#1
What solo would go with this progression?

Em7 - D7 - Cmaj7 - Gmaj7

Been playing around with modes, not sure if this is in E aeolian.

would e aeolian go well with this progression? f*** >.<

i've tried to create a solo for this, but i just cant get one. it could be my phrasing.

i tried e aeolian, cmaj... dnno where to start.
#2
for one thing this is a tonal progression, not modal, and you would play G major scale, not c major. if anything just try e minor pentatonic and you should come up with a decent solo
#3
oooh, i was under the impression that if the tonic fell under something else than G it was modal, if you play the progression around it'd resolve on Em7...errr


but, yeah, i was thinking emin pent for it. i dont know if it's just me but pentatonic scales sound too banal.
Last edited by EagerAdoration at Aug 4, 2010,
#4
The progression is in E minor. So use the E minor scale. As said above, there's no modes involved here.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
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#5
if you say it's in E minor, wouldnt it as well be E Aeolian? sorry for being dense, but that's what i see. Please help me distinguish E minor from E Aeolian, because from what you're saying (AlanHB) it doesnt make sense.

Stating a progression is in E minor is basically saying E dorian or E Aeolian (E phryg is obviously out of the question as the key sig is G, as well as e dorian).

the chords i used were

Em7 -D7- Cmaj7 - gmaj7 - Am11 - Em9 - Bm7 in the entire piece of music.

oh, btw, played with E Nat minor (aeolian) and came up with something nice.
Last edited by EagerAdoration at Aug 5, 2010,
#6
Quote by EagerAdoration
if you say it's in E minor, wouldnt it as well be E Aeolian? sorry for being dense, but that's what i see. Please help me distinguish E minor from E Aeolian, because from what you're saying (AlanHB) it doesnt make sense.

Stating a progression is in E minor is basically saying E dorian or E Aeolian (E phryg is obviously out of the question as the key sig is G, as well as e dorian).

oh, btw, played with E Nat minor (aeolian) and came up with something nice


A couple of different issues you raise;

Well that's assuming E aeolian is the same thing as E minor. They're not. E aeolian is a mode, and you don't have a modal progression. It's tonal. 99% of music is tonal, and will be in either major or minor key. E aeolian does share the same notes of E minor, so it's easy to be confused.

It's not E dorian either, dorian is a mode. This chord progression is not modal, it's tonal. E minor does not share the same notes as E dorian either, which makes this suggestion confusing. E dorian has a C# which would clash over your chord progession, adding yet another reason why you wouldn't choose this scale/mode, even if you were merely adding accidentals.

And the key signature of G major - it's the same key signature as E minor. The difference is where the song resolves to. It's not the same key signature as E dorian, as noted above it has a C#.

You got a nice sound using E aoelian because you're just using E minor over a chord progression in E minor.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
Soundcloud
#7
Quote by AlanHB
A couple of different issues you raise;

Well that's assuming E aeolian is the same thing as E minor. They're not. E aeolian is a mode, and you don't have a modal progression. It's tonal. 99% of music is tonal, and will be in either major or minor key. E aeolian does share the same notes of E minor, so it's easy to be confused.

It's not E dorian either, dorian is a mode. This chord progression is not modal, it's tonal. E minor does not share the same notes as E dorian either, which makes this suggestion confusing. E dorian has a C# which would clash over your chord progession, adding yet another reason why you wouldn't choose this scale/mode, even if you were merely adding accidentals.

And the key signature of G major - it's the same key signature as E minor. The difference is where the song resolves to. It's not the same key signature as E dorian, as noted above it has a C#.

You got a nice sound using E aoelian because you're just using E minor over a chord progression in E minor.

half of what you said just contradicted what i said/asked.
and i stated that E dorian was out of the question, if you read thoroughly (it's obvious you didnt, as youre SUGGESTING im even considering E Dorian).
please give a proper explaination, not a douchebag contradiction.
im not even finished with the solo yet, so the last paragraph is dickish.

I've distinguished each chord as you do with a mode, i've emphasized on the notes within the chords of a mode, i really don't see what ive done wrong.
if you're going to help me, dont contradict me, as you can see im still tentative with modes..
Last edited by EagerAdoration at Aug 5, 2010,
#8
Mate I was addressing this statement in terms of dorian;

Quote by EagerAdoration
Stating a progression is in E minor is basically saying E dorian or E Aeolian (E phryg is obviously out of the question as the key sig is G, as well as e dorian).


