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#1
My Engl Fireball just sold on eBay. It is now time for me to order my new amp.

Option 1:
Egnater Renegade. This amp makes the most sense for me to buy. I played it at Guitar Center the other day through a similar guitar and similar cab, and it was amazing. I freaking loved it. It was exactly what I was looking for. It was also extremely versatile yet still simple to use.

Option 2:
Rivera Knuckelhead. It's an older model, probably mid 90's. It's going used (obviously) for the same price as the Egnater. I haven't played it, and don't have access to it, but from what I read in reviews it is amazing. If it's THAT much better than the Renegade, I don't want to miss out on this offer.

Option 3:
Carvin Legacy. The first run of two channel ones. I don't know much about this amp, and haven't gotten a chance to play it. I know that if I get it used, I can afford a nice road case and couple other goodies.

I play post-hardcore like Life In Your Way and UnderOath. Big, complex chords yet still need a good enough tone for riffing and leads. I play a Washburn Idol with a JB/Jazz set up and have a B-52 4x12 with Vintage 30's. I also need cleans that don't break up at high volumes.

TL;DR:
Egnater Renegade vs. Rivera Knuckelhead (old as hell, might need maintainence) vs. Carvin Legacy. I play post hardcore and need to slice through the mix like a beast.

EDIT: Pic of the Rivera to guesstimate the age:
Rivera
Washburn HM Idol w/ SD JB in bridge > Ibanez Weeping Demon > Korg Pitchblack > Digitech Bad Monkey > Boss NS-2 > Boss DD-6 > Egnater Renegade > Splawn 2x12 w/ Weber Sig12Bs

Last edited by Unskathed at Sep 22, 2010,
#2
Jcm 800!!!
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#3
Quote by Teque86
Jcm 800!!!

I've played a JCM800, 900, and 2000 and none of them appealed to me over these amps.
Washburn HM Idol w/ SD JB in bridge > Ibanez Weeping Demon > Korg Pitchblack > Digitech Bad Monkey > Boss NS-2 > Boss DD-6 > Egnater Renegade > Splawn 2x12 w/ Weber Sig12Bs

#4
Quote by Unskathed
I've played a JCM800, 900, and 2000 and none of them appealed to me over these amps.


i play similar styles, if you can get hold of a JCM 900 SL-X, its a perfect solution for you.

failing that i'd take the knucklehead.
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#5
peavey 6505?
Quote by BobDetroit
It's all about the abalone. You can't play metal without it. Mother of pearl? MOTO? GTFO!
#6
Quote by primusclaypool1
peavey 6505?

I appreciate the power and tone of the 6505, but they aren't what I'm looking for.
Also, Marshall is out of the question.

Really, it's between the Rivera and Egnater. The Carvin I threw into the question just in case some had such a great experience one, that they would take it over these two amps.
Washburn HM Idol w/ SD JB in bridge > Ibanez Weeping Demon > Korg Pitchblack > Digitech Bad Monkey > Boss NS-2 > Boss DD-6 > Egnater Renegade > Splawn 2x12 w/ Weber Sig12Bs

#8
The Rivera is meant to be a monster, definitely worth looking at more. Can you try it out?
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#9
the JCM is the post hardocre amp.


the Rivera is an all out metal amp

the Renegade just doesnt really sseem to fit for anything you want to play, but if it is the one you like them get it..

but i would advise you try the marshalls thats very daft of you to rule them out.

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#10
How about a Dual Rectifier. Definitely enough gain and definitely good cleans.
Call me Andrew. It's my name.

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#11
also why the heck did you sell the ENGL?

1977 Burny FLG70
2004 EBMM JP6
2016 SE Holcolmb
#12
Vyvpr




Kidding. Why is everyone recommending....oh nvmd

Have not played that Rivera YET but I have played one and they obviously have great tone and are well built. I'd find as much as you can about this amp.

Never played a Carvin.

