Page 1 of 6
#1
http://news.yahoo.com/s/csm/307229

read it all the way through and give your thoughts about whether or not the Arizona economy will bounce back with the law set in motion.
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#2
Arizona is ****ed then. They need the immigrant work force, as does all of America if it wants economic recovery. They need people who are willing to work for shit wages.
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers

If women can be annoyed there arent any women incongress I should be allowed to be pissed off there are no members of pink floyd or the beatles in congress.
#3
The economy will be fine without them. In fact, there would obviously be a lot of more job openings, leading to more money being moved around. So it could actually improve.
#4
Quote by Epicbizzjizz
The economy will be fine without them. In fact, there would obviously be a lot of more job openings, leading to more money being moved around. So it could actually improve.




Denial at its finest.

Every period of economic growth in US history was fueled by immigrant labor. Open a history book.

And lol @ more jobs by decreasing population
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers

If women can be annoyed there arent any women incongress I should be allowed to be pissed off there are no members of pink floyd or the beatles in congress.
#5
Quote by TunerAddict
Arizona is ****ed then. They need the immigrant work force, as does all of America if it wants economic recovery. They need people who are willing to work for shit wages.


That's just not true, businesses do NOT need to have shitty wages...
#6
lol @ "Illegal is a crime" on the posterboard

So, they cracked down on illegal aliens in Arizona, so they moving to another state.

What's resolved?
"The future's uncertain, and The End is always near."
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Last edited by SlinkyBlue at Jun 11, 2010,
#7
Quote by TunerAddict


Denial at its finest.

Every period of economic growth in US history was fueled by immigrant labor. Open a history book.

And lol @ more jobs by decreasing population

What about all that wonderful "looks like growth but is actually an entire economic system on the brink of collapse" growth? What immigrants contributed to that? Apart from Ponzi of course.
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#8
Quote by sg255
What about all that wonderful "looks like growth but is actually an entire economic system on the brink of collapse" growth? What immigrants contributed to that? Apart from Ponzi of course.


Are you seriously blaming immigrants for the economy falling? Seriously?

I didn't know immigrants were responsible for the housing bubble.
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers

If women can be annoyed there arent any women incongress I should be allowed to be pissed off there are no members of pink floyd or the beatles in congress.
#9
Quote by TunerAddict
Are you seriously blaming immigrants for the economy falling? Seriously?

I didn't know immigrants were responsible for the housing bubble.

No, of course not. It was a pathetic attempt at humour. Clearly sarcasm isn't welcome in this thread.
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#10
Quote by sg255
No, of course not. It was a pathetic attempt at humour. Clearly sarcasm isn't welcome in this thread.


it is, some UGers fail to see it but there are those few that got it I'm sure.
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#11
Quote by sg255
No, of course not. It was a pathetic attempt at humour. Clearly sarcasm isn't welcome in this thread.


My bad. The other guy got me a bit riled up.

Quote by jrcsgtpeppers

If women can be annoyed there arent any women incongress I should be allowed to be pissed off there are no members of pink floyd or the beatles in congress.
#12
Pretty straight forward really. If you are in America and not legally here GTFO.
You do not belong here, you are not wanted here its really that simple.


Racial profiling? Ask the Federal Government about the federal law regarding suspect illegal's, its the same as AZ law.

Dunno why its an issue, because its not an issue it's law and not just Arizona law.

As far as labor is concerned the American economy is so scrood right now people will soon be fighting to pick the orchards for a day job and it is even sadder that corporate America is perfectyl fine with it as they provide jobs offshore and pay only pennies to the foriegners to ship product into America.

There was a time when jobs in America were good and plentiful but now alot of people are just fighting for a job at McDonalds. SO consider all of this a culmination of the so called "Free Trade" deals. They are not free trade deals at all, they are merely deals that allow American companies to hire cheap labor in other countries while tanking the american economy with junk and providing no jobs.
Last edited by Stuntaxe at Jun 11, 2010,
#13
Quote by Stuntaxe
Pretty straight forward really. If you are in America and not legally here GTFO.
You do not belong here, you are not wanted here its realyl that simple.


Racial profiling? Ask the Federal Government about the federal law regarding suspect illegal's, its the same as AZ law.

Dunno why its an issue, because its not an issue it's law and not just Arizona law.


I want them here. So...

