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#1
I don't know if I'm alone here, but whatever happened to a fat strings, no pedals and a big tall guitar amp?

It seems everyone is dead set on having a pedal board the size of Australia and guitars that tune themselves and can sound like everything from a violin to a banjo. If you want to sound like a computer, buy a computer. If you want to sound like a banjo, what the hell are you doing on a Les Paul?

It just sucks all the tone straight out of your guitar. I don't know about you but I play guitar because I like to play guitar, not because I want to play a synth.

So who's with me on that natural sound of a valve amp breaking up under the force of your humbuckers, or the sweet snappy tone of a hand built tele? And who's against me? And for either answer.... why?
#4
I agree with you, but man, I'm not about to call someone an idiot for disagreeing with me.

Also, I like playing synths too.
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#5
personally I use a wide range of tones, most of them I would need to be running an amp cranked to high hell to get the same tone. Most people can't do that. I'm with you on the cranked amp thing, whenever I'm the only one home I'll crank my amp and I love every second of it, but since I can't do that often I get my cranked tones from using pedals that I keep on a pedalboard the size of a small country.
Call me Dom
Quote by Dmaj7
I don't know how to count canadians, the metric system is hard

Quote by gregs1020
well if lbj pokes his head in here and there's no nuts shit's gonna go doooooooowwwwwwwwwn.



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#6
I kinda agree with you, sometimes effects drown out the way you play - if done too much. But then again using effects subtly improves the way you sound. Plus, you can't get a fuzz sound out of an overdriven amp alone - and I love me some fuzz.

Oh, and cool blog brah.
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#8
It's the way people have advanced.
Yeah sure it's great if you're playing gnarly dirty rock to just go straight from a cranked valve amp.

But then you think "...my guitar has a little bit of noise...I think I need a noise suppressor..."
Then "Oh...I best be in tune, I'll get a pedal tuner."
Then "The reverb on my amp isn't cutting it...I'll get a reverb pedal." "I think I need a boost for my solos, I'm not cutting through enough"

That's how pedalboards come about.

Seriously though, I think people just realised you can still get that great driven tone with pedals in front of it.
My Dad's a great one for this stuff, he was around in the era of "AMP. GUITAR. That is all" so he sees people like Steve Vai and says the words I hate the most "Well all his sound is in his pedals" (and "his playing's all in the whammy bar" which makes no sense).
When a lot of people don't seem to realise that having a pedal doesn't mean you're using a pedal.
I use a chorus for the two bands I'm in right now. It's on probably for a couple of minute during a 40 minute setlist for one, and for like 30 seconds for the other (and when I want to make my solos sound a bit fusion-y! )

So yeah, it's kinda down to opinion, but I also use these pedals just to give me options.
Why just have one cranked sound when you can use multiple drives AND have a clean sound? That being just on a one channel amp!
#9
I wasn't calling anyone an idiot. I guess the whole thing was worded badly; I wanted to start a discussion on whether you were for or against the whole masses of pedals thing, and also include my opinion on it. (I figured the title would get people in here and commenting )
#10
Innovators use whatever is available to get new and unique sounds. Without innovation there is no progress. Progress is a good thing, especially in music. And what the **** is 'real tone'? There's no such thing. The term is meaningless.
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#11
I am for the whole mass of pedals thing, if my board doesn't have over 10 pedals on it I feel lost
Call me Dom
Quote by Dmaj7
I don't know how to count canadians, the metric system is hard

Quote by gregs1020
well if lbj pokes his head in here and there's no nuts shit's gonna go doooooooowwwwwwwwwn.



{Pedalboard Thread Native: The Muffin Man}
#12
i do prefer tube amp distotion over pedals but sometimes you need a fuzz or a wah or a reverb or phaser doesnt mean thye are all used all the time just means that songs have different sounds to them and cant get there with a just an amp
btw i also like thick strings and found to prefer analog effects over digital
#13
I'm with you. Angus Young's tone is the epitome of what rock tone should be. No effects, very simple, yet unbelievably awesome.
#14
I just use a TS9 as a boost, sometimes use my Delta Labs SC-1 Chorus or the crappy built in reverb on my amp when I want some cool cleans or leads.

I don't need much, but I would like a nice chorus, a nice reverb(pan for the amp, screw pedal), delay, maybe wah, and my TS9 and I'll coax more tones than you can think of.

I think that people who have 20 pedals on their board seem to have a issue finding a good tone, which makes me think either their guitar is lacking, or their amp is.