I really really like the Renegade. If something happened to my Splawn I'd consider getting one . Really can't say enough good things. I've played it 2 or 3 times now. EL34 mode mostly


Without more info I'd get the Renegade and warranty....and I usually go for the used ones

(I'm sure Min wants to kill me right about now)
#13
I've played a slew of Marshalls and I didn't like any of them. I doubt the SLX is different enough to sway me.

I tried a Triple and Dual Recto before I got the Engl, they aren't my thing.

I sold the Engl because it's a great recording amp, great for practicing with a band, sounds great, and then once you play a DIY show, you get drowned in the mix and no one can hear you no matter what you try.


To 311, yeah, the Renegade is great! I played it with the clean channel set to 60W, tube mix for 6L6's, and the drive channel set to 18W, tube mix at EL34's. Sounded absolutely beautiful. I even got to crank it to be about 1/2 on the channel volumes, and 1/4 on the master because i was in a loud room. I came.
Washburn HM Idol w/ SD JB in bridge > Ibanez Weeping Demon > Korg Pitchblack > Digitech Bad Monkey > Boss NS-2 > Boss DD-6 > Egnater Renegade > Splawn 2x12 w/ Weber Sig12Bs

Last edited by Unskathed at Sep 22, 2010,
#14
I'm not like super familiar with the two bands you listed. Could you go into more detail on what you like, what you play, favorite guitarists, etc and also tell us more about what you didn't like about the Fireball.

so play along briefly....

Budget?
Genres?
New or Used? both
Home or Gig?
Current gear?
Closest City?

^ (my standard list)

v...custom list just for you

Also check out the Mesa ElectraDyne and Marks and maybe a used Roadster. Orange Rocker 30, Rockerverb 50, Thunderverb, and new Thunder. Marshalls already mentioned....wait nvmd. Traynor YCV 50Blue, Budda Superdrive 18, Egnater Tweaker, Blackheart 100, Jet City JCA50, and a bunch of other amps I can't think of. Splawn.

PS: Because I got Min's Idiot of the Day #2 award for recommending the Renegade - I'll go ahead and let you know now that he IM'd me to tell me that that Rivera is a 'no go' and that he rec's the JCM800.
Last edited by 311ZOSOVHJH at Sep 23, 2010,
#15


OT: I'd rec the 800 too.

It's okay 311, I might have rec'd the Renegade as well
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#16
The Legacy is a very articulate amp. Accents and leads will 'pop' so to speak.

Have you considered Soldano? A Hot Rod 50 sounds like it would be up your alley as well.
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What the hell is a G&L.



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Greg what did you send me??
#17
$925

Post Hardcore. Huge chords, I need every note to shine through. Great cleans.

New and used. I don't care.

Lots of gigging. Like 60+ shows a year. Probably about 50% of DYI with only vocals mic'd.
Washburn HM Idol with Seymour Duncan JB/Jazz pickups. B-52 AT 4x12 w/ Vintage 30's. Ibanez Weeping Demon, Boss DD-6, Korg Pitchblack.

Closest city is Grand Rapids. They have a Guitar Center, which is where I played the Renegade, the Rectos, and the slew of Marshalls. They stock basically every Mesa you can imagine, every Marshall you can imagine, and random Peaveys, Egnaters, etc. No Orange, VHT, or Rivera unless it's used. It's an hour and a half drive. Takes about half my gas tank.

What I didn't like about my Fireball: Sounded great. It was a great amp. Get it live with a band though, and the best word I can think of is "bitchy." Bands running Valvekings were getting ballsier tone than I am with the Fireball.
Fireball's already sold, so all advice on how to make it sound better live is useless.
Washburn HM Idol w/ SD JB in bridge > Ibanez Weeping Demon > Korg Pitchblack > Digitech Bad Monkey > Boss NS-2 > Boss DD-6 > Egnater Renegade > Splawn 2x12 w/ Weber Sig12Bs

Last edited by Unskathed at Sep 23, 2010,
#18
^ I'd like to think my VK sounds pretty ballsy.
Quote by DeathByDestroyr
What the hell is a G&L.



Quote by Flux'D
Gay & Lesbian I think, the box smelled funny
Greg what did you send me??
#19
Quote by Raijouta
^ I'd like to think my VK sounds pretty ballsy.

