#3
it would change the angle of the strings after the bridge and i think that that has something to do with the tone?
#4
hmm perhaps the angle of the string with respect to the tailpiece and bridge might have an advantage? Not sure though
#5
Actually, it's supposed to cut sustain. I do it on my SG and I find it makes strings a fair bit easier to bend(which is welcome for me since I use .12s). Zakk Wylde does it, I believe(although I can't see how it would benefit pinch harmonics).
Quote by SlayingDragons
Nah, I prefer to tune lower. My tunings usually go into weird Hebrew symbols.
#6
I tried this once, When you do this any tension from strumming is on the string itself and not the ball end so the string can break easier. I wouldn't recommend it.
Always tin your strings.

_____

Don't be afraid to be honest.
#7
Cause you can do some of what zakk wylde calls "stupid shit" on his old instructional video....the thing he does at the very beginning of "low down" is what he means...he used to do it all the time back around 1999-2000 era
I used to do it also but its not really that cool...I've found that you break strings easier cause instead of a straight shot down the neck the winding near the ball is being bent....
Fender 70s Ri Strats w/various Dimarzios
Modded 1982 Marshall JCM800 2203

Boss DS-1,Dunlop Crybaby,MXR Phase 90,Ibanez AD9,Boss CH-1

Check out randy dobsons underground ,tell me what you think
#8
It lowers string tension while bending (not while picking regular notes) while keeping the stopbar as low as possible for maximum sustain; you get the same effect as if you raised the stopbar, but then your sustain starts to drop slightly.
Yes, I know everything. No, I can't play worth a damn.
A child is trafficked and sold for sex slavery every 30 seconds. Support Love146.
#9
Quote by MrFlibble
It lowers string tension while bending (not while picking regular notes) while keeping the stopbar as low as possible for maximum sustain; you get the same effect as if you raised the stopbar, but then your sustain starts to drop slightly.


I haven't tried this but I heard that if one wants maximum sustain with the strings raised and doesn't want to top wrap there's the option of putting washers underneath the stopbar. What do you think?
Always tin your strings.

_____

Don't be afraid to be honest.
#10
I've never tried it or even heard of it, but it makes some vague sense. You would probably have to weld the washers together to make kind of I dunno, super-washer or something though, and it would need to be a very tight fit. If it was a bunch of loose washers then that would suck the sustain more.
Yes, I know everything. No, I can't play worth a damn.
A child is trafficked and sold for sex slavery every 30 seconds. Support Love146.
#11
Quote by MrFlibble
It lowers string tension while bending (not while picking regular notes) while keeping the stopbar as low as possible for maximum sustain; you get the same effect as if you raised the stopbar, but then your sustain starts to drop slightly.

I didn't realise that

When i tried this on my epiphone G-400 a few years ago, it just made the bridge rattle like hell for some reason, and in the end i just couldn't see the benefit of it since i like the higher tension. But that's because i asked what it does and everyone just said "it improves the sustain" and wouldn't elaborate.

Would it improve sustain without adjusting the string tension if i wrapped the strings over and lowered the stopbar to the point where it had the same break angle over the bridge that i have with the strings through the stopbar normally? (so long as there's enough room for movement before it's as low as it can go of course)
Rig Winter 2017:

Fender Jazzmaster/Yamaha SG1000
Boss TU-3, DS-2, CS-3, EHX small stone, Danelectro delay
Laney VC30-112 with G12H30 speaker, or Session Rockette 30 for smaller gigs
Elixir Nanoweb 11-49 strings, Dunlop Jazz III XL picks
Shure SM57 mic in front of the amp
Last edited by Blompcube at Jul 22, 2010,
#12
If I am understanding what you're saying right then yes.
Basically, when the stopbar is as low as it can possibly go it will help sustain notes better - it's not a huge, ground-breaking improvement, but it can be quite noticable on higher notes. The reason why the sustain is improved is because having the stopbar all the way down ensures that the stopbar, its posts and the inserts are all as stiff and as tight as can be, as well as the break angle over the sadldes being increased which ensures a firmer connection between the strings and the saddles (which is probably why your bridge started to rattle; the strings were no longer pressing down on the saddles enough)
Increasing the break angle over the saddles (or the nut, if you install staggered tuners or string trees or whatever else) also means there is more resistance as you try to move the strings while bending. Some people like this, some people don't. Personally, although I can notice a slight difference, I don't think it's enough of a difference to worry about.

