#1
First off I'll tell you about me. I've been playing about 2 years, I'm not great for the amount of time I've been playing but not too bad, especially when I know the song well and practice a lot. I would consider that I have a good skill at composing and knowing what to add / remove (say I do a riff I would know exactly what I want the others to do), and use Guitar Pro at a good level. I'm living in Spain but I'm from England.
Ok, so here's the situation:

We are a folk / pagan / viking metal band (not exactly my favorite genre but it's metal!) and it's our first band. I do rhythm guitar, our lead guitarist is probably our best musician but he lacks the ability to play in a band (following bass / drummer) and he is hopeless at composing. The drummer has only started playing and ****s up in about every single way possible, refuses to get lessons cause he's like a lot of people in Spain, poor and doesn't want to spend any money whatsoever. Our bassist is like our drummers twin (in a musical way)... can't play fast, fails at playing, and if I listen to him while we're playing a song I will immediately **** up... Awful. Our vocalist isn't that bad at doing what he has to do, but his attitude is the worst part about him; he thinks his views on everything are correct, he refuses to do covers and just sits around doing nothing. He is the only member that has been in other bands (god knows how they put up with him).

We arrive, set everything up, attempt 1 song about 2 times which involves the bass player not knowing what he's playing, the drummer sort of ****ing up but not too much, the lead guitarist improvising everything he does and speeding up or slowing down, and me getting absolutely lost. Vocalist is outside smoking a fag. I should add that 95% of the time the lead guitarist is ****ing around with his guitar and doing noise, the drummer is shitting him self and thinks that the harder and faster he attacks the drums the better he will play / the more metal it will sound. And me and the bassist waiting for them to finish ****ing around. Vocalist is outside smoking another fag. After all this mayhem we have a "break" and have a snack, they all start playing cards and I join the vocalist and we smoke a joint due to boredom. About 1,5 hours later we go back to "attempting" and usually end up doing everything I just mentioned again. Practice over.

They are utterly shit at composing all of them, except for me (no I'm not showing off). I'm in a situation right now where playing songs at home all day isn't going to make me advance and I need to go out there and play in a band if I want to improve. After all that the next day all they can do is blame it on to someone that we're not advancing (everyday it's someone else's fault). Me and the drummer have chosen 2 songs to cover but the vocalist refuses to do covers like I said. We have all agreed that the lead guitarist improvises everything and sucks at being in a band despite his skill, the drummer is shit, the bassist is shit and can't play fast, I get lost in the songs (guess why...) and the vocalist does **** all but cry about how terrible everything is.

The reason to us not advancing is bloody obvious to me. I'll admit that I'm not a great musician and I lack in skill but jesus christ... I could carry on writing how terrible it all is but I've already written enough.

I would love some views and suggestions on how we should really start advancing. No way do I want this group to do gigs (the genre is really nerdy and for weirdos, we would be laughed at) but I do want our band to not be so shitty.

Thank you.

Edit: Sorry about my grammar I'm hopeless
Last edited by Hellhammerr at Jul 13, 2010,
#2
Sounds like you already know what needs to be done. Fire them all, start working with other people. And the most important thing for successfully learning songs with a band, (at least in my experiences), is a drummer who knows what he/she is doing.
#3
Quote by Leather Sleeves
Sounds like you already know what needs to be done. Fire them all, start working with other people. And the most important thing for successfully learning songs with a band, (at least in my experiences), is a drummer who knows what he/she is doing.


Yes, but especially this bit...

a drummer who knows what he/she is doing
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#4
Getting rid of everyone wont help, they are my friends after all. If I wanted to have a completely different band I would go ahed and do it. But that's not the case. I'm still waiting for the right band to take it very seriously but first I need to learn along with my friends about being in a band.
#5
Quote by Hellhammerr
Getting rid of everyone wont help, they are my friends after all. If I wanted to have a completely different band I would go ahed and do it. But that's not the case. I'm still waiting for the right band to take it very seriously but first I need to learn along with my friends about being in a band.


Okay then your biggest problem from my POV is your singer you don't need someone with a bad attitude and in my experiance learning covers is the best place to start in a band in terms of figuring where you all are stylistically and technically, so if he aint on board talk to him or fire his ass. Maybe its differcult because their your friends but if their not good for you there's no point thats why I wouldnt get in a band with a friend because if you want out your going to look like your letting people down. But if your rhythm section look like their improving give them time enjoy being the one who knows what hes doing.
SMILE!
Last edited by Mr.DeadDuck at Jul 13, 2010,
#6
Quote by Hellhammerr
Getting rid of everyone wont help, they are my friends after all. If I wanted to have a completely different band I would go ahed and do it. But that's not the case. I'm still waiting for the right band to take it very seriously but first I need to learn along with my friends about being in a band.



