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#2
I've owned Studios in the past. Gibson LPs are decent, but they're very overpriced and the quality control is shit. My advice would be to get a Carvin instead. It'll probably be cheaper, and it'll definitely be made better.

Gibsons hold their value much better, but you're a guitarist, not a stockbroker.
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Last edited by Sunn_O))) at Dec 28, 2009,
#3
Gibson is way overpriced here in Europe. If you want Les Paul I suggest you to take a look at a good Japanese copy. My recommendation would be a Tokai LS100 which is way cheaper than the Gibby Standard but will very likely deliver the same level of quality.

Or why not import directly a ESP/Edwards E-LP model. Even with customs and shipping the final price will still be a chunk cheaper.
G͔͓̅e͎͉̟̽ͬ͐̎̃͐ͨͅå͈͖͕̹̤̟̐̏͋ͅr̩͕̫̰̗s̹̳̼ͥ̒̍̄̅ͥ̚:


ESP Standard Eclipse I CTM VW
ESP LTD Deluxe H-1001
ESP LTD Deluxe Viper-1000 STBC
ESP Edwards E-EX-100STD
Warmoth Paulcaster "Tiger"
Tanglewood TW170 AS
Vox Tonelab ST
Blackstar HT-1R


Last edited by hminh87 at Dec 28, 2009,
#4
Im affraid I've got my heart set on a les paul, I absolutely love the tone you get through a les paul and a marshall. Stuck between these two guitars though, the weight isnt an issue at all as i think they are about 10 pounds which is next to nothing really and i like to be able to feel the guitar.
#5
You're getting suckered into marketing/fanboy myths. Carvins (and probably many other brands, especially those that sell direct) sound just as good as Gibsons, if not better, at a lower price. Carvins are absolutely better in the materials/workmanship department.
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#7
If you're dead-set on a Gibson Les Paul...
Basically I don't think there are any bigger different between those two you listed. The only noticeable different would be the neck profile (between '50 and '60). I personally would go for the slimmer '60 profile but if you have big hand and can handle the more chunky '50 neck then I say go for it. Thicker neck = more sustain (as if '60 doesnt give enough already :P)
G͔͓̅e͎͉̟̽ͬ͐̎̃͐ͨͅå͈͖͕̹̤̟̐̏͋ͅr̩͕̫̰̗s̹̳̼ͥ̒̍̄̅ͥ̚:


ESP Standard Eclipse I CTM VW
ESP LTD Deluxe H-1001
ESP LTD Deluxe Viper-1000 STBC
ESP Edwards E-EX-100STD
Warmoth Paulcaster "Tiger"
Tanglewood TW170 AS
Vox Tonelab ST
Blackstar HT-1R


#8
You came to the wrong place to ask about Les Pauls. These idiots will tell you not to get one regardless of your question.
#9
I've really big hands compared to most people, well normal size hands and really long fingers so I'd not mind a thicker neck. Anybody know the difference in the pickups? Im into Led Zep style music but versatility is a must. From what I've read theyr both versatile and the traditional I played today was great on all the pickups, the rythm one especially.
#10
Yeah, don't listen to the Les Paul hate. THe guy asked which Les paul between the two and the first three responses were high and mighty "Get something else" BS.

It depends on your neck preference, but I'd say get the regular traditional and not the Pro. I like the covered pickup look and the thick 50's neck is AWESOME! Wouldnt trade my Traditional plus for anything. Don't worry about quality control either. The plek'd neck on the traditionals is awesome......the fretwork on mine was flawless.
#11
Quote by GuitarDTO
Yeah, don't listen to the Les Paul hate. THe guy asked which Les paul between the two and the first three responses were high and mighty "Get something else" BS.



If he asked whether to get a Pinto or a Yugo, I would have told him to get a Miata.

Letting him know he can get a better guitar at a lower price is better advice than recommending one of the two inferior guitars that marketing and fanboy worship made him consider in the first place.
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#12
Quote by Sunn_O)))
If he asked whether to get a Pinto or a Yugo, I would have told him to get a Miata.

Letting him know he can get a better guitar at a lower price is better advice than recommending one of the two inferior guitars that marketing and fanboy worship made him consider in the first place.
And you can get a better guitar than a Carvin buy having one custom made by a local luthier using whatever high end woods that you want at the same price point as a Carvin, with better construction and better materials. What is your point?

Some people just want a les paul, and if they want a les paul, how about answering his question about les pauls instead of insinuating that he's an idiot who is falling for marketing schemes and not even trying to give feedback to what he actually asked.

