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#1
Not all that long ago, I purchased a Danelectro 59 DC from GAK (guitar amp keyboard) which I am sure you have all heard of.

When the guitar got here, I noticed an issue with the guitar falling out of tune when I fret a note (not an intonation issue...the open note would change like half a note sharp). I contacted them and they said they would take it in for repairs.

It got back today, and the problem has not changed. As far as I am aware they have done a simple setup and nothing else. I called to ask about what they could do and they told me I had TO PAY for the repair they did?

There was no mention of paying, no mention at all. I sent the guitar in within 2 weeks of buying it and it should still be covered by them during that time.

I am currently waiting for a call, but this is really terrible customer service. Not pleased.

I'm stuck here with a guitar that doesn't work to my standards of what is acceptable, and have them demanding money from me that they have not earned.

Does anyone have any similar experiences or advice?
yep
#2
You should have got it from Andertons
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#4
If you bought it with a fault, you definitely do not have to pay for repairs. Technically you should have gotten a replacement.
#5
Quote by kaneorsomething
Whilst you are quite correct, that doesn't really help me much now:P


well i dont know how things are in your country legally and all but in my country the law states that product must be decent and if it has any shortcomings the party that delivers the product must repair it or make it decent like the two of you intended it to be.
#6
Faulty Goods: Within 28 days of the date of delivery, we will arrange for the collection and replacement of faulty goods. Outside of 28 days from the date of delivery, we will arrange from the return of faulty goods from us to the manufacturers for repair, under the terms of manufacurer's warranty. This policy is invalidated if the goods have been altered in any way from their original condition, or if the fault is due to misuse by the purchaser.
Orders for software products or hardware that includes software as part of the package, cannot be refunded once the software has been opened. Video/Audio content in the form of CDs or DVDs also cannot be returned if the item has been opened. If further clarification is required on our Returns Policy regarding software and audio/video content, please email: returns@gak.co.uk
This does not affect your statutory rights.

Taken from the GAK website.
#7
I am now trying to get through to them via phone with no answer, despite the website stating they are open until 10pm.
yep
#8
GAK's customer service is really shit. GAK as a whole are not good to deal with. I've lost count of how many times I've heard about faulty products being delivered or totally wrong orders in some cases. GAK is a pile them high, flog them cheap kind of place.

It doesn't help you with this case but in future, don't buy from GAK. Dv247, Andertons and Thomann all have much better service and are often cheaper as well than GAK, although don't buy amps from Thomann since they only sell the German versions which have the EU 2-pin wall plug, not the UK 3-pin plug. But for guitars they're fine and Dv247 and Andertons are good for everything.

It is actually law that if a product is faulty then the store you bought it from must exchange it, like-for-like, for free immediately. I think the limit on that is it has to be within either 6 months or 1 year, I don't remember which. That only covers actual faults with the product though, it doesn't count if YOU damaged it or whatever. So long as you've kept the guitar in as-new condition and you've still got your receipts and invoices then GAK HAVE to exchange it for another of the same model. They can't refuse, it's the law.
#10
Cheers for the heads up. GAK should really be better than that given their size.

Get them to sort it out, and maybe consider notifying Trading Standards Authority (or whatever they're called).

You definitely have the legal right to have them sort out the problem.

I wrote this a long time ago. I realise looking at it now it's quite law-heavy and quite long, but if you have the time to look over it (and a lot of the subsequent comments are helpful/concise) you'll find all the legal shizzle you want.

Long-story short, they need to sort it out for free.

https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1238806
#11
Quote by Duv
Cheers for the heads up. GAK should really be better than that given their size.

Get them to sort it out, and maybe consider notifying Trading Standards Authority (or whatever they're called).

You definitely have the legal right to have them sort out the problem.

I wrote this a long time ago. I realise looking at it now it's quite law-heavy and quite long, but if you have the time to look over it (and a lot of the subsequent comments are helpful/concise) you'll find all the legal shizzle you want.