10 pedals is about the maximum you should have, more than that then you prolly need to start looking at your gear other than pedals.
#15
So I am alone on this almost. Haha. But on a lot of this stuff, I 100% agree with you too. If that makes sense. I just cant stand pedals without true bypass or a bypass looper; does anybody just find their sound getting more and more muffled under pedals?
#16
if it sounds good, if the guy playing it thinks it sounds right...
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#17
I find nothing wrong with a few pedals, but when there's people like The Edge, who focus more on ****ing tap dancing between pedals instead of actually making music, that shit pisses me off
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#18
Both approaches have their places in music. The straight guitar into amp approach is fine if you are going for a classic rock or blues tone and you aren't playing a very large venue. It can sound pretty thin if you are playing a big place or if you don't have other instruments to fill in the spaces in your sound. Listen to some live albums from the 60s and 70s and you'll hear what I mean. A bit of good signal processing goes a very long way.

I agree with you that some people use so many tone-shaping effects that their guitars hardly sound like guitars anymore. There is certainly a place for that, but in a number of cases it does detract from the overall sound quality. During the 80s, a lot of guitarists literally chorused their parts to death. The chorus is a nice effect, but it was definitely overdone.

The other thing to consider is that a lot of guitarists who claim to use only a guitar into an amplifier are mistaken. They use only a guitar into an amp, but their sound tech adds compression and delay and a little bit of God knows what else to the final mix. It is more common than a lot of people would normally believe.

Use whatever you think best. Take good advice and reject bad advice. It's your sound, after all.
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#19
the edge is one of the most innovative guitarists in the modern era. He is responsible for everyone "needing" dotted eighth delays.
Call me Dom
Quote by Dmaj7
I don't know how to count canadians, the metric system is hard

Quote by gregs1020
well if lbj pokes his head in here and there's no nuts shit's gonna go doooooooowwwwwwwwwn.



{Pedalboard Thread Native: The Muffin Man}
#20
Quote by ethan_hanus
I just use a TS9 as a boost, sometimes use my Delta Labs SC-1 Chorus or the crappy built in reverb on my amp when I want some cool cleans or leads.

I don't need much, but I would like a nice chorus, a nice reverb(pan for the amp, screw pedal), delay, maybe wah, and my TS9 and I'll coax more tones than you can think of.

I think that people who have 20 pedals on their board seem to have a issue finding a good tone, which makes me think either their guitar is lacking, or their amp is.


10 pedals is about the maximum you should have, more than that then you prolly need to start looking at your gear other than pedals.


Pedals aren't always about tone in the classic sense. They're about getting unique textures you can't get with anything else. Most people with 20 pedals could give a rat's ass about how natural a pedal sounds and all that bull. 10 pedals is honestly nothing. There are dozens of different fuzz circuits that provide different textures. There are several different types of chorus, several different types of delay, several different types of flange, several different types of reverb, several different types of pitch shifting, several different types of wah, etc. Some people don't want to be limited in their expression and therefore have large boards. There are genres of music that require a large number of FX.

One of my favorite videos of one of my favorite guitarists, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fUf8TGiIwiU
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#21
Quote by simpleben09
I find nothing wrong with a few pedals, but when there's people like The Edge, who focus more on ****ing tap dancing between pedals instead of actually making music, that shit pisses me off


You are officially a dumb ****.

Quote by jolly_26
So I am alone on this almost. Haha. But on a lot of this stuff, I 100% agree with you too. If that makes sense. I just cant stand pedals without true bypass or a bypass looper; does anybody just find their sound getting more and more muffled under pedals?


Blah blah blah. Pete Cornish, the man responsible for many classic tones will tell you to shove your true bypass up your ass. Bypass type is the least of my concerns when looking for pedals.
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Last edited by mmolteratx at Sep 17, 2010,
#22
Quote by lbj273
the edge is one of the most innovative guitarists in the modern era. He is responsible for everyone "needing" dotted eighth delays.

Is he innovative? Certainly. But I truly don't see a need for a pedalboard that big. I would be willing to bet that he could have done it with much fewer pedals. I'm sorry if I offended any Edge fanboys
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#23
Personally, I think it is pretty simple. And I'm not trying to be offensive here:

The only reason why it is so easy for you to just use a cranked amp/guitar and whatnot is because that is what your music calls for.

Plain and simple. A metal guitarist is going to want a noise gate/overdrive. A pyschedelic guy is going to want his phasers and stuff (whatever they use?). It all comes down to what you play.