Apparently, this forum has become so "well-informed" that no one answers any questions anymore. A guy can't even ask a question about a Gibson les paul without 1) being insulted and 2) getting no answer except, buy a different guitar. A question like this would be answered on the Les Paul forum or the Gear Page within a post or two, but those forums are all full of uninformed where fanboy worship and marketing prevail right? This also goes for Marshalls, and EMGs.
Last edited by al112987 at Dec 29, 2009,
#13
Quote by al112987
And you can get a better guitar than a Carvin buy having one custom made by a local luthier using whatever high end woods that you want at the same price point as a Carvin, with better construction and better materials. What is your point?



If that's possible for him, and he has the patience for it, he should do that. As I mentioned before, there are probably other brands around that are better and cheaper than Gibson besides Carvin. My whole point is there are much better options than Gibson and that he should not get caught up in the hype.
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#14
But the guy has his eyes set on a les paul.

Whether it's better for him or not is completely up to him. In the end, it's not like he's asking for suggestions of a 2 humbucker 4 control guitar, it's a comparison between two similar model les pauls. In my experience, if you're heart is set on a les paul, then you might as well just get a les paul because anything else obviously isn't going to fill that void, whether it's spurred on by hype or not.

I don't know how determined he is for a les paul, but for me personally, if I have my eyes dead set on a sunburst les paul (ala Page's burst or Clapton's burst), then I'm not going to be satisfied with anything other than a les paul (granted, I find one that sounds and plays well, but regardless...) you can go ahead and call it shallow or that I'm paying too much for a guitar, but as far as I'm concerned, if I'm getting what I want, then it's not too much if I can afford it.
#15
Quote by Sunn_O)))
If that's possible for him, and he has the patience for it, he should do that. As I mentioned before, there are probably other brands around that are better and cheaper than Gibson besides Carvin. My whole point is there are much better options than Gibson and that he should not get caught up in the hype.


Yes but Carvin's are almost exclusively cheap if you live in the American market. And given that TS is working off the Thomann site then I'd doubt that a Carvin would be of better value when you look at stuff like shipping and handling, vat etc. to get to his home market.
#16
When it comes to Gibsons, each one of them varies to a massive degree. Don't look online. Go to every store you can physically get to and try out all of the ones they have in stock. Don't stop until you've tried all of them. Then, once you've played them all, buy the one that felt and sounded best to you. Pay no attention to what the model name is, disregard any reviews you might have read, it doesn't matter what the guys in the shop say, it doesn't matter if it's a little cheaper online. Every single Gibson is different, even two of the same model that came out the factory at the same time on the same day will be different. Considering you're looking at buying a guitar that should hopefully last you a lifetime, don't settle for second best and don't gamble on an online purchase. Try the ones out in the shops, buy the one that works for you. If you can't find one in a shop that plays and sounds how you want it to then don't settle for a substitute, wait for the stores to get more in or consider travelling further away to try others. Personally, I drove from the South West all the way to the far South East just to try a few LPs and luckily I found one there which was perfect for me - but that was after hours of driving and after having played many, many other Gibsons first which were all crap.
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#17
Was just using the links as a reference, and im in the UK. I've not got caught up in the Gibson hype but think for the sound i want they're the perfect guitar through my marshall amp, planning to get many more after though. Plus they're absolutely stunning to look at.
#18
Quote by MrFlibble
When it comes to Gibsons, each one of them varies to a massive degree. Don't look online. Go to every store you can physically get to and try out all of the ones they have in stock. Don't stop until you've tried all of them. Then, once you've played them all, buy the one that felt and sounded best to you. Pay no attention to what the model name is, disregard any reviews you might have read, it doesn't matter what the guys in the shop say, it doesn't matter if it's a little cheaper online. Every single Gibson is different, even two of the same model that came out the factory at the same time on the same day will be different. Considering you're looking at buying a guitar that should hopefully last you a lifetime, don't settle for second best and don't gamble on an online purchase. Try the ones out in the shops, buy the one that works for you. If you can't find one in a shop that plays and sounds how you want it to then don't settle for a substitute, wait for the stores to get more in or consider travelling further away to try others. Personally, I drove from the South West all the way to the far South East just to try a few LPs and luckily I found one there which was perfect for me - but that was after hours of driving and after having played many, many other Gibsons first which were all crap.


