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#1
Hey guys. Im looking to get a head to start playing live. I play rock like Seether, Escape The Fate, Hawthorne Heights, and stuff like that. The heads Im looking at are a Peavey XXX and a Bugera 1990 or a JCM 900 if I can find one cheap enough. Which head do you guys like better and which one would work better for this music on a budget? Thanks in advance
#2
check out The Tone King, this guy is awesome. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFv-VBRrtlA

the bugeras are great deals and they have fixed all of their main production problems so you shouldnt have to worry.

id say the marshall would be the best, the xxx will be a different sound but still good, and the 1990 will be very similar to the marshall
#3
well I have a Peavey Vypyr 75 with the XXX modeled on it and i like it for a good rhythm tone but i was wondering how it compared to the 1990
#4
Quote by CamaroEric+
check out The Tone King, this guy is awesome. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFv-VBRrtlA

the bugeras are great deals and they have fixed all of their main production problems so you shouldnt have to worry.

id say the marshall would be the best, the xxx will be a different sound but still good, and the 1990 will be very similar to the marshall


lemme give ya one of those bad boys right there \|,,|

plays :
A------------/5-5-6-7

alrighty boys and girls......

sorry just an overview of all of the tone kings videos... but on topic

XXX is an extremely good amp
Marshall is pretty good
not much experience with bugeras.
Where's Waldo?
#5
The Tone King is one of the biggest losers on YouTube. The XXX and 900 would be solid choices. The XXX would probably work a bit better. The 1990 is a piss poor copy of the 900 and I'd avoid it.
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#6
Quote by mmolteratx
The Tone King is one of the biggest losers on YouTube. The XXX and 900 would be solid choices. The XXX would probably work a bit better. The 1990 is a piss poor copy of the 900 and I'd avoid it.


+1 to the XXX

It's more versatile than the others IMO...and has a more modern gain sound.
#7
Yeah, the fact that it sounds virtually identical to the 900 shouldn't effect your decision (ugh) and the fact that he plays comparable amps on identical speakers with identical settings sure makes him a looser for not making the expensive amp sound better.

If your looking at the XXX, give the Bugera 333 and 333xl a good hard listening to. Great tone, and in several ways BETTER than the Peaveys (not even counting the price)
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#8
They don't sound virtually identical. I've AB'd them through the same cab and they definitely do not sound the same.

And as far as the Tone King comments, playing two "comparable" amps with the same settings is ****ing stupid. You EQ the two to sound the best and compare then. And even then, you wouldn't be able to tell because the ****ing retard uses a shitty camera mic. He can't play worth a shit and does a piss poor job at demoing anything as everything he puts up sounds like shit.
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#9
^+1

TTK fails...and the Bugera amps sound 'similar' to the amps they clone. But 'identical' is a stretch for any amp...hell...some of the same models from the same manufacturer's don't sound identical.

Quote by Vinson
several ways BETTER than the Peaveys (not even counting the price)


Do tell...
Last edited by eyebanez333 at Jun 13, 2010,
#10
yeah, im really leaning towards Peavey. They have always been really solid in my experience. Question, Do they make the Marshall in a combo? cuz im looking for something with 212s so i can haul it around. I have a small car...
#11
^ 212 combos are much harder to move around than a head + 2x12 cab, unless you're comfortable lifting >80 lbs worth of amp on a regular basis.

As far as amps go, have you tried the Vypyr Tube 60? I know you have the 75 already but the 60 is a big step up.
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#13
I got another option that im considering. Would a Tube head version of the Vypyr be a major upgrade? Cuz I realized last night that it has a lot of things that make it conveniant to use in a cover band, mostly ease of use and a wide range of effects. Any thoughts between this and the XXX? would the head be too loud to use in clubs and sports bars and things?
#14
I have a 333xl and i have only good things to say about it!
Give it a try.
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Fish And Chips eq
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#15
Quote by mmolteratx
They don't sound virtually identical. I've AB'd them through the same cab and they definitely do not sound the same.

