#1
I see that the guitars are on Rondo are worshiped as "Good guitars for a low low price", and the one guitar that REALLY caught my eye was the Douglas Fulcrum, I was wondering if any of you have any experience with this guitar and or brand.

And yes, I am aware that most of the stock pups on these guitars are utter shit, but I was going to replace them anyway.

Edit: This is the guitar, and yes, I am an extremely poor musician that's fortunate enough to have friends to help support me.
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Last edited by Scutchington at Dec 23, 2009,
#3
Quote by ThatCostsMoney
play it and see how it sounds


I would also like to point out that there is absolutely no way for me to try out the guitar in real life, you can only get the guitar straight from the rondomusic website.
No gods or kings. There is only zuul.
Quote by RU Experienced?
Now police, fire, and EMS vehicle's sirens sound in tritones. Suck it Christians, your protectors are satans minions.


I have been sigged by UG's Greek, what have YOU done today?
#4
Well, for 139 bucks it's not much of a gamble. It uses real wood (BASSWOOD), so that's something.

I just find really cheap guitars unplayable....at least not very comfortable.

But unless you're playing really articulate stuff, and you're just banging out power chords, it should be fine.
#5
I have heard nothing but good reports on all of Rondo's lineup (SX, Douglas, Agile, etc.) as well as there customer service and return policy. So you should be fairly safe.

As for playability, that has more to do with having a solid setup on the guitar then having a "cheap" guitar. I'd say order it, when it arrives check it out and play it while, then (if you are happy with it) buy new strings and put it in the shop for a proper setup.
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#6
Personally, I would never get a bolt on V. Rondo has plenty of set neck V's at or below that same price.

If the bolt-on doesn't bother you why not just find a used Jackson JS30KV or JS30RR. Should be able to pick one up within $20 of that Douglas.
#7
Quote by webwarmiller
Personally, I would never get a bolt on V. Rondo has plenty of set neck V's at or below that same price.

If the bolt-on doesn't bother you why not just find a used Jackson JS30KV or JS30RR. Should be able to pick one up within $20 of that Douglas.


You do know that a set neck doesn't get any better sound then a bolt-on, right?

OT: I would buy it, I've heard rondo has great customer service and return policy, so if you hate it, you can just return it.
Last edited by SlayingDragons at Dec 23, 2009,
#8
Quote by SlayingDragons
You do know that a set neck doesn't get any better sound then a bolt-on, right?


It's not about the sound, it's about the playability. V's (and SG's for that matter) are designed for a set neck with easy high fret access. The bolt-on versions of either lose this significant aspect of the design.
#9
Quote by webwarmiller
Personally, I would never get a bolt on V. Rondo has plenty of set neck V's at or below that same price.

If the bolt-on doesn't bother you why not just find a used Jackson JS30KV or JS30RR. Should be able to pick one up within $20 of that Douglas.


Umm, first off, I have a JS30RR and it is shit. I'm looking at selling it to buy a fulcrum right now and put a JB in the bridge of the fulcrum. The low price Jacksons pretty much suck as far as what you get for the price. The pickups stink, they don't play that good, and they really don't have any good features. A LTD V-50 would be a better bang for the buck name brand guitar. Also, bolt-on necks transfer something like 60% more treble form the vibration of the strings to the body than set necks because glue doesn't transfer treble as well as metal. That's why Ed Roman says a bolt-IN , and yes I do mean IN not on, is the best because it's got the same reachability and more treble. If you want gloomy, bassy, death metal tones a set might be better tho.
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#10
Douglas are good. I've bought an SIV-45 from them, and it blew me away. It was $100 without shipping, but played better than my $200 Ibanez RG. For the price, they're very well built. Hardware is decent, not bad. Also, there's nowhere to go but up. Douglas guitars are practically templates for upgrading.
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#12
Quote by IbanezDudeCK
Umm, first off, I have a JS30RR and it is shit. I'm looking at selling it to buy a fulcrum right now and put a JB in the bridge of the fulcrum. The low price Jacksons pretty much suck as far as what you get for the price. The pickups stink, they don't play that good, and they really don't have any good features. A LTD V-50 would be a better bang for the buck name brand guitar. Also, bolt-on necks transfer something like 60% more treble form the vibration of the strings to the body than set necks because glue doesn't transfer treble as well as metal. That's why Ed Roman says a bolt-IN , and yes I do mean IN not on, is the best because it's got the same reachability and more treble. If you want gloomy, bassy, death metal tones a set might be better tho.


Off topic; You sir, are an idiot. Really, what the hell? How can treble be transferred from the strings into the body? Its just vibrations, not actual sounds.

I dont see why people bitch about bolt-ons soo much, Fender, Charvel, Kramer etc etc all use bolt-ons, and there are no problems with these.

On topicl Id say go for the guitar, Nothing to lose.
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#13
Quote by TomG10-7
Off topic; You sir, are an idiot. Really, what the hell? How can treble be transferred from the strings into the body? Its just vibrations, not actual sounds.

I dont see why people bitch about bolt-ons soo much, Fender, Charvel, Kramer etc etc all use bolt-ons, and there are no problems with these.