Can't blame people for trying to get a better life. They can't get in legally, so they come in illegally. It is either continue to live in poverty, or break laws and give your children a chance at a brighter future. You'd be doing the same if you were in their situation.
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers

If women can be annoyed there arent any women incongress I should be allowed to be pissed off there are no members of pink floyd or the beatles in congress.
#14
TunerAddict... Everyone wants a better life, even an American that wants a fair playing field.

Imagine that.
#15
Quote by Stuntaxe
Pretty straight forward really. If you are in America and not legally here GTFO.


Our economy would collapse if you had your wish.

Quote by Stuntaxe
You do not belong here, you are not wanted here its realyl that simple.


Talk to the farm owners who rely on them to pick their crops before you say no one wants them here.

Quote by Stuntaxe
Racial profiling? Ask the Federal Government about the federal law regarding suspect illegal's, its the same as AZ law.


Yeah. You know what this is stepping towards?

Papers, please.

Quote by Stuntaxe
Dunno why its an issue, because its not an issue it's law and not just Arizona law.


So, as far as you are concerned, laws should not be questioned?

I think you should meet some of the people who make these laws, friend.
"The future's uncertain, and The End is always near."
-Jim Morrison
#16
I don't get what you're saying. Americans have it a lot better then the immigrants coming here, they have an advantage. If anything, illegal immigration is really taking advantage of those in poverty.
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers

If women can be annoyed there arent any women incongress I should be allowed to be pissed off there are no members of pink floyd or the beatles in congress.
#17
Quote by Stuntaxe
TunerAddict... Everyone wants a better life, even an American that wants a fair playing field.

Imagine that.



well they're gunna get a fair chance now in the state of arizona, only problem is not only are illegal mexicans leaving but so are the legal ones. Arizona is kinda hurting itself there, if the gears don't keep turning and are properly maintained the machine breaks down and produces nothing. I think that a constuction site will hire an immigrant because his ignorant thoughts (which apply to most of us here) believe that they have hands on knowledge and pay under the table, as opposed to a legal american citizen who he would have to train, pay, and upkeep that person so the material continues to pump out. long story short alot of jobs are going to suffer since some of those mexicans that work here are legal but are becoming afraid of prejudice and assumptions from people that even though they have papers work here, that the papers can be fake. its a vicious cycle dude.
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Last edited by Hart_Attack at Jun 11, 2010,
#18
Meh, its just another day in this hot ****ing desert.

Im still seeing mexicans, im still seeing border patrol patrol the borders, and im still seeing people flip out about this shit. I've been called a spic/dirty beaner and i've had a gun drawn on me by Irish new york city police officers. I'd take this situation any day compared to the harassment I had to endure from people who were supposed to protect me.

What is ****ed up about this law is the probable cause aspect of it. If an officer has reason to believe you are an illegal and deny proper identification such as papers, and you are of legal citizenship, they can check your car and book you for other shit that was never in the equation.

This whole situation is tongue and cheek with me. Just have your drivers license on you and be aggressive with the officer who just profiled you. It's that simple really.
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#19
Quote by TunerAddict
I don't get what you're saying. Americans have it a lot better then the immigrants coming here, they have an advantage. If anything, illegal immigration is really taking advantage of those in poverty.



Absolutly. Mexico would be a better country if the people that wanted to leave it stayed and simply made it a better place to live.

As far as the Nazi symbol posting boy above, got no idea what you have illusioned yourself with, America is already as fascist nation that is wholly owned by the corporations that do nothing but find new ways to exploit you and pay you less or even worse pay foreigners less with no labor laws.

Seriously the jobs out in the fields are becomming fair game for an American worker, as jobs in America are scrood completely with most jobs going off shore. I must re-iterate again all the jobs are in Asia/India from manufacturing to just about everything else and then its all shipped here on the cheap under "Fair trade" when it's not fair trade at all considering most all foriegn countries in the Free Trade agreements have little to zero labor laws, Workers comp, Benefits, retirement. Not to mention they will work on buildingor engineering new computer's for the same price a Mexican labor worker will pick in American Orchards.

Essentially our leaders have sold us all out and do nothing but the bidding of thier corporate masters. Welcome to America...

