#1
Hooray!

My band just got it's first invitation to a paid gig, on the 30rd of April (Queen's day here in the Netherlands). They asked if we could play the date and how much we asked. So any advice on what to ask?

I'm thinking of 150/200 euros, or would that be too high? Or too low? It seems to be some kind of Youth-Centre, a bit bigger then the average bar. We're a metal band that plays originals though so I'm not sure if we're the right type of band since Queen's day is usually when people get drunk and listen to coverbands of cheesy dutch artists or at most some rock.
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#2
It depends what you do.

Generally what I've experienced, is two 45 minute sets of cover songs (here in the UK at least) can get the band anywhere from about £200-£400.

Though, last night a band I'm in got paid £40 (£10 per member who was present, if the sax player didn't leave we could've got £50! ) for about a 35 minute set, plus providing the drum kit and sorting the sound out for two support bands.

Ask people you know who've gigged on a set a similar length to your own and see how much is usually paid for it.
#6
We'll be playing a set of about 75 Minutes, of which about 5 covers (2xIron Maiden, 2xIn Flames, 1x Metallica). And the rest are originals.
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#7
go low the first time. so there is more of a chance of them asking you to come back..

If they ask you to come back a 2nd time then up the price on them
#8
50eu per band member + drinks on the house or a meal or something.
I know Lucifer so well I call him by his first name...I say, "Hey Lou!"
#9
I found out that one of the other bands on the bill is a band we know, so I just sent them a mail to ask how much they ask. We already have drinks on the house.
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#11
Quote by sstony
Eat and drinks should always be on the house.


key word = SHOULD
#12
Quote by pinguinpanic
We'll be playing a set of about 75 Minutes, of which about 5 covers (2xIron Maiden, 2xIn Flames, 1x Metallica). And the rest are originals.


Sounds like you're a beginner band to me, I'd personally charge AUS$100 for that. In the meantime figure out whether you're a covers band or originals band.

As for the "food and drinks on the house", it's nice to get but don't walk in expecting it. Demands like that can get you a bad rep. So basically discuss it and if they offer, go for it, but don't push for freebies.
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#13
We're an originals band AlanHB, but we like having a couple of covers for now, but they are pretty much just there to beef up the set.

The place already offered us drinks on the house, and I asked the other band that played and they first asked 100 euros, but eventually just got 40, there band was with 4 guys, we are with 5 so I figured 50 euros would be a decent amount to ask.
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#15
Quote by pinguinpanic
We're an originals band AlanHB, but we like having a couple of covers for now, but they are pretty much just there to beef up the set.


Oh really. Consider these situations;

1. A pub says "we want a covers band to entertain guests at our pub, can you play?". You say, "well, we have 5 covers which make up about half our set which goes for a little over an hour. The rest is originals". They say "nah sorry, we want someone who can just play covers for 2-4 hours, we'll get a covers band".

2. A pub says "we want an originals band to show off the local scene, can you play?". You say, "well we have 7 original songs, which make up about half our set which goes a little over an hour. The rest is covers". They say "nah sorry, we want someone who can just play originals for an hour to hour and a half, we'll get an originals band".

So which one are you again?
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#16
Quote by AlanHB
Oh really. Consider these situations;

1. A pub says "we want a covers band to entertain guests at our pub, can you play?". You say, "well, we have 5 covers which make up about half our set which goes for a little over an hour. The rest is originals". They say "nah sorry, we want someone who can just play covers for 2-4 hours, we'll get a covers band".

2. A pub says "we want an originals band to show off the local scene, can you play?". You say, "well we have 7 original songs, which make up about half our set which goes a little over an hour. The rest is covers". They say "nah sorry, we want someone who can just play originals for an hour to hour and a half, we'll get an originals band".

So which one are you again?


5 songs would probably average at around 1/3-4th of the set at 75 minutes, and those covers can be replaced later. It's just a gig that they can play with their current situation and this current setlist and it can be adjusted later according to the venues.

What kind of band they are at the moment isn't the issue at the moment. They just need information on how much they can ask for at the moment. If the band was having an identity crisis, they wouldn't be getting approached with any paying gigs, I'm guessing. If he comes back in a month saying 'Well, Alan was right', then unload all your advice on him, but it's really not necessary right now.

