#1
Alright UG R&R Forums, theres are a few questions that pop up more often than not on this board and I honestly think we should, as a community, write a guide on how to start recording. It gets annoying to have the same few questions (like "What do I need to get started?", "What is a good mic?", "Would it work if I did X?" and "How can I record a guitar without an amp?") asked 30 times a day all having the same answer said by the same 3 people.

So lets write a little guide that answers a few of the basic questions we see everyday. Anyone up for doing this with me?
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#3
Right there with you, let me know what you need help with
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#4
Quote by TheDriller

the only problem i forsee is the more experienced among us giving solid advice and the less experienced calling us out as arrogant elitists.


Yeah I'm gonna go right ahead and agree with this.

But I'm also going to step right out and say a community recording guide here is just going to end up a bag of concessions and half truths. In general, people here don't want help, they just want the cheapest quick fix they can find, theres an inherent culture of reveling in mediocrity.

Implementing a plausible change here is never going to happen, the volume of the same questions asked and the often critical lack of common sense is just reflective of a culture of people too lazy to use their own initiative and capitalise on a resource that could easily be so much more.

Rank amateurs don't believe people that know their shit in this forum because they think automatically that anyone on this board knows nothing and has just invested in this because they have money to throw at it. As a result, confident assertions are ignored and arrogance is often the only way to drill home common sense issues into overly thick skulls.

Hardly anyone on this board BELIEVES they can do better, its enough just to be "OK" or "acceptable", people will criticise me for my negative approach, but really in a carrot or stick situation to many people lack the initiative or desire to see the reward at the end of the day.

The attitude here is very much "if you really know what you're doing why the hell are you here wasting your time with us?", and when you see situations like this, you think to yourself "good question, what the **** am I doing here?" - all to often with people who know shit on here it seems to be a misguided sense of altruism or positive human nature trying to wade through closet-minded and instituted dogma.

I'm quite tempted just to log out and not log back in again, and I'm sure many here would be happy with that outcome, but the more time I spend on this forum the more I realise that time is a waste when I could be contributing to more thoughtful and developed discussion elsewhere.
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#6
Yeah the majority think a MIXER is a must for recording one track at a time - an Interface isn't needed and AUDACITY rulz...
Now running an Eleven Rack with Pro Tools 10.3.3 - it's amazing and I'm having ball with it - worth every penny. PT 10 is tops IMO and the Eleven Rack is a work of art!
#7
i agree with beefmo too, mainly b/c i was one of the people that thought "naw i don't need to spend all that money" but as it turns out, the more you spend, the better it can sound and unfortunately cheap fixes sound just like that usually (sometimes they can have good results though!)

i'd actually like to see a mixing flowchart suggestive type guide, i have my own way of mixing stuff, but so does everyone else and i think it'd be nice to see how others set their levels and what not.
#8
Quote by strangedogs
Yeah the majority think a MIXER is a must for recording one track at a time - an Interface isn't needed and AUDACITY rulz...


behringer mixers,

audacity,

guitar pro,

in-built soundcards,

radioshack mics,

separating vocals from a song,

the list of drivel posted on this forum just goes on and on and on....


Anyway, back on topic.
I'm reminded of when we had all those stickys full of decent info that everyone roundly ignored. im not at all opposed to the idea of a Recording Guide,
more concerned about how we go about compiling a guide that doesn't sell-out to mediocrity just to keep the gibbering masses placated.

Edit:
Quote by z4twenny

i'd actually like to see a mixing flowchart suggestive type guide, i have my own way of mixing stuff, but so does everyone else and i think it'd be nice to see how others set their levels and what not.


are we talking about a workflow for mixing? i'd be up for contributing on that topic.
Last edited by TheDriller at Jun 18, 2010,
#10
Quote by TheDriller


are we talking about a workflow for mixing? i'd be up for contributing on that topic.


thats exactly what im referring to, i've talked to several different people and watched quite a few instructional vids and it seems like everyones mixing workflow is a little different and everybody has their own reasons, sometimes its for simplicity, sometimes its to get a certain sound and sometimes (like still being a novice) it's just not knowing any better.
#11
I'd be up for writing something for it, qualified in Music Technology and currently doing a degree in creative technology while teaching music technology at a high school. I mainly use Cubase and Reason, but I have used all the other major DAWs at some time or another.