Just to counter this, my experiences were the exact opposite of Flibble's. I tried about 10 different Les Pauls at a Guitar Center here in the states (Illinois), and 8 of them were worthy of buying to me. Perfect quality, no obvious cosmetic flaws, and no discernible difference in tone minus the pickup differences (I tried standards, traditionals and studios). The only 2 I didnt like were both studios and both had a few cosmetic flaws. So, I decided I wanted a traditional plus and I ordered it online. Ordering online is not as bad as some make it out to be, and with Musiciansfriend it is no gamble whatsoever. At the most, it is just an inconvenience if you don't end up liking what you get. My LP came flawless cosmetically and fretwork out of the box. Some minor tweaking of the action was all I needed. Mine DID however have an electronic problem. They missed one of the ground solders, so there was some buzzing and one of my volume tone pots wasnt working properly. I took it to my local gibson repair, they spotted the missed solder in 3 minutes, soldered it, didnt even bother filling out a warranty repair form, and for my inconvenience Musiciansfriend gave me a $50 gift card on top of the 20% discount they gave me on the guitar.

My point, each one of them do not vary as massively as Flibble would like you to believe, at least in the states. I'd order over and over again online with no second thoughts.
#19
every guitar company has flawed models, ive played custom carvins that sounded horrible and had a super tight feel, ive played high end japanese esps with the same issue it comes down to playing the guitar, hell i have an epi les paul studio, mid 90s that plays better than my gibson custom, it all comes down to trying them, i love les pauls, out of the two your looking at, id lean towards the one with uncovered pickups, because they just sound hotter without the covers, thats just me ultimately its up 2 you, i dont think either will dissapoint though
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#20
If your heart is set on a Les Paul, but it doesn't have to be a Gibson, Check out an Epiphone Standard Plus or Custom. Yes there made in China, but there way cheaper and if you want you can always just change out the pickups for Gibsons or some SDs or somethings and still have a good chunk of change to put towards an amp or some pedals.
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#21
Has to be a Gibson sorry, I've played epis and although they're good it just doesnt compare to a Gibson for me. I already have an amp I love and want to get saving for either a really nice acoustic or rackmount effects after this as I'm not too keen on pedals.
#22
I was admiring a Les Paul traditional the other day in Guitar Centre here in Calgary. It was 2400.00 CDN (fair price here) and looked gorgeous. I didn't play it though, if it played as good as it looked, I would've wanted to buy it and now's not a good time for me. I'd also take the advice of LP haters who only own lower end guitars with a grain of salt. Most of them seem to prefer the more modern feeling guitars with thin necks and more Strat style designs which is fine but they obviously wouldn't appreciate a true LP as it is so different from their preferences.
Moving on.....
#23
Quote by GuitarDTO
Just to counter this, my experiences were the exact opposite of Flibble's. I tried about 10 different Les Pauls at a Guitar Center here in the states (Illinois), and 8 of them were worthy of buying to me. Perfect quality, no obvious cosmetic flaws, and no discernible difference in tone minus the pickup differences (I tried standards, traditionals and studios). The only 2 I didnt like were both studios and both had a few cosmetic flaws. So, I decided I wanted a traditional plus and I ordered it online. Ordering online is not as bad as some make it out to be, and with Musiciansfriend it is no gamble whatsoever. At the most, it is just an inconvenience if you don't end up liking what you get. My LP came flawless cosmetically and fretwork out of the box. Some minor tweaking of the action was all I needed. Mine DID however have an electronic problem. They missed one of the ground solders, so there was some buzzing and one of my volume tone pots wasnt working properly. I took it to my local gibson repair, they spotted the missed solder in 3 minutes, soldered it, didnt even bother filling out a warranty repair form, and for my inconvenience Musiciansfriend gave me a $50 gift card on top of the 20% discount they gave me on the guitar.

My point, each one of them do not vary as massively as Flibble would like you to believe, at least in the states. I'd order over and over again online with no second thoughts.

I get what you're saying to a certain extent, but there really is a lot of variation from guitar to guitar, especially with necks, they have certain tolerance of differing nut widths, neck angles etc... which they even give you an estimate of how much variation there will be on the model's specs on the website. And i've never found 2 gibsons that sound anywhere near identical. Maybe you need to try those guitars through decent amps (instead of the crap amps they usually plug everything into in most shops) or perhaps even train your ear to hear the differences a bit better, because no 2 pieces of wood will ever have exactly the same resonant properties - that's just a fact of life.