Rest assured it sounds ballsier than an Engl Fireball in a DIY hardcore setting.
Washburn HM Idol w/ SD JB in bridge > Ibanez Weeping Demon > Korg Pitchblack > Digitech Bad Monkey > Boss NS-2 > Boss DD-6 > Egnater Renegade > Splawn 2x12 w/ Weber Sig12Bs

#20
Can you link me to something you would consider the heaviest (guitar wise) that you play.

I'd at least look into some of these, I know you don't want a Marshall but I thought the TSL was actually pretty cool.


Sep 15 - Orange Rocker 30 Combo - $999 (Downtown Grand Rapids) pic
Sep 14 - Mesa Boogie F-50 Combo - $650 (BC)
Sep 12 - Peavey Mark VI head and BW118 cab - $500 (downtown GR)
Sep 11 - Marshall JCM 2000 100w Voodoo Modded - $1100 (spring lake) pic
Sep 9 - Mesa MK3 Green Stripe guitar head - $700 (Lansing) pic
Aug 19 - Marshall TSL 100 Head - $799 (Allendale, MI) pic
Aug 17 - Sovtek Mig 60 Tube Head with Ampeg 412 American made cab - $600 (Grand River Music - Eastown) pic

http://grandrapids.craigslist.org/search/msg?query=amp&srchType=A&minAsk=500&maxAsk=1200

just throwin stuff out there to see if it sticks basically. I still like the Renegade in the 'New' amp dept
#21
Honestly dude, when I played the Egnater, it was EXACTLY what I wanted. In every way. I only started this thread to find out of the Rivera was better. lol.

But, I like where it's going. It's helping me keep an open mind.
In other news, I might be able to acquire a Budda Superdrive 80 head or a Budda Superdrive 45 Combo for my budget. Yeah, I know. Might be a long shot, I might get lucky. I'm optimistic because the Superdrive 80 is one of my dream amps. The other being a SLO 100.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIH4U7poyww
That's all the more gain I need.
And yes, I know the dude in Rosetta uses a Marshall.

Am interested in the Sovtek Mig.
Washburn HM Idol w/ SD JB in bridge > Ibanez Weeping Demon > Korg Pitchblack > Digitech Bad Monkey > Boss NS-2 > Boss DD-6 > Egnater Renegade > Splawn 2x12 w/ Weber Sig12Bs

Last edited by Unskathed at Sep 23, 2010,
#22
Quote by 311ZOSOVHJH


PS: Because I got Min's Idiot of the Day #2 award for recommending the Renegade - I'll go ahead and let you know now that he IM'd me to tell me that that Rivera is a 'no go' and that he rec's the JCM800.


What doesn't he like about the Renegade?
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#24
Quote by AxSilentxLine
UnderOath use Orange Rockerverbs, that's my vote

I REALLY REALLY want to try an Orange, but the closest place that sells them is so far away, it isn't even worth my time.
Washburn HM Idol w/ SD JB in bridge > Ibanez Weeping Demon > Korg Pitchblack > Digitech Bad Monkey > Boss NS-2 > Boss DD-6 > Egnater Renegade > Splawn 2x12 w/ Weber Sig12Bs

#25
The Renegade is pretty good from what I've seen, it really does a lot.
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Last edited by I am wet : Today at 03:26 XM.
#26
Quote by I am wet
The Renegade is pretty good from what I've seen, it really does a lot.

I know. It's like, 6L6 cleans with 60W of head room AND EL34 drive with 18W break up. It's a beautiful thing.
Washburn HM Idol w/ SD JB in bridge > Ibanez Weeping Demon > Korg Pitchblack > Digitech Bad Monkey > Boss NS-2 > Boss DD-6 > Egnater Renegade > Splawn 2x12 w/ Weber Sig12Bs

#27
Quote by I am wet
The Renegade is pretty good from what I've seen, it really does a lot.


says the guy who owns one
Quote by rmr024
Well, in California, people carry around devices that control the minds of bears. So expect to see people walking their bears.