It seemed you were under the impression that E minor and E dorian were mutually exclusive? Or something similar.

The last paragraph isn't dickish - it addresses your issue.

Your confusion relates to modes as a whole - they aren't just the minor scale starting on a different note, nor do they change per chord in a standard progression. The chords that you have in your progression all belong to the key of E minor, and the progression resolves to E as you noted above.

But there's no worrying about modes anymore, they're not present in this chord progression.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
Soundcloud
#9
Quote by EagerAdoration
if you say it's in E minor, wouldnt it as well be E Aeolian? sorry for being dense, but that's what i see. Please help me distinguish E minor from E Aeolian, because from what you're saying (AlanHB) it doesnt make sense.

Stating a progression is in E minor is basically saying E dorian or E Aeolian (E phryg is obviously out of the question as the key sig is G, as well as e dorian).

the chords i used were

Em7 -D7- Cmaj7 - gmaj7 - Am11 - Em9 - Bm7 in the entire piece of music.

oh, btw, played with E Nat minor (aeolian) and came up with something nice.


Quote by EagerAdoration
half of what you said just contradicted what i said/asked.
and i stated that E dorian was out of the question, if you read thoroughly (it's obvious you didnt, as youre SUGGESTING im even considering E Dorian).
please give a proper explaination, not a douchebag contradiction.
im not even finished with the solo yet, so the last paragraph is dickish.

I've distinguished each chord as you do with a mode, i've emphasized on the notes within the chords of a mode, i really don't see what ive done wrong.
if you're going to help me, dont contradict me, as you can see im still tentative with modes..



E minor is the scale of choice over that progression, and you just said it yourself that E dorian is basically E minor. So yes, you're pretty much suggesting that E dorian is a good scale to use over the progression. You just need to be less of a douchebag yourself to people that are genuinely trying to help you.
#10
again, it's obvious im not talking about e dorian, jesus. i was making a point, if were to be corrected, about minor scales; listing them. and alan took it as if i were even suggesting/considering e dorian.

please don't incoherently insult me about something i didn't state. e dorian is harmonic minor, that doesnt apply here.

next time, you, yourself shouldnt be a douchebag in an aggressive way that compromises your intelligence. judging by your quote, it's obvious what i've just stated is valid.

and yes, his intentions to help were genuinely motivated, but the way he applied himself to this thread were doobious, and sidetracked my questions. and transpired an obvious assumption that he was being a douche. he sidestepped my main question and aggressively attacked me about talking about minor scales ( as you can read, im sure you can read, i was listing minor scales).

just disregard my mentioning of e dorian, i listed it because i didn't want to be mistaken in my question.
Last edited by EagerAdoration at Aug 5, 2010,
#11
Quote by AlanHB
Mate I was addressing this statement in terms of dorian;


It seemed you were under the impression that E minor and E dorian were mutually exclusive? Or something similar.

The last paragraph isn't dickish - it addresses your issue.

Your confusion relates to modes as a whole - they aren't just the minor scale starting on a different note, nor do they change per chord in a standard progression. The chords that you have in your progression all belong to the key of E minor, and the progression resolves to E as you noted above.

But there's no worrying about modes anymore, they're not present in this chord progression.


just forget me mentioning dorian, heh. i mentioned it because i assumed people would mistake me, as i've read in countless threads before of people being mistaken in such matters.
I have an idea about modes, its just applying them to chords, emphasizing on a
particular note that distinguishes a chord into making the listener, yourself, understand that its a mode.

if you can , could you give me an example of a couple progressions in E Aeolian, or anyone.
#12
Best way to establish modes with chords are vamps, but if you want to use something more then that:

I - IV - V - I

ii - iii - IV - I - ii

iii - ii - vi - IV - iii

IV - vi -V - iii - IV

V - IV - I - V

vi - V - IV - V - vi

Modal playing is something very complicated, and not something that most people would do 'naturally' so to speak, so it might be best to just forget modes for now, and experiment with the standard diatonic scales.
#13
Ok well you just scored yourself a warning mate - you're the only one who's being aggressive here.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
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#14
Em G Major
Tick tock and waiting for the meteor
This clock is opening another door
#15
Quote by EagerAdoration

if you can , could you give me an example of a couple progressions in E Aeolian, or anyone.


