Poll: read title
Poll Options
View poll results: read title
fine
0 0%
make them pay the liabilities
8 19%
fine + all liabilities
25 60%
corporate death penalty (split them up into smaller companies, similar to anti-trust laws)
8 19%
other
1 2%
Voters: 42.
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#1
in light of this oil spill fiasco, one thing that particularly annoys me is that the corporations responsible for this will only get away with paying a maximum of $75 million due to some dickface lobbying back in the early 90s. to the likes of BP, halliburton, transocean, and, hell, even the united states's minerals management service, they're practically getting away with merely a slap on the wrist.

a citizen alone would face fines and penalties worth well over their assets if it occurred that one person and one person only was in charge of this.

the rational side of me tells me that corporations are more mistake-prone to humans. sure, humans make mistakes, but many humans make many mistakes and companies like BP aren't run by one person. plus, corporations are an essence to the economy. simply fining the shit out of any large corporation generally results in massive job losses, and may get rid of a competitor in the market.

i like the idea of having the responsible companies paying for the oil spill, but something tells me that cleaning up a disaster like this will cost well over $75 million. well, this issue was addressed in our wonderful congress where we had senator menendez introduce a bill that would raise BP's liability to $10 billion. shamefully, it was blocked by alaskan senator lisa murkowski who received $1.2 million from energy and natural resource interests (seriously, i think we should ban women from alaska from having any power). rageface.

so, pit, back to the title question, how should corporations be held responsible for any such disaster?
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#2
they should be fully responsible for any costs made in the proces of 'repairing' the damage the disaster caused, as far as that is possible.
You who build these altars now

To sacrifice these children
You must not do it anymore
#5
Quote by sashki
Assess the costs of repairing the damage as far as possible, and make them pay for it.


parrot.
You who build these altars now

To sacrifice these children
You must not do it anymore
#6
Plug the hole with BP stock.
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#8
It was their mess, so they should clean it up. Even if it forces them out of business.
#9
Well, while making them pay does sound nice, how many people would wind up out of a job if BP went bust(most of whom would have had nothing to do with the spill)?
It's worth remembering that companies like BP are also seen by pension fund managers as a fairly safe bet, so you'd be f*cking over a lot of people's pension pot as well.
#10
Quote by RU Experienced?
We should switch to a clean, sustainable fuel alternative and put them all out of business. That would learn 'em!


Yeah that's exactly what we need, some big, evil, unaccountable windmill company.
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#11
Just pay the costs of damages, in small (comparatively) sums of money as to not destroy too many jobs.

"The mind is its own place, and in itself

Can make a Heav'n of Hell, a Hell of Heav'n"

- John Milton, Paradise Lost
#12
Quote by metallicafan616
Just pay the costs of damages, in small (comparatively) sums of money as to not destroy too many jobs.

BP is a British company. I don't really care if they go tits up.
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#13
Quote by Jackal58
BP is a British company. I don't really care if they go tits up.

It's the 4th largest company in the world. You can kid yourself that you'd not notice it going belly-up if you like, but that's just wishful thinking.
#14
Trifigura, a UK company, were dumping toxic waste in America. Someone in Parliament asked during the House of Commons what was going on with their court case. The Guardian reported this question, and Trifigura took out a super injunction on them. (This means they can't report ANYTHING about this case, not even that they can't write about it). This means they successfully libel'd parliament, which is impossible in this country.

Yet the law was still going to cover up this corruption. Yes, every company should be helf responsible.
#15
I think the citizenry needs to stop relying on someone else to correct the practices of mega corporations. We are the economy, it's our money. If it's such a big deal, well then maybe we would stop supporting them every day. But no, we want them to be held accountable for things we've empowered them to do - as long as we can still have our convenience. I'm not blowing my own horn here, either, because I like my conveniences and comforts.
We're only strays.
#16
Quote by MightyAl
It's the 4th largest company in the world. You can kid yourself that you'd not notice it going belly-up if you like, but that's just wishful thinking.

Exxon would simply inhale what was left. They have 80,000 employees. The US gov't put more people out of work buying GM. It wouldn't be a blip.
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#18
Quote by RU Experienced?
We should switch to a clean, sustainable fuel alternative and put them all out of business. That would learn 'em!


Fusion power all the way.
#19
Quote by Jackal58
Exxon would simply inhale what was left. They have 80,000 employees. The US gov't put more people out of work buying GM. It wouldn't be a blip.

BP has 92,000 employees, as of 2009. US$236bn of assets.
That's considerably more than a blip.
#20
Quote by br33dlove
Fusion power all the way.


You mean fusion, the reaction that currently takes more energy to set off than it generates? Don't hold your breath.
#22
Quote by MightyAl
BP has 92,000 employees, as of 2009. US$236bn of assets.
That's considerably more than a blip.

The assets don't go away. They get absorbed by a competitor. Any cash held by BP goes to the clean up. Any assets sold go to clean up. Just a blip. Pip pip.
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#23
Quote by Jackal58
The assets don't go away. They get absorbed by a competitor. Any cash held by BP goes to the clean up. Any assets sold go to clean up. Just a blip. Pip pip.