So they may be quite consistent, quality-wise, but the dimensions do vary, and it really is the difference between loving a guitar and hating it in many cases. Of course, it's a matter of chancing upon one that's just right and honestly, you can't know if it's just right until you play it, and most people who buy online tend to just make do with a guitar if it's "good enough" for them even though it may not be exactly how they want it to be, but when you're paying that much for a guitar i think it's perfectly fair to be picky and make sure you get one that's just right.
I like analogue Solid State amps that make no effort to be "tube-like", and I'm proud of it...

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#24
I love the way a Les Paul sounds, and I love how they play.
I do not, however, think that the new ones are a good value, as far as the money you're paying for the guitar you're getting.
But, that is just MY personal opinion.

I TOTALLY agree with trying out the ACTUAL guitar (preferably with YOUR amp as well) you're going to buy, if you're going to be paying that much money for it.
Don't be afraid to be picky!
#25
Ok check it out, all these people telling you not to get a Les Paul or a Gibson because they're crap are usually people who can't afford them. So to better answer your question, its a matter of personal preference. The two are basically the same. Your going to get the same sound out of both, varying pretty much only through the amps you use.

The "Traditional" model has a thick ass neck on it. Thats the difference between what they call the "50's Neck profile" and the "60's Neck profile". The 50's profile is thick, and the 60's is alot thinner.

I have a 1960 LP and I'll be the first to tell you that it smokes all the other Les Paul's I've played because the neck is alot faster. They sound the same, but play differently.
#26
Quote by Blompcube
I get what you're saying to a certain extent, but there really is a lot of variation from guitar to guitar, especially with necks, they have certain tolerance of differing nut widths, neck angles etc... which they even give you an estimate of how much variation there will be on the model's specs on the website. And i've never found 2 gibsons that sound anywhere near identical. Maybe you need to try those guitars through decent amps (instead of the crap amps they usually plug everything into in most shops) or perhaps even train your ear to hear the differences a bit better, because no 2 pieces of wood will ever have exactly the same resonant properties - that's just a fact of life.

So they may be quite consistent, quality-wise, but the dimensions do vary, and it really is the difference between loving a guitar and hating it in many cases. Of course, it's a matter of chancing upon one that's just right and honestly, you can't know if it's just right until you play it, and most people who buy online tend to just make do with a guitar if it's "good enough" for them even though it may not be exactly how they want it to be, but when you're paying that much for a guitar i think it's perfectly fair to be picky and make sure you get one that's just right.


I never said it wasnt perfectly fair to be picky. To each his own. I'm not picky enough to where the subtle differences in tone from guitar to guitar will make or break it for me. To me, my playing has more effect on the tone than anything, so I am not going to stress over finding some impossibly exact tone therefore the "Good enough" of online ordering is just that....even with an expensive guitar. Quality and fretwork are the main things I look for.
#27
Quote by Sunn_O)))
You're getting suckered into marketing/fanboy myths. Carvins (and probably many other brands, especially those that sell direct) sound just as good as Gibsons, if not better, at a lower price. Carvins are absolutely better in the materials/workmanship department.



or maybe he just likes a les paul? saying a carvin sound slike a less paul is a joke. the band that your user name is after uses LPs. i guess they are just fan boys though right?


TS, out of both of them the second one offers a bit more due to the coil taps. its up to you. if they feel good and you like the tone flip a coin.
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#28
I don't really like the Trad Pro, as it feels cheaper than the trad, which feels like an epiphone when compared to a Classic or a standard.

edit: Consider the others, but out of the two, I's get the first one, the traditional.
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Last edited by Pencil Man at Dec 29, 2009,
#29
yeah man do what you want to do. but in all respects, all guitars are different to a degree. done people assemble them? thus every guitar ever made is different than thier respective model brothers.

kinda like how clapton got his black strat? bought 10 strats, gave like 4 away, and assemled 1 from 6 guitars worth of the "best" parts? same thing.

i have a epi les paul custom and it was bought set up perfect. my roomate whos dad has a guitar collection loves my guitar and says my epi plays better than his dads les paul, and almost soynds as good (not quite, cause the gibson of course has better pickups). he says its close though.

all depends. but yeah if your dropping that money make sure you play it, then make sure it looks good to you, and then make sure its either set up well, or get it set up well. no sense not hearing or feeling a guitar that cost that much.
#30
Quote by Crohny
or maybe he just likes a les paul? saying a carvin sound slike a less paul is a joke. the band that your user name is after uses LPs. i guess they are just fan boys though right?