You need to stop addressing this progression as modal because later on it's going to confuse you and people around you. This TONAL progression is in E minor.

Start with G major or E minor. You can control alot of emotion just with knowing the relative minor/major of a given key.

Beyond this, learning the circle of fifths/fourths (what I am currently studying) will give you an even broader palette for Phrasing not to mention Progressions
Last edited by Funk Monk at Aug 5, 2010,
#16
Quote by EagerAdoration

if you can , could you give me an example of a couple progressions in E Aeolian, or anyone.


Other than someone just playing an E minor chord vamp, I'm unsure. It most likely wouldn't help you anyway, as a progression in E aeolian will actually end up being an E minor progression. There's an argument that you can't actually have a progression in E aeolian at all.

But that's really besides the point. You should get a handle on the major and minor scales and keys.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
Soundcloud
#17
Quote by EagerAdoration

I've distinguished each chord as you do with a mode, i've emphasized on the notes within the chords of a mode, i really don't see what ive done wrong.
if you're going to help me, dont contradict me, as you can see im still tentative with modes..


Look, you can do that all you want, but you will still be playing in E minor. Just because you emphasize chord tones or whatever you're doing, doesn't make something modal. Modality is established by the backing behind the solo. Your chord progression is not modal at all. It is in the key of E minor. That is where it resolves to.

Using modes is harder to do than tonal music. There are stricter guidelines to their use, or else you end up in tonal music. In addition, using the Aeolian or Ionian modes is near impossible (most likely impossible), because you might as well be using the Minor or Major scales. Just because modes share the same notes as the Major or Minor scale, doesn't make them the same. They are used in very different ways and are separate entities, hence the difference in names.

Bottom Line: You're progression is in E minor. You solo in E minor. You can use the chord tones, but they are all in the E minor scale, so in the end, you're using E minor.
^^The above is a Cryptic Metaphor^^


"To know the truth of history is to realize its ultimate myth and its inevitable ambiguity." Everything is made up and the facts don't matter.


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#18
Quote by AlanHB
Other than someone just playing an E minor chord vamp, I'm unsure. It most likely wouldn't help you anyway, as a progression in E aeolian will actually end up being an E minor progression. There's an argument that you can't actually have a progression in E aeolian at all.

But that's really besides the point. You should get a handle on the major and minor scales and keys.

A i - v vamp will have a definitive Aeolian sound. Let me give you an example.

To the TS: frankly, you're trying to make things more complicated than they need to be. E Minor is all you need. Modes aren't involved in this at all. Just mess around with E Minor and you'll be fine.

Quick advice: When asking for help, don't get defensive when someone says something that you don't believe in/haven't learned/contradicts what you think. Learn to see all sides. You aren't the sole proprietor of theory. No reason to get angry, especially since AlanHB wasn't attacking you in the least.
#19
Quote by DiminishedFifth
A i - v vamp will have a definitive Aeolian sound. Let me give you an example.


That's right! You told me the other day haha.

Doesn't make it any more relevant though.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
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#20
Quote by DiminishedFifth
A i - v vamp will have a definitive Aeolian sound. Let me give you an example.


I thought that Aeolian and Ionian were "replaced" with the Minor and Major scales after the rise of tonal music. Can you explain a bit more?

I love the guy you linked to, btw.
^^The above is a Cryptic Metaphor^^


"To know the truth of history is to realize its ultimate myth and its inevitable ambiguity." Everything is made up and the facts don't matter.


MUSIC THEORY LINK
#21
Quote by rockingamer2
I thought that Aeolian and Ionian were "replaced" with the Minor and Major scales after the rise of tonal music. Can you explain a bit more?

I love the guy you linked to, btw.

While they're the basis of tonal music, they can still be used to make Modal music. Chord vamps (I - V and i - v, respectively) and a melody accenting the chord tones (as well as the color tones of the scale) can make a strict Ionian and Aeolian piece. Especially with Aeolian. I've seen the V7 in tonal music a lot more than I've seen v. The leading tone that songs in a Minor key have is what separates Tonal and Modal, Minor and Aeolian.

The same guy has a piece in Ionian which sounds DISTINCTLY modal. It's very interesting. His Locrian piece is awesome too. I always link him when I need to make a point about what modal music is and isn't.
Last edited by DiminishedFifth at Aug 6, 2010,