Original bands without a huge local following tend to do well with occasional covers thrown in anyway because people are more likely to recognize the covers and stay for the originals.
modes are a social construct
#17
Quote by Hail
5 songs would probably average at around 1/3-4th of the set at 75 minutes, and those covers can be replaced later. It's just a gig that they can play with their current situation and this current setlist and it can be adjusted later according to the venues.


5 of 12? Back to school for you

Quote by Hail
What kind of band they are at the moment isn't the issue at the moment. They just need information on how much they can ask for at the moment. If the band was having an identity crisis, they wouldn't be getting approached with any paying gigs, I'm guessing. If he comes back in a month saying 'Well, Alan was right', then unload all your advice on him, but it's really not necessary right now.

Original bands without a huge local following tend to do well with occasional covers thrown in anyway because people are more likely to recognize the covers and stay for the originals.


I do agree that for this gig it may be ok, because it sounds like there's a bunch of beginner bands. However if you want reasonable pay and regular gigs, it's mandatory that you identify what sort of product you're creating. Are you creating a butter knife or a cutting knife? Or something that does neither thing satisfactorily? That's great that 50 euros is getting to the band...that might even cover the petrol.

As for considering whether this is an issue "right now", I'll argue that it's an issue from before the band even has their first practice. For some reason this gets a lot of users throwing up their arms and saying "no...that's not right! original bands play covers too!". Well yes they do. But does half their set consist of covers? A quarter? More than 2?

I'm just going to assume that these "original bands play covers too" objection comes from the fact that those users are currently in bands which play half/half, and don't want to be told they're going nowhere. Recently I asked users to call pubs and offer them a band which plays half covers and half originals, nobody posted their replies if they tried.
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#18
Quote by AlanHB
5 of 12? Back to school for you

Just estimating 5 minutes per song, 5 out of 15 would be closer because it's over an hour, but the shorter their original songs are, the lower the fraction of covers, and we don't have exact information on the number of songs so it was a rough guesstimation, just like 12 was for you. I didn't base it off of your calculations because that would stretch to over 6 minutes on average per song, and I doubt they're a neoclassically influenced atmospheric prog metal band or a roots jam band or something of that nature. Hell, 4 minutes/song sounds reasonable, as well. That would be 5/18.


I do agree that for this gig it may be ok, because it sounds like there's a bunch of beginner bands. However if you want reasonable pay and regular gigs, it's mandatory that you identify what sort of product you're creating. Are you creating a butter knife or a cutting knife? Or something that does neither thing satisfactorily? That's great that 50 euros is getting to the band...that might even cover the petrol.

As for considering whether this is an issue "right now", I'll argue that it's an issue from before the band even has their first practice. For some reason this gets a lot of users throwing up their arms and saying "no...that's not right! original bands play covers too!". Well yes they do. But does half their set consist of covers? A quarter? More than 2?

I'm just going to assume that these "original bands play covers too" objection comes from the fact that those users are currently in bands which play half/half, and don't want to be told they're going nowhere. Recently I asked users to call pubs and offer them a band which plays half covers and half originals, nobody posted their replies if they tried.


I really don't know anybody that actually plays half-and-half and tries to get gigs with that, but most starting out local bands don't get 75 minute slots either. If they were to be playing a regular 35-60 minute slot, they'd probably get off with at most 3 covers. It's a process of starting out to mess with cover songs, especially if you haven't been with many bands in the past. They're not gonna get a record deal having a small handful of covers as a part of their set unless they're damn good covers, but they're still a small band trying to get some support, so a couple of covers shouldn't be a big deal, especially since it really doesn't seem like they're half-and-halfing it from earlier rough calculations.

It's not like the world will fall apart if they haven't replaced all their covers yet, and it seems common sense that they'd start taking out more and more covers as their originals gained recognition/are adjusted or they begin to write more to pick and choose from.
modes are a social construct
#19
Quote by Hail
Just estimating 5 minutes per song, 5 out of 15 would be closer because it's over an hour, but the shorter their original songs are....