Long-story short, they need to sort it out for free.

https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1238806


Thanks for the informative post Duv! I was wondering who exactly I am supposed to call with this issue., too.

Quote by grohl1987

It is actually law that if a product is faulty then the store you bought it from must exchange it, like-for-like, for free immediately. I think the limit on that is it has to be within either 6 months or 1 year, I don't remember which. That only covers actual faults with the product though, it doesn't count if YOU damaged it or whatever. So long as you've kept the guitar in as-new condition and you've still got your receipts and invoices then GAK HAVE to exchange it for another of the same model. They can't refuse, it's the law.


The problem is, this guitar scratches very easily, and even in shipping the thing to me there've been a couple appear. Therefore they pretty much refuse to exchange it. It's stupid.
yep
#12
Here

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Governmentcitizensandrights/Consumerrights/index.htm

and here

http://www.oft.gov.uk/consumer-advice/oft-and-cd/

Now go bring a case against GAK. Instead of butting heads with them... get da man to butt heads with GAK.
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#13
i've only gotten strings and my squier starter pack from them, no complaints really apart from the order always comes one day late, but strings and the starter pack come ready boxed so it takes skill to mess it up.
i use them just to get a rough estimate of what im gunna pay for a guitar / amp in shop because their range is very good.
#14
Quote by kaneorsomething
The problem is, this guitar scratches very easily, and even in shipping the thing to me there've been a couple appear. Therefore they pretty much refuse to exchange it. It's stupid.


From a legal point of view this doesn't make a difference. There's an implied term in sales of certain products that it's a condition (breach of which permits you to return the thing) of the contract that the product is delivered to you in mint condish basically. Most of the cases in relation to these 'certain products' are about cars - someone's bought a car and it turns out to be scratched. This even applies to used cars. The courts basically say that when the item is of the type that scratches/dents/imperfections devalue the item you have the right to rescind (ie. cancel) the contract. Guitars sit squarely in this category.

They literally have no leg to stand on when it comes to this, and are pointlessly ruining their already sullied reputation. Most stores would do everything in their power to make sure you're happy.
#15
Guitars should be bought in store full stop. (.)
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#16
Quote by Rich EpiWildkat
Guitars should be bought in store full stop. (.)

Unless no stores nearby you have the guitar you want and you can't afford a long-ass journey >.>
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#17
GAK are good when everything goes smoothly which it usually does, but they are shit at dealing with problems when problems arise.

they've scammed me out of shipping costs for bulk shipping because they stopped stocking certain products when i made a big order on pedals once (it was some EHX things that had been discontinued in that form when EHX replaced all the sheet metal chassis stuff with the die cast chassis stuff), where they continued to delay the "estimated despatch date" until i cancelled the order only to tell me "shipping is calculated per order", and have loopholes in their terms and conditions that stop me from making a legal claim against them. so i lost money on shipping costs for things that weren't shipped and the stuff their site said was "in stock" didn't arrive in time for studio sessions.

use GAK at your own risk. they are good most of the time, but when the shit hits the fan... i don't need to complete that sentence.
I like analogue Solid State amps that make no effort to be "tube-like", and I'm proud of it...

...A little too proud, to be honest.
#19
Quote by Rich EpiWildkat
Guitars should be bought in store full stop. (.)


Online is fine. Some companies are better than others about exchanges. I just make sure to ask a lot of questions beforehand even if I know the answers when ordering.

Sorry about your bad luck kaneorsomething.
#20
Have you tried breaking in the strings..?

Because it seems to me, you received the guitar with fresh strings before and after the setup.

Break it in.
#21
you bought a dirt cheap guitar, with shit hardware and the tuners are slipping. Bad as gak are, that isn't their fault.

take it to a local tech or learn how to string it to help prevent slipping.

1977 Burny FLG70
2004 EBMM JP6
2016 SE Holcolmb
#22
Are you sure you can't fix that yourself? By restringing it differently or rubbing a pencil across the nut? Although it does sound like a bit of a ball ache, I can't imagine it being that hard a problem to fix.

