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#1
Hello all,

Every time I watch a video of a band playing at a big festival (Reading, leeds, Glastonburry that kind of stuff) they play on amps such as Fender Hot Rod Deville 60W.

I always heared that when the amp is miced high volume is not recommended, and that it's better to set the amp to a low volume so that the "sound guy" can handle the sound better.

Why don't they play with smaller amps such as Blues Jr (15w) for example ?

Thanks!
#2
A lot of the time, it's just for show. They might have an endorsement deal with a company. I've seen a people play with 6+ Marshall stacks on stage, but their ears would probably explode from all of that. They usually have another amp back behind everything mic'ed up. Plus, how lame would it be to see someone playing a small 12" combo at a big show?
#3
"High" volume? No. "Stage" volume? Yes. You get the band to push their respective gear to their comfort tone point, THEN you mic that up. And in festival situations, with all that space overhead, stage volume is probably louder than in smaller venues.

I mean, yeah, you can have smaller amps, but what if you like your bigger one better? Shrug.

Edit: And yeah, when you see stack walls, that's usually just for show. Maybe in the old days where sound reinforcement was in infancy they'd need all that. But not now. I actually talked to the main sound guy from Woodstock at a conference a few years back, and his description of the stuff they invented/figured out just to make Woodstock work in the first place was fascinating. One of which were extensive stage monitors. Hardly ever tried before then, go figure.

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Last edited by BaffAttack at Apr 22, 2011,
#4
Quote by Zalu
A lot of the time, it's just for show. They might have an endorsement deal with a company. I've seen a people play with 6+ Marshall stacks on stage, but their ears would probably explode from all of that. They usually have another amp back behind everything mic'ed up. Plus, how lame would it be to see someone playing a small 12" combo at a big show?

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#5
Quote by Zoot Allures
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See: my post above yours.

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#8
a 60 watt amp isn't a lot
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#9
Im' not talking about big walls of amps. I'm talking abuot big Hot Rod's I see on stage, the kind of amp if you set it to 4 your ears explode...

So I guess it's just because a Blues Jr would look lame !
#10
Quote by greeny23





i was aware that big bands used "empty" cabs just for show but that is just hilarious.
lmao
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#11
well you have to get the stage volume right before you bring the PA into the equation really. otherwise, if you have a really quiet amp, like a fender champ, the microphone is gonna need a lot of gain which is going to increase the amount of noise, feedback, and other instruments bleeding through. also, when you've got a large stage with PA speakers either side projecting outwards, if you don't have enough on-stage volume from your amp nobody at the front will hear you.

so that's why at festivals people have higher wattage amplifiers and still mic them up.
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#12
Quote by alans056
Im' not talking about big walls of amps. I'm talking abuot big Hot Rod's I see on stage, the kind of amp if you set it to 4 your ears explode...

So I guess it's just because a Blues Jr would look lame !


Ya, because a Blues Jr sounds exactly the same as a Twin, JCM800, Bogner, etc.
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#13
You didn't understand. I'm talking a bout bands who play on Hot Rod Deville. The Blues Jr is the same thing exept not as loud, so I was wondering why would a band take a Deville instead of a Jr.

But I agree with the argument that it would look lame.
#14
Quote by mmolteratx
Ya, because a Blues Jr sounds exactly the same as a Twin, JCM800, Bogner, etc.

that's another thing. the blues junior has a single 10" speaker doesn't it?

you see, a 4x12 sounds different to a 1x10 - people might want a 4x12 for the sound, not because it makes their penis feel bigger
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Elixir Nanoweb 11-49 strings, Dunlop Jazz III XL picks
Shure SM57 mic in front of the amp
#15
Oh I see. I didn't know that the sound changes with the number of speakers.

Does it really make a significant difference ?
#16
Quote by alans056
Oh I see. I didn't know that the sound changes with the number of speakers.

Does it really make a significant difference ?


Usually. Pushes more air, usually makes it sound fuller at the least.

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#17
blues deville is like what 6l6 tubes where jr has like el84 big difference.
#19
Quote by alans056
You didn't understand. I'm talking a bout bands who play on Hot Rod Deville. The Blues Jr is the same thing exept not as loud, so I was wondering why would a band take a Deville instead of a Jr.

But I agree with the argument that it would look lame.


The Blues Jr is in no way the same as a HRD. They are completely different amps in every single way.
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#20
Quote by alans056
Im' not talking about big walls of amps. I'm talking abuot big Hot Rod's I see on stage, the kind of amp if you set it to 4 your ears explode...
So I guess it's just because a Blues Jr would look lame !

I never understand this kind of talk, i can have my amp all the way up and my ears don't 'explode'... I wanna know how many people here have played in a band and actually experienced the loudness of a loud drummer for instance.

Obviously practices require earplugs to prevent tinnitus but i can play loudly on my own and it's not unbearable by any means.
#21
Quote by Zoot Allures
Obviously practices require earplugs to prevent tinnitus but i can play loudly on my own and it's not unbearable by any means.



lol you need earplugs for when you pracitice by your self why would you want to be that loud if it's just you (not making fun of you it's just funny to me)
when I'm with my buddys and shit sure the amp gets turned up and the plugs go in but I don't think I've ever just been ****ing around in my room and then thought ' lets crank this bitch to 10'
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#22
Quote by alans056
Oh I see. I didn't know that the sound changes with the number of speakers.

Does it really make a significant difference ?


Yup.

Different amps also sound different.