I never said they went anywhere. Money, unlike energy, can be destroyed, though.
And you'd better hope your pension fund hasn't invested in BP.
#24
Quote by Jackal58
The assets don't go away. They get absorbed by a competitor. Any cash held by BP goes to the clean up. Any assets sold go to clean up. Just a blip. Pip pip.


Hope you're not suggesting the winding up of a company with such massive assets and employees in the five figures would just be a blip.
#25
Quote by MightyAl
I never said they went anywhere. Money, unlike energy, can be destroyed, though.
And you'd better hope your pension fund hasn't invested in BP.

What pension fund? I'm on the "Work til you die" retirement plan.
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#26
Quote by webbtje
Hope you're not suggesting the winding up of a company with such massive assets and employees in the five figures would just be a blip.

Hmmmm. You Brits were all for the failure of GM a year ago. Sucks when it comes home.
Yes it would just be a blip.
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#27
Quote by Jackal58
What pension fund? I'm on the "Work til you die" retirement plan.

Well, in that case, the numbing oblivion generated by your life probably would insulate you from just about any event.
#28
Quote by Jackal58
What pension fund? I'm on the "Work til you die" retirement plan.


Then we shall hope it's soon, we need less self centred apathetic idiots.


Btw, ever heard of amnesia? arthritis? amnesia?

"The mind is its own place, and in itself

Can make a Heav'n of Hell, a Hell of Heav'n"

- John Milton, Paradise Lost
#29
Quote by webbtje
You mean fusion, the reaction that currently takes more energy to set off than it generates? Don't hold your breath.


If we put more money into it we could easily make it worthwhile in 30 years tops.

And no, I mean fusion power, the energy generated by nuclear fusion reactions.
Last edited by br33dlove at May 16, 2010,
#30
Quote by MightyAl
Well, in that case, the numbing oblivion generated by your life probably would insulate you from just about any event.

BP could be fined into oblivion and it would have no effect on the global economy, oil production or my oblivious life.
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#32
Quote by Jackal58
Hmmmm. You Brits were all for the failure of GM a year ago. Sucks when it comes home.
Yes it would just be a blip.


This has nothing to do with where I come from, it's to do with my seeing how fucking hideously complicated it is winding up Woolworths, let alone seeing BP go insolvent.

Seriously, do you have any idea how much wrangling is involved when even a small company goes down? Can you imagine how much is involved when there are 90,000 employees baying for blood, shareholders, lawyers, clients, and parties to various contracts wanting their money back, and most of them using every dirty trick in the book from claiming Quistclose trusts to stealing master keys in order to make sure they don't get shafted? Calling it a 'blip' is downright glib.
Last edited by webbtje at May 16, 2010,
#33
BP should be held responsible for the entire thing, but should be given the option of paying in instalments, in the view of safeguarding jobs etc.

imo anyway
#34
Quote by boreamor
Aren't they trying to create a small sun in 2012 or something?


I've heard about something like that. I think it is going to be about the size of a small football.
#35
Quote by Jackal58
BP could be fined into oblivion and it would have no effect on the global economy, oil production or my oblivious life.

Believe what you like; it doesn't make you any less wrong.
#36
Quote by MightyAl
Believe what you like; it doesn't make you any less wrong.

Did the world come to a screeching halt due to the banking crisis. Ongoing banking crisis. Nope. Are you going to starve tomorrow because the EU is bailing out Greece? No. Are you going to be standing in a breadline because BP disappeared? Nope.
Just a blip. I'm not wrong. You're just to British to see it happening. BP is not that important.
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#37
Quote by Jackal58
Did the world come to a screeching halt due to the banking crisis. Ongoing banking crisis. Nope. Are you going to starve tomorrow because the EU is bailing out Greece? No. Are you going to be standing in a breadline because BP disappeared? Nope.
Just a blip. I'm not wrong. You're just to British to see it happening. BP is not that important.

I never said the world would come to a screeching halt. A lot of people would find themselves up to the neck in shit if BP went under; just like what's happened to a lot of people as a result of the banking crisis.
So, in summary - you = wrong.
#38
Quote by MightyAl
I never said the world would come to a screeching halt. A lot of people would find themselves up to the neck in shit if BP went under; just like what's happened to a lot of people as a result of the banking crisis.
So, in summary - you = wrong.

How many people? 50,000? 100,000? 500,000? All still just a blip. A big fat British blip but still just a blip nonetheless.
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#39
Quote by Jackal58
Did the world come to a screeching halt due to the banking crisis. Ongoing banking crisis. Nope. Are you going to starve tomorrow because the EU is bailing out Greece? No. Are you going to be standing in a breadline because BP disappeared? Nope.
Just a blip. I'm not wrong. You're just to British to see it happening. BP is not that important.

This. You really wouldn't see a difference in your life. Gas costs might go up 20 cents for the rest of the summer, that's about it. Some of those 90k people who work there can get jobs at other oil places.
#40
Quote by Jackal58
How many people? 50,000? 100,000? 500,000? All still just a blip. A big fat British blip but still just a blip nonetheless.

BP has American employees and subsidiaries.
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