GAK's customer service does have a reputation of being a bit craptastic, but they probably don't care that much because it is a cheaper guitar with a simple problem, and shipping a guitar can cost a fair bit.
Cam Sampbell's my hero
#23
Quote by Tom 1.0
you bought a dirt cheap guitar, with shit hardware and the tuners are slipping. Bad as gak are, that isn't their fault.

take it to a local tech or learn how to string it to help prevent slipping.


Nevertheless they should still give him a decent standard of service and just fixed it/swapped it in the first place for free.
Last edited by Duv at Jun 12, 2011,
#24
He said they gave it a full setup.

If I sold you a cheap guitar and you send it back because the tuners won't hold and you demand I fixed it? Well you wouldn't be getting a new set of better tuners, I would set it up as best I could and send it back.

What did he expect? A set of sperzels and a hug? Sorry but I don't see what they were meant to do.

1977 Burny FLG70
2004 EBMM JP6
2016 SE Holcolmb
#25
They were meant to do what every shop in the EU has to do, by law; right the problem, even if that means exchanging the guitar for a whole new one. That's the law. If any store doesn't adhere to it they can be had up for selling faulty goods.

Notes pulling sharp doesn't happen because of tuners or the strings slipping. Slipping makes you go flat, this isn't that.
#26
Quote by philwhite
Online is fine. Some companies are better than others about exchanges. I just make sure to ask a lot of questions beforehand even if I know the answers when ordering.

Sorry about your bad luck kaneorsomething.

it's not a matter of asking questions beforehand. you don't know what you're getting unless you try before you buy, and that applies to individual guitars not a particular model - playing one in-store and then buying online is still a gamble, because no two guitars are alike.

and i kinda agree with tom here, it's likely that the tuning problems are due to cheapness more than anything, and there's no reason why GAK should replace the tuners on a guitar that is just factory fitted with crap tuners that don't hold tuning very well - if the manufacturer cuts corners by fitting their guitars with cheap hardware, that is not the retailer's responsibility to sort out.
I like analogue Solid State amps that make no effort to be "tube-like", and I'm proud of it...

...A little too proud, to be honest.
#27
Quote by Tom 1.0
He said they gave it a full setup.

If I sold you a cheap guitar and you send it back because the tuners won't hold and you demand I fixed it? Well you wouldn't be getting a new set of better tuners, I would set it up as best I could and send it back.

What did he expect? A set of sperzels and a hug? Sorry but I don't see what they were meant to do.


You could argue that, but if its really half a note its out on one fret thats a bit much.
What you sell has to be "fit for purpose", just if something is cheap it has to be able to be used as what its sold for, a guitar that wont stay in tune at all I guess would fall under that.
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#28
bollocks,

if you buy a guitar from a retailer such as GAK who iirc dont have a public store which even if they did, their on-line stock will be warehouse stock anyway., they wont have opened that case more than once to check the guitar is in there, they will then send it out in its box, so they see a guitar with 6 strings, to them should be working as sent from Danelectro.

just because he bought a dirt cheap guitar that is famous for originally being a cheap POS why should a store take it back and replace it when you knowingly buy a cheap guitar, by your logic walmart should replace their starter packs with Fenders when they wont work brilliantly for you.

I agree bad customer service sucks but if you want a guitar that should stay in tune and not require a setup upon purchase, dont buy cheap shitty ones....

1977 Burny FLG70
2004 EBMM JP6
2016 SE Holcolmb
Last edited by Tom 1.0 at Jun 12, 2011,
#29
I dont know the legal position, but if you bought a car and it leaks oil the dealer cant just go "well that car is cheap, you should expect that".

You and I both dont expect a lot from a guitar that cheap, but if you play one note and its miles out of tune id say its not fit for purpose. However, I dunno if that stands up. However, the guitar being able to hold tune is pretty central to its ability to be an instrument, more so than bad fretwork etc.
Gibson 58 RI VOS Custombuckers
Mesa Lonestar Special 2x12
#30
^ Nope (to Tom1.0). That's just not how things work.

