#1
There are plenty for bluesy, clean, and hard rock-type sounds, but I don't think there's one for ultra high-gain metal like a 6505 or a Triple Rectifier would put out. Why not? It seems like there would be a great market for it.
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#2
From what I've heard, it's because you don't want tube breakup, which would make the sound less tight and "precise", for lack of a better word.
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#3
You want preamp breakup but not so much power amp.

In all honesty at lower wattage Solid State is probably better, like the Peavey Bandit.
#4
Blackstar HT-5 and Krank Rev Jr. spring to mind, although neither are particularly "stupidly-high gain".

It's hard to get that kind of sound at a low wattage, because alot of the sound of those high gain monsters comes from having a large transformer and the headroom.

Plus, it's expensive to do, as higher gain amps are far more complex than their lower-gain counterparts.
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#5
High gain amps are all pre-amp distortion.
If you're getting power distortion out of a 6505, god help you.
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#6
Quote by Uranutan
There are plenty for bluesy, clean, and hard rock-type sounds, but I don't think there's one for ultra high-gain metal like a 6505 or a Triple Rectifier would put out. Why not? It seems like there would be a great market for it.
Er, what about the 6505 and Triple Rec combos?

You're not going to find low-wattage ones, as metal tones require plenty of headroom. The high wattages combined with very complex high-gain preamp sections mean the amp chassis needs to be pretty large to fit everything in (lots of preamp tubes, beefy transformers etc).

The Mesa MkIII is pretty damn small if I remember correctly.
#8
I was thinking more along the lines of a Blackstar HT-5 volume amp than a 60 watt one, but the 6505+ is looking like my best option.
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#9
Quote by fishermanbob
High gain amps are all pre-amp distortion.


This.

Quote by fishermanbob

If you're getting power distortion out of a 6505, god help you.


#10
Quote by eyebanez333
This.





tube amp nub here. why is power distortion out of a 6505 a bad thing? Does that call for insane volumes or something?
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#13
Quote by zeemonkey
tube amp nub here. why is power distortion out of a 6505 a bad thing? Does that call for insane volumes or something?


yeah...power tube distortion out of a high wattage amp usually means ear-drum-splitting volumes
#14
Quote by zeemonkey
tube amp nub here. why is power distortion out of a 6505 a bad thing? Does that call for insane volumes or something?


Yes. Like to 11. They're made not to.

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#15
Quote by zeemonkey
tube amp nub here. why is power distortion out of a 6505 a bad thing? Does that call for insane volumes or something?



yeah man, If your neighbours don't call the cops on you for cranking a 6505, they're either deaf or dead. they're CRAAAAZY loud.
#16
how do you know when youve hit power distortion?

don't mean to derail the thread, im just curious
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#17
Quote by zeemonkey
how do you know when youve hit power distortion?

don't mean to derail the thread, im just curious



because its overdriven and not clean? It breaks up gradually as the volume goes up, its not an instantaneous thing.
#18
Quote by zeemonkey
tube amp nub here. why is power distortion out of a 6505 a bad thing? Does that call for insane volumes or something?


Yes, that would be ridiculously loud, and it would probably sound bad. Traditionally the distortion you hear in metal is preamp distortion.
#19
You don't really. I really notice the difference between pre and power amp distortion on my AC4 though. If I slam the input with an LPB-1 it doesn't sound the same.

Power amp distortion sounds more "vintage" I guess. And roundy.
#20
Quote by Lt. Shinysides
because its overdriven and not clean? It breaks up gradually as the volume goes up, its not an instantaneous thing.



i'm sorry, i should have specified which channel. How do you know when your OD channel is receiving power distortion, it must be hard to tell since you're already using high gain from the preamp. I've turned my VK to like 7 and then plugged a metal zone (level at 6) into the front end of the clean, you guys have got me wondering if the awesomeness I hear is just high gain or power amp distortion.
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#22
It has a lot to do with 3 things: Lots of headroom, really powerful OT's, and LOTS of preamp tubes. As an example, a 6505 has 5 12AX7s in the preamp, and a 6505+ has six. a Triple recto has 5. A Mesa Mark V has 7 12AX7s. In comparison, most of these little amps have one or 2 preamp tubes.
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#23
When the volume is really up on the overdrive, you get this creamy type of sound which you will notice makes your sound flabby for metal, great for classic rock and such though.
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#24
If you use a tube amp at any point and are allowed to crank it, you WILL notice when the power tubes break up. It's a very clear transition.
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#25
Quote by JoePerry4life
When the volume is really up on the overdrive, you get this creamy type of sound which you will notice makes your sound flabby for metal, great for classic rock and such though.



so basically your bass response loses some punch and the amp becomes warm/dark?
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#26
Quote by zeemonkey
so basically your bass response loses some punch and the amp becomes warm/dark?


I wouldn't say dark, although it depends on the amp(Oranges, for example, definitely get dark, hah). You start with a more mellow overdrive and it progresses to full blow crunch. Bass does get a little less obvious, yes.
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#27
Pretty much to my ears.
On my clean chaneel I have many times cranked it 10 volume and 10 gain. I get a really nice creamy overdrive. It can kill some animals though.

However I never crank my od channel that high.

Its pleaseant with some genres and others not so much.
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#28
Quote by JoePerry4life
When the volume is really up, you get this creamy type of sound which you will notice makes your sound flabby for metal, great for classic rock and such though.

Yeah, though as far as I'm aware, some early metal bands used that kind of tone. Randy Rhoads' tone was the result of a cranked, modified Marshall Plexi. It was metal, but very creamy sounding. EVH's tone was also the result of a cranked plexi - though his tone was quite fizzy, in my opinion.

Eric Clapton's tone on John Mayall's Bluesbreakers with Eric Clapton is a good example of power amp distortion.
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Quote by Anonden
You CAN play anything with anything....but some guitars sound right for some things, and not for others. Single coils sound retarded for metal, though those who are apeshit about harpsichord probably beg to differ.
#29
There is the JSX mini that's like 5watts.

High gain metal sounds come from a lot of preamp distortion which requires a lot of tubes and enough headroom to prevent poweramp distortion.
They could make a 30watt 112 high gain amp but the cab would have to be quite large to fit everything and isn't very practical.
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