#1
  • Photography
  • Television/Movies


Why do these subjects involve so much things that do not need to be involved, mostly shocking things such as images that are really not normal or extreme.

There is a lot of films that have been made over the last few years that have been extreme and that being the only reason why people watched them, it doesn't even matter about the storyline of the film, people will still watch it. To list a few films:
  • Teeth
  • The human centipede
  • A Serbian film


This is also involved in photography, i know this is still a very touchy point that im going to make here, but I dont mean to offend or piss anyone off, but when the person jumped from the twin towers, why did the photographer choose to take a picture? i mean that person had a family, imagine them seeing that image in the paper the next morning.

If anyone has any views or disagree with what i said, speak up but lets not get out of hand

Also feel free to add any more forms of entertainment/art and points
#2
wait...

I don't quite understand.
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#3
Well, in America we have the freedom to express ourselves in many ways that others deem inappropriate or crude / vulgar.
#4
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wait...

I don't quite understand.



Not understanding, that makes me angry
#5
Movies aren't made to tell stories, they are made to make cash.
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#6
In short: if you don't like the premise of a movie, don't watch it. If you don't like a photographer's work, don't look at it.

And don't say "Oh but we have no choice but to see it, blah blah", there are warnings and laws about what can be shown on TV and when. Just accept that different people have different views on what they enjoy seeing or think is necessary.
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#7
(Invalid img)

People want to make money.
It's what we are raised to believe.
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#8
Two different arguments, really. If someone makes a gory movie with no plot, see it if you want to, don't see it if you don't. The thing you said about the dude that jumped from the twin towers is a different matter, because I agree I wouldn't want that published if it was my family member. As far as I know, though, in that particular instance, the guy isn't recognisable.
#9
so uhm. why do you care? watch something else then?
Just like with music, we can all bitch and moan about how much of a homosexual mr. Bieber is, while we could also just listen to OUR favorites instead. saves everyone the hastle right?
#10
Quote by esther_mouse
In short: if you don't like the premise of a movie, don't watch it. If you don't like a photographer's work, don't look at it.

And don't say "Oh but we have no choice but to see it, blah blah", there are warnings and laws about what can be shown on TV and when. Just accept that different people have different views on what they enjoy seeing or think is necessary.


yeah i understand the first bit if i was really offended by the movie, i wouldn't watch it

but why has it come to that people only care about making money from movies, like i know its pretty much been that way since the start, but you can tell how inspired the film storylines are, in most films even, but then 2007 came along and everything changed! even in music, purely about the money
#11
The movies you cited though are specifically made to be shocking. That is their purpose and they are attempting to appeal to the demographic who are attracted to those kind of movies. As far as pictures go, I doubt that guy was taking that picture deliberately. He was probably just clicking away and happened to get that one. Although a lot of creative photography is meant to provoke an emotional response. Anger is an emotion.
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#12
Because people who watch it are completely desensitised to violence and it doesn't bother them. I personally hate any horror film & video nasties (i.e. the polish(?) guy being murdered, terrorists beheading people) because they give me nightmares. Don't really give a toss what people think, it's not natural to see things like that and not feel any empathy/ no emotive reaction bar finding it enjoyable amusing.

They are made to shock & make money based on shock value. They win on both accounts. Why do you think most horror movies are a massive success? It's certainly not because of the amazing story line. Look at Hostel, when it was released a was a massive film (at least here in the UK). It's a film basically watching people be kidnapped and tortured. Sounds brilliant ...
#13
Quote by Silent Murder

People want to make money.



this.


supply and demand, if theres pepole willing to pay to watch crappy movies about a vagina with teeth then someone is bound to make it and sell it.
#14
Quote by mikeyknowsbetter
yeah i understand the first bit if i was really offended by the movie, i wouldn't watch it

but why has it come to that people only care about making money from movies, like i know its pretty much been that way since the start, but you can tell how inspired the film storylines are, in most films even, but then 2007 came along and everything changed! even in music, purely about the money


It's always been about making money. They enjoy it & enjoy the money it makes them even more, it's never been any different. If you honestly believe otherwise you're extremely naive.

