#1
Just wondering what's out there in the 30W or less range. I know there's the Orange AD30 but that's about it.
#2
The AD30 is Class A/B, bro.
Everyone is entitled to an opinion.

Feel free to express yours so I can make an informed judgement about how stupid you are.
#4
it's the classic vox ac30 = class A thing. class A/B EL84s, biased really hot closer to Class A. it still has a class B phase, so it is still class A/B. the valves act in Class A range longer than other amps. but it is still class A/B.

class A EL84 would output about 5~6w by itself. four of those in parallel, would only make 20~24w. where did they get 30w from? they lied. it's class A/B.
Call me "Shot".

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#8
Quote by bubb_tubbs
It doesn't matter what it says. It's lying.
I'm pretty sure the AD30 is class A, but the AD50 and AD140 are class A/B.
Quote by MightyAl
I took a pic of myself, cut a hole in the face and stuck my knob through so i could see what I'd look like if I got bitten by a radioactive elephant.
#9
Quote by Ferrets!
I'm pretty sure the AD30 is class A, but the AD50 and AD140 are class A/B.


no they aren't.

they are push/pull class a/b.

4 el84s in push pull class A is like 16 watts.
Prs se Holcomb is the answer
#10
Quote by AcousticMirror
no they aren't.

they are push/pull class a/b.

4 el84s in push pull class A is like 16 watts.
Oh. I just looked into it. You're right. Weird. Apparently the only true class A amp Orange has made was the AD5. Or at least, it's the only single-ended class A amp they've made.
Quote by MightyAl
I took a pic of myself, cut a hole in the face and stuck my knob through so i could see what I'd look like if I got bitten by a radioactive elephant.
#11
Quote by AcousticMirror
no there are.

just not that one. actually not really any guitar amps at all.

Then what's the difference in terms of guitar amps? A Class A and Class A/B amp have different qualities. It's not a matter of which is better either or more expensive. You have an AD30 which costs less than a Rockerverb. Orange specifies which is Class A and Class A/B and they both feel very different. When they say Class A, they must say it because there's something that differentiates it from other Class A/B amps.
#12
Sounds like a candidate for one of Craig's Suckerpunches. It runs a single KT88 instead of EL84's but still, it's a true class A boutique amp.

Do you honestly think that marketing people let the truth get in the way of a good ad? They say it's a Class A amp because they think it gives it some aura of mojo by calling it that. Facts have nothing to do with marketing.
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#13
first, you must understand that class A is NOT "superior" to class A/B just because the "A is better than B" thing.


class A power sections distort in an asymmetrical manner. class A/B power sections distort in a symmetrical manner.

class A power sections do not sag. class A/B power sections sag slightly with valve rectifiers.

class A power sections eat up a lot of power, but cannot output much power. it's weak, inefficient. class A/B power sections eat up as much power, but will output much more power. it's very efficient in how much electrons it can move. this way, class A/B is louder than class A with the same amount of tubes.

class A/B must have power tubes in multiples of 2. class A can have one power tube and still work.
Call me "Shot".

ShotRod Guitar Works

Custom Hand-wired Amplifiers and Effect Pedals.

Est. 2007


Source to everything I say about Guitars, Pedals, and Amplifiers: I make them.


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#14
Quote by Cathbard
Do you honestly think that marketing people let the truth get in the way of a good ad? They say it's a Class A amp because they think it gives it some aura of mojo by calling it that. Facts have nothing to do with marketing.

I don't think it has to do with marketing. Orange's most expensive non-custom shop amps are all Class A/B. The ones they say are Class A are the least expensive ones such as the AD5, Tiny Terrors, Thunder 30, Rocker 30, and AD30. Those are all very different from the larger and more expensive Class A/B amps like the Rockerverbs and Thunderverbs.
#15
Quote by JELIFISH19
I don't think it has to do with marketing. Orange's most expensive non-custom shop amps are all Class A/B. The ones they say are Class A are the least expensive ones such as the AD5, Tiny Terrors, Thunder 30, Rocker 30, and AD30. Those are all very different from the larger and more expensive Class A/B amps like the Rockerverbs and Thunderverbs.