Hell, I use big amps at very small venues. They come equipped with a volume knob for a reason.
#23
Quote by OliOsbourne
a 60 watt amp isn't a lot

Wrong. It's only slightly quieter than a 120w amp. It just has less headroom.
Quote by Shayne777
lol you need earplugs for when you pracitice by your self why would you want to be that loud if it's just you (not making fun of you it's just funny to me)
when I'm with my buddys and shit sure the amp gets turned up and the plugs go in but I don't think I've ever just been ****ing around in my room and then thought ' lets crank this bitch to 10'

Most amps sound better the louder you crank 'em
Quote by alans056
Oh I see. I didn't know that the sound changes with the number of speakers.

Does it really make a significant difference ?

The more speakers you have, the more air there is being moved. That said, the volume increases around 3db with every speaker, which isn't much.
Last edited by darkwolf291 at Apr 22, 2011,
#24
Quote by Shayne777
lol you need earplugs for when you pracitice by your self why would you want to be that loud if it's just you (not making fun of you it's just funny to me)
when I'm with my buddys and shit sure the amp gets turned up and the plugs go in but I don't think I've ever just been ****ing around in my room and then thought ' lets crank this bitch to 10'


Cranking an amp is like driving a car really fast. You might not be a professional but it's fun as hell.

I dunno about you but on days when no one's home I really do like to get the volume up there and then just strike an open chord and let it ring until it feeds back. Feels good.
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#25
I usually use musician ear plugs when I have my Peavey 5150 above 2 when I'm just playing alone.

But I discovered a better, totally less economical way to prevent myself from hearing loss -- A wireless system. Now I can turn my amp up to 4 and make others' ears bleed at my own pleasure!
#26
wait who uses a hot rod deville at a festival
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#27
Quote by darkwolf291
Wrong. It's only slightly quieter than a 120w amp. It just has less headroom.

But compared to a 300 watt...
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#28
Quote by mmolteratx
The Blues Jr is in no way the same as a HRD. They are completely different amps in every single way.


Hmm no. They are the same amp exept the Blues Jr is 15w so quieter. They are the same family of amps, Jr, Deluxe and Deville.


Quote by AcousticMirror
wait who uses a hot rod deville at a festival


A lot of bands. The Strokes, Franz Ferdinand...
Last edited by alans056 at Apr 23, 2011,
#29
Quote by alans056
Hmm no. They are the same amp exept the Blues Jr is 15w so quieter. They are the same family of amps, Jr, Deluxe and Deville.

Well i trust matts word, so...
#30
well good for you, but I know they are the same. I know a ton of youtube reviews and forums that could testify.
#31
Quote by alans056
Hmm no. They are the same amp exept the Blues Jr is 15w so quieter. They are the same family of amps, Jr, Deluxe and Deville.

that's kind of like saying "the marshall MG and the marshall JCM800 are the same thing, they are the same brand, lol".
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Elixir Nanoweb 11-49 strings, Dunlop Jazz III XL picks
Shure SM57 mic in front of the amp
#32
Quote by alans056
well good for you, but I know they are the same. I know a ton of youtube reviews and forums that could testify.


Yeah, not to sound like everyone's ganging up on you, but they're different beasts all together.
Just because they're under the same marketing line or whatever, it doesn't make them similar.

That's like saying that the Fender Highway One Tele is the same as the Highway One Strat just with different amounts of wood.

Just because they're marketed together, doesn't mean they have to be similar.

And people like the Strokes use HRD because they like 'em!
There is definitely a different sound from a higher watt amp being cranked and a lower one.
For one, the Blues Jr doesn't have any real headroom at that size at all! (like home pracctice and maybe if you miced it at like a coffee shop gig or something you probably would), so you won't get a nice cranked tone without it breaking up too much.

But with a higher watt amp like the HRD you can crank it, get "that" cranked tone, while still having some cleanliness and clarity.
#34
Because small amps sound small and that might not be what they're going for.

You won't get the same sonic footprint out of a 5W or even 30W amp as you will out of a 100W, even if the tonestacks are the same.
Everyone is entitled to an opinion.

Feel free to express yours so I can make an informed judgement about how stupid you are.
#35
Quote by alans056
Hmm no. They are the same amp exept the Blues Jr is 15w so quieter. They are the same family of amps, Jr, Deluxe and Deville.


A lot of bands. The Strokes, Franz Ferdinand...


Being in the same family =/= Same amps.

You wouldn't use a small amp if it didn't give you the tone you wanted, simple as that. The only time you'll ever really see >/=15W amps being used are small local bands, backing bands for acoustic players or as a thickening up for a different.

IIRC, Josh Homme and Joe Perry both use small amps running balls to the wall to help achieve their tones.

Only time I've seen a blues Jr on stage is with Josh Radin's band in a tiny little bar.
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#36
Quote by icronic
Yup.

Different amps also sound different.

Hell, I use big amps at very small venues. They come equipped with a volume knob for a reason.


Exactly.
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#38
Quote by alans056
well good for you, but I know they are the same. I know a ton of youtube reviews and forums that could testify.


great and i have all the schematics that show they umm aren't?
Jumping on dat gear sig train.
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#39
A Hot Rod Deville is by no means a big amp when it comes to festivals. The stages there are so big that it's the one place where a Half Stack WOULDN'T be overkill even if it was miked up.
With all the crowd noise coupled with the volume of a live band, the sound from any amp is going to get completely lost on stage. So a guitarist can turn up pretty loud without bleeding into mics or making the sound guy's job more difficult. I mean guys at Guitarcenter turn Hot Rods up to about 4 and they're not shaking walls or anything, so imagine how loud you'd have to be if the mic on your amp is competing with thousands of screaming fans and the amps of 3 or 4 band members, as well as the blasting stage monitors.

In the end it's all a matter of the sound they're after. If a guitarist needs to turn a 100 watt half stack up to 7 to get his tone, then he can do it because the stages there are so huge the sound almost gets lost anyway. (and I have experience playing in venues of many different sizes, so this is not all speculation)
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