#2
i never seen a rest dotted. I would put an eighth rest in place of the dot.
I play guitar.
#3
What I would do is put the eighth rest directly following the eighth note and have the measure ending with the quarter rest
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#4
Quote by British Josh
What I would do is put the eighth rest directly following the eighth note and have the measure ending with the quarter rest


better would be (for measure 5 and 8)

eighth note - eighth rest - quarter rest - half rest

quaver - quaver rest - crotchet rest - minim rest

whichever terminology you prefer.

for measure 6, do what british josh said.
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Last edited by AeolianWolf at May 8, 2011,
#5
I just found this forum post online:

Quote by some guy
In 2/4, 3/4 and 4/4 meter, one never dots rests.

In 6/8 there is some variation as to how it is done. There are many, many scores where in 6/8 meter the dotted quarter rest is replaced by a quarter rest and eighth rest. But this is not universal. I have a Dover score of a Tchaikovski piece where in 6/8 there are many, many dotted quarter rests. A recent notation textbook mentions that dividing the rest into a quarter rest and an 8th rest is unnecessary and the dotted quarter rest is perfectly fine.

Yet, I find that a lot of well done modern scores still use a quarter rest and 8th rest in 6/8 meter.

Now in 9/8 meter and 12/8 meter the dotted quarter rest is considered by almost all references to be perfectly fine. So go figure.

What is somewhat more difficult to find a consensus is when the pick up is a note in 6/8 meter:

Most scores will use a quarter rest followed by an 8th note in 6/8 meter, regardless of whether it is the first beat or the second beat. Some scores will place two 8th rests followed by an 8th note for the first beat but will use a quarter rest followed by an 8th rest for the second beat. And what if the pick up is two 16th notes? Some scores will use to 8th rest preceding this and some will use a quarter rest.

And in some scores there is no consistency from page to page. In the old Kalmus (or similar publisher) score of Dvorak's 7th symphony, movement one (in 6/8 meter) that is written by hand in ink, there is an early measure where there are two 8th rests followed by two 16th notes in one staff and there is a quarter rest followed by two 16th notes directly below it. The calligrapher could not make up his/her mind.

I'm trying to avoid dotted quarter rests in 6/8 meter, but it would not be proper for me to claim that it is wrong. But most scores divide the dotted quarter rest into a quarter rest and 8th rest. And I am more accustomed to seeing it as two rests.

David
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#6
I think you have to seperate the rests according to the beats.
For instance, for the first measure, it would be : eighth note - eighth rest - quarter rest - half rest (or two others quarter rests) ... Just make sure that for a 4/4 signature your measure is either uniform (like the third rest) or divided in two parts which are either uniform, or divided in two parts etc...
Last edited by Etidlover at May 8, 2011,
#9
Quote by demon.guitarist
Is this the correct way to present the rests? Should they be dotted crotchets or left as crotchet and quaver rests?

Just need to double check as the examiners are really anal about scores.

Thanks!!


What I would do is make them quarter notes. if you want them short, put a staccato mark above them. Easier to write, easier to read.... same musical result.
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#10
What I would do is put the eighth rest directly following the eighth note and have the measure ending with the quarter rest


^^
#11
crochet is british for eighth note right?
but your notation is all wrong. basically (for ease of reading), you should be able to draw a line in the middle of a measure, and you should avoid anything crossing this imaginary line (invisible bar line--theres times its impossible--like a quarter, half note quarter note figure--but when possible it should always be adheared to). you should have an eighth note, followed by an eighth and then quarter rest, after that either a half note rest or 2 quarter note rests (measures 5 and 8). measure 6 is kosher, though it would be easier to read if it went eighth note, eighth rest quarter rest on beats 3 and 4. generally, you want to write your measures in a way that each beat is clear and seperated from the others (obviously, don't let this convention effect the music you write--but when you write something that can be notated multiple ways, try to make it clearer if you want it performed well).
edit:
as far as "never dot quarter notes in 4/4, 3/4 or 2/4". i don't know if its technically wrong to do so (ive seen it plenty of times), as long as your following the invisible barline convention--but I'd tend to avoid doing so, if only to make the music easier to sightread. (as your goal when writing music is to see it performed, accurately and well).
all the best.
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Last edited by tehREALcaptain at May 8, 2011,
#12
Quote by British Josh
What I would do is put the eighth rest directly following the eighth note and have the measure ending with the quarter rest

^^ It makes a lot more sense to see how each beat is divided up as its being divided...if that makes sense.
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#13
Try actually reading something like that. I bet you can't. You know why? There is absolutely no sense of metric division to help you keep track of where you are in the beats. You need to separate the rhythmic notation so that it clearly delineates where 1, 2, 3, and 4 is.



Your teachers should absolutely be anal about proper score presentation. If you're a serious musician at all you should be anal about it.

...modes and scales are still useless.