Some people do enjoy the shock value so your argument is not logical and extremely biased.
#15
Quote by mikeyknowsbetter
yeah i understand the first bit if i was really offended by the movie, i wouldn't watch it

but why has it come to that people only care about making money from movies, like i know its pretty much been that way since the start, but you can tell how inspired the film storylines are, in most films even, but then 2007 came along and everything changed! even in music, purely about the money

It's been about the money for a lot longer than that.
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#16
Quote by Shabalaba
It's always been about making money. They enjoy it & enjoy the money it makes them even more, it's never been any different. If you honestly believe otherwise you're extremely naive.

Some people do enjoy the shock value so your argument is not logical and extremely biased.


But, so is your last post
#18
Wow. Terrible shit happens. No one benefits from pretending it doesn't. Documenting historically significant events is important.
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#19
Quote by Guynametyler
A Serbian Film sounds so brutal I can't believe it was actually made... I'm curious to how graphic the movie actually is.


I hadn't ever heard of that one actually. I just looked it up. I regret it immensely. I dont think there is a line that that movie doesn't cross. just wow. In this case, I agree with TS.
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#20
Quote by mikeyknowsbetter
But, so is your last post


Fair play but i do put "I personally hate..." and the rest follows on from that :p
#21
Teeth isn't that bad, it seems they were actually trying to make a point (though the shock value is definitely a hook) but the fact that things like The Human Centipede and every Saw sequel exist enrage me too. It's always existed, though there are some things on the internet no one should ever see.

On the photography thing, there is no answer. I had a class in university on this very topic, covering famous photos from various wars, and you can go in circles forever. Either you show it and are condemned for pornography (in the broad, not specifically sexual sense), or you don't show it and are condemned for censorship. In your example, suppose no one took pictures of the jumpers. We wouldn't have evidence that such a thing ever happened, even though it did. Who should judge what information should be documented and shared and what should be forgotten? I think there's a line somewhere, but it's a gray area--showing someone trying to end their life in the least horrifying way possible may be a bit perverse, but others--say the abuse photos from Abu Ghraib--might open people's eyes and actually change things for the better.
#22
As has been stated, It's been like this a while.

"Last House On The Left" (the original from 1972) was nothing but torture porn/revenge fantasy. and it was based the 1960 Swedish film "The Virgin Spring" by Ingmar Bergman which was based on a 13th century Swedish poem.

So that kind of thing has been around a long time. Why do people watch crap like "The Human Centipede"? The same reason people watch "The Jersey Shore" or "The Real Housewives of (insert city)"

There are stupid people every where and crap like that appeals to them. As long as stupid people watch and/or buy crap, crap will be produced.


As Theodore Sturgeon stated in "Sturgeon's Revelation": "Ninety percent of everything is crap"

The movies that stay around from the 20's until today only survived because they were good. There are thousands of movies that have disappeared from history because they were crap and should have been forgotten.
Last edited by jugglingfreak at Apr 4, 2011,
#23
Behind all the shock value, A Serbian Film does have a message. A twisted, depraved message, but still a message. I was actually shocked at how much I was affected by it, as I am normally good at detaching myself from things.
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#24

This is also involved in photography, i know this is still a very touchy point that im going to make here, but I dont mean to offend or piss anyone off, but when the person jumped from the twin towers, why did the photographer choose to take a picture? i mean that person had a family, imagine them seeing that image in the paper the next morning.

If anyone has any views or disagree with what i said, speak up but lets not get out of hand

Also feel free to add any more forms of entertainment/art and points

I would take a picture of a person being shot if it were a good shot: documentary photography documents. Doc Photography is probably the most chilling genre of photography you get (excluding the works of Andres Seranno - he takes pictures of corpses and pisses on stuff) - it documents what really happens. People take these pictures because it is a reflection of the real world and the sad things that happen in it outside of your comfy little home.

fact is, most people dont have a clue about how the world works, or what really goes on - i can safely say that documentary photography is important because of that. i personally want to see the things that really go on, because it A: makes me realise how lucky i am, and B: drives me to document the same things.

some people want to live in blissful ignorance of the world; some want to see the most horrific things the world can throw at them.

edit: also; art. as mentioned, photographers like Andres Seranno, Floria Sigismondi, on mccullin and robert mapplethorpe have taken fine art shots because shock is useful in fine art, and gains attention. as well as this, they are often making a statement. shock and sadness have artistic merit.
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Last edited by Banjocal at Apr 4, 2011,
#25
Glad I'm not the only one who doesn't get why movies like Saw and The Human Centipede exist. Both are immensely stupid and only go for shock value.
#26






I really don't think images like these can be compared to The Human Centipede.