On topicl Id say go for the guitar, Nothing to lose.


Don't get all pissy at me, I'm just stating what Ed Roman, the owner of one of the world's biggest custom shops, says. I read a huge article on his site about bolt on and bolt in vs. set and thru necks and that's exactly what he said- bolts transfer more treble. HE says that if you want any loose, funky vibes, twangy treble, or a loose tone, it is impossible to get from a set neck because it doesn't transfer as much treble. I'm only saying what he said and seeing as he has made custom guitars for Leslie West of Mountain, Ted Nugent, and tons of other celebrities, I think he knows what he is talking about.

Here's the link if you don't believe me: line 30 of the written text inside the black border box, just below the picture.
http://www.edroman.com/techarticles/NeckMountingMyths.htm
Axes:
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Ibanez RG320FM
LTD GUS600
Kramer Striker
Acoustics:
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Stupid Ovation CC
Washburn 12 String
Amps:
Randall Colossus Head
Randall Century 170 Cab/Head
Fender Acoustasonic
Last edited by IbanezDudeCK at May 8, 2010,
#14
Quote by IbanezDudeCK
Don't get all pissy at me, I'm just stating what Ed Roman, the owner of one of the world's biggest custom shops, says. I read a huge article on his site about bolt on and bolt in vs. set and thru necks and that's exactly what he said- bolts transfer more treble. HE says that if you want any loose, funky vibes, twangy treble, or a loose tone, it is impossible to get from a set neck because it doesn't transfer as much treble. I'm only saying what he said and seeing as he has made custom guitars for Leslie West of Mountain, Ted Nugent, and tons of other celebrities, I think he knows what he is talking about.

Here's the link if you don't believe me: line 30 of the written text inside the black border box, just below the picture.
http://www.edroman.com/techarticles/NeckMountingMyths.htm


Ed Roman is a fool

Sustain and vibration transfer depends on the construction of how a neck is set. A super snug bolt-on neck could have just as much sustain as a neck-through. That said, a poorly constructed neck-through could have horrible sustain

Set-necks can have the least amount of sustain because the glue isn't completely solid or very hard, so you lose sustain because of the glue.

Set-through necks would have more sustain than a neck-through because the neck is more inside the body, meaning the guitar is built more sturdy and will have more sustain because its more solid.

But I mean, what do I know? I mean, come on there's only a million funk and country bands out there that use Telecasters and Strats, and obviously they don't get twangy treble notes or any funky vibe whatsoever... Ed Roman clearly knows far more than me.
#15
Quote by r0ckth3d34n
Ed Roman is a fool

Sustain and vibration transfer depends on the construction of how a neck is set. A super snug bolt-on neck could have just as much sustain as a neck-through. That said, a poorly constructed neck-through could have horrible sustain

Set-necks can have the least amount of sustain because the glue isn't completely solid or very hard, so you lose sustain because of the glue.

Set-through necks would have more sustain than a neck-through because the neck is more inside the body, meaning the guitar is built more sturdy and will have more sustain because its more solid.

But I mean, what do I know? I mean, come on there's only a million funk and country bands out there that use Telecasters and Strats, and obviously they don't get twangy treble notes or any funky vibe whatsoever... Ed Roman clearly knows far more than me.


First off, did you even read the article? It was primarily about how bolt-ons have a bad name because they were done correctly and a good, snug bolt on is just as good as any other joint so that sums up your first 3 paragraphs. Second, country music is known to have the most twangy guitars of most any genre. That's why they use fenders- its got a loose twang to it. That's also why i assume most of them don't use ceramic magnet pickups- so the magnets are weaker and allow more of a loose feel as Seymour Duncan said in an interview about why he uses Alnico II pickups and a tele. I'm not talking about sharp piercing tinging or tinking, im talking about twanging. Funk and country music are full of twang because that's the tone that the music started with- as soon as teles were released the pretty much became THE guitar for country twang.
NOTE- I'm not trying to be a jerk, I'm just saying, you should read the article before you comment. Also, I can't tell if you're trying to be sarcastic or a jerk with the italicized obviously
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Last edited by IbanezDudeCK at May 8, 2010,
#16
You'll find that Ed Roman has little to no respect in the guitar community of nearly every musicians' site out there.
#17
Quote by Vlasco
You'll find that Ed Roman has little to no respect in the guitar community of nearly every musicians' site out there.


