#1
Does anyone feel that when they are asked about a band or musician or asked to listen to a piece of music, they aren't allowed to give any personal opinion whatsoever? I mean, i know that as a music student and prospective musician/producer/engineer/whatever you are meant to look at things from an impartial viewpoint, but i feel that when i give any sort of personal opinion on something it is immediately jumped on, and sometimes the debate even seems loaded.

Now i know of and like quite alot of music, some music i know of but have never heard, some i know but don't like, but when trying to explain why i don't like a certain band, some of the points i make would sound a bit weak, but only because it is a personal opinion, for example, if someone asked me to evaluate a Christina Aguilera song, i might say "i don't particularly like the fact that the drums sound artificial, as it dosen't suit the fact that her voice and piano sound more organic and natural", but then again someone else might think the treatment of the drums makes it better.

TL;DR- Do you guys think it seems impossible to put in a personal opinion of a piece of music when having a debate about it in a music class, even if that opinion is relavent?
WHOMP

Think of that next time you are not allowed to laugh.
#2
Quote by donender
Do you guys think it seems impossible to put in a personal opinion of a piece of music when having a debate about it in a music class, even if that opinion is relavent?

No. I give my opinion in all music projects.

chedit: Oh, right. Music analysis has nothing to do with opinion. You just have to figure out the structure, key, other musical aspects and so on.
Last edited by chaoticfables at Dec 25, 2009,
#3
If you are analysing how the piece is put together from a musical perspective then your opinion isn't warranted at all.

It's the same as being an art critic asked to judge the likeness of a painting of a fruit bowl and saying 'Well I'm allergic to oranges actually, so I think it's shit'.
#5
Quote by Casketcreep
If you are analysing how the piece is put together from a musical perspective then your opinion isn't warranted at all.

It's the same as being an art critic asked to judge the likeness of a painting of a fruit bowl and saying 'Well I'm allergic to oranges actually, so I think it's shit'.

Exactly.
#6
Quote by Casketcreep
If you are analysing how the piece is put together from a musical perspective then your opinion isn't warranted at all.

It's the same as being an art critic asked to judge the likeness of a painting of a fruit bowl and saying 'Well I'm allergic to oranges actually, so I think it's shit'.


No it isn't, if the picture was of say, a beautifully painted boat, then right in the middle of it was a picture of a dog that had been painted by a three year old, its like saying "the style of the dog isn't in keeping with the rest of the painting, some might say its better to stick to one style or the other".

I should have rephrased the question really, if they asked you what songs you do like and what songs you don't like, have you ever had the problem of them jumping on you for saying you don't like a certain song, then when you explain why it still dosen't seem sufficient.
WHOMP

Think of that next time you are not allowed to laugh.
#7
That's not a problem music students have. I think you just have a dickish teacher.

Unless of course you mean that they are deliberately making you justify your own choices and understand why you enjoy the music you do. In which case they are perfectly right in doing so.
#8
In your opinion you don't really have to justify it. I mean if you don't like it you don't like it. If you're a metal head and you don't like a Christina Agulera(spelling fail idc) song someone saying "But her voice is very in time and flows so well with the music " isn't going to change your mind.

In a musical analysis your evaluating the structure of the piece and not what you personally think of it so I don't see the relevancy of this thread >.> . seems a pretty simple concept to me.
Quote by saxaxe
YESI love you.


Quote by Wulphy
Ever stuck their finger in their ass, just to see what it was like? I did


Quote by thewho65
My sister has a big ass
#9
Quote by Casketcreep
That's not a problem music students have. I think you just have a dickish teacher.

Unless of course you mean that they are deliberately making you justify your own choices and understand why you enjoy the music you do. In which case they are perfectly right in doing so.


Yeah i had a uni interview earlier this year and i'm not gonna go into the details right now but basically they asked me what sort of bands i do like and what i don't like, i was kind of all over the place in terms of what style of music i listened to, but i told them about one band i didn't like, and they asked me why i didn't, at first i simply said it wasn't my cup of tea, but they made me justify it, and i did, and said i can see why some people do like it, and gave reasons why, but then they just started ****ing with me and talking to me as if i was just ignorant to everything.

Anyway i digress, this was kind of inspired by another thread because i find that music teachers seem to be really into Jazz and Classical music and if someone says they don't like a piece for xyz reason, the teachers seem to disregard it just because of the genre or artist.

