#1
I have a couple questions:

1. A lot of regulars on here complain that the term progressive gets tossed around too much. Any band with odd time signatures, complex song structures, etc. gets labeled progressive this or that. So what exactly defines a progressive metal band and who are some good examples? Also, what would you label the other bands who maybe aren't that progressive, but don't just sound typical (i.e. the ones that use the odd timing signatures and what not).

2. A lot of the regulars here are harsh critics. I believe this is a great thing and I'm trying to get better at it myself. Well I see a lot of the same points being brought up when bashing band A, and then it's okay for band B. Take for instance 2 bands with songs 8 minutes long. Band A is called boring and repetitive while band B is labeled atmospheric and trance-like. Or some metalcore band with a verse-chorus song structure is generic and predictable while some classic heavy metal gem with the same structure is considered genius. Where is the line drawn and what's the difference. I mean, I agree with most of you usually but I'd like someone to explain it to me.

Oh, and I'll delete this pointless thread after I get an answer. Thanks!
#2
Quote by Born Headless


1. A lot of regulars on here complain that the term progressive gets tossed around too much. Any band with odd time signatures, complex song structures, etc. gets labeled progressive this or that. So what exactly defines a progressive metal band and who are some good examples? Also, what would you label the other bands who maybe aren't that progressive, but don't just sound typical (i.e. the ones that use the odd timing signatures and what not).

Someone like Enslaved I consider progressive, if you look at their entire discography, where they started and where they are now, but how subtle the change album to album was.
I think it could be argued the bands who adhere to typical 'prog' features are more regressive, than progressive. But I usually just call it Prog, rather than Progressive. Sounds odd, but it makes sense to me.,

Quote by Born Headless

2. A lot of the regulars here are harsh critics. I believe this is a great thing and I'm trying to get better at it myself. Well I see a lot of the same points being brought up when bashing band A, and then it's okay for band B. Take for instance 2 bands with songs 8 minutes long. Band A is called boring and repetitive while band B is labeled atmospheric and trance-like. Or some metalcore band with a verse-chorus song structure is generic and predictable while some classic heavy metal gem with the same structure is considered genius. Where is the line drawn and what's the difference. I mean, I agree with most of you usually but I'd like someone to explain it to me. !

Not all 8 minute songs are the same. Just cause they last the same amount of time doesn't mean the contents have to be anything alike. If someone happens to think song B is Atmospheric and trance like, it may very well be cause song B is Atmospheric and trance like, and Track A may very well be repetitive and boring. But just because someone has said it is, doesn't mean it is. I think with atmospheric music its very much down to the individual and if they are 'feeling it' or not.
And Metalcore and Classic metal have different stylistic features, and evoke different feelings. Again with the time thing, just cause a song has a similar structure doesn't automatically make it like another song. You have to take into acount, the riffs, the melodies, the feel of the song, does it feel more than the sum of its parts, or like it seems with a lot of metalcore (at least the more popular end of the spectrum), that its music by numbers?

I know its not an in depth analysis or owt like that, but I hope it makes some sense to you.
#3
Quote by AnnihiSlateR
Someone like Enslaved I consider progressive, if you look at their entire discography, where they started and where they are now, but how subtle the change album to album was.
I think it could be argued the bands who adhere to typical 'prog' features are more regressive, than progressive. But I usually just call it Prog, rather than Progressive. Sounds odd, but it makes sense to me.,


Not all 8 minute songs are the same. Just cause they last the same amount of time doesn't mean the contents have to be anything alike. If someone happens to think song B is Atmospheric and trance like, it may very well be cause song B is Atmospheric and trance like, and Track A may very well be repetitive and boring. But just because someone has said it is, doesn't mean it is. I think with atmospheric music its very much down to the individual and if they are 'feeling it' or not.
And Metalcore and Classic metal have different stylistic features, and evoke different feelings. Again with the time thing, just cause a song has a similar structure doesn't automatically make it like another song. You have to take into acount, the riffs, the melodies, the feel of the song, does it feel more than the sum of its parts, or like it seems with a lot of metalcore (at least the more popular end of the spectrum), that its music by numbers?

I know its not an in depth analysis or owt like that, but I hope it makes some sense to you.


Eh, I already understand that they aren't alike. I was just trying to eliminate the subjectivity and see where taste came in to play with things of that nature. And while 2 songs may be totally different, I was only comparing 1 particular point. I just see people rolling their eyes at some bands they don't like because of poor songwriting and a very common/simple song structure but then go praise a heavy metal album that may be better all around but has the exact same structure. Like I said, I just wanted to know where the line was drawn with these things.
#4
A lot of regulars here are cunts.
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#6
Quote by Born Headless
I have a couple questions:

1. A lot of regulars on here complain that the term progressive gets tossed around too much. Any band with odd time signatures, complex song structures, etc. gets labeled progressive this or that. So what exactly defines a progressive metal band and who are some good examples? Also, what would you label the other bands who maybe aren't that progressive, but don't just sound typical (i.e. the ones that use the odd timing signatures and what not).

2. A lot of the regulars here are harsh critics. I believe this is a great thing and I'm trying to get better at it myself. Well I see a lot of the same points being brought up when bashing band A, and then it's okay for band B. Take for instance 2 bands with songs 8 minutes long. Band A is called boring and repetitive while band B is labeled atmospheric and trance-like. Or some metalcore band with a verse-chorus song structure is generic and predictable while some classic heavy metal gem with the same structure is considered genius. Where is the line drawn and what's the difference. I mean, I agree with most of you usually but I'd like someone to explain it to me.

Oh, and I'll delete this pointless thread after I get an answer. Thanks!


1. For me, progressive bands are ones who make an album that pushes the limits and sounds of a genre or breaks new ground, while remaining true to the ideals of writing original and interesting metal. My examples:

Voivod
Coroner
Nocturnus
Celtic Frost
Sigh

2. Its just down to taste. None of us waste time with actual reviews on this site. You get sick of seeing the same stupid shit that belongs in other forums, and it gets on your nerves. However, if you actually want to see some reviews I did write in full, il gladly email them onto you.
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#7
Well, progressive doesn't describe the sound of the actual music, but rather that it pushes certain boundaries or uses outside-the-box songwriting/riffage. If I tell you a band is 'progressive metal', then I'm not telling you very much at all.

Take for instance 2 bands with songs 8 minutes long. Band A is called boring and repetitive while band B is labeled atmospheric and trance-like. Or some metalcore band with a verse-chorus song structure is generic and predictable while some classic heavy metal gem with the same structure is considered genius.


This has more to do with whether the song is shit or if it's good. There are copious amounts of bands that use unpredictable song structures, and/or are not repetitive at all, and sound like complete bullshit. You don't even have to bring up as I gay dying or similar nonsense.
#8
Quote by eazy-c
A lot of regulars here are cunts.



It's true. We are pretty cuntish.
#9
Ultimately, it's down to subjective taste, no other way around it. It may appear that there is some sort of line because in any community with such a defined basis for gathering, there are bound to be certain acknowledged matters.
This forum's specific harsh reaction is, like Strangles said, a direct outcome of people coming in and talking about the same shit again and again, as well as genuine hatred for the aforementioned shit being brought up repetitively. I think many of us would agree that having a go at Alexi Laiho with a pair of brass knuckles would be a productive and entertaining afternoon.

As for progressive and its definition, like others have already said, it's more of a concept than it is a musical style.
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#10
hmm. I always considered Progressive to be a band doing something that is pushing thier genre, like Dissection. They took influences from what was going on at the time and created thier own style from it
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