By Definition America is now a Fascist Nation. Look it up
Last edited by Stuntaxe at Jun 11, 2010,
#20
well this is what they get then, if their own fault
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#21
Lastly the AZ law was made because Mexicans were crossing the border and commiting crimes and often murdering people...
#22
Quote by Stuntaxe
Lastly the AZ law was made because Mexicans were crossing the border and commiting crimes and often murdering people...


if that's not racial profiling, i don't know what is.

immigrants help the economy grow because they work so damn hard and do all of the jobs Americans simply don't want...get rid of them and your economy is going to tank.

i've said this before, it doesn't surprise me in the least that a southern, republican state controlled for the most part by middle class white guys want laws that get rid of foreigners. sure, it's already a federal law, so let the damn federal government take care of it...don't take matters into your own hands just because you have beef with the current government, not to mention the fucked up ethics you must have to not allow people to better their lives through work simply because they don't have a paper that says "American Citizen" on it.
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Last edited by Waterboy799 at Jun 11, 2010,
#23
Quote by TunerAddict
I want them here. So...

Can't blame people for trying to get a better life. They can't get in legally, so they come in illegally. It is either continue to live in poverty, or break laws and give your children a chance at a brighter future. You'd be doing the same if you were in their situation.

yeah you definitely can't. on that note i'm gonna go ahead and move into your house, eat your food, use your bathrooms, sleep in your beds, let you take me to the dr's and you can go ahead and pay for that too. cool right? i appreciate it man, just shoot me a mesage with your address and i'll break in sometime in the next 48 hours and we can be happy roomies, me living there illegally and you paying for everything. dude i'm so looking forward to it, don't worry i'll make sure theres a communication barrier by also failing to learn your language. thanks!
#24
Well its easy for you to discuss water boy while you sittin over in New York.

Mexican is not a racial term? Uhmm its a country dude, Mexico right? Its not about Heritage or race its about illegal Aliens comming into America from a country called Mexico.

And when these Mexicans cross the border illegally it does not matter where they are from. They entered our country without permission. Lastly...

Mexicans can always go about it the right way and get work Visa's to work in America. Supporting Illegal's in America is just kinda weird to me I guess I have no idea why its an issue once again. Illegals have no accountability and often are a danger to not just themselves but to others, with regards to insurance, car insurance, health insurance...

When an American goes to another country to work a "Work Visa" is required why should a Mexican be allowed more privilages than anyone else?
Last edited by Stuntaxe at Jun 11, 2010,
#25
The immigration process is appalling from what I've learned about it. Wouldn't cutting out the red tape go a lot farther towards straightening out the problem than making this kind of law? There's no doubt the quality of life in Mexico is significantly less than what it is in the US, but Arizona seems like they are shooting themselves in the foot here.
#26
The immigration thing is getting pretty bad down there, especially since a lot of drug dealers are coming as well as the people trying to make a better life for themselves, but xenophobia is not the answer.
#27
Quote by cornmancer
The immigration thing is getting pretty bad down there, especially since a lot of drug dealers are coming as well as the people trying to make a better life for themselves, but xenophobia is not the answer.

+1 , i live in texas and it's not really any better here. i'm all for having people come to this country LEGALLY, aside from native americans everyones ancestry in america comes from elsewhere, but they generally came here legally.

the big problem is that the border town issues are slowly pouring over into the border towns in the states. if mexico wants to have drug war massacres then thats cool, thats mexicos issue. i don't want it spilling over into the u.s.a.

Quote by iro-bot31
The immigration process is appalling from what I've learned about it. Wouldn't cutting out the red tape go a lot farther towards straightening out the problem than making this kind of law? There's no doubt the quality of life in Mexico is significantly less than what it is in the US, but Arizona seems like they are shooting themselves in the foot here.

the immigration process is a long one regardless of where you're going to. everyone else who came here legally had to deal with it, why should there be exceptions to the rule? if somethings gone horribly wrong in mexico then move somewhere else in mexico.
Last edited by z4twenny at Jun 11, 2010,
#28
Quote by Stuntaxe
Well its easy for you to discuss water boy while you sittin over in New York.




Uhh, just want to point out, there were more immigrants in Brooklyn in 2000 than there were in the whole of Arizona. Don't know what it is now though. That's legal ones though, so, make of that what you will.