And as far as the Tone King comments, playing two "comparable" amps with the same settings is ****ing stupid. You EQ the two to sound the best and compare then. And even then, you wouldn't be able to tell because the ****ing retard uses a shitty camera mic. He can't play worth a shit and does a piss poor job at demoing anything as everything he puts up sounds like shit.


So then, how do you set up the EQ so each sounds "best"? That's why there are tone knobs...everyone has a different opinion on what the "best" tone is. Keeping everything the same, with the knobs at 12:00 lets you hear the amps un-altered tone.
He is getting better at using other equipment than a camcorder mic, and while he may not be Zakk, he does well enough for you to get a comparison of the 2 amps he is testing.

Quote by eyebanez333


^+1

TTK fails...and the Bugera amps sound 'similar' to the amps they clone. But 'identical' is a stretch for any amp...hell...some of the same models from the same manufacturer's don't sound identical.


Identical? No. VIRTUALLY identical...pretty damn close (i.e. 1990 vs. JCM900)

If TTK "fails" so badly.....who DOESN'T that has more than 3-4 amps to test?

Better to try and fail, than to fail to try....where's YOUR comparison tests boys?
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Last edited by Vinson at Jun 16, 2010,
#17
A 333XL would be awesome. A jcm 900 would be great aswell, and if you like the 900 a 1990 is an amp you have to try. 6262 might be a little much for you, but I love mine
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LTD Alexi-200 Black(Death Adder pickup & Gold OFR)
Agile Interceptor Pro 727 7-string
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amps:
Bugera 6262 212 loaded with WGS veteran 30's
#18
Quote by Vinson
So then, how do you set up the EQ so each sounds "best"? That's why there are tone knobs...everyone has a different opinion on what the "best" tone is. Keeping everything the same, with the knobs at 12:00 lets you hear the amps un-altered tone.
He is getting better at using other equipment than a camcorder mic, and while he may not be Zakk, he does well enough for you to get a comparison of the 2 amps he is testing.


There's no such thing as an unaltered tone when referring to amps. What you said makes no sense. What you would do, is take several settings on each that sound good and then compare. Just like you would in person. Some amps sound like complete shit with everything at noon and like monsters when tweaked to sound better. And everything, I repeat everything, he does sounds the same through those shitty camera mics. He hasn't gotten better. The guy's a tool, not really sure why you're trying to defend him.
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#19
Quote by mmolteratx
There's no such thing as an unaltered tone when referring to amps. What you said makes no sense. What you would do, is take several settings on each that sound good and then compare. Just like you would in person. Some amps sound like complete shit with everything at noon and like monsters when tweaked to sound better. And everything, I repeat everything, he does sounds the same through those shitty camera mics. He hasn't gotten better. The guy's a tool, not really sure why you're trying to defend him.


ya unaltered tone doesn't make any sense. Sorry, but an amp's eq section doesn't work anything like a hifi audio eq section. There is no unity. There entire range and interaction of the eq section has everything to do with how it's wired and which circuit design was used.

The only thing close to unity would be to take the tone stack right out of the amp but for many amps there are values in the tone stack that are responsible for the sound of the amp so that's not always even possible.
Prs se Holcomb is the answer
#20
Quote by mmolteratx
There's no such thing as an unaltered tone when referring to amps. What you said makes no sense. What you would do, is take several settings on each that sound good and then compare. Just like you would in person. Some amps sound like complete shit with everything at noon and like monsters when tweaked to sound better. And everything, I repeat everything, he does sounds the same through those shitty camera mics. He hasn't gotten better. The guy's a tool, not really sure why you're trying to defend him.



Because you really have no idea what your talking about. (And I say that in the nicest way)
You can repeat all you want, but he HAS gotten better, unless you think SM57 and Sennheiser e609 are the same as his crappy cam corder mic.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDfu6YIsXxo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHsfZWpERNE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1TJn9iGycgQ

With everything at 12:00 everything is equal not scooping the mids, not boosting the bass...you get 10 minutes...you wanna compare 2-4 channels all with different EQ settings? Your not going to make everyone happy anyway.
MOSTLY, when he compares amps, he is showing how similar they sound...if they sound similar with everything @ 12:00, they will likely sound similar with different EQ settings.
It's basic 2 horse race... you only change ONE thing at a time. Not one amp set to what YOU think is best, and the other with a different setting. Then all you will get are people bitching that brand A was EQed better then brand B. Suddenly when the 6260 has a better bottom end than the 6505 it's because your cheating in favor of the 6260!

