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#1
http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/navigation/guitars?N=100001+304262&Ntk=All&Ntt=kramer&Nty=1

Sweetness.

The only thing I don't get is the Assaults, there's an Assault 211 FR and the Assault 220. The Assault 220 comes in two colors that have Floyd Rose Trems, and the price is still cheaper than the 211 FR, and there's nothing about them in the description.

I'd like a white one.

Don't forget to check out those transparent purple strikers!
Striker 211 Custom


Striker 211 (looks a lot different!)


Pacer Classic (Charvel anyone? )
Last edited by r0ckth3d34n at May 29, 2010,
#5
I have always wondered, are the kramer LFRs any good? That purple one looks sweet.
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#7
Hmm, tempting, i was after a floyd rose guitar, and that trans purple is sexy.

They seem a bit too cheap though, no?

But they have good specs, besides pups and the LFR.

Anybody played one?
#8
They're like Agiles; quality for a cheap price.

They're so cheap because they're not a well known guitar brand. They're owned by Gibson, though.

I would imagine the quality is pretty on par with most Epiphones in a similar price range. The electronics are also probably similar to those put in Epiphones.
#9
Well, electronics can always be replaced, ill have to keep an eye out for these. See how they match up against the jackson dk2 i wanted since im too poor atm.
#10
The Pacer Custom I posted a pic of looks almost exactly like one of the Jackson Dinky's, but more like an 80's Charvel...
#11
I've been wanting the purple hardtail one for a long time, but reviews and impressions are saying these new Kramers are actually pretty terrible.
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#12
They seem pretty much the same thing as the older striker models, except for the pickups which are not the dual rails and quadrails.
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#14
Quote by MrFlibble
I've been wanting the purple hardtail one for a long time, but reviews and impressions are saying these new Kramers are actually pretty terrible.


Thats too bad. I would have considering one of the Assaults, but oh well.
#16
i would rock that white pacer no question.

any notable company making these things? are they of atleast acceptable quality?
#17
Quote by archenemyfan
Was wondering,is everything under 400$?do they make any expensive guitars?
They used to make some MIA models that were reissues of older Kramers. Those ran for over USD$1000. They don't seem to be making them now though.

Quote by ikey_
i would rock that white pacer no question.

any notable company making these things? are they of atleast acceptable quality?
Kramer is owned by Gibson and in the last few years they've been made in Korea, China and Indonesia (bar the above MIA models). So they're Epiphone quality, basically.
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#20
Hard-tail Trans-purple Striker 211 and a floyded Nite-V are definitely on my list.
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#21
Quote by MrFlibble
I've been wanting the purple hardtail one for a long time, but reviews and impressions are saying these new Kramers are actually pretty terrible.


+1 The older music yo kramers were pretty awsome guitars,production has moved from indonesia to china for the new models and quality has suffered .If you want a Kramer go 80's or music yo and forget about the new crap there putting out.
#22
That was my bad review of the Pacer Classic. To say it was covered in paint flaws was an understatement and the pots barely worked right. Kramer contacted me personally though and wanted the guitar back. "We are very serious about quality control." They sent a fed ex pick up,no charge,and promised that what I got in return would be A+. They got it on 5/26 so I'm still waiting for my guitar. It was a very good player though. I loved the feel of the neck and the pups sounded great. I can't say much about the FR with out proper time and testing with it.

I own a 1985 Kramer Pacer custom and that guitar is on a whole other level but at twice the cost. My 1983 Kramer Vanguard,flying V style,is a dream come true and for about the same price as the new Kramers. My Gary Kramer Crusader which is in the same price range is a freakin killer guitar but they no longer offer real floyds with them but customer service from Gary Kramer Guitars is about the best there is. They treat you like an old family member when you contact them,effin top notch.

There is a great website for Kramer info http://www.vintagekramer.com/index.htm a lot of nice guys on the forum that really know Kramers inside and out.

It was pretty cool seeing another forum talking about Kramers. They are great guitars at all price levels,vintage and new. Just be careful,owning one can turn into owning a dozen real quick. Give one a try and I'll bet you won't be disappointed.

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#23
I want that Lumi!!!!!

Vengence, pm me on KF and sell it to me!