Quote by IronNecrosis
In your opinion you don't really have to justify it. I mean if you don't like it you don't like it. If you're a metal head and you don't like a Christina Agulera(spelling fail idc) song someone saying "But her voice is very in time and flows so well with the music " isn't going to change your mind.

In a musical analysis your evaluating the structure of the piece and not what you personally think of it so I don't see the relevancy of this thread >.> . seems a pretty simple concept to me.


Yeah but when evaluating it, i think it seems more acceptable for someone to say "the crescendo in this section creates tension very well", rather than "i think the bassline in this section does not work particularly well with the guitar as the tones conflict".
WHOMP

Think of that next time you are not allowed to laugh.
Last edited by donender at Dec 25, 2009,
#10
Quote by donender
No it isn't, if the picture was of say, a beautifully painted boat, then right in the middle of it was a picture of a dog that had been painted by a three year old, its like saying "the style of the dog isn't in keeping with the rest of the painting, some might say its better to stick to one style or the other".

I should have rephrased the question really, if they asked you what songs you do like and what songs you don't like, have you ever had the problem of them jumping on you for saying you don't like a certain song, then when you explain why it still dosen't seem sufficient.


I don't feel I need to have anymore justification than I like the style/feel of it really. It's your personal choice why should it matter. If it's just for conversations sake and they're not being defensive about it I'd probably just discuss what I don't like about that style of music or lyrics of the song ect. You shouldn't feel you need to justify much more than that or at all really.
Quote by saxaxe
YESI love you.


Quote by Wulphy
Ever stuck their finger in their ass, just to see what it was like? I did


Quote by thewho65
My sister has a big ass
#11
Depends what the aim of the discussion is. If it's to look at the composition or technical aspects, your opinion is irrelevant. If it's an informal talk amongst students about a particular piece then opinion may have a place... but since it's a music class after all, can't you leave your personal taste for when it's more appropriate?
#12
Maybe they get hundreds of guys applying with their Les Pauls slung over their backs thinking they are the next Angus Young and are damn sick of it.

-"What style of music do you listen to primarily"
-"Heavy metal dude." *throws horns and puts tongue out*
*Everyone thinks he's a tool, and unanimously rejects him*
*Young metal head goes onto guitar forum and bitches about what he believes is bigotry towards heavy metal, when in fact it's because he doesn't want to work on music, he just want's to play solos over that one scale he learned 7 years ago.*

In the right area here?
#13
Quote by Casketcreep
Maybe they get hundreds of guys applying with their Les Pauls slung over their backs thinking they are the next Angus Young and are damn sick of it.

-"What style of music do you listen to primarily"
-"Heavy metal dude." *throws horns and puts tongue out*
*Everyone thinks he's a tool, and unanimously rejects him*
*Young metal head goes onto guitar forum and bitches about what he believes is bigotry towards heavy metal, when in fact it's because he doesn't want to work on music, he just want's to play solos over that one scale he learned 7 years ago.*

In the right area here?


I didn't see many people who looked like that at the interview but it wouldn't suprise me if they have seen a fair few people like it, i am not just dismissing what you have to say, i can see your point completely but when evaluating something (in terms of the structure and whether the song works well or not), negative points are usually challenged and stand out more than positive points, even if you do recognise the good points to a song you may not like.
WHOMP

Think of that next time you are not allowed to laugh.
#14
im a music major in college

its probably not important for a music student to determine whether a piece is good or bad, you just have to be able to understand.

youre not better able to determine whether or not something is good ebcasue youre a music student, the value of music is completely subjective
Member of the Frank Zappa Fan Club, PM deadhead313313

People Wouldn't know good music if it hit them in face
- Frank Zappa

Gear:
Carvin CT3
Digitech GNX3
Peavey Classic 30
#15
If they ever brow-beat your opinion, just say "In an area as subjective as music you can't prove anything." If I say that Slash's solos are too similar to one another, or that Kirk Hammett uses too much WahWah, you can't say I'm empirically wrong because it's an opinion. All music is is sound defined by opinion.

/philosophy
...
#19
I got all 4's on an assignment in which I said Paganinni lacked any compositional talent, was uninteresting and a novelty/ gimmick at best, and amounted to nothing more than self indulgent wankery.

So yeah, I don't really have the problem here.