Point taken, we're probably going off a guesstimate from the TS in relation to the length of the set too (75 mins...is this timed?).

Quote by hail
I really don't know anybody that actually plays half-and-half and tries to get gigs with that, but most starting out local bands don't get 75 minute slots either. If they were to be playing a regular 35-60 minute slot, they'd probably get off with at most 3 covers. It's a process of starting out to mess with cover songs, especially if you haven't been with many bands in the past. They're not gonna get a record deal having a small handful of covers as a part of their set unless they're damn good covers, but they're still a small band trying to get some support, so a couple of covers shouldn't be a big deal, especially since it really doesn't seem like they're half-and-halfing it from earlier rough calculations.


It's quite easy to score some random slots here and there, but it's a different thing to get regular work from the same venue again. Fundraisers and rallies are good examples of the one-off random no demo required gig.

So in your opinion, when is a good time to identify what sort of band you are, if not at the beginning?

It's not like the world will fall apart if they haven't replaced all their covers yet, and it seems common sense that they'd start taking out more and more covers as their originals gained recognition/are adjusted or they begin to write more to pick and choose from.
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#20
AlanHB, thanks for your concerns and thought. We are a original band, but we haven't gotten enough material to play a set of only covers, and we feel that at most shows it's simply necessary for us to crack out a cover to make things work. We are trying to get rid of them though, if we get offered shorter slots we play our originals over our covers, but we're just starting out with gigging and the scene isn't that great, or well we're still pretty much searching where the scene is, and for these local pubs it's usually a great way to get the people listening by playing The Trooper, but yes you're right, it's not going to get us a record deal.

Some of the regular fans are getting too know our songs though so I hope we can stop playing covers soon. We're also working on a concept album which we might self-release so we'll hopefully get some gig-worthy stuff on there :P.

Furthermore, I'd wanted to let the forum know that our band is doing fine. I always see these threads complaining about members, complaining about gigs, complaining about this, complaining about that, so I thought for a change I might say:
My band is doing fine, we're 5 friends that get along well, everybody shows up for practice, we can all write songs together in a well-organized way and everybody leaves room for each other's opinion. Furthermore we've finally gotten the hang of how not to be awkward when we're on the stage so we're having lots of fun with gigging as well as we have with practising. And that is what it's all about for us, we're just playing to all do what we love, which is creating music. I'd like to say to everyone who plays in a coverband: Start writing originals, because nothing in music, and pretty much in life in general is more fun then seeing people enjoy the music you created.
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#21
Something I noticed in an advert for a gig recently (one organised by a promotions agency that handles a dozen bands or more and puts on about two shows a week) is that they mentioned a specific cover one of the bands does as a selling point. The specific wording was something like "X band, a female-fronted rock group with strong harmonies and a great sound...and check out their cover of Queen's Somebody To Love!" If you can do a particular cover *really well*, it can become a reason to see you specifically.
#22
Quote by Samzawadi
Something I noticed in an advert for a gig recently (one organised by a promotions agency that handles a dozen bands or more and puts on about two shows a week) is that they mentioned a specific cover one of the bands does as a selling point. The specific wording was something like "X band, a female-fronted rock group with strong harmonies and a great sound...and check out their cover of Queen's Somebody To Love!" If you can do a particular cover *really well*, it can become a reason to see you specifically.


Ok, now look at the company closely....were most of the bands listed cover bands? It's usually pretty hard for an originals band to get picked up by a promotions agency as most people who contact an agency want a cover band. If they had an originals band in mind, they'd just contact the originals band directly.

The reason I ask this is because it sounds like an ad for a cover band.
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#23


Ok, now look at the company closely....were most of the bands listed cover bands? It's usually pretty hard for an originals band to get picked up by a promotions agency as most people who contact an agency want a cover band. If they had an originals band in mind, they'd just contact the originals band directly.


No, all originals bands. I might have misspoke when I said 'promotions agency' - the company runs several band nights at different venues, decides who plays there, advertises those nights, and plays a part in selecting bands for other events in which it is involved, mini-festivals and such.