#1
I want to be able to record drums but still have a pretty tight, punchy sound, so I decided triggering/augmenting drums and just using real overheads would be the way to go. My drummer has mics and I want to know how to have an analog signal already recorded trigger a sample for a kick or whatever drum in MIDI format. I was trying it out with a free program called KTDrumTrigger but I couldn't really understand the routing, so any help and suggestions would be appreciated.
#2
If your drummer has mic's why is it necessary to use triggers?
#4
Drumagog, or toontrack do one, blanked on the name, it's called drumtracker or soemthing. For either one you'll either need gog samples or ezdrummer/superior drummer, and I think it may work with BFD etc aswell.
#5
I've used KTDrumTrigger very recently. It's great for a piece of freeware!!

Why use samples if you have real audio?

Well...

Reason #1. I didn't spend as much time on mic placement as I should have. Either that or my hearing was shot that day. Whatever the reason, the drum sounds I got with my mics on a particular day really sucked. I used the audio tracks to trigger samples and got WAY better drum sounds. Given that I was working with a human performance, and the rest of the kit was picked up in the overheads (I might replace the toms with samples too), it sounds *very* real - better, in fact, than anything I could have done with mics on their own.

Reason #2.... One song was sort of "Stabbing Westward-ish" and needed a more 'artificial' sounding kick. Sample replace = done!

Now.... how to use it...

On your drum track (kick, snare, whatever), put on KTDT as an insert. Create a midi track and set KTDT as the input source. Press play on the drum track and open the KTDT plugin.

Adjust the threshold by clicking on the horizontal bars across the graph. Make sure you set it so that each drum hit produces a 'hit' on the graph. It does help to gate your track go get rid of extraneous noise that might actually trigger a hit.

Record your midi track so that the input is set to receive KTDT and you will simply record midi events as the track plays through. Once you're done recording your midi track, then you can route that midi track through a sampler to trigger whatever drum sound you want.

Note: there is a setting in KTDT somewhere that you need to (or should) select that captures velocity data. Otherwise, all your drum hits will be the same volume, which does not sound natural.

Another note: Play the sampled track and the original audio track together. You might find that the sampled track is a bit late... and by a bit, I mean maybe 20ms. Adjust the midi sampled track so that it plays a few milliseconds early and so that the two tracks match perfectly. Use your ears... not your eyes.

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
#6
Thanks so much man, I'll definitely try that. I read that you press record instead of play and it was giving me just more analog on top of the midi track. Also, I think I need to put my threshold lower because that may have had something to do with it. I'll post how everything works out once I try.
#7
Alright, I really am not getting this send receive thing. I'm using Reaper, and I'm just using a metronome right now to test this out. I have the KT Trigger on the track with the click on it, sending to the blank midi track. I've tried pressing play and record and nothing is going on the MIDI track. I have thresh as low as it can go too so that's not the problem.
#8
You need an audio track to feed input into the trigger. A metronome will not give you an audio track. (unless you're miking a 'real' metronome, as opposed to simply using a click track in Reaper...)

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
#9
no man, it's an audio track. If you have metronome enabled in reaper and you record on that track, it records it.
#10
Oh, you *recorded* the metronome. I didn't get that before. I thought you were just using the metronome.

Have you set the KTDT as an insert on the metronome track?

Have you set up a midi track with KTDT as the input source?

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
#11
Yeah, I did both of those things. I had the metronome track's send to the midi track and the midi track's receive as the metronome one. Not sure what I'm missing. On the KTDT plugin, it has settings for three drums and I only tweaked the first one, not sure if that changes anything.
#12
Quote by sambot12
I had the metronome track's send to the midi track


A send is not the same as an insert. Although a send should be able to work, using it on an insert is probably more foolproof.

So you have a track called something like "metronome.wav" or something, right?


Quote by sambot12

On the KTDT plugin, it has settings for three drums and I only tweaked the first one, not sure if that changes anything.


Yeah, it will probably be the first one, though it can be set up to receive input from three different tracks. That just gets unnecessarily complicated for our purposes right now, though.

Did you see any activity on the first one to suggest that it was receiving a signal, or no?

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
#13
I thought by insert, you meant to put KTDT on the FX on the track with the click.

I don't know what activity to look for... nothing was really going on on the plugin while it was playing.
#14
Each track should have two ways of adding effects. One way is by an insert. This puts the effect on just that channel. The other way is as a send. The track then 'sends' data to the effect unit and then 'returns' it to the track. This is useful when you want to send multiple tracks to the same effect - say the same reverb on the vocal, the snare drum and the toms.

You should have the means in Reaper to add KTDT on a track insert.

As far as what activity to look for... here is a tutorial on how to use it using some other software. Maybe it will help with some of the details.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wLciIfUQdtQ

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
#16
Alright! Got the triggering working, but I just need to figure out how to get it to actually write the MIDI track (or does it). Any help there is appreciated.
#17
The rest should be easy.

Set up a midi track. Set the input for that midi track to be the KTDT, and press record. As the song plays through, the audio from the percussion track will create midi events on the midi track.

Going back on my system, I found that setting the midi track backwards by 20ms made things line up perfectly.

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
#18
Was aptrigga or drumagog out of the question?
ADELOS
POP PUNK
for fans of...

Motion City Soundtrack, Get Up Kids, Jimmy Eat World, Transit, Brand New, Dashboard Confessional, Early November, Fall Out Boy, Jawbreaker, Polar Bear Club, The Story So Far, the Wonder Years, Something Corporate.
#19
Probably not. It's just that he already had a perfectly usable piece of freeware and someone who could help him with it.

As much as I fully support intellectual property rights and insist on purchasing software, if I can find legit freeware that will do the same thing.... I'll go the freeware route. I'm sure I'm not the only one.

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
#20
Yeah for sure. I need to get a hold of that VST myself.
ADELOS
POP PUNK
for fans of...

Motion City Soundtrack, Get Up Kids, Jimmy Eat World, Transit, Brand New, Dashboard Confessional, Early November, Fall Out Boy, Jawbreaker, Polar Bear Club, The Story So Far, the Wonder Years, Something Corporate.
#21
Yeah it's good, but I still need to figure out how to record the MIDI for it... don't know why I cant get it.