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#1
Before you begin to read this, understand that I know you cannot learn proper technique in this game. I understand having 5 buttons representing 6 strings along 21-24 frets is not usable at all. This is not what the post is focused on.

I was considering incorporating more Rock Band playing in mine and my friend's daily practice routine during coordination and dexterity exercises. I have noticed, or believe I have, significant improvements in my speed and dexterity a day after heavy Rock Band 2 playing. My fingers seem to be more responsive and agreeable to where my brain wants them to go and independent of the other fingers.

I really don't believe playing the game is detouring my learning and advancement as some have suggested to me. I believe as long as I understand the purpose of the incorporation that this can be a very beneficial to a beginner-novice such as myself. I was even going to recommend it to my brother who wants to take up the guitar as a practice method included with normal and accepted practice.

Any comments or opinions.
Michael
2010 Gibson Les Paul Studio (Ebony w/ Gold)
Peavy Rage 158 Practice Amp
#2
I don't care what gains you've noticed, they have not come from Rock Band. It will not help you in the slightest with playing guitar.
Speed is a by-product of shut the fuck up.
#4
The game definitely can introduce someone to playing guitar because the rhythm is there in the game, the same as it would be with a real instrument. I don't know if I would make a daily practice regimen out of it but people who say it does harm are wrong.
#6
i would say, take the time you were going to incorperate rock band into your daily practice...
...and just put it into playing your guitar.
#7
No, because the learning curve on Rock Band is much less. You are not thinking about chords and where your fingers go or the next sequence in the song. You are just exercising your fingers. This is building muscle strength and dexterity. It has nothing to do with technique. It is simply an exercise.
Michael
2010 Gibson Les Paul Studio (Ebony w/ Gold)
Peavy Rage 158 Practice Amp
#8
Quote by SpawnedX
No, because the learning curve on Rock Band is much less. You are not thinking about chords and where your fingers go or the next sequence in the song. You are just exercising your fingers. This is building muscle strength and dexterity. It has nothing to do with technique. It is simply an exercise.

No it's not. It's not designed to do that, it's a game and it's made so that purely average people can play it, otherwise it wouldn't be so damn successful.
Again: Rock Band will not help you with guitar, REALLY!
Speed is a by-product of shut the fuck up.
#9
And on another note, please don't bother taking this into a lecture about put my time into my guitar, blah, blah.

I put in at the very minimum on a very, very business day an hour of practice. I average closer to 2 hours. I'm sorry, but the very beginning stage of learning guitar is boring. I am looking at a fun alternative to squeezing tennis balls.
Michael
2010 Gibson Les Paul Studio (Ebony w/ Gold)
Peavy Rage 158 Practice Amp
#10
Quote by Aleksi
No it's not. It's not designed to do that, it's a game and it's made so that purely average people can play it, otherwise it wouldn't be so damn successful.
Again: Rock Band will not help you with guitar, REALLY!


I'm sorry, but you sir are reading illiterate. This post is not about helping with guitar. Please read better next time. This is about finger exercising. If only playing the guitar can help with that, than I feel bad for piano players.
Michael
2010 Gibson Les Paul Studio (Ebony w/ Gold)
Peavy Rage 158 Practice Amp
#11
Quote by SpawnedX
I'm sorry, but you sir are reading illiterate. This post is not about helping with guitar. Please read better next time. This is about finger exercising. If only playing the guitar can help with that, than I feel bad for piano players.

And what, my ignorant friend, do you propose the point of this "finger exercising" is? Are you, or are you not intending to use it in a practice regime to help improve your guitar playing? Did you, or did you not claim that you'd noticed improvements in your playing after playing Rock Band? If you're not seeking to improve your guitar playing with rock band, then this is very much the wrong forum for this post.
By all means, play the game, just don't expect to improve on guitar (or any musical instrument for that matter) because of it.
Speed is a by-product of shut the fuck up.
#12
Quote by Aleksi
And what, my ignorant friend, do you propose the point of this "finger exercising" is? Are you, or are you not intending to use it in a practice regime to help improve your guitar playing? Did you, or did you not claim that you'd noticed improvements in your playing after playing Rock Band? If you're not seeking to improve your guitar playing with rock band, then this is very much the wrong forum for this post.
By all means, play the game, just don't expect to improve on guitar (or any musical instrument for that matter) because of it.