If you can do better, lets see it.
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Last edited by Vinson at Jun 17, 2010,
#21
Honestly any one of these amps would be good.

I can't go too in to detail but....

Pretty much the XXX is most likely going to have the most gain

The JCM 900 pretty much goes without saying, but the clips i;ve heard of the 1990 directly compared to the 900, they are pretty close, not exact, but pretty close, the 900 is still slightly better. Brighter and cleaner. And these days you can find 900's pretty cheap. Not even that much more expensive than the Bugera's these days. Bugera's are still pretty good for their price range.

If you can I would suggest looking for a JCM800, Peavey 5150 or 6505, or Mesa Dual or Triple Rec if you want to spend a little more money.
Last edited by handbanana at Jun 17, 2010,
#23
He keeps the mics placed straight ahead at the center of the cone for the majority of that first video. Big no no. The second video shows his incompetence at showing how an amps plays by not being able to control his picking dynamics. I'm not even going to bother watching the third one. Granted, it does prove his recording has gotten nicer but it's still not up to par with PGS or even guys like Jack Zucker. He still manages to make everything sound extremely similar, even when in person they don't.

EDIT: LOL at the description of the V22 and AC15 'shootout'. 'Both are EL84 1x12 combos.' Therefore they must be similar.
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Last edited by mmolteratx at Jun 17, 2010,
#24
Peavey. No question whatsoever.

Then again, only question is between the XXX, 6505, 5150, or JSX.
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Thank you, you've all been very informative and helpful (except you Mr_CiNiC, f*ck you.)
Love you too, babe.
#25
Never played the XXX or the Marshall, but I can say only good things about the Bugera. I think they have one of the best clean settings on the market and the lead channel isnt half bad either. I've only heard demos of the Marshall but I don't think it's worth the extra money you'll have to put into it.
I hate my sig
#26
I am not the Tone King....I am in far better shape LOL and don't have that Boston (?) accent LOL!

Matt, he may not be perfect, but admittedly, he IS getting better.
I give him credit for at least putting it out there for us all to see. Not many others are doing side X side tests...and those that do, are only doing a couple of amps vs. his MANY comparison vids.
I just don't understand the hate for the poor guy.
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#28
Quote by mmolteratx
He keeps the mics placed straight ahead at the center of the cone for the majority of that first video. Big no no. The second video shows his incompetence at showing how an amps plays by not being able to control his picking dynamics. I'm not even going to bother watching the third one. Granted, it does prove his recording has gotten nicer but it's still not up to par with PGS or even guys like Jack Zucker. He still manages to make everything sound extremely similar, even when in person they don't.

EDIT: LOL at the description of the V22 and AC15 'shootout'. 'Both are EL84 1x12 combos.' Therefore they must be similar.



Hate to brake it to you friend but boogers and pee-vee's sound exactly extremely similar.
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LTD Alexi-200 Black(Death Adder pickup & Gold OFR)
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amps:
Bugera 6262 212 loaded with WGS veteran 30's
Last edited by Gundamnitpete at Jun 17, 2010,
#29
Quote by Mr_CiNiC
Peavey. No question whatsoever.

Then again, only question is between the XXX, 6505, 5150, or JSX.


Whatcha got against the 3120 and the 6534?
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#30
The Peavey copies do, I never said anything about that. The Marshall copies are awful though.