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#14
as people have said, you need to be able to draw a line down the middle that doesn't hit anything. basically any rests you have should still follow the exact same subdivisions that notes in the bar would follow.

edit: i'm not sure about dotted rests, they don't appear much in older scores but i know a lot of people who use them now for ease of notation.
Last edited by gavk at May 8, 2011,
#15
Quote by AeolianWolf
better would be (for measure 5 and 8)

eighth note - eighth rest - quarter rest - half rest

quaver - quaver rest - crotchet rest - minim rest

whichever terminology you prefer.

for measure 6, do what british josh said.
Bam, this.
Only play what you hear. If you don’t hear anything, don’t play anything.
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#16
^ how often do you guys come across music where you play an 8th note on the downbeat, but an 8th rest on the upbeat?
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#17
Quote by GuitarMunky
^ how often do you guys come across music where you play an 8th note on the downbeat, but an 8th rest on the upbeat?
A lot more often than an eighth note followed by a half res.

Seriously though, it's pretty common in my experience.
Only play what you hear. If you don’t hear anything, don’t play anything.
-Chick Corea
#18
Quote by GuitarMunky
^ how often do you guys come across music where you play an 8th note on the downbeat, but an 8th rest on the upbeat?


This is a valid point. If the eighth notes are isolated like this, then I would tend to agree and write it as a quarter note to simplify the look of the notation, although I would be more inclined if it was a smaller value, like writing a 16th as an eighth. If they were part of more rhythmic values, then I would write it as eighth, eighth rest.
#19
This is a valid point. If the eighth notes are isolated like this, then I would tend to agree and write it as a quarter note to simplify the look of the notation, although I would be more inclined if it was a smaller value, like writing a 16th as an eighth. If they were part of more rhythmic values, then I would write it as eighth, eighth rest.


i think it depends. if you want the note sustained to the off beat, then a quarter note makes more sense--if not an eighth note and eighth rest (or a quarter note with a staccato sometimes i guess) makes more sense.
munky,
i see them fairly often.
all the best.
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#20
Quote by tehREALcaptain
i think it depends. if you want the note sustained to the off beat, then a quarter note makes more sense--if not an eighth note and eighth rest (or a quarter note with a staccato sometimes i guess) makes more sense.
munky,
i see them fairly often.
Yeah if you don't want it sustained through to the next beat, you should at least write the quarter note with a staccato. I don't think you should ever put just a straight quarter note just so it looks nicer, when really you don't want its full value.
Only play what you hear. If you don’t hear anything, don’t play anything.
-Chick Corea
#22
I personally would prefer to see an eighth note, just seems more precise to me. I guess it's all about preference.
Only play what you hear. If you don’t hear anything, don’t play anything.
-Chick Corea
#23
Quote by food1010
Seriously though, it's pretty common in my experience.


this.
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#24
crochet is british for eighth note right?
QUOTE]

Crotchet is a whole note.
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#25
Quote by tehREALcaptain
crochet is british for eighth note right?
QUOTE]

Crotchet is a whole note.


Crotchet is a quarter note. BTW what is up with that system? I'd rather have the exact division simply stated and not have to learn a bunch of weird words. I think pretty much everyone has a basic understanding of mathematics, especially ones studying music theory, so 8th, 16th, 32nd, half to me seems much more practical.
#26
Quote by Woffelz


Crotchet is a quarter note. BTW what is up with that system? I'd rather have the exact division simply stated and not have to learn a bunch of weird words. I think pretty much everyone has a basic understanding of mathematics, especially ones studying music theory, so 8th, 16th, 32nd, half to me seems much more practical.


you and me both. but it's good to know, anyway.
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#27
Quote by AeolianWolf

you and me both. but it's good to know, anyway.


Sure, but that's really only because it is used and you will run into it at some point. It has no real musical advantage other than to facilitate communication between people from both schools. But it is good to know anyway you're right.
#28
Quote by food1010
A lot more often than an eighth note followed by a half res.

Seriously though, it's pretty common in my experience.


well an 8th note followed by a half rest as shown in the OP is just plain bad notation.

regarding the commonality of the 8th note 8th rest figure....
I have alot of music sitting here in front me. It should be pretty easy to find an instance of this since it's so common.... yet I can't find one.

I can see in an 8th note exercise, or where you're playing against something on the upbeat. Based on the context given I would say that a staccato quarter note is more appropriate.

Would be interested in seeing some non-exercise, but musical examples of where an 8th note followed by an 8th rest is more appropriate than a staccato quarter note. Not saying they don't exist... but if they are common, lets see a few.
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Last edited by GuitarMunky at May 9, 2011,
#29
Order, order!

Oh crap I meant to tell you it was a 1/4! My bad!
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#30
Quote by Woffelz
Order, order!

Oh crap I meant to tell you it was a 1/4! My bad!

LOL
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