Also I would totally agree with previous comments about the general attitude in the R&R section. Every day there is at LEAST 3 topics "How do I record guitar" and there seems to be one every day saying "I tried recording my band with a rock band mic, I plugged it into the mic part of my computer but it doesn't sound good"

The most peculiar part of this board is people think that if you post here, it's your opinion and you don't know anything, but that youtube is the centre of all knowledge. I was recording a band's demo once, and the guitarist questioned EVERY single decision and mic placement made because "I watched a video on youtube and this guy did it different".

One of the things he got mad about was I didn't cover the mic and amp in a blanket because the guy on youtube said it made it sound better. We were in a completely treated room.

But anyway after that tangent... The R&R Resource thread I think is fantastic, but it doesn't cover the use of the applications, so yeah, let's do this!
#12
I feel guilty as I read this, not being willing to invest all of my money in top-quality equipment, but I'm a 15 year old kid. It's definitely annoying when people refuse to listen to others that are actually experienced, but that is more a lack of desire to succeed. I take into account everything that is suggested to me and I use much of my free time learning and practicing, and my recordings sound better every time I make a new one.

People need to understand that it's not just about "what should I buy to sound good?" It just doesnt work like that. It takes dedication and commitment to produce quality recordings (which of course by no means implies that having nice equipment won't improve your sound, but you get the point).

All that said, it would be awesome to have everyone that knows what they are doing (and we know who most of those people are) contribute ideas. We would just have to trust that people that should not be giving advice would not be overly confident and give bad advice, which could very well be a problem. The workflow for mixing idea is great too.
#13
Quote by TheDriller
I'm reminded of when we had all those stickys full of decent info that everyone roundly ignored. im not at all opposed to the idea of a Recording Guide,


I remember that. It was about 6 different guides on everything. I remember reading one then reading another one of them (I forget which two) and they completely contradicted each other. None provided really any solid answers or suggestions into starting out recording other than the few lines that said "Don't plug your guitar straight into the mic port" and "Don't use Audacity".
Derpy Derp Derp Herp Derp
#14
Quote by lockwolf
I remember that. It was about 6 different guides on everything. I remember reading one then reading another one of them (I forget which two) and they completely contradicted each other. None provided really any solid answers or suggestions into starting out recording other than the few lines that said "Don't plug your guitar straight into the mic port" and "Don't use Audacity".


True, true.

OK Mr Wolf,

lets get the show on the road.

if you can devise a list of articles you want to see written and then delegate writing duties to volunteers you can trust, we can get somewhere with this.

I'll volunteer for the "Mixing Workflow" tutorial.
#15
you guys write articles, and i will compile a nice thread with them. either a sticky or at least a link in the sticky (probably the former).

i would contribute, but i know i dont know as much as some people on here. i contribute what i can, and learn from the rest.
#16
let me first say this is a good idea if we can pull it off.

a problem i see, and a problem i had with the old stickies, is that with recording and mixing, there are so few "right" answers. many engineers have differing opinions on pretty much every aspect (besides the mic jack, audacity, and behringer gear) of recording/mixing. it just comes down to whatever works for that particular person, which means that what one person sees as "right" wont work for another person.

i think if a proper guide is written, it will need to include more than one side of the issue. perhaps have more than one person write on the same issues so we can see the differing opinions explained by people who actually believe in them without it being on big argument.

that's my two cents. if anyone believes i have the slightest idea of what i'm talking about, i would be more than happy to contribute to the guide.
#17
One thing I've discovered in these forums - People don't READ. The same questions are asked 10 times a day and if one were to just read some of the threads their questions would be answered over and over... not sure what good a sticky would be but I guess we could direct them to it instead of answering the same questions again and again.
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#18
Can I make a suggestion? Why don't you write two guides? One could be "the cheapest way to recording with OK quality" and the other "the suggested way to recording with optimum quality".

In the first guide, you just mention the stuff that the newbie needs to get started, and in the second, you can analyse all the right techniques that need to be applied for a really top-notch recording...

This way the no-reader newbie gets his hands-on guide to start recording, and the other guy who wants to delve into recording, gets his guide too. Plus, the no-reader newbie will(?) eventually evolve...
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#19
Bamp

PM me lockwolf if you want me to help, i do know a good amount about all kinds of recording gear and techniques etc.

