#1
i have some questions!!!

first of all, is it ok for me to use a mixolydian scale as a riff on a song written in ionian?(major)

2nd.....does the circle of fifths apply to an "8" note scale?( diminished)

3rd, is there a different harmonized chord scale proggression for each different scale, and yes i am refering to every single scale that exists.....

anyone have any tips on how to get away from 4/4 i think im programmed.....

and somebody please make me uderstand what chords go well with each other while playing rythm im trying to hammer the circle of fifths/forths into my head and its just not working!!!!!

and finally, when is it ok to use augmented chords?

im sure most you will agree that most this just ends up being preference, whether or not it sounds good or not i know. but im always open to a new perspective. and ironicly the new perspective to me is structure, and not just letting my fingers take a shit on my fretboard.
#2
If you're playing in a major key, you're not going to be using the mixolydian mode. Modes aren't just scale positions. They require specific harmonic framework, otherwise you're just going to end up playing in a major/minor key. Simple rule of thumb: if a song is in a given key, you're going to solo in that key. You can add notes outside of that key, but that doesn't mean you're playing in a different mode.

The circle of fifths is used to assign key signatures. I suggest you read up on it a bit more.

Not sure what your third question is asking. C major is harmonized differently than G major or C minor. However, A minor is harmonized the same way as C major because they have the same key signature.

To get away from 4/4, practice, practice, practice. Count in your head, tap your foot, use a metronome. Do whatever you need to do. There's no easy way to get out of it. Try simpler time signatures first, like 3/4, then move on to 5/4 or 7/8.

The circle of fifths isn't used to make chords. Like I said, it's used to assign key signatures. Memorization is the key. To understand what chords go well together, you're going to need to understand the major scale and how to harmonize it in each key. It takes time and practice.

You can use augmented chords whenever you'd like. If it's the sounds you're going for, use it. Theory is just a set of guidelines.

I recommend you learn the major scale, and REALLY learn it. Learn how to harmonize it in triads, then extend to 7ths, 9ths, etc. Learn, listen, and understand what each scale degree sounds like and what effect it can have, even notes that aren't in that key. I think you should bag modes for now until you REALLY understand the major scale. Modes are pretty limited, actually. The major scale is much less so, and can be used effectively in most situations.
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#4
Quote by jDrHobbs
first of all, is it ok for me to use a mixolydian scale as a riff on a song written in ionian?(major)

First of all, stop calling the major scale "Ionian" just because it sounds pro. It's the major scale. No modes involved. (Sorry if I sound a bit elitist...)
That guy Jimmy_Page_Zep put it well. Modes aren't scale positions. What you're asking is "Can I use a flat seventh in a song that's in the major scale?". The answer is yes, you can borrow any note you want, as long as it sounds good to you

Quote by jDrHobbs
2nd.....does the circle of fifths apply to an "8" note scale?( diminished)

No, I don't think so.

Quote by jDrHobbs

3rd, is there a different harmonized chord scale proggression for each different scale, and yes i am refering to every single scale that exists.....

Yes, if the scales are different, the chords built off of them will be different. Except if the notes in the scales are the same.
And that's not the right use of the word "progression". A progression is the sequence of chords used in a specific piece of music, if you get me.

Quote by jDrHobbs
anyone have any tips on how to get away from 4/4 i think im programmed.....

Listen to songs in other time signatures. You'll get more used to them.

Quote by jDrHobbs
and somebody please make me uderstand what chords go well with each other while playing rythm im trying to hammer the circle of fifths/forths into my head and its just not working!!!!!

Look into harmonised scales, namely the major and minor (which I suppose you have, but you didn't really get it) and cadences.

Quote by jDrHobbs

and finally, when is it ok to use augmented chords?

I usually use them to lead to the chord a fourth above. As in Vaug - I. (Actually, I wrote something about an hour ago that uses G - Gaug - C).
#5
Have you considered getting a private guitar teacher? You asked a slew of seemingly random questions, without the sense that you have your background knowledge required. Can you tell me a little bit about what you do know and understand, what you want to know and understand and how you've learned whatever you do know, up to this present day.