Its a tough sell the new Gibson-Kramer's for people who know their Kramer's cause an 80's Focus model, MIJ by ESP, German OFR and in great condition can be had for $350. Still at least they are trying but I honestly think Gibson really doesn't give a rats ass, cause if they did they'd bring back some of the old models from the 80's and use the Kramer name and reputation to compete against Fender/Charvel. Why they don't, I have no idea and never understood that. Complete ignorance.
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Last edited by DSOTM80 at May 30, 2010,
#24
Quote by DSOTM80
I want that Lumi!!!!!

Vengence, pm me on KF and sell it to me!

Its a tough sell the new Gibson-Kramer's for people who know their Kramer's cause an 80's Focus model, MIJ by ESP, German OFR and in great condition can be had for $350. Still at least they are trying but I honestly think Gibson really doesn't give a rats ass, cause if they did they'd bring back some of the old models from the 80's and use the Kramer name and reputation to compete against Fender/Charvel. Why they don't, I have no idea and never understood that. Complete ignorance.


+1
Maybe if these sell well, they'll consider it.
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#26
Quote by whitenihilist
How are the Kramer licensed trems?
Since they're being made by the Epiphone factory in China, they are almost certainly the same Floyd Rose Specials that Epiphone use. Jackson, ESP and Schecter use them too. They're actually pretty good in that they have steel knife edges that don't wear down like other cheap Floyds. They are, for all intents and purposes, an official Floyd Rose (note: official, not Original). They're good bridges.

Been thinking of getting a floating bridge guitar, and these seem like something I might pick up.
Bear in mind that the Floyd isn't floating on some of these models.

Quote by DSOTM80
I honestly think Gibson really doesn't give a rats ass, cause if they did they'd bring back some of the old models from the 80's
They did that already. They didn't get enough demand to bother again; the ones they did make sold out, but not very quickly and there's been very little demand for more since they stopped making them. Most people who are hardcore Kramer fans won't buy a new one no matter how good it is, since actual '80s Kramers don't cost that much second hand anyway. The majority of other people these days don't know who the hell Kramer are(were).

Though I would pay a heullva lot for their Jersey Star Reissue.
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#27
Quote by MrFlibble


They did that already. They didn't get enough demand to bother again; the ones they did make sold out, but not very quickly and there's been very little demand for more since they stopped making them. Most people who are hardcore Kramer fans won't buy a new one no matter how good it is, since actual '80s Kramers don't cost that much second hand anyway. The majority of other people these days don't know who the hell Kramer are(were).

Though I would pay a heullva lot for their Jersey Star Reissue.



The Jersey Stars are fetching the same for a used or more then what people paid for them a few years ago new, they are awesome guitars.
The problem with the USA made Kramer/Music Yo stuff was that there was never any supply available when people wanted to buy one. I remember going on the site and it was always expected arrival in a month or so. People ordered and had to wait or were waiting and waiting for new stock to come in. They never made a large quantity of them, hardly any advertisement efforts were made like in Guitar World etc or a large booth at NAMM and they didn't put them into the big stores such as Sam Ash or Guitar Center.
There are not many people who will order online, and buy a guitar they never held before. Thats a tough sell. Its too bad cause the '85 Baretta RI, the JS, the 1984 and then the USA Pacer RI were awesome guitars and because it was pretty much direct from Yo/Gibson people paid much less then they should of.
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#28
Quote by whitenihilist
How are the Kramer licensed trems?

Been thinking of getting a floating bridge guitar, and these seem like something I might pick up.



ive played one of the newer ones and one older one side by side, the old one obviously kicks more ass,buy for the new one, the floyd seemed fairly solid, especially for a floor model set-up. its great guitar for an even better price
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#29
Quote by DSOTM80
words
Well that's the thing, they basically shot themselves in the foot. They didn't make enough guitars for everyone that wanted one to get one when they wanted it, they were a pain to order, they didn't advertise them well, they didn't give many major outlets a chance to review them and then they wonder why there wasn't record-breaking demand for them? You basically only knew about them if you stumbled upon them by sheer luck and then it was pot luck again whether you'd be able to buy one or not.