Hey what now? You don't think they'd talk up their cheaper amps? You are looking at an ad and you don't think you are reading marketing bs?
The naivety is strong in you.
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#16
it's not so much marketing douchery on oranges part as much as it is that since the ac15/30 all el84 cathode biased no negative feedback amps are just called class A even though they aren't.
Prs se Holcomb is the answer
#17
Quote by AcousticMirror
it's not so much marketing douchery on oranges part as much as it is that since the ac15/30 all el84 cathode biased no negative feedback amps are just called class A even though they aren't.

You just described an 18W Marshall. Ever seen them advertised as Class A?
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#18
Quote by Cathbard
Hey what now? You don't think they'd talk up their cheaper amps? You are looking at an ad and you don't think you are reading marketing bs?
The naivety is strong in you.

It's not marketing BS because if you want an an AD30 is a completely different beast from a Rockerverb. They don't need to talk up an AD30. The amp speaks for itself. If calling it Class A is talking them up, then is calling a Rockerverb Class A/B talking it down? Orange, in the interest of making the best profit, doesn't want you to think Class A is the best. They want you to buy Rockerverbs and Thunderverbs so they can make more money. If Class A was the best, no one would buy the more expensive amps. And that wouldn't be good for Orange.

Quote by AcousticMirror
it's not so much marketing douchery on oranges part as much as it is that since the ac15/30 all el84 cathode biased no negative feedback amps are just called class A even though they aren't.

That's pretty much what I'm asking. What amps fit the "modern definition" of Class A and have tube rectifiers besides the Vox, Orange, and Matchless?
#19
Quote by Cathbard
You just described an 18W Marshall. Ever seen them advertised as Class A?


no but they did advertise it at 18 watts just to be different.

lol. ya marshall didn't do that.

vox sure did.


That's pretty much what I'm asking. What amps fit the "modern definition" of Class A and have tube rectifiers besides the Vox, Orange, and Matchless?

umm vox, orange, matchless, bad cat, morgan, xits, magic amps, valvetech, dr z...lots more? i dunno.
Prs se Holcomb is the answer
Last edited by AcousticMirror at Jun 9, 2011,
#20
yep, when it's actually 17.9 watts or whatever.
Call me "Shot".

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Est. 2007


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#21
They don't have to throw around bs mojo terms like "class A" to sell a Rockerverb. When something is good you don't have to talk crap about it. It's like I've always said, "when somebody tells you they are good you know that they aren't; if they were they wouldn't have to tell you."
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#22
why does it matter whether the amp is class A or A/B?
Call me Dom
Quote by Dmaj7
I don't know how to count canadians, the metric system is hard

Quote by gregs1020
well if lbj pokes his head in here and there's no nuts shit's gonna go doooooooowwwwwwwwwn.



{Pedalboard Thread Native: The Muffin Man}
#23
because A is before B, and A/B has a little bit of B. A is pure A. so A is better.
Call me "Shot".

ShotRod Guitar Works

Custom Hand-wired Amplifiers and Effect Pedals.

Est. 2007


Source to everything I say about Guitars, Pedals, and Amplifiers: I make them.


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#24
but B is closer to C and L and the more C and L you have the better your Crystal Lettuce sounds
Call me Dom
Quote by Dmaj7
I don't know how to count canadians, the metric system is hard

Quote by gregs1020
well if lbj pokes his head in here and there's no nuts shit's gonna go doooooooowwwwwwwwwn.



{Pedalboard Thread Native: The Muffin Man}
#25
btw UG, when howard dumble mentioned "Crystal Lattice" and "fragile harmonics" he said...


the fragile harmonics are more likely to survive free space vacuum, but they get squashed inside the crystal lattice.


translated in layman terms:
good sound (electrons) can survive vacuum tubes but they are ruined when it goes through transistors.

he meant crystal lattice as in the transistors.

so crystal lattice = bad.
Call me "Shot".

ShotRod Guitar Works

Custom Hand-wired Amplifiers and Effect Pedals.

Est. 2007


Source to everything I say about Guitars, Pedals, and Amplifiers: I make them.