I haven't read many of his articles but this one seems to make complete sense to me as far as the more treble thing goes. Think about it, what's the difference between a tele and a LP? No carved maple top and a bolt on neck. Since maple tops supposedly add treble and the tele still has more treble twang, even if it has humbuckers, a bolt on must add that twangy clean sound. That's why more country/bluegrass players use teles as apposed to LPs and why more funk players use strats as apposed to SGs. If you say this article is BS, you are basically saying the Paul Reed Smith and Seymour Duncan know nothing about guitars because they've said pretty much the same thing.
Axes:
Ibanez RG7321
Ibanez RG320FM
LTD GUS600
Kramer Striker
Acoustics:
Art & Lutherie CW Antique Burst
Stupid Ovation CC
Washburn 12 String
Amps:
Randall Colossus Head
Randall Century 170 Cab/Head
Fender Acoustasonic
#18
what you seem to not understand is that there isn't actually any sound coming from the guitar. guitar pickups work on vibrations. therefore, what style of neck joint you have doesn't affect sound, just how long and how the string vibrates.

also, Ed Roman should never be trusted when it comes to talking about guitars, he has a long history of being a complete idiot who does not know what he is talking about, and likes to make claims as to what he knows and the quality of his guitars.
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Last edited by aradine at May 9, 2010,
#19
i too have been wondering the quality of these guitars. im very interested in one of their randy rhodes styled guitars, but i do not know if it would be worth it
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#20
Quote by aradine
what you seem to not understand is that there isn't actually any sound coming from the guitar. guitar pickups work on vibrations. therefore, what style of neck joint you have doesn't affect sound, just how long and how the string vibrates.

also, Ed Roman should never be trusted when it comes to talking about guitars, he has a long history of being a complete idiot who does not know what he is talking about, and likes to make claims as to what he knows and the quality of his guitars.


Even if that is so, the actual build of the guitar still has some effect on the sound of a guitar. Why else would there be TONE woods and JUNK woods. If the type of wood used makes a difference, why shouldn't the way the wood is put together make a difference? It just seems to make sense that most death metal guitarists use Neck-thru on a mahogany body guitar because it gives it a deeper tone. That also explains why LP players tend to hate the guts out of Fenders (even the ones with humbuckers)- the woods and construction give it a different tone. This one to me seems to add up. All the low end $200 LTDs use the LH-150 pickups but they all sound a little different because of the body size and woods. The $400 M series sounds way different from the $400 EC series and I personally think it's because of the neck construction that these differences seem to get so much greater because they still have the same pickups.
Axes:
Ibanez RG7321
Ibanez RG320FM
LTD GUS600
Kramer Striker
Acoustics:
Art & Lutherie CW Antique Burst
Stupid Ovation CC
Washburn 12 String
Amps:
Randall Colossus Head
Randall Century 170 Cab/Head
Fender Acoustasonic
#21
Quote by IbanezDudeCK
Even if that is so, the actual build of the guitar still has some effect on the sound of a guitar. Why else would there be TONE woods and JUNK woods. If the type of wood used makes a difference, why shouldn't the way the wood is put together make a difference? It just seems to make sense that most death metal guitarists use Neck-thru on a mahogany body guitar because it gives it a deeper tone. That also explains why LP players tend to hate the guts out of Fenders (even the ones with humbuckers)- the woods and construction give it a different tone. This one to me seems to add up. All the low end $200 LTDs use the LH-150 pickups but they all sound a little different because of the body size and woods. The $400 M series sounds way different from the $400 EC series and I personally think it's because of the neck construction that these differences seem to get so much greater because they still have the same pickups.


What he's saying is that the guitar itself is not producing the sound of the strings. The vibration of the tension of the strings is what makes the sound, and the tone wood effect the sound in various ways, and the neck joint effects how it vibrates.

You're getting into why guitars sound different. It's rather obvious why a Fender Tele is going to sound different than a Gibson Les Paul. Gibson Les Pauls are about a half inch thicker than Tele's, and are made of a more dense wood. Not to mention, the maple top adds a touch of brightness to the highs, so they're not as muddy. The humbuckers add a much deeper tone. The 24.75" scale keeps the sound more loose and bluesy.

Fender Tele's are made of what, Alder, Ash? First off, those are way less dense than Mahogany. They typically have much more emphasized mids and highs. The single coils add the twang and brightness. Even a Tele with humbuckers won't sound as full as a Les Paul because the body woods....

If you think most death metal guitarists use neck-thru mahogany guitars, you should ask the guitarist of Bring Me the Horizon, Children of Bodom, Dethklok, Divine Hersey, Lamb of God, The Red Chord and Whitechapel like to play....
#22
Quote by IbanezDudeCK
I haven't read many of his articles but this one seems to make complete sense to me as far as the more treble thing goes. Think about it, what's the difference between a tele and a LP? No carved maple top and a bolt on neck. Since maple tops supposedly add treble and the tele still has more treble twang, even if it has humbuckers, a bolt on must add that twangy clean sound. That's why more country/bluegrass players use teles as apposed to LPs and why more funk players use strats as apposed to SGs. If you say this article is BS, you are basically saying the Paul Reed Smith and Seymour Duncan know nothing about guitars because they've said pretty much the same thing.



A bolt on probably adds a bit of treble but not nearly to the extreme that Roman says. Really it's the pickups that are very mellow on LPs and very twangy on Teles among other design differences. I've had teles and strats that I put humbuckers on and the twang went away completely. My neck through guitar with a single coil is very twangy to the point that most people think it's a tele when I send recordings of it.
#23
Off topic a bit, but a lot of the Tele's twang comes from the fact the bridge pickup is mounted directly onto a metal bridge plate.
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