They also use some other brand that utilizes a metal neck. The name escapes me, but it must have killer sustain.

Maybe they are fanboys, though. Do I have to like every single thing they do just because I like their music?

Quote by aaron66
Ok check it out, all these people telling you not to get a Les Paul or a Gibson because they're crap are usually people who can't afford them.



I've owned two. Also, do you realize how much of a snob that makes you sound like?
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Last edited by Sunn_O))) at Dec 30, 2009,
#31
Quote by Sunn_O)))
They also use some other brand that utilizes a metal neck. The name escapes me, but it must have killer sustain.

Maybe they are fanboys, though. Do I have to like every single thing they do just because I like their music?





you can like whatever you want, but dont be narrow minded. there is a reason people use gibson. they arent shitty guitars and there arent a lot of companies that are better. the carvins iv played werent anything special and surely didnt feel better or sound better than a LP. its all personal preference, but if the guy wants an LP how are you going to knock what he likes? you dont have to be a complete tool and call him a fan boy.
stay lit


Quote by PeteTLT
Will preamp tubes turn black and melt slightly undernormal conditions and still work?
#32
Quote by Pencil Man
I don't really like the Trad Pro, as it feels cheaper than the trad, which feels like an epiphone when compared to a Classic or a standard.

edit: Consider the others, but out of the two, I's get the first one, the traditional.
That's odd, seeing that Classic is a lower end guitar than the Traditional.
#33
Quote by al112987
That's odd, seeing that Classic is a lower end guitar than the Traditional.



they have different necks though dont they? i could be wrong. i think i might be, but something in my head said i might not be. if thats the case, the neck on one could be more suitable than the other for him...
stay lit


Quote by PeteTLT
Will preamp tubes turn black and melt slightly undernormal conditions and still work?
#34
Quote by Crohny
they have different necks though dont they? i could be wrong. i think i might be, but something in my head said i might not be. if thats the case, the neck on one could be more suitable than the other for him...
Nope, Classics have that '60s slim tapered neck.
#35
well the traditional pro has burstbucker 3 in the bridge, 60's neck and coil split

the traditional has a Classic Plus in the bridge and 50's neck

so u choose, but i would go with the traditional
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#36
Quote by Crohny
you can like whatever you want, but dont be narrow minded. there is a reason people use gibson. they arent shitty guitars and there arent a lot of companies that are better. the carvins iv played werent anything special and surely didnt feel better or sound better than a LP. its all personal preference, but if the guy wants an LP how are you going to knock what he likes? you dont have to be a complete tool and call him a fan boy.


Is coming to my conclusion about Gibsons after I've spent thousands of dollars buying two Les Pauls being narrow minded? I think I gave that company a pretty fair chance.

I'm sorry if i came across as calling him a fanboy. I think it's more the case that he's being too heavily influenced by those who are.
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#37
hey there are a few shops that sell gibsons in my area and there's a problem. One shop sells a Gibson Les Paul Custom for 1000 bucks and the other store sells the very same Gibson, i ain't too sure if it's a Les Paul Studio or Les Paul Custom but it roughly had the same look,for 3000 bucks. anyone here can tell me what the hell is up with the big gap in pricing??
#38
Quote by gisobon
hey there are a few shops that sell gibsons in my area and there's a problem. One shop sells a Gibson Les Paul Custom for 1000 bucks and the other store sells the very same Gibson, i ain't too sure if it's a Les Paul Studio or Les Paul Custom but it roughly had the same look,for 3000 bucks. anyone here can tell me what the hell is up with the big gap in pricing??


It'd help to have more information, and pics

Buying used is the only time I'd recommend buying a Gibson. If the one for a grand is in decent shape as far as wear and tear and quality control (which is extremely inconsistent with them) I'd look into buying it. That's not a bad price, if you're talking USD. It's so far on the cheap side, make sure you give it a good looking over.

Be aware, though: all that binding on the neck is going to making refretting even more expensive when it comes the time for it.
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Last edited by Sunn_O))) at Dec 30, 2009,
#39
Yeah both are new . But what is up with the difference in pricing? A fake Les Paul ? I doubt there is such a thing. Both guitars are the ones in the links in the very first post.
#40
Quote by gisobon
Yeah both are new . But what is up with the difference in pricing? A fake Les Paul ? I doubt there is such a thing. Both guitars are the ones in the links in the very first post.


It's hard to find a new Studio for that price. I don't know what it is, but it's definitely not a Custom.

Unless the people they hired to run the shop are idiots. Which is possible.
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