Do you know what the term ignorant means? It means the person is ignoring certain statements and facts in day to day living to their detriment.

That would make you ignorant, since my very first paragraph already stated everything you decided to drum up in your postings. You blatantly ignored just about everything I have said. That would be ignorant.

I am proposing that Rock Band can help your hand and eye co-ordination, finger dexterity and compliance and even to an extent strength. Because no matter how much you try to ignore the fact in your epic travels to call me ignorant. You have to use muscles and your mind to tell your fingers what to do and where to go. Anytime you use muscles, you first wear them down so they must repair themselves to heal stronger for the tasks they are subjected to. This by no means is inclusive to fingers through guitar playing.

I have a huge array of practice techniques I use from a real guitar teacher to actually learn guitar technique and precision. Those are to help me with the guitar. I am suggested an alternative to finger exercising. So in order to be compliant with your statements you are saying that if my fingers get stronger without doing so by playing the guitar, than my fingers being stronger cannot benefit me in playing my guitar. Gotcha.
Michael
2010 Gibson Les Paul Studio (Ebony w/ Gold)
Peavy Rage 158 Practice Amp
#13
I have a response to your butthurt arguments.

1. There are finger exercises you can do on the actual guitar. Yes! Finger exercises! Im not ignoring everything your saying! I think these would be much more beneficial

2. You say your a beginner. And the beginning stages of learning are boring. You, sir, are playing the wrong thing. Ive been playing for five years and have loved every minute. try changing what your playing.
#14
1. I am doing them. Tons of them and plan on not stopping. Would you like a video of the actual finger practices I also do on the guitar?

2. If you think that constantly repeating the same tasks to get yourself better is fun, than you sir are well fit to work any menial job and be happy in life. I know the pains of practice to get better have a purpose, does not mean they are "fun."
Michael
2010 Gibson Les Paul Studio (Ebony w/ Gold)
Peavy Rage 158 Practice Amp
#16
Also I am not talking about learning songs here and playing them, that is fun to me, no matter how much I suck at it.

However, I devote most of my practice time to practicing chord changes and making sure they are all clear and sound nice. This is boring because it is just a repetitive task that is needed not wanted.
Michael
2010 Gibson Les Paul Studio (Ebony w/ Gold)
Peavy Rage 158 Practice Amp
#17
Quote by SpawnedX
Do you know what the term ignorant means? It means the person is ignoring certain statements and facts in day to day living to their detriment.

No it doesn't, it means to be uninformed/unaware/uneducated/unknowing.

That would make you ignorant, since my very first paragraph already stated everything you decided to drum up in your postings. You blatantly ignored just about everything I have said. That would be ignorant.

No it didn't, you stated that you were aware that Rock Band would not assist you in guitar technique. You went on to state that it would help coordination and finger dexterity which could then be applied to the guitar. This was a false claim, as I have tried to tell you.

I am proposing that Rock Band can help your hand and eye co-ordination, finger dexterity and compliance and even to an extent strength. Because no matter how much you try to ignore the fact in your epic travels to call me ignorant. You have to use muscles and your mind to tell your fingers what to do and where to go. Anytime you use muscles, you first wear them down so they must repair themselves to heal stronger for the tasks they are subjected to. This by no means is inclusive to fingers through guitar playing.

Rock Band will not aid you in these things, if I rip apart cotton wool for several hours a day, my muscles (though in use) will not benefit. This use is negligible. There are ways to increase finger strength/dexterity/coordination without a guitar, but Rock Band is not one of them.
Speed is a by-product of shut the fuck up.
#20
By your assumption than one could play Rock Band for 24 hours straight and never once feel tired in their fingers, because it doesn't use any muscles or energy.
Michael
2010 Gibson Les Paul Studio (Ebony w/ Gold)
Peavy Rage 158 Practice Amp
#21
I actually did once play rock band for around 24 hours straight. the only thing tired was my eyes. i wear contacts.
#22
For the last effing time, I am not talking about getting better at the guitar. That's like saying I can get better at riding a mountain bike by riding a motorcycle.

I am stating instead that both require you to be able to balance yourself so you won't fall. Learning to balance is not inclusive.
Michael
2010 Gibson Les Paul Studio (Ebony w/ Gold)
Peavy Rage 158 Practice Amp
#23
Quote by the_burning_one
I actually did once play rock band for around 24 hours straight. the only thing tired was my eyes. i wear contacts.


