't everything made digital anyways? Cd would be fine, if bands cared for there cds as they do with thier vinyls.

/ranting because record player broke
#35
Quote by screechuzi
I never got the buzz over vinyl, it's seems to be a extra step in production. Isn't everything made digital anyways? Cd would be fine, if bands cared for there cds as they do with thier vinyls.

/ranting because record player broke


cd's are boring. you get a cd.. cool. it comes in one version.. cool.

records sound way better than cd's (atleast the first 2 times you listen to them), there are different colors, the artwork is usually way cooler since it's bigger, and it's just nice to actually own a record or something as opposed to a cd which i could just upload to my computer and then throw away
#36
Nooooooooooo, not this old debate again.
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#37
I download..but I spend too much money on purchases. In one month I ordered:

You fail me cd + Converge bumper sticker
Acrid Lp + Combat wounded veteran shirt
Chaos is me/dance tonight...
Takaru cd off of ebay
and 2 o'haste annihilation cds

I previously had the majority of that downloaded...and it ran me around $80-100(to buy legally)

I also just burnt 4 Summoning cds, but only because I'm trying to figure out which ones I want to actually buy, and no, I can't afford to buy all 4 of them, so fuck anyone against downloading, I probably still spend more than a lot of people who don't download, and can find their favourite Metallica cd at HMV.
Last edited by technicolour at Dec 22, 2009,
#38
Quote by willingvictim
cd's are boring. you get a cd.. cool. it comes in one version.. cool.

records sound way better than cd's (atleast the first 2 times you listen to them), there are different colors, the artwork is usually way cooler since it's bigger, and it's just nice to actually own a record or something as opposed to a cd which i could just upload to my computer and then throw away

Not to mention the fact that any decent label has a free download or cd in the slip, as well as free shit like posters. I got a huge Ruiner sticker when I got I Heard These Dudes Are Assholes
#39
I went to a metal show the other week. Lamb of God + Shadows Fall + High on Fire, woo for free tickets. High on Fire was selling their 12" for $50.

Buying vinyls off eBay is the way to go, my friend is lurking it 24/7 and gets some amazing vinyls for really cheap prices. eg. Coalesce Ox for $6
#40
It's like this: If I check out a band on youtube (perfectly legal), and I want to buy their junk, I'll go to their concert where I'm presented with the choice of:

-Shirt
-CD

From what I understand, they make more money off the shirt, so I'll buy that. And that'll be all that I can afford. I would feel guilty about downloading their entire catalog and trying to compensate by buying one shirt. Then again, I mostly buy used metal, because it's cheaper, and the band gets no royalties from used music. How is downloading any different from that, except that instead of giving your money to a music store, some guy is giving it to you for free?

It's a tricky issue, but I'd say this: Download the music so that you can listen to the band, because if you have all their music, then you'll probably want to go to their concerts, buy a lot of merch, go to their concert again, etc, whereas if you don't have their catalog, you won't be as heavily invested in the band. In the long run, the band will probably get more of your money if you download vs. you not downloading.
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