From a common-sense point of view you're position's defensible but in terms of the law that's just not the case. Whether the guitar's £5 or £5000 the thing should be sent out working properly. What Kane's complaining of clearly isn't something that can be remedied by a good setup because they've done that and it didn't work. It's also not something inherently wrong with the guitar. It's just a fault in an otherwise decent design. They need to just change the bloody thing, and maybe send the junk one back to Danelectro.

They do have a store (in Brighton I think), and they shouldn't just open the case to check it's there and send it out. At any rate it's not in their interests to have people wasting their time sending stuff back so they should check stuff over properly before sending it out. That's what being a retailer is all about and there's laws about this shit.
#31
if you buy a car sold as seen, its your responsibility as a buyer to check it. Using a car is a shit analogy too in this instance.

yeah i appreciate that, but he sent it back and they gave the guitar a setup, which is all they would be required to do, why should they replace a guitar because the manufacturers fitted shit hardware? they wont fit new tuners or nut if they arent physically broken dude.

its not gak fault he paid pittance for a cheap guitar.

1977 Burny FLG70
2004 EBMM JP6
2016 SE Holcolmb
#32
Quote by Tom 1.0
if you buy a car sold as seen, its your responsibility as a buyer to check it. Using a car is a shit analogy too in this instance.

yeah i appreciate that, but he sent it back and they gave the guitar a setup, which is all they would be required to do, why should they replace a guitar because the manufacturers fitted shit hardware? they wont fit new tuners or nut if they arent physically broken dude.

its not gak fault he paid pittance for a cheap guitar.


The car's actually a good analogy as a lot of the case-law about sales of goods relates to cars. Unless you waive your rights when buying, and you're buying from a business, you do have the right to inspect it. This can include taking it away to a specialist/taking time inspecting it (as long as you're reasonable about it) as not all faults are apparent.

GAK would also be required to exchange it, or give him a refund. And if I was Kane I would've just asked for a refund.
#33
He is not buying the guitar second hand, it is bought new so theres a load of consumer protection law in the UK built around you basically getting a fair deal and something that works.

I believe the wording of the law is "fit for purpose". So basically, an instrument has to stay in tune, have frets, be structually sound and the electronics work. If he was saying it sounded bad then yeah, thats a different issue but it doesnt work as a guitar if it wont stay in tune for a while. I honestly dont know of any actual cases of it, as yeah generally its used for cars and electronics but it applies here.
Gibson 58 RI VOS Custombuckers
Mesa Lonestar Special 2x12
#34
The car analogy sucks. I don't hear people talking about beginner cars made in China or Indonesia, intermediate ones being made in South Korea or high-end being made in Japan and the USA.

Any car you buy new, should be new. It should work. You should have zero problems with it whatsoever, because a new car costs $15,000. Give or take.

A Danelectro costs $300. A Gibson Les Paul Custom costs $3,000. IF you want to use the car analogy, it makes more sense using it toward a guitar that costs as much as car, but even then, a $3,000 Gibson LP Custom shouldn't have any issues.

It's a crappy guitar, but the problem sounds really strange. TS could probably rest his hand on the tremolo somehow so the strings go sharp, or is pulling the neck. There's a bunch of different reasons. It's a crappy guitar.

There's a significant difference between cars and guitars, it may slightly rhyme, but they're different. There is no real difference in "quality," with cars. The more you're paying for a guitar, the more you're getting out of it, whether it be a bigger engine, little upgrades and tweaks that make it look more appealing, or whatever. It's a similar concept with a guitar, you pay more, and you typically get a more appealing guitar with more to it, whether it be neck-thru, locking tuners, quartersawn neck, but still.

Danelectro guitars are pretty low-end. They're made out of hardboard. I would not compare this to a car.