I am sure if I had been playing guitar for a long period of time, than I too could do this task. However, I have not, so any finger exercise is beneficial to me.
Michael
2010 Gibson Les Paul Studio (Ebony w/ Gold)
Peavy Rage 158 Practice Amp
#25
There must be a hidden statement in the first post that says "Rock Band will make Slash a better guitar player." Obviously it will not. He as well as other guitarist are well beyond that game.

However, a guy who picked up a guitar yesterday for example, probably has absolutely no hope at playing a barre chord or simple chords for more than 15 minutes. I think at that point pushing a button on a microwave would help. (Exaggeration for effect.)
Michael
2010 Gibson Les Paul Studio (Ebony w/ Gold)
Peavy Rage 158 Practice Amp
#28
Damnit SEEEMILYPLAY! we had this all figured out, and now you just brought back a point long ago resolved. Now he will never stop using clever metaphors.
#29
Quote by SpawnedX
For the last effing time, I am not talking about getting better at the guitar. That's like saying I can get better at riding a mountain bike by riding a motorcycle.

I am stating instead that both require you to be able to balance yourself so you won't fall. Learning to balance is not inclusive.

So, to use your example: if I ride a motorcycle, learning how to balance a two wheeled vehicle and then I go to ride a mountain bike and find myself able to balance (having previously been unable to do so), then my motorcycling had not aided my mountain biking? I would say that it certainly has had a positive effect on my mountain biking.

You are saying the same thing with Rock Band and guitar. You are claiming that Rock Band will improve finger strength/dexterity/coordination which will in turn aid your guitar playing, yet, you are trying to say that Rock Band is not aiding your playing. In both this and your mountain bike/motorcycle analogy you are directly contradicting yourself.

The fact is that the dexterity, coordination and strength required to play Rock Band are negligible. It will not improve any of the aforementioned things, nor will it improve your guitar.

Edit: Someone above claimed you were using clever metaphors and I'd like to point out that they are neither clever, nor metaphors. They are poorly thought out analogies.
Speed is a by-product of shut the fuck up.
Last edited by Aleksi at May 30, 2010,
#31
Let's resolve it like this.

I think you are an idiot. You think I am an idiot. I will neither believe you or you me. I will continue to do things my way, because no matter how much you wish to differ, my playing has improved at a much faster rate than many people I know.

The end.
Michael
2010 Gibson Les Paul Studio (Ebony w/ Gold)
Peavy Rage 158 Practice Amp
#32
Rock Band misses the crucial muscle memory and precision needed to play guitar equally well. Sure, you may be able to move your fingers faster by playing Rock Band, but you wont know where to put them.
I pride myself on my humility.
#33
Quote by mtshark
Rock Band misses the crucial muscle memory and precision needed to play guitar equally well. Sure, you may be able to move your fingers faster by playing Rock Band, but you wont know where to put them.


This I agree with. Which is why I will continue traditional practice as well. I am simply talking about my strengthening my fingers, not committing chords to muscle memory or learning how to play chords better.
Michael
2010 Gibson Les Paul Studio (Ebony w/ Gold)
Peavy Rage 158 Practice Amp
#34
Quote by mtshark
Rock Band misses the crucial muscle memory and precision needed to play guitar equally well. Sure, you may be able to move your fingers faster by playing Rock Band, but you wont know where to put them.



well said. and we all know, from listening to certain crappy shred metal, that playing fast and not knowing where to put your fingers sounds like SHIT.
#35
I will give a specific example of what I noticed:

I was having a really hard time controlling my pinky. I was getting frustrated with it and gave up all hope of gaining better control of it. Enough to where I wanted to quit. I even stopped playing that entire week.

I play Rock Band for fun, so I bumped up the difficulty to expert with only the goal of having fun. Through-out the game I was having fun and really not paying attention to what I was doing other than getting a very high score. I didn't even notice that I was getting more control over my pinky. When it occurred to me that I was now more in control of it. I went and picked up my guitar again and started doing my finger excercises again. It was still difficult on a thicker neck, but it wasn't as frustrating and I have noticed significant improvements with control.
Michael
2010 Gibson Les Paul Studio (Ebony w/ Gold)
Peavy Rage 158 Practice Amp
#36
Quote by SpawnedX
I will give a specific example of what I noticed:

I was having a really hard time controlling my pinky. I was getting frustrated with it and gave up all hope of gaining better control of it. Enough to where I wanted to quit. I even stopped playing that entire week.