UG's Best DIY PedalBoard
#26
you should delete that and just laugh at the silly people that don't know the actual joke
Call me Dom
Quote by Dmaj7
I don't know how to count canadians, the metric system is hard

Quote by gregs1020
well if lbj pokes his head in here and there's no nuts shit's gonna go doooooooowwwwwwwwwn.



{Pedalboard Thread Native: The Muffin Man}
#27
I can't believe this guy is arguing, despite the vast database of the Internet proving it's not Class A.

Wait, yes I can...



Teach the controversy!
Everyone is entitled to an opinion.

Feel free to express yours so I can make an informed judgement about how stupid you are.
#28
Quote by ECistheBest
btw UG, when howard dumble mentioned "Crystal Lattice" and "fragile harmonics" he said...


the fragile harmonics are more likely to survive free space vacuum, but they get squashed inside the crystal lattice.


translated in layman terms:
good sound (electrons) can survive vacuum tubes but they are ruined when it goes through transistors.

he meant crystal lattice as in the transistors.

so crystal lattice = bad.

This annoys me too...
People keeping making jokes that are like "MA DUMBLE AMP HAZ TEH CRYSTAL LATTICE"

when crappy solid states have teh lattice.
I love the crystal lattice/lettuce jokes as much as anyone just not in the wrong context
Last edited by coolstoryangus at Jun 9, 2011,
#29
Quote by Cathbard

Do you honestly think that marketing people let the truth get in the way of a good ad? They say it's a Class A amp because they think it gives it some aura of mojo by calling it that. Facts have nothing to do with marketing.


+1

i really, really do not like marketing.

EDIT: i can't believe the dude is still arguing too

what does he want to know now, "what amps are there which aren't class a but which people think are?"



EDIT: i think you mean cathode biased and no negative feedback, push-pull class A/B. look into that.
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
Last edited by Dave_Mc at Jun 9, 2011,
#31
ya that's great. that's how you'd actually have to do it.

i bet that thing sounds like sex.

imma go build one when i get out of bed.
Prs se Holcomb is the answer
#32
yeah those lionhearts actually are class a, as far as i'm aware. for example the 20 watter has 4 el84s in parallel single-ended class a. And yup, it's 20 watts, not 30 like the ac30.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#34
Quote by Magicpad
Fender champs are class A


I was thinking that

Quote by Dave_Mc
yeah those lionhearts actually are class a, as far as i'm aware. for example the 20 watter has 4 el84s in parallel single-ended class a. And yup, it's 20 watts, not 30 like the ac30.


That 20W sounds damn good. Surprised how cheap they are. Never seen one in a store though.
Last edited by Duv at Jun 9, 2011,
#35
i dunno, i always thought they were a bit dear. though they released the 1x12 combo version of the 20 watter since i tried them, and assuming it sounds the same, it's a better price.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#36
Quote by ECistheBest
btw UG, when howard dumble mentioned "Crystal Lattice" and "fragile harmonics" he said...


the fragile harmonics are more likely to survive free space vacuum, but they get squashed inside the crystal lattice.


translated in layman terms:
good sound (electrons) can survive vacuum tubes but they are ruined when it goes through transistors.

he meant crystal lattice as in the transistors.

so crystal lattice = bad.



yep -


it has been proven!


#37
£500ish new, half that for a used one for a decent 20W head. Sounds good to me. Especially in light of the crazy above-inflation price hikes in amp prices that has gripped the nation in the last year.

I'm glad I bought my Deluxe Reverb just before things got silly. The price has gone up by £100+ in a year. Madness.
#38
man 50 watts in class A though with 5 power tubes.....

5 el34s to replace every time.

that doesn't sound like somethign guitarists wanna do. what are you thinking laney.
Prs se Holcomb is the answer
#39
^

Quote by Duv
£500ish new, half that for a used one for a decent 20W head. Sounds good to me. Especially in light of the crazy above-inflation price hikes in amp prices that has gripped the nation in the last year.

I'm glad I bought my Deluxe Reverb just before things got silly. The price has gone up by £100+ in a year. Madness.


oh yeah that's true. i was sorta thinking of the old prices
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?