/rant
#35
"The more you're paying for a guitar, the more you're getting out of it, whether it be a bigger engine, little upgrades and tweaks that make it look more appealing, or whatever." lol wut

Seriously, its just an analogy. And theres a difference between something that is what you would call a luxury and the bare bones of what makes something able to do what it does. Its the difference between a cars AC not working and the cars engine not turning over, one is annoying but if the engine doesnt work then it doesnt work as a car, same if the steering wheel wont turn.
Gibson 58 RI VOS Custombuckers
Mesa Lonestar Special 2x12
#36
Quote by Rich EpiWildkat
Guitars should be bought in store full stop. (.)


nope. you should learn how to fix things.

if it's a problem that can't be fixed then you need to return the guitar.

I don't understand why the op doesn't return the guitar. It's obviously f'ed up or something. Tell them to send you a new one.
Prs se Holcomb is the answer
#37
why anybody buys those is just beyond me. every one i've checked over has been truly a piece of crap.

i think it's made of basswood pressboard.

return it. if you want something nice shaped like that then just build one.
I wondered why the frisbee was getting bigger, then it hit me.
#38
Quote by Snapple
"The more you're paying for a guitar, the more you're getting out of it, whether it be a bigger engine, little upgrades and tweaks that make it look more appealing, or whatever." lol wut

Seriously, its just an analogy. And theres a difference between something that is what you would call a luxury and the bare bones of what makes something able to do what it does. Its the difference between a cars AC not working and the cars engine not turning over, one is annoying but if the engine doesnt work then it doesnt work as a car, same if the steering wheel wont turn.


Nail on the head.


Quote by gregs1020
why anybody buys those is just beyond me. every one i've checked over has been truly a piece of crap.

i think it's made of basswood pressboard.

return it. if you want something nice shaped like that then just build one.


Masonite I believe, which is pretty much just like pressboard. I've played a few and quite like them, but I've always been concerned that the thing's going to fall apart. Also the cheap one can't be intonated and all that.

They do sound good though, and the reason people keep buying them is because of these guys (and Clapton):


#39
Quote by Tom 1.0


yeah i appreciate that, but he sent it back and they gave the guitar a setup, which is all they would be required to do, why should they replace a guitar because the manufacturers fitted shit hardware? they wont fit new tuners or nut if they arent physically broken dude.

Quote by Tom 1.0

just because he bought a dirt cheap guitar that is famous for originally being a cheap POS why should a store take it back and replace it when you knowingly buy a cheap guitar, by your logic walmart should replace their starter packs with Fenders when they wont work brilliantly for you.

I don't think you quite understand what we're getting at here or what the law is.

If you buy a nameofproduct and for whatever reason it does not work exclusively as described, every shop within the UK has to, BY LAW, exchange it like-for-like with another copy of nameofproduct without fuss. I think this applies for something like 1 year for certain electrical products and 6 months for others. For the first week anything you buy, faulty or not, can be returned either for a refund or a like-for-like exchange.

If YOU **** it up they don't have to do shit about it.
If you don't know how to work it then you still have that one week to get a refund or exchange.
If it is actually broken or has a manufacturing fault then you can get a direct exchange.

Nobody is talking about having new tuners fitted or exchanging Squiers for Fenders. That's gibberish, nobody said that. In fact I believe if a shop did offer to simply fit new tuners that would actually then void your right to have the guitar exchanged.


You or anyone else can come up with whatever batshit insane analogies you want, but that's the law in the UK. If a shop refuses to exchange they will be had up for selling faulty goods. If they refuse to exchange or refund within the first week of sale then they'll get ****ed up the arse by trading standards. We're not talking about some theory on what might have gone wrong, ignoring the fact that slipping tuners or loose restringing technique would only make strings go flat, not sharp. This is the law, black & white.
#40
looks like a lot of back and forth here.

my simple opinion is that the guy should have called to return, not
asked to "repair" the guitar.

if i call GC and ask them for service on a guitar,
that dept has nothing to do with sales.

so they will either replace shoddy tuners, or restring (which is what they did)
and then bill you.

if you choose to return, then you get a shipping number and return.

right now,
i wouldnt pay the service, (depending on what he asked for) because the guitar still doesnt work.

and i would get a customer rep and ask to return the guitar.
Jenneh

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