Edit:
Actually, US census figure's don't differentiate between legal and illegal foreign borns. So unless anyone wants to count these dudes themselves, no one really knows how many illegals there are.
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Last edited by sg255 at Jun 11, 2010,
#29
Quote by Stuntaxe
Well its easy for you to discuss water boy while you sittin over in New York.

Mexican is not a racial term? Uhmm its a country dude, Mexico right? Its not about Heritage or race its about illegal Aliens comming into America from a country called Mexico.

And when these Mexicans cross the border illegally it does not matter where they are from. They entered our country without permission. Lastly...

Mexicans can always go about it the right way and get work Visa's to work in America. Supporting Illegal's in America is just kinda weird to me I guess I have no idea why its an issue once again. Illegals have no accountability and often are a danger to not just themselves but to others, with regards to insurance, car insurance, health insurance...

When an American goes to another country to work a "Work Visa" is required why should a Mexican be allowed more privilages than anyone else?


what does where i live have anything to do with this discussion? what, New York doesn't have an immigrant population all of a sudden? last time i checked, NY has a larger immigrant population then Arizona does.

first off, not all immigrants are Mexican. fine, the greater majority of them are, but people come here from countries in Central America, the Philippines, India etc. as well. secondly, you say one of the reasons for the law was that Mexicans were committing crimes and thus they should be deported. were all Mexicans committing these crimes? what was the percentage of crimes committed by illegal immigrants in Arizona? did you know that areas in the US with large immigrant populations have lower crime rates than areas without large immigrant populations? bet you didn't.

what if they asked for permission but our all too mighty US government overlooked the poor Mexican family who needs a Visa to come over the keep their children from starving. don't think it's possible? it's difficult to get a Visa, my grandparents and all of their cousins, sisters and brothers who came to the US from Greece would know.

Illegals don't have any benefits...they're illegals and aren't bound by the Constitution or any laws that would pertain to American citizens. so with that in mind i ask you, what privileges do illegals have that Americans citizens do not, and are they more than what an American citizen has?
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Last edited by Waterboy799 at Jun 11, 2010,
#30
OK... So from your point of view its perfectly fine for me and few friends to go in yer back yard, help our selves to the porch, ahh hell yer such a cool guy let me at yer fridge to, I mean after all I am pretty hungry cuz my backyard kinda sucks and me and my friends dont even got a fridge.

You must be the most giving sucker I know.

Oh wut? You got a daughter? Can I help myself to her as well? Yeah, we jsut gonna take her for a ride if ya know what I mean, but we do not got any car or health insurance incase anything happens, but yer fine with that right?! Right on dude!
Thanks man yer a real bro, while we're at it give me the keys to yer car again I goto get around town and see whats goin on, and when I get back leave yer back gate open. Because like I am chillin in yer back yard and all it just easier for us to get inside. Oh what ya got a job? Here let me know who they are I can come in for ya a few days no problemo! Infact I am such a nice guy yer boss can pay me a quarter of what he pays you! I got yer back! Awe heck no one has to know yer boss even hired me over you! Sorry ya lost yer job It's all under the table man, I love not having any taxes and shit why do you deal with that anyways? Yer boss is really happy about me hanging out and is wondering if I can get some more friends in yer back yard and I got plans laid out for all that! I think ya gonan need a bigger fridge!

Well me and my bro's are gonna go to our backyard for a few days and we'll be back as we please PS: leave the fridge open with a few beer's in it for us to.
PS: Yer daughter is a real blast sorry she's pregnant!

Thanks.
Last edited by Stuntaxe at Jun 11, 2010,
#31
Quote by Stuntaxe
OK... So from your point of view its perfectly fine for me and few friends to go in yer back yard, help our selves to the porch, ahh hell yer such a cool guy let me at yer fridge to, I mean after all I am pretty hungry cuz my backyard kinda sucks and me and my friends dont even got a fridge.

You must be the most giving sucker I know.

Oh wut? You got a daughter? Can I help myself to her as well? Yeah, we jsut gonna take her for a ride if ya know what I mean, but we do not got any car or health insurance incase anything happens, but yer fine with that right?! Right on dude!
Thanks man yer a real bro, while we're at it give me the keys to yer car again I goto get around town and see whats goin on, and when I get back leave yer back gate open. Because like I am chillin in yer back yard and all it just easier for us to get inside. Oh what ya got a job? Here let me know who they are I can come in for ya a few days no problemo! Infact I am such a nice guy yer boss can pay me a quarter of what he pays you! I got yer back! Awe heck no one has to know yer boss even hired me over you! Sorry ya lost yer job It's all under the table man, I love not having any taxes and shit why do you deal with that anyways? Yer boss is really happy about me hanging out and is wondering if I can get some more friends in yer back yard and I got plans laid out for all that! I think ya gonan need a bigger fridge!