TBH every thread on here is asking about

what gear to get to start recording

or

Why do my guitars sound like shit? (and its usually because your are micing a line 6 spyder with a rock band mic into your f***ing sound card!)

It really is frustrating to see these questions every day. Google is not hard, and there are SO many guides to recording and starting out its insane.
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Last edited by Tig Bitties at Jun 20, 2010,
#20
I'm definitely up for it too! Pro Tools and Cubase 5 are my main programs.

I think a nice little FAQ would solve a lot of repeated questions, for ex:
"Q: Do I need a mixer to record?"
"A: Short answer NO, but/ however" and then develop the pros and cons, etc...

"Q: Can i use my line in on my soundblaster to plug my guitar with a 1/4" to 1/8" jack?"
"A: NO, unless you're aiming for a pile of shit recording" and once again develop on the subject.

I also think that in order for this to be effective (aka in order to make people READ the damn things) we should make it a rule that everyone read the full thing before posting anything at all. It would be pretty easy to spot a post from someone who hasn't read it and hand out warnings/ bans for not complying to the rules.
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Last edited by miguelito2729 at Jun 20, 2010,
#21
Quote by Wise_One
Can I make a suggestion? Why don't you write two guides? One could be "the cheapest way to recording with OK quality" and the other "the suggested way to recording with optimum quality".

In the first guide, you just mention the stuff that the newbie needs to get started, and in the second, you can analyse all the right techniques that need to be applied for a really top-notch recording...

This way the no-reader newbie gets his hands-on guide to start recording, and the other guy who wants to delve into recording, gets his guide too. Plus, the no-reader newbie will(?) eventually evolve...

I think this is a very good idea. For example, at university, I can record using a £1000+ vocal Mic, into a £50,000 desk, and so need to know how best to make use of it. But on the other hand, I can only afford a £70 vocal mic and a £350 interface for home demo'ing/recording, which is going to be harder to get a top notch sound out of, but guides from professionals on how to get as good a recording and mix as possible out of my crap equipment, but another guide on how to make use of top quality equipment, would be incredibly useful.
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#23
I've added a few videos to my thread to answer most of the common questions and have more to do when I get the time but it seems most of the members are just going and posting without even reading the FAQ or watching the videos.
I think at this point most of the posts could be answered by linking to the main resource pinned thread at the top of the forum.
#24
Quote by miguelito2729
I'm definitely up for it too! Pro Tools and Cubase 5 are my main programs.

I think a nice little FAQ would solve a lot of repeated questions, for ex:
"Q: Do I need a mixer to record?"
"A: Short answer NO, but/ however" and then develop the pros and cons, etc...

"Q: Can i use my line in on my soundblaster to plug my guitar with a 1/4" to 1/8" jack?"
"A: NO, unless you're aiming for a pile of shit recording" and once again develop on the subject.

I also think that in order for this to be effective (aka in order to make people READ the damn things) we should make it a rule that everyone read the full thing before posting anything at all. It would be pretty easy to spot a post from someone who hasn't read it and hand out warnings/ bans for not complying to the rules.


I was thinking a similar Q & A type thing mainly since 95% of the topics made can be answered in a few easy questions.
Derpy Derp Derp Herp Derp
#26
I think a glossary format of recording gear might be a better way than listing all the reasons a mixer is not necessary or how it is still useful. Or explaining the difference between a mixer, an interface, and a hybrid interface/mixer.

For example:

Preamp.
A microphone can't get it's signal recorded without amplification because it is too quiet.
A pre-amplifier is a circuit used in guitar amps, microphone preamps, mixers, and audio interfaces to name a few.
This is required to get signal from the microphone. Some preamps offer phantom power, which is an extra power source some microphones require.
While a mixer is not necessarily needed to record, a preamp is always needed, whether it is in your mixer or on your audio interface.

You can usually tell when a preamp is in a piece of gear because there will be LEDs or meters that tell you how hot incoming signal is, and there will be a knob titled 'gain' 'mic' 'drive' or some variant. Some of the most accepted way to use this section of your gear is to turn the gain up until you reach distortion (a red light will most likely come on to let you know this is happening) turning it back down.
Or turning it up to a point where the loudest parts do not go above -6dB.
The latter is my preferred method, although if you do not have meters you may have to do the first option.