Sure if Angus Young had 90 pedals on his board, and yet played with the same tones/styles that he does it would be stupid, he would never use them. But other genres do want/need some pedals.

I do think relying on pedals or large pedalboard is bad though. But to each his own.
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#24
not an edge fanboy, but I will defend him on this. If you've ever seen It Might Get Loud you would realize that he uses the seemingly endless options he has as inspiration. If thats what it takes to inspire you to create some great music so be it.
Call me Dom
Quote by Dmaj7
I don't know how to count canadians, the metric system is hard

Quote by gregs1020
well if lbj pokes his head in here and there's no nuts shit's gonna go doooooooowwwwwwwwwn.



{Pedalboard Thread Native: The Muffin Man}
#25
Quote by lbj273
not an edge fanboy, but I will defend him on this. If you've ever seen It Might Get Loud you would realize that he uses the seemingly endless options he has as inspiration. If thats what it takes to inspire you to create some great music so be it.

Not a bad point. I more or less used the Edge as an example as far as huge pedals boards go. I guess he's somewhat an exception, but for a lot of people, there's really no need for that huuuuuuuuuge ****in pedal board(s), you know?
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Quote by My Father
So is this guitar Mexican made or human made? Wait, shit, that was really racist wasn't it?


My shitty covers: http://www.youtube.com/simpleben09
#26
Quote by patriotplayer90
I'm with you. Angus Young's tone is the epitome of what rock tone should be. No effects, very simple, yet unbelievably awesome.


And personally, I hate Angus Young's tone. I don't really like many of those "classic rock" tones. Pedals are great. And if I wanted to go no pedals, why not go no distortion as well and go for a straight jazz tone?

And yes, some people need pedal boards that big. Get over it.
#27
My pedal board is a midi controller. My effects come from a rack mounted rocktron prophesy. Sure my amp sounds great with no effects but it sounds a hell of a lot better with them. I pretty much always use compression and chorus. Literally on everything, my heavy rhythm channel, my cleans, my leads. They all have chorus to thicken the sound and they all have different levels of chorus. I also use reverb, delay and two noise gates.

Due to the genre of music I play (Doom Metal) and the gain I use my sound would be terrible without effects. It would be noisy as hell and would not have that thick, saturated tone I am using now.

Its horses for courses. Sure straight into the amp is great for blues and some classic rock but as a metal player effects generally make everything better and noise gates are an absolute necessity.
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#28
which brings the question, how big is too big?

and because someone WILL say it, yes that is what she said.
Call me Dom
Quote by Dmaj7
I don't know how to count canadians, the metric system is hard

Quote by gregs1020
well if lbj pokes his head in here and there's no nuts shit's gonna go doooooooowwwwwwwwwn.



{Pedalboard Thread Native: The Muffin Man}
#29
I love nothing more than the sound of an guitar straight to amp cranked up. However alot creativity in your tone in today's day and age comes mainly from pedals, thus why so many people use it. Me I try and constantly think of ways to make a little sound like alot.
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#30
I have a rack of effects but to be honest, I play with most of them turned off most of the time. I spent quite a few years purposely using nothing but guitar and amp and left the rack at home. It sharpened my technique up no end. There is a certain satisfaction to be gained from relying on nothing but guitar technique alone. When I see people trying to cover up shitty playing by just hitting a pedal I shake my head and walk away.
Now don't get me wrong people, I'm NOT saying everybody that uses effects can't play - all trout are fish but not all fish are trout.
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#31
Quote by simpleben09
Not a bad point. I more or less used the Edge as an example as far as huge pedals boards go. I guess he's somewhat an exception, but for a lot of people, there's really no need for that huuuuuuuuuge ****in pedal board(s), you know?

No touring guitarist is gonna have a huge pedalboard just for the sake of showing off to all of the 7 people in the front row that can see their board. If you're talking about middle aged guys on TGP who fill up two Pedaltrain Pro's with boutique pedals, then yes, it's unnecessary, but that's their volition and who are we to judge ho someone else spends their money?
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#32
Quote by lbj273
which brings the question, how big is too big?

and because someone WILL say it, yes that is what she said.


How long is a piece of string?



Size isn't up to anyone but the player really!
Yeah sure other limitations would be present (size of venue played in, time of set-up, etc) but the size of the board depends on what the player needs/wants (cos I could easily make use of a 20 foot board, but it'd be ****in' tiring for minimal changes in tone!).