Well me and my bro's are gonna go to our backyard for a few days and we'll be back as we please PS: leave the fridge open with a few beer's in it for us to.
PS: Yer daughter is a real blast sorry she's pregnant!

Thanks.

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#33
I don't understand what the big deal is...I mean, illegal immigration is already illegal, so why will this law drive them away? Also...illegal immigrants do hurt the economy in some aspect, since they take jobs away from Americans who could occupy them, which raises the unemployment rate right?
#34
Quote by Stuntaxe
*idiocy*


that made absolutely no sense whatsoever.

thanks for proving this law is being implemented on racist/discriminatory grounds.
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#35
Quote by justaramsfan
I don't understand what the big deal is...I mean, illegal immigration is already illegal, so why will this law drive them away? Also...illegal immigrants do hurt the economy in some aspect, since they take jobs away from Americans who could occupy them, which raises the unemployment rate right?

90% of Americans wouldn't take 90% of the jobs illegal immigrants "take". And this law isn't just driving illegal immigrants away but legal ones as well.
Quote by Pleasure2kill
The truth is, Muslims never apologized for their faith having something to do with the attacks on 9/11.
#36
Quote by justaramsfan
I don't understand what the big deal is...I mean, illegal immigration is already illegal, so why will this law drive them away? Also...illegal immigrants do hurt the economy in some aspect, since they take jobs away from Americans who could occupy them, which raises the unemployment rate right?



Careful bud... You are making sense!
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#37
Quote by damian_91
90% of Americans wouldn't take 90% of the jobs illegal immigrants "take". And this law isn't just driving illegal immigrants away but legal ones as well.


How are you going to prove that? That's speculation at it's finest...what do they do that other people couldn't? I mean, if your trying to feed your kids, you'd work any job I would think...

That's what I mean, why are the legal immigrants being driven away? Does this law affect them? Maybe I'm missing something...
#38
Quote by justaramsfan
How are you going to prove that? That's speculation at it's finest...what do they do that other people couldn't? I mean, if your trying to feed your kids, you'd work any job I would think...

That's what I mean, why are the legal immigrants being driven away? Does this law affect them? Maybe I'm missing something...

Racial profiling.

edit: illegal immigrants take jobs other people would simply refuse to take.
Quote by Pleasure2kill
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Last edited by damian_91 at Jun 11, 2010,
#39
Quote by damian_91
90% of Americans wouldn't take 90% of the jobs illegal immigrants "take". And this law isn't just driving illegal immigrants away but legal ones as well.



BS! I live in Orchard country guess who is picking the orchards now? ALot of American's, as in white, black anmd Asian. THe old belief that these are jobs Americans do not want does not fly whats so ever! Infact it's incredibly misleading.

When an illegal is working in a field the company that is paying him is not paying a fair wadge, is not paying taxes for hiring the illegal and evading a great number of laws that any AMERICAN citizen has with regards to employment.

It's not that its a job Americans do not want it's just job that allows companies to cut corners, and thats probably why this is some sort of button issue in the media, there are corporate think tanks out there that put it all together to benefit the companies not people.

Illegals have rights to and just because they are here illegalyl does not make it fair for there work to fly under the radar to be taken advantage of by companies that want them over a bonefide American citizen.

By stating that these people are desperate for a new life and deserve one is it so fair to take advantage of them and allow them to work without proper protections in employment and pay? It's not, people need a fair shake and taking advantage of people when they are down and desperate is just outright criminal.

NO matter how you look at it, and illegal is an illegal, they are a danger to not only themselves but others in far more ways than one.
Last edited by Stuntaxe at Jun 11, 2010,
#40
Quote by damian_91
Racial profiling.

edit: illegal immigrants take jobs other people would simply refuse to take.


The article says it could lead to racial profiling...so there's no reason for Hispanics to worry about that yet. It does say that policemen could stop you if you were a "suspected" illegal immigrant, which I guess is kinda edgy, but it's the only way to enforce this law really