Also, don't be surprised if some robot hookers try to solicit sex to you on the streets.
#30
Quote by SLonergan
What doesn't he like about the Renegade?

He will be back in a day or two, he'll probably jump in here and tell you why. I think he felt that it didn't have enough gain and voiced wrong for what Unskathed plays. I didn't think the stuff I listened too so far was all that over top as far as gain or 'metal' goes (despite the cookie monster vocals )

A Renegade whould be able to handle that music just fine. Plus the added benefit of 6L6 or EL34s and 65w or 15w.
#33
The question here isn't if the Renegade is a good amp for the job. Because I have played it, dicked around with it, etc. and I freaking loved it. Like, seriously. I was running the gain at about half way on the drive channel. On my Engl I ran the gain at just barely over 9 o'clock. I'm not a gain junky by any means.

The question is, is there an amp that sounds astoundingly better and is a better value that I should be looking at instead?
Washburn HM Idol w/ SD JB in bridge > Ibanez Weeping Demon > Korg Pitchblack > Digitech Bad Monkey > Boss NS-2 > Boss DD-6 > Egnater Renegade > Splawn 2x12 w/ Weber Sig12Bs

#34
Better's subjective, what sounds better to me may not sound better to you. We've given you our recs. The rest is up to you really.
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#35
Word. Thanks to everyone who replied to me with rec's or otherwise. I might be making another trip to try out more amps, it all depends on this Budda situation. Thanks!
Washburn HM Idol w/ SD JB in bridge > Ibanez Weeping Demon > Korg Pitchblack > Digitech Bad Monkey > Boss NS-2 > Boss DD-6 > Egnater Renegade > Splawn 2x12 w/ Weber Sig12Bs

#36
Quote by Unskathed
The question here isn't if the Renegade is a good amp for the job. Because I have played it, dicked around with it, etc. and I freaking loved it. Like, seriously. I was running the gain at about half way on the drive channel. On my Engl I ran the gain at just barely over 9 o'clock. I'm not a gain junky by any means.

The question is, is there an amp that sounds astoundingly better and is a better value that I should be looking at instead?

The egnater amps have a distinct sound IMO, for better or worse. They aren't really that comparable to any other amp I have heard or played. Though I haven't heard or played that many.

So no, if you like that amp, get it
#37
Absolutely hated the Legacy I had. I like smooth, but not THAT smooth. Ew.


I haven't tried that Rivera, I know many of the older ones weren't exactly metal amps. However, if it's anything like the K-Tre, that thing will smoke the Renegade.

Really like the Renegade, I think that's really the safest choice (obviously since you've tried it), though I'd try to score one used.

Quote by 311ZOSOVHJH
I think he felt that it didn't have enough gain and voiced wrong for what Unskathed plays.

AM doesn't even play metal

The Renegade I played could bring teh br00tz.
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Last edited by MatrixClaw at Sep 23, 2010,
#38
Unfortunately the Rivera sold.
I may be able to land a Budda Superdrive 45 2x12 or Budda Superdrive 80 head for my price range. If that doesn't work, Egnater it is.
Washburn HM Idol w/ SD JB in bridge > Ibanez Weeping Demon > Korg Pitchblack > Digitech Bad Monkey > Boss NS-2 > Boss DD-6 > Egnater Renegade > Splawn 2x12 w/ Weber Sig12Bs

#39
Quote by Unskathed
Unfortunately the Rivera sold.
I may be able to land a Budda Superdrive 45 2x12 or Budda Superdrive 80 head for my price range. If that doesn't work, Egnater it is.

My question is if you found something you love why do you keep considering alternatives?
#40
If you like the Renegade, then get it. I wasn't too pleased with it when I tried a head version of it, but it was probably the icky Marshall cab that it was plugged into. My GC had a tendency to put nice heads on some atrocious or mediocre cabinets. But yeah, the cleans are nice enough and there is plenty of gain for your style. The medium gain sounds were what turned me off. Too hard for my liking, but then again, it might have been the cabinet.
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