These are stark realities, yes, but they are not here for amusement or money, they are representative of an ugly reality of the world that need/needed to be seen/addressed. They help people tune emotionally into something they would have no engagement with usually, but which they should.
Would you censor photos of the holocaust? America's bombings of Japan? Riots anywhere in the world? These are things that need to be seen to make a change, they are not indulgences in sadistic curiosity like Saw.

That said, curiosity in such things is not wrong in itself, but a taste for such things might not be a virtue...
#27
People are running out of ideas. What ever sells the best makes it to theaters.

On the Twin Tower jumping, what is the point of photography? I would say photography is meant to capture a moment in time, be it beautiful or horrifying. That picture captures a horrifying moment in history and that picture can convey more than words ever can about what happened to all those people. Stop being so damn sensitive.


EDIT: The first Saw was brilliant. After that I realized it was going for as much money as possible.
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#28
Quote by entity0009
Behind all the shock value, A Serbian Film does have a message. A twisted, depraved message, but still a message. I was actually shocked at how much I was affected by it, as I am normally good at detaching myself from things.


I dont see how that movie could not have an effect on you...
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#29
I think the picture of someone jumping from the twin towers is pretty significant
To me it describes 9/11 in one picture...it shows the pain and suffering that occurred that day...thats my opinion of it

Also I watched A Serbian Film and that ruined porn for me, newborn porn? Like come on I don't want to think of that when i'm watching porn lol
#30
Quote by shikkaka
I dont see how that movie could not have an effect on you...


I read the wikipedia page on it and wished I didnt

On the Human Centipede, I saw it, not proud of it, I looked away for half the movie. The second one is supposedly going to have a chain of a dozen or so people. The fact that it was made doesnt piss me off, the fact that it was on demand on Netflix and Comcast does. There should be no easy access to material like that.

On photographs as long as they were not staged and if the photographer can do something to help than I have no qualms about it.
#31
Quote by epiless
I read the wikipedia page on it and wished I didnt



My feelings exactly...
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#33
Quote by epiless

On photographs as long as they were not staged and if the photographer can do something to help than I have no qualms about it.

Journalistic photography can't always be about helping. Sometimes the only thing you can do is take a picture and share it with the world so they know what went on.
I certainly wouldn't have believed that people jumped out of the World Trade centre unless I'd seen the pictures and video footage.
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#34
Those three pictures are exactly what i had in my head when making the thread, i clearly have a different mind frame to photographers, if i was working for a newspaper and saw someone jumping to their death to escape a horrible horrible death, taking a picture would be the last thing on my mind, same with the other pictures, that's what gets me most i think, how at times, they can lack human feelings, its like the photographers themselves become nothing more than someone who operates the camera
#35
Quote by mikeyknowsbetter
Those three pictures are exactly what i had in my head when making the thread, i clearly have a different mind frame to photographers, if i was working for a newspaper and saw someone jumping to their death to escape a horrible horrible death, taking a picture would be the last thing on my mind, same with the other pictures, that's what gets me most i think, how at times, they can lack human feelings, its like the photographers themselves become nothing more than someone who operates the camera


I agree. Everyone around the camera must have been awe struck in terror as the guy jumps out of the building and he's thinking "wow what a great photo opportunity".
#37
Quote by Antis0cial
Movies aren't made to tell stories, they are made to make cash.

Same can be said for Video games. They buy a company with a respected title and make a quick-cash-in sequel with elements resembling a sell-out -- appeal to the masses, i.e. CoD players.
#39
No, you're angry with things. not at. You're mad at a person, but angry with them. you can be angry about something, but not at something. damnit.
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