EDIT:^ The 3120 is the XXX and I'm not sure how many have tried the 6534 yet.
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Last edited by mmolteratx at Jun 17, 2010,
#31
I know...I was just ribbing him...for some reason the smiley buttons aren't working for me.'
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#32
the tone kings vids with everything at 12 o clock is pure BS. Thats an easy way to make alot of amps sound terrible. If you want to do a shoot out make it with the best tone possible from each amp so you know what each amp is capable of


That said, Peavey might be better. Bugera might be for you. try them out
I traded in my Real Books for Robbins and Cotran Pathology Textbooks
#33
Quote by mmolteratx
^A used 900 is cheaper than a 1990 bro.

hey bro, why don't you show me where I can pick up a used 900 for $450 or less.
R.I.P. Randy Rhoads
#34
I saw a JCM900 on craigslist recently for $300, been seeing them in the $400-450 a lot lately. Everyone is more in demand for the 800
#36
Quote by mexican_shred
the tone kings vids with everything at 12 o clock is pure BS. Thats an easy way to make alot of amps sound terrible. If you want to do a shoot out make it with the best tone possible from each amp so you know what each amp is capable of


That said, Peavey might be better. Bugera might be for you. try them out


Because then fanboys for the loosing amp will claim it's because the EQ wasn't set right.

What ARE the BEST possible tone settings for a 5150 anyway? Or a JCM 900 or a Bugera V22?

There is NO such thing as the best tone possible! Best tone to YOU is different than best tone to me...otherwise they would just set the amps up that way, and not have the extra expense of tone knobs.
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Last edited by Vinson at Jun 17, 2010,
#37
Quote by Vinson
Because then fanboys for the loosing amp will claim it's because the EQ wasn't set right.

What ARE the BEST possible tone settings for a 5150 anyway? Or a JCM 900 or a Bugera V22?

There is NO such thing as the best tone possible! Best tone to YOU is different than best tone to me...otherwise they would just set the amps up that way, and no have the extra expense of tone knobs.

oh please objectivism only goes so far. There are certain ways to EQ the amp to make it bad and good in general. If someone really want to do a shoot out they would try to make the amp sound best from their ears, not this everything 12 o clock shit. My old mark IV would have sounded like an MG with everything at 12.
I traded in my Real Books for Robbins and Cotran Pathology Textbooks
#38
Find the thread about "show me your front panels" or something like that. Some guys have the SAME amp with the mids at 10, and the other with the mids at near zero. ALL kinds of tastes. people like them set up DRASTICALLY different. There is no best....there IS an equal (everything the same on both amps). He chooses 12:00. He could choose 10/0/10 and that would piss some people off, he could choose 5/8/6 or anything else...12:00 is a common neutral setting.
Dismiss his vids if you wish...so me a better way.


Quote by Gundamnitpete


+1

even better:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57CHIaJPONE&feature=related
vs.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKTz_7vPWwc&feature=related
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Peavey 412M w/Eminence Wizards & Swamp Thangs, Rocktron Hush Super C, Furman PL-8C,15 band EQ, Boosta grande, ISP Decimator, Dano EQ, Ibanez TBX 150,TC Elec Polytune
Last edited by Vinson at Jun 17, 2010,
#39
Quote by Vinson



First off, ever hear of a thing called post-production editing? After you make a video you can EQ the audio to make it sound a lot better or a lot worse (i.e. you could make two amps that sound nothing alike sound very similar with a little bit of editing).

Also, to all of your comments about TTK. He is horrible. The whole "everything at noon" idea is complete bullshit - you have two amps, and even though one is a "clone" of the other they aren't going to be voiced exactly the same. Therefore turning everything to 12 o'clock really doesn't show you how comparable the two amps are - he would be better off trying to dial the amps in to get a similar of a tone out of both amps as he can, that way it shows that the clone really is capable of sounding like the original. Also, the man uses a camera mic which is a terrible choice because it doesn't have the same frequency response as instrument mics. In a lot of his videos he will have the camera closer to one amp than the other which will alter the tone. Lastly he sucks (not saying that I'm good or anything but I don't plaster my face all over youtube trying to "demo" stuff for people).
#40
i sold a jcm900 combo not 5 months ago for 450.
i see them for under 500 all the time. everywhere. if you can't find one for under 500 you don't deserve one.

@vinson....look we know you like the toneking. we know you like bugera. but....
you honestly have no clue in hell how an amp's tone stack works. and neither does the tone king. seriously. this argument is getting silly.
Prs se Holcomb is the answer
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