I'm sure if Gibson gave them another go and marketed them properly this time, they would sell fantastically. But it was pretty clear last time that they either didn't know what they were doing with the brand or couldn't really be bothered and I've no hope that they'll try again now.
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#30
You're right, I agree we're saying the same thing
They don't give a sh*t thats the problem, plain and simple. Gibson has enough money to promote the brand if they really wanted to and compete against the likes of Charvel and ESP with real USA built instruments but they don't and turned the company into a budget brand. Shit happens you know but at least the original 80's Kramers are still affordable and can be found. They have a vibe, mojo, whatever you wanna call it that just takes you back to a better time in music Right now I'm GAS'ing for an RS, in champagne finish more specifically.

By the way, I heard from the Kramer camp over at the forum that EVH was approached by Gibson to do a signature line so I guess they maybe do care after all. Wanna know why it fell through? Ed wanted too much money lol, typical and now he's praising Fender Charvel like its the greatest thing he's played since sliced bread.
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#31
Just my opinion here but I can't believe Gary hasn't tried to buy kramer back from gibson.I know he's doing good with his line of gk's,but if he could buy kramer back it would be a win win for sure.We could get the good kramers of old back and scrap all the new crap gibson has put the kramer name on.It would also keep the kramer name from being dragged through the mud like gibson is doing with them with there low budget crap guitars.
#32
Quote by MaidenFrieak71
Just my opinion here but I can't believe Gary hasn't tried to buy kramer back from gibson.I know he's doing good with his line of gk's,but if he could buy kramer back it would be a win win for sure.We could get the good kramers of old back and scrap all the new crap gibson has put the kramer name on.It would also keep the kramer name from being dragged through the mud like gibson is doing with them with there low budget crap guitars.
Wouldn't be worth his time. Any idea how much it would cost to buy a brand like that from Gibson? I'm willing to bet it would take him several years just to stand a chance of breaking even.

Quote by DSOTM80
Right now I'm GAS'ing for an RS, in champagne finish more specifically.
I saw one in the champagne finish for sale just two weeks ago. Can't find the page now, but I'll keep my eyes open for ya.
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#34
I was somewhat interested in the Pacer classic until I realized it had a LFR. The Kramer(gibson) website simple says Floyd Rose (never once says licensed) which made many think they would have OFR's on them. Gibson stuck an OFR on the Epi Prophecy EM FX2 at $400 street along with active pups and binding. You would think they could've put an OFR on the Kramers......but no, they put some mystery metal Kramer branded LFR on them. The problem is that we have no clue if they are crap or not.....and won't for a year or so when they've been out for a while.
#35
Quote by webwarmiller
I was somewhat interested in the Pacer classic until I realized it had a LFR.
I've checked, it an FR Special. Technically, that is an official Floyd Rose, not a licensed one. The only difference between an FR Special and an OFR is the OFR is made in a machine operated by a German guy while the FR Special is made in the same type of machine but operated by a Korean guy - and you've got to be pretty racist to think that a Korean person couldn't turn a machine on and press a few buttons as well as a German person could. The FR Specials used to come with a smaller sustain block but that seems to have changed.

In other words, if someone hands you the FR Special (which is what the Epis and these Kramers use, as well as Jacksons, Carvins, Fenders, Schecters and ESP-LTDs) and an OFR, you would not be able to tell the difference, even if you had each of them for three years. They are exactly the same.
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#36
I love Mr. Flibble's all-knowing about every guitar related topic intelligence.

I'd still like to try one of these out.
#37
Quote by MrFlibble
I've checked, it an FR Special. Technically, that is an official Floyd Rose, not a licensed one. The only difference between an FR Special and an OFR is the OFR is made in a machine operated by a German guy while the FR Special is made in the same type of machine but operated by a Korean guy - and you've got to be pretty racist to think that a Korean person couldn't turn a machine on and press a few buttons as well as a German person could. The FR Specials used to come with a smaller sustain block but that seems to have changed.

In other words, if someone hands you the FR Special (which is what the Epis and these Kramers use, as well as Jacksons, Carvins, Fenders, Schecters and ESP-LTDs) and an OFR, you would not be able to tell the difference, even if you had each of them for three years. They are exactly the same.