So your question is "How do I get people I clearly hate and have zero respect for and who lack musical ability to become good?"
Tell you what, you figure out the answer to that and I will book you for motivational speeches around the world.
Start a new band or accept your band the way it is. You can motivate people, but you cannot change their nature.
#7
Quote by Hellhammerr
our lead guitarist is probably our best musician but he lacks the ability to play in a band (following bass / drummer) and he is hopeless at composing. The drummer has only started playing and ****s up in about every single way possible, refuses to get lessons cause he's like a lot of people in Spain, poor and doesn't want to spend any money whatsoever. Our bassist is like our drummers twin (in a musical way)... can't play fast, fails at playing, and if I listen to him while we're playing a song I will immediately **** up... Awful. Our vocalist isn't that bad at doing what he has to do, but his attitude is the worst part about him; he thinks his views on everything are correct, he refuses to do covers and just sits around doing nothing.


I'll be honest, I didn't read much past this point at first, I'm not sure why you expect a band full of poor, lazy and inexperienced musicians to be anything but, well, poor, lazy and inexperienced.

Their musical ability wouldn't be too much of a problem if they put some effort it, everyone improves over time with effort, but lack of ability + lack of effort = guaranteed fail, every time.

What you need to do:

Make the bassist and drummer practice, even if they've just started out they will improve with some serious effort, and improvement happens much faster in a band situation.

Make the singer come in and practice with you, he's a part of the band as well and should be in there with you at all times if available, unless he's doing harsh vocals and can't do it every time but that doesn't sound like the problem. Also, you joining him for a joint makes him feel that his behaviour is being condoned, make him come in.

Stop taking breaks. Any band practices I've ever been at have been at least an hour and a half of straight playing/writing/arranging/discussing the songs, these are pretty much the only acceptable activities in a rehearsal room, playing cards should be saved for later.

Although you may be telling us only half a story, it seems like you're not doing too much wrong besides allowing the others to act this way, either set everyone straight or leave the band, that's pretty much all you can do.

My last two band rehearsals with my band were pretty much perfect, because we came in, set everything up, recapped the new song we completed last time, finished the one we worked on last time, started writing a new song, jammed for a while in a bunch of different styles and played around with some covers.
Now compare that to your "rehearsals," and you'll see why you need to do something if you want the band to work

Also, this is why I would suggest you never start a band with friends, because if you were in this situation with strangers, you would have already left, I'm hoping.
#8
So that's what a folk/pagan/viking metal band sounds like!

You can't just jam with your friends and expect them to be good musicians - it sounds like they all suck. Even the guitarist you think is good - he sucks. As mentioned above, play some simple covers together until you can get those together first. One day you may be able to do harder stuff.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
Soundcloud
#9
Thank you to all the people who answered, all the answers were really helpful (some were more helpful then others). I know what I need to do. First off I'll tell them to ****ing stop taking 1 and a half hour brakes and get of their lazy arses and go do some music! Once I've improved my skill a bit more musically and in a band, I AM SOOOOO OUT OF THERE! As soon as a good offer pops up when I'm better . For now though, I have to teach them how to "act normal"? Idiots... oh well... Thank you again, to all of you! I still have hope in them!!!
#10
Quote by Hellhammerr
our lead guitarist is probably our best musician but he lacks the ability to play in a band (following bass / drummer) and he is hopeless at composing.


Well if he can't compose and can't play in a band he's not your "best musician" is he? He lacks these two fundamental skills to being a musician. I take it you mean he's a great technical player when playing solo?
-Mithaearon-
"Just because you can, doesn't mean you should."
#11
After posting that a friend of mine with years of proper band experience asked me if I was interested in making a (SERIOUS, not over the top like a lot of them...) death metal band with me on bass. He said it's still just a MAYBE, and it would only happen if a drummer we know is interested. He said he wants it to be the most serious band he's been in so far, and it would be a 3 man band to make us "special". So I think it's even more then what I asked for, in fact, maybe too much :P.

Blimey...

Oh and before you say anything. Yes I can play the bass and quite well. And NO I won't leave my current group for them, to not ruin our friendship. Besides it's only once or twice a week...

Mithaearon - Yes I meant technical.
Last edited by Hellhammerr at Jul 14, 2010,
#12
Quote by koslack
So your question is "How do I get people I clearly hate and have zero respect for and who lack musical ability to become good?"
Tell you what, you figure out the answer to that and I will book you for motivational speeches around the world.
Start a new band or accept your band the way it is. You can motivate people, but you cannot change their nature.


This.
#13
Quote by Hellhammerr
Getting rid of everyone wont help, they are my friends after all. If I wanted to have a completely different band I would go ahed and do it. But that's not the case. I'm still waiting for the right band to take it very seriously but first I need to learn along with my friends about being in a band.


I know these are your friends, but if you seriously want to start making music you need to dump these people. They are not taking this seriously and you will never progress unless you start working with other musicians.

A drummer that has good rhytm and time is critical no matter what type of music you are playing. Seriously think about what you want to get from music and playing with bands. If you want want results and frustration all the time, stick with your friends. If you really want to improve and advance, work with people who actually care about music and what the band is doing as a whole.
#14
My band had a similiar problem where i was the only one who knew my shit in music while the other guys sucked, i made them all practice and listen to music basically all the time.
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