I play Rock Band for fun, so I bumped up the difficulty to expert with only the goal of having fun. Through-out the game I was having fun and really not paying attention to what I was doing other than getting a very high score. I didn't even notice that I was getting more control over my pinky. When it occurred to me that I was now more in control of it. I went and picked up my guitar again and started doing my finger excercises again. It was still difficult on a thicker neck, but it wasn't as frustrating and I have noticed significant improvements with control.

That's called consolidation: your rest period has allowed time for you to process what you were learning and thus, your playing has improved. It has nothing to do with Rock Band.

Edit: Also, the break would tend to calm you down, preventing frustration and allowing you to continue the exercise with better results.
Speed is a by-product of shut the fuck up.
Last edited by Aleksi at May 30, 2010,
#37
Your not understanding. I couldn't even play medium on rock band, because I could not move my pinky at all without lifting or moving the finger next to it, to the point that I wasn't even holding down the button. Multiply that by the difficulty of playing the guitar and just forget it.

My pinky was so pathetic, that it needed a lot of exercise to just be controllable. It had nothing to do with the guitar. I didn't even use it to type with. I typed with 6 fingers instead of 8. Focusing on it was frustrating and aggravating. The fun factor of the game had me exercising it subconsciously. I wasn't thinking about it, I was just doing. That's what my benefit was. It didn't help my guitar technique at all, it just allowed me some dexterity in that finger, which allowed me to practice the guitar more efficiently.
Michael
2010 Gibson Les Paul Studio (Ebony w/ Gold)
Peavy Rage 158 Practice Amp
#38
Quote by SpawnedX
Your not understanding. I couldn't even play medium on rock band, because I could not move my pinky at all without lifting or moving the finger next to it, to the point that I wasn't even holding down the button. Multiply that by the difficulty of playing the guitar and just forget it.

My pinky was so pathetic, that it needed a lot of exercise to just be controllable. It had nothing to do with the guitar. I didn't even use it to type with. I typed with 6 fingers instead of 8. Focusing on it was frustrating and aggravating. The fun factor of the game had me exercising it subconsciously. I wasn't thinking about it, I was just doing. That's what my benefit was. It didn't help my guitar technique at all, it just allowed me some dexterity in that finger, which allowed me to practice the guitar more efficiently.



well ive concluded that this thread shouldnt be about rock band or real guitar.

we should really talk about your retarded pinky.
#39
Quote by SpawnedX
Do you know what the term ignorant means? It means the person is ignoring certain statements and facts in day to day living to their detriment.

That would make you ignorant, since my very first paragraph already stated everything you decided to drum up in your postings. You blatantly ignored just about everything I have said. That would be ignorant.

I am proposing that Rock Band can help your hand and eye co-ordination, finger dexterity and compliance and even to an extent strength. Because no matter how much you try to ignore the fact in your epic travels to call me ignorant. You have to use muscles and your mind to tell your fingers what to do and where to go. Anytime you use muscles, you first wear them down so they must repair themselves to heal stronger for the tasks they are subjected to. This by no means is inclusive to fingers through guitar playing.

I have a huge array of practice techniques I use from a real guitar teacher to actually learn guitar technique and precision. Those are to help me with the guitar. I am suggested an alternative to finger exercising. So in order to be compliant with your statements you are saying that if my fingers get stronger without doing so by playing the guitar, than my fingers being stronger cannot benefit me in playing my guitar. Gotcha.

you asked for people's opinions, they're giving them to you, and it's making you mad
anyways, personally I don't think that playing Rock Band is going to help you with guitar. That sort of thinking is kinda like saying that playing a video game about boxing will make you a better boxer...
#40
I'm not getting mad. I'm incredulous to people putting words in my mouth. I never said it would make me better at guitar. I said it will make my fingers stronger and more compliant. Stronger and more controllable fingers will make me get better at the guitar.
Michael
2010 Gibson Les Paul Studio (Ebony w/ Gold)
Peavy Rage 158 Practice Amp
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