I think I've gone in circles or missed something out here but sod it, I didn't get any sleep last night and it's a pain to explain this stuff without physically being there with a guitar and being able to move everything about to demonstrate it properly.

tl;dr version:
Stopbar at its lowest point = slightly improved sustain and clarity.
Shallower break angle over the saddles = less tension when bending strings, slightly less clarity and sustain.

In my experience the differences are only slight and very hard to notice if you tune down a lot/use very heavy strings/use lots of gain/have a plain crap guitar to begin with.

Yadda yadda, etc etc, something something, **** this I'm going back to bed.
Yes, I know everything. No, I can't play worth a damn.
A child is trafficked and sold for sex slavery every 30 seconds. Support Love146.
#13
it's cork!
generally you want the stop bar as low as it can go without having the strings touch the back of the bridge.

some people do it, some people don't. if you like the sound of wrapping try it out...
strings are like 5 dollars a pack.
Jumping on dat gear sig train.
PRS Hollowbody II / BKP Warpigs
Strandberg OS6T / BKP Aftermath
Strandberg OS7 / Lace Poopsticks
Skervesen Raptor 7FF / BKP Warpigs
Skervesen Raptor 6 NTB / BKP Juggernauts
Hapas Sludge 7 FF / Hapas Leviathan
Anderson Baritom / Motorcity Nuke BKP Sinner Anderson H2+
Warmoth Baritone / BKP Piledriver
Ibanez Rg2120x / BKP Nailbomb

Blackstar ID:Core Beam
#14
Quote by MrFlibble
If I am understanding what you're saying right then yes.
Basically, when the stopbar is as low as it can possibly go it will help sustain notes better - it's not a huge, ground-breaking improvement, but it can be quite noticable on higher notes. The reason why the sustain is improved is because having the stopbar all the way down ensures that the stopbar, its posts and the inserts are all as stiff and as tight as can be, as well as the break angle over the sadldes being increased which ensures a firmer connection between the strings and the saddles (which is probably why your bridge started to rattle; the strings were no longer pressing down on the saddles enough)
Increasing the break angle over the saddles (or the nut, if you install staggered tuners or string trees or whatever else) also means there is more resistance as you try to move the strings while bending. Some people like this, some people don't. Personally, although I can notice a slight difference, I don't think it's enough of a difference to worry about.

I think I've gone in circles or missed something out here but sod it, I didn't get any sleep last night and it's a pain to explain this stuff without physically being there with a guitar and being able to move everything about to demonstrate it properly.

tl;dr version:
Stopbar at its lowest point = slightly improved sustain and clarity.
Shallower break angle over the saddles = less tension when bending strings, slightly less clarity and sustain.

In my experience the differences are only slight and very hard to notice if you tune down a lot/use very heavy strings/use lots of gain/have a plain crap guitar to begin with.

Yadda yadda, etc etc, something something, **** this I'm going back to bed.

Thanks - and don't worry, that did make sense, and was very helpful

I think i'm gonna try that with my les paul. I would guess the problem with my G-400 was that i didn't lower the stopbar all the way. Though, all in all, it seems like there's a slight chance of me achieving absolutely nothing, since i think with the stopbar screwed down all the way, there's actually going to be a slightly shallower break angle, counter-acting the slight improvement in sustain and clarity
Rig Winter 2017:

Fender Jazzmaster/Yamaha SG1000
Boss TU-3, DS-2, CS-3, EHX small stone, Danelectro delay
Laney VC30-112 with G12H30 speaker, or Session Rockette 30 for smaller gigs
Elixir Nanoweb 11-49 strings, Dunlop Jazz III XL picks
Shure SM57 mic in front of the amp
#15
Quote by Gargoyle2500
I haven't tried this but I heard that if one wants maximum sustain with the strings raised and doesn't want to top wrap there's the option of putting washers underneath the stopbar. What do you think?
That also works. The purpose is to ensure the maximum amount of mechanical contact between the body and the bridge. More energy from the standing wave of a guitar string goes directly to the body and less is lost at contact of the tailpiece and studs.

I top wrap because I prefer a slinkier feel in the strings, but I also do not like using light strings. I prefer how 11s feel but I don't like how they bend. So I prefer to crank the tailpiece down and top wrap. It doesn't really affect sustain that much imo.