This is COMPLETELY wrong. The Floyd Rose Special is clearly marked as such and differs from an OFR in that it uses ZINC saddles and trem block. You are confusing it with the Korean FR-1000 which is supposedly made to German OFR standards. Most people can't visually tell them from a true German OFR because they both simply say "Floyd Rose" on the baseplate. However, if you look at the rear edge of the saddles the Korean FR-1000 has a bevel whereas the German OFR does not. Most people are happy with the Korean FR-1000......however, some have run into some QC issues.

Regardless I've got no clue as to what "floyd" is on the new Kramers....and they aren't telling anyone either. There's a reason is has to say licensed on it unlike the OFR, FR1000, and the Floyd Rose Special.
#38
Quote by webwarmiller
This is COMPLETELY wrong. The Floyd Rose Special is clearly marked as such and differs from an OFR in that it uses ZINC saddles and trem block.
Tell that to the SA-2 sitting next to me with no markings that it is any different to an OFR, which has steel saddles and a steel sustain block, though granted the sustain block does seem fractionately smaller than usual on an OFR.

Regardless I've got no clue as to what "floyd" is on the new Kramers....and they aren't telling anyone either. There's a reason is has to say licensed on it unlike the OFR, FR1000, and the Floyd Rose Special.
The only places calling it a licensed unit are the shops themselves (which get many things wrong anyway). The actual Kramer site notes them as simply 'Floyd Rose', which means it has to be either an FR Special, FR-1000 or OFR. Considering the price point it won't be an OFR; the Epiphone factory, which is handling the production of these guitars, has yet to see an FR-1000 leave its doors. That leaves the FR Special has the only possible option. This is very easily backed up by the fact that Epiphone guitars at the same price point from the same factory are currently using FR Specials.


Quote by r0ckth3d34n
I love Mr. Flibble's all-knowing about every guitar related topic intelligence.
It's called "using your brain", "common sense", "thinking" and "doing more research than just Googling for the product's Wikipedia page."

I'd still like to try one of these out.
Same. Like I said before, I'm hearing bad things about them, but they can't really be any worse than the standard Epiphone guitar. I've been after a guitar with a non-recessed Floyd for ages too so I'm thinking I'll grab a Pacer Classic, give it a bit of a review, if it's at least a good base then I can mod it up and ahve a decent enough guitar to kick around and if it is shit after all then it's not like it's been a huge expense anyway and I can report back to y'all.
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#39
Quote by MrFlibble
Tell that to the SA-2 sitting next to me with no markings that it is any different to an OFR, which has steel saddles and a steel sustain block, though granted the sustain block does seem fractionately smaller than usual on an OFR.


This pic from ESP's website clearly shows a FR Special as it says "Special" below "Floyd Rose" just like the ones here that sell for $76 in chrome: http://www.gpdusa.com/Floyd_Rose_Tremolos-Floyd_Rose_Special.html. Still a good trem as the geometry is OFR spec and the baseplate and posts ARE hardened steel just like an OFR. Can alway upgrade the saddles block down the road. Perhaps you got lucky and got a true OFR or Korean FR-1000 before the 'Specials' got to the factory or something.


Quote by MrFlibble
The only places calling it a licensed unit are the shops themselves (which get many things wrong anyway). The actual Kramer site notes them as simply 'Floyd Rose', which means it has to be either an FR Special, FR-1000 or OFR.


LTD clearly states they use Floyd Rose Specials. Kramer is out an out trying to deceive people that they are using true Floyds. I've seen up close pics of their Floyd and it is branded Kramer and has "licensed under floyd rose patents" stamped on it. If it were a true Floyd it would NOT need this. Unfortunately it is NOT a Floyd....it is a mystery trem. Here's a pic from a new Pacer Classic:



Quote by MrFlibble
the Epiphone factory, which is handling the production of these guitars, has yet to see an FR-1000 leave its doors.


The Epiphone EM2 FX has the FR-1000 on it. I've seen them in person as well....


Don't mean to be a dick or anything....just presenting facts. Also, here is a good site that shows some difference between the German and Korean "OFR's": http://dellus.net/
Last edited by webwarmiller at Jun 2, 2010,
#40
Im gunna see if i can give these things a go this week sometime if my shop has em in stock (Theyre listed on the site..)

Id quite like to know if an OFR or something better would be a drop in replacement.
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