Personally I could be settled with maybe 3 pedals at a minimum for live gigs at this moment.
But the pedalboard I'm planning will be about 7-10 pedals.
If money was no issue I'd go more.

Though to some guys, this is way too much (people such as the TS, the people who much prefer just going straight into amp, or people who go the route of having like, a wah pedal for one song and that's it).
But then some guys will think this is way too small. Such as the guys who have a massive rack which deals with all their pedals and racks via midi and stuff.

It's hard to have this discussion as anything but "Say what you like and why" because any arguments that will spawn from it are going to be insanely pointless!
#33
Different stokes for different folks.
While I dont have many pedals at all, I can see a use for them for other players.
I'm a rhythm guy, I don't do much for solos...a fill here, a little tapping there, but nothing for me along the line of phasers, flangers, or chorus, or even a wah. But I can see where a lead guy would find some of those indispensable.
At the same time, I'm not a guitar>amp>cab guy either. I have a very high gain amp...and I HATE noise, so it's gonna have a gate. I can tune a LOT faster with a pedal than I can by ear...so a tuner is nice to have. The only pedal I have that effects my tone, would be my "Boosta Grande" and it's just a clean boost...used on the crunch channel to give me a different kind of lead tone. Oh yeah, once in a while, I'll toss a delay in the loop....jury is still out on that.

I will admit, sometimes when I see these HUGE pedal boards, I just don't see the point. Sometimes watching these guys, it takes 3..4..5 stomps to get them from the sound they had, to the sound they want....kinda distracting. By the time they've switched from the lead tone to their rhythm tone, they're 1/2 way through the verse LOL! A local band here...the BASS player has nearly 20 pedals!!! Of course, the guitar player has even MORE....kinda think they might be compensating for something.

to each his/her own
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#34
Quote by mmolteratx
You are officially a dumb ****.


Blah blah blah. Pete Cornish, the man responsible for many classic tones will tell you to shove your true bypass up your ass. Bypass type is the least of my concerns when looking for pedals.


two points. 1) calm down. I'd take your opinion way more seriously if you weren't going off your nut. Read my other comments. I'm not trying to slag off everyone who uses pedals, I do use them myself. 2) Am I not allowed to ask a question? I wanted to know if anyone else had problems with muffled tone due to pedals, and I was set to ask for help actually. But I'd appreciate if you stopped posting on my thread now. Thanks.
#35
Know what my main reason is? I love Guitar > amp setups...but eventually it gets boring as...hmm...the Oprah show.

There's no reason effects should be looked upon as bad,. If someone wants to use 500 pedals in their rig, let them if that's the tone they're after.

If you want pure, unaltered guitar tone, play an acoustic guitar. Otherwise, well...don't be suprised when someone uses a guitar tone that is actually interesting and hasn't been done 500000 times on every record known to man.
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#36
Facepalm....the OP deserves one.

I use a pretty big amp, and use a noise gate and an overdrive. Pure tone other than that!
I've bought, sold, and traded more gear than I care to admit.
#38
Quote by jolly_26
Back in my day, we didn't have any of these fancy 'pedal boards'...and we had to walk 5 miles uphill in the snow BOTH WAYS just to get to and from school!

And we didn't have any of these thin latex CONDOMS...We just had a rabbit skin that you wrapped around your junk and tied off with a bungie cord...and you just had ONE that you used over and over and over!


Times change bro. Oh, and to answer your question, "Real Tone" didn't go anywhere. Times change, but there are still plenty of people who plug directly into their amps.

Don't be an old curmudgeon...
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#39
Quote by 311ZOSOVHJH

i'm not for or against you......but threads like these don't turn out so good. Ask CasinoEpiphone.



I remember him...lol "pure tone" I think it was...lol

Anyways my reply to this is that I think some people, sometimes myself, just feel they shouldnt limit themselves to only a guitar and amp. Its just technology for guitars, why not have some fun with it, experiment with it...
There was a time when electric guitars and tube amps were new technology...

Perhaps we should not bother with guitar and amps, there just not natural sounding... everything should be acapella...
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#40
Quote by SLonergan
Times change bro. Oh, and to answer your question, "Real Tone" didn't go anywhere. Times change, but there are still plenty of people who plug directly into their amps.

Don't be an old curmudgeon...



haha mate I'm most likely younger than you. And I'm loving the quote doctoring haha this is the thread I wanted its crackup
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