Sean
#6
Quote by jDrHobbs
i have some questions!!!

first of all, is it ok for me to use a mixolydian scale as a riff on a song written in ionian?(major)

2nd.....does the circle of fifths apply to an "8" note scale?( diminished)

3rd, is there a different harmonized chord scale proggression for each different scale, and yes i am refering to every single scale that exists.....

anyone have any tips on how to get away from 4/4 i think im programmed.....

and somebody please make me uderstand what chords go well with each other while playing rythm im trying to hammer the circle of fifths/forths into my head and its just not working!!!!!

and finally, when is it ok to use augmented chords?

im sure most you will agree that most this just ends up being preference, whether or not it sounds good or not i know. but im always open to a new perspective. and ironicly the new perspective to me is structure, and not just letting my fingers take a shit on my fretboard.


1) you don't understand modes. drop them and don't come back to them until you know tonal theory as though it were your first name.

2) no. it applies to diatonic scales.

3) i really have no idea what that question is asking. but yes, no two scales have the same chords (even in relative keys, where the function of the same chord is different).

4) LISTEN to music not in 4/4. your best bet is classical music or jazz music, but that's not to say there's nothing in 6/8 in rock or some other genre.

5) study tonal theory. we can't hammer anything into your head. we can't do anything for you except lead you in the right path. ultimately, YOU have to do all the work.

6) use augmented chords whenever you want.

if you really want to master this stuff, expect to take the next two years or so studying and applying theory before you even get a decent command of it. but it'll pay off if these are the skills you want.
Anfangen ist leicht, Beharren eine Kunst.
#7
well you guys certainly answered some of my questions.

im gonna call it ionion just because i like to bother people like you....


Quote by Sean0913
Have you considered getting a private guitar teacher? You asked a slew of seemingly random questions, without the sense that you have your background knowledge required. Can you tell me a little bit about what you do know and understand, what you want to know and understand and how you've learned whatever you do know, up to this present day.

Sean



yes ive considered seeing a private teacher...no i havent followed through with it,
ive been playing for nearly 9 whole years and i have been playing by myself only for basiclly the entire time, i have never been in a band. im basiclly a product of the internet, i havent learned that many songs do to my severe adhd(diagnosed in 3rd grade and took ritilin) so its tough for me to create structre. probably the reason why i have "asked a slew of random questions" as well.
i have an eradict and wide array of influences anywhere from singer songrwriter americana music, pop music to crazy weird metal like dillinger escape plan. even dub step
i basiclly learned to run before i could crawl so to speak, attempting to play arpegios sweeps and playing as fast as i could just trying to be impressive. i realised recently that i was quickly drowning in a pool of bad habits and my timeing was HORRIBLE...

so recently i finally found a drummer to play with and the first day we played together i blew it. hard, it was an eye opener and it knocked me off of my pedastol, i realised that i needed to actually rwrite some music and face my arch nemesis...structure.
so i bought an "M-audio fast track" and it came with a copy of pro tools se and let me tell ya it was very hard for me to sit down and record a 3 minute rythm track with just chords..it took me like 6 hours due to the fact i was just used to playing scales and making random shit up. but i overcame.

so in a nutshell thats it ...i have plenty of ideas and its just a matter of putting them down and making something out of nothing.

thats why ive decided to learn about the fifths and theory. beacuse i want to write some good music rather than just be impressive.
also the reason ive decided to learn about modes and scales more is because i decided to take of my little riffs and jams and find out what they actually are, so far im all over the place...im a mess. a decent sounding mess but none the less, a mess.


sorry about typos im jacked up on coffee
#8
Well given your challenges and learning disabilities, I feel for you. I have taught hundreds, even someone that was completely blind, but I have never had success teaching someone that had their ADHD unchecked. (Many of my students, have had ADHD but if they maintained it with their meds, they tended to do very well)

I like your decision, to try and mature as a musician. Normally I might have suggested, that you might look into studying with us online, but given your lack of control and structure, I honestly, don't know that it would be wise in this instance. I run a very structured program, and it does take self-discipline. I wouldn't want you to waste your time (or mine).

Since the only way that is left, by default, to learn is random and erratic, most of us will try to help answer your questions, such as they make sense in your scattered way of assembling things. I know it can be tough with unchecked ADHD, but I respect you for even trying.

Best,

Sean

Quote by jDrHobbs


yes ive considered seeing a private teacher...no i havent followed through with it,
ive been playing for nearly 9 whole years and i have been playing by myself only for basiclly the entire time, i have never been in a band. im basiclly a product of the internet, i havent learned that many songs do to my severe adhd(diagnosed in 3rd grade and took ritilin) so its tough for me to create structre. probably the reason why i have "asked a slew of random questions" as well.
i have an eradict and wide array of influences anywhere from singer songrwriter americana music, pop music to crazy weird metal like dillinger escape plan. even dub step
i basiclly learned to run before i could crawl so to speak, attempting to play arpegios sweeps and playing as fast as i could just trying to be impressive. i realised recently that i was quickly drowning in a pool of bad habits and my timeing was HORRIBLE...

so recently i finally found a drummer to play with and the first day we played together i blew it. hard, it was an eye opener and it knocked me off of my pedastol, i realised that i needed to actually rwrite some music and face my arch nemesis...structure.
so i bought an "M-audio fast track" and it came with a copy of pro tools se and let me tell ya it was very hard for me to sit down and record a 3 minute rythm track with just chords..it took me like 6 hours due to the fact i was just used to playing scales and making random shit up. but i overcame.

so in a nutshell thats it ...i have plenty of ideas and its just a matter of putting them down and making something out of nothing.

thats why ive decided to learn about the fifths and theory. beacuse i want to write some good music rather than just be impressive.
also the reason ive decided to learn about modes and scales more is because i decided to take of my little riffs and jams and find out what they actually are, so far im all over the place...im a mess. a decent sounding mess but none the less, a mess.


sorry about typos im jacked up on coffee
#9
Quote by jDrHobbs
im gonna call it ionion just because i like to bother people like you....
It's not that it bothers people, it's just that it makes you come across as, quite frankly, an idiot.
Only play what you hear. If you don’t hear anything, don’t play anything.
-Chick Corea
#10
so youve helped 100s of students but you dont think you can help. i can assure you i wouldnt be your most hopeless. i already feel very confident in my ability to play. im more or less just trying to retrain so that i can understand what playing.i also feel that i am a very disciplined person. i live life out of a suit casedue to the fact that my job requires me to fly weekly . i stay healthy,and excerise, i pay all my bills on time blah blah blah so on and so forth
i seems as though i have been misunderstood on this forum.

and i was only joking bothering people. .............ionian
#11
Last edited by jDrHobbs at Apr 23, 2011,
#12
Quote by jDrHobbs


Great, it sounds like you've got it all figured out then. I wasn't trying to offend you, I was just saying if it's unchecked then I can't teach someone. As I understood your post and reasoning to be, you sounded like you are all over the place and can't follow structure very long, that's what I was basing my comments by. If that were true of a student that came to me, I can't teach someone that can't learn from a structured format.

So, it's clear I misunderstood your words/explanation, but I wasn't trying to offend you, belittle you, or make you feel like an idiot. If you had the ability to receive instruction, and accept and follow structure, then I definitely could help someone like you.

Course I think it would be important to understand what your needs/goals were and then address what if any ways we could help.

But by the sounds of it, between these sites above and free YouTube's, you seem to have everything you feel you need, to keep on rolling, and that it's working out great for you!

Best,

Sean
Last